StephenDedalus

I'm getting back into biking after a long time off. I decided to go with an electric assist bike to conquer some of the hills on my daily commute. Trying one of these out I found that I rode more with that bike than I did before getting the bike. It was nice to have a little kick on the hills as I shed the pounds. I went to my bike fit guy and the bike I was looking at Kalkhoff Pro Connect Sport was too small when he tried to fit me to it. So I went and ordered a Large (the tryout bike was a Medium) instead. The bike arrived this weekend it's gigantic. Just a quick comparison to my standard bike, which is fit perfectly to me.

My other bike is a 2008 Gary Fischer Wingra modified to have drop bars. It's 32 inches to the top of the seat tube, 30 inches to the top tube near the seat (standover) and 34 inches to the top of the head tube.

The new bike is 34 inches to the top of the seat tube, 33 inches to the top tube and 39 inches to the top of the head tube.

Now I know that geometry goes far far beyond that. Since I've had many fittings done in the past I know that there's a lot more that goes into a good fit. The reason I even bothered to take these measurements, though, is because the Kalkhoff feels giant. It seems comfortable to ride when I'm on the bike, but it's definitely bigger than I'm used to. And I have zero clearance on it. I barely had any on my normal bike. I'm 6'1" with around a 31 inch inseam. So that fun "short legs, long torso" situation where I often have to modify a bike to get upright enough and stretched out enough. This has created some "interesting" mods in the past, but nothing that wasn't totally unreasonable, nor comfortable. I'm worried about this, though. My fit guy is going to look at it soon, but I wanted to ask if I'm worrying over nothing. The difference in standover height is huge.

Any thoughts on this?

Fangowolf

I have the same short legs, long torso problem. I just let the bike lean when I stop. I try to get into the habit of always leaning to the non drive side. The first real bike I got when I was in first grade lasted into college, so I got used to bikes that were to big early on.

StephenDedalus

So I measured my old bike that's already fit to me as well as the new bike. Only for height. My other bike is a 2008 Gary Fischer Wingra modified to have drop bars. It's 32 inches to the top of the seat tube, 30 inches to the top tube near the seat (standover) and 34 inches to the top of the head tube.

The Kalkhoff is 34 inches to the top of the seat tube, 33 inches to the top tube and 39 inches to the top of the head tube.

Now I know that geometry goes far far beyond that. Since I've had many fittings done in the past I know that there's a lot more that goes into a good fit. The reason I even bothered to take these measurements, though, is because the Kalkhoff feels giant. It seems comfortable to ride when I'm on the bike, but it's definitely bigger than I'm used to. And I have zero clearance on it. I barely had any on my normal bike. The gearing is tremendous and it's much much more powerful. So I'm not totally down on it yet, but I'm concerned. That's a big difference. I have a week to sort this out.

MattFoley

I have short legs and a longer torso + arms, so buying a bike based on standover simply isn't an option for me, as I'd always be choosing a bike that was at least one size too small for me in every other aspect. If you have to tip-toe to keep clear of the TT (by clear, I mean the TT doesn't put pressure on your junk), then a smaller size is probably a good idea, but if you can flat foot it, then you should be fine. When I got into cycling a couple years ago, the dumbass shop that sold me the bike fitted me pretty much by TT clearance alone (I didn't know any better) and that bike ended being quite a bit too small for me...of course, I only figured that out after I was riding for a while and learned how the bike was actually supposed to fit. But if you do get a frame that's slightly too small, that's easier to work with than a bike that's too big.

johnnywhale 

I just stop next to a curb

StephenDedalus

I rode it and it's not a problem to lean the bike slightly and I can handle the bike well. It's just a conundrum. The Large bike is really nice. Much nicer than the Medium. Disc brakes, perfect components, nice thick rims. It's fantastic and seems like it will be perfect for someone my size. Minus the standover clearance. The fit guy I usually use looked at it and thought it was perfect as well. He was able to fit it to me without much effort. On the other hand the Medium has rim brakes and slightly lesser components. It's much easier to get on and off the bike, but it would require an extension to the top tube as well as different handlebars to fit properly.

rideorglide

Same here - Lean.
Normal bikes are just not made for us.
Mine's a home put together from parts to get the fit I wanted.

Anyway Stephen, think about whether you need to dismount on hills, That's where you'll notice the standover issue the most. Also whether you'll have time and space to dismount uphill, across the fall line. On an MTB you can sometimes grab a tree branch to stay up without dismounting, of course, but not so easy to do on the road, lol

StephenDedalus

It's a commuter bike in a hilly city. So I'll be off and on depending on lights and hills are usually wide open.

youcoming

Stand over is very important, bike fit is everything.

100bikes

The top tube/bar always wins!

The "fit" is a result of matching the correct frame design to the rider. That is, each manufacturer( big names or custom) have a frame design philosophy. As I recall, Specialized tends to be a long top tube design relative to the seat tube. Trek tends to be proportionally shorter top tube for equal seat tube length.

Your fit issues are not uncommon. An "A" fit will come from not only getting the correct type/shape/brand of bike for your standover issue, but will result in matching the stem length, bar width and even crank arm length to your specific needs.

Leaning is OK when you have time to think about it.

StephenDedalus

I think the thing I'm struggling with this most is that the large bike fits. It fits right now. The standover clearance is bad, but it fits right now. Versus purchasing a medium and hoping we can get it close with a combination of parts.

c_m_shooter

Sounds like it fits. Go read some of Grant's articles over at Rivindell.

hamster

I was in a somewhat similar situation last fall. Our LBS had a good deal on one of their bikes, I liked the bike, it felt okay on a test ride, but it was one size higher than what I was used to and the store didn't have any smaller sizes (neither in stock nor in the warehouse). I debated this for a few hours and pulled the trigger. To put my clearance in perspective, I can put both heels on the ground when I'm in bike shoes, but I can't do that if I'm barefoot.

So far I put 1500 miles on it and it is working fine. I probably look a bit awkward at stop signs, but it's totally livable. I think the key is that the frame is acceptable for my dimensions in other aspects. I still run the stock stem (100 mm, I think), I'm in a reasonably aerodynamic position, and there's still room to move the handlebars down if I wanted to. One of the risks of going with a big frame is that you may be unable to go as low as you want to: all frames are similar length-wise, but bigger frames have longer head tubes.

That said, if I had to exchange the frame (under warranty or something) I think I'd still ask for the next smaller size.

StephenDedalus

That sounds like you're saying go with the smaller bike? Btw, here's the bike. I realized I had never posted a picture of it.

The large bike.

https://www.kalkhoff-bikes.com/int/en...l-drive-1.html

The smaller bike.

https://store.kalkhoffusa.com/Pro-Con...ka10prosdd.htm

hamster

I'm not sure if I'm saying anything. Except that one can live with some standover deficiency. I wouldn't want to advise you one way or another based on incomplete information. Besides, for a commuter e-bike the fit isn't all THAT crucial.

* Just what exactly do you mean by "zero clearance". Inseam 31" and top tube height 33" would mean that you don't have zero clearance, you have negative clearance, probably even with shoes on. Can you put both heels on the ground? Have you tried leaning it with one foot on the ground and the other on the pedal, does that feel comfortable and stable? Those are both pretty heavy bikes, the "smaller" bike is specced at 49 lbs, the "large" bike must be heavier than that. (BTW, I don't know much about electric bikes, but that weight sounds quite excessive to me. The battery is the heaviest extra part, and the 26V/10Ah lithium battery listed in the specs of the second bike should not weigh more than 5 lbs.)

* 39" to the top of the head tube also sounds like a lot. Do you have any concerns about feeling too "upright" with bars that high?

Fangowolf

This is just a thought, I bought a LHT not to long ago and it is running 26" wheels. Even with my short legs and long torso the bike fits much better and I can stand flat footed on the bike. Is it possible to put 26" wheels on the bigger bike? Your spending an awful lot of money, seems like it would be nice to get the nicer bike and be able to stand over easier.

hamster

He will risk hitting the ground with pedals during turns.

StephenDedalus

I can put both feet on the ground, but the bar presses up into my boys and almost hits my pelvis. Maybe that means I'm not measuring inseam appropriately, but I can stand flatfooted. It's just not what I'm used to.

I have ridden the bike and I had no trouble. I've handled a bike for a couple of decades including years of a 35 mile commute. The reason I'm looking at this bike is because I was t-boned on my bike a few years back and put on weight. So I'm trying to get kick-started back in the right direction and my trial of the medium (I got to ride it for 2 weeks as a trial) was great. I rode every day. So I know it will help me get back on the horse, to smooth out those hills. The medium bike was also pretty comfortable, but it's not as nice of a bike and I started to develop elbow pain due to it being a poor fit.

I rode the large bike a few days ago and it was great. Perfectly comfortable and I went through the city (Portland, OR.) in start-and-stop traffic and was able to easily stop and take a foot off by leaning the bike slightly. That's a pretty natural motion for me. I don't typically straddle the bike when I come to a stop anyway. I don't have any concerns about being too upright. I've been dealing with my fit guy since 2001 when I got back into cycling and my natural comfortable position is a little more upright. Even my road bikes are typically converted hybrids or cyclecross bikes with a less aggressive slope. It's literally just the standover height and the general "bigness" of the bike that's my concern. Otherwise I really like the large model.

StephenDedalus

I'm worried about this, yes. I have size 15 feet. So I have to place my panniers far back as it is to avoid kicking them.

rumrunn6

to the OP --- it's not important. it's critical. there is no judgement call to be made here. it's like seatbelts. you don't wear them? you don't ride in a car. your standover height is too high? you don't ride the bike.

Wooden Tiger

Standover clearance. That's a bit of a strange topic for me. I'm at that "in between" height (5'11) where I could either go Medium or Large. My last MTB was a Medium while my current one is a Large.

My standover is next to nothing. There are no two inches between my inseam/crotch area. If I slip off my pedals or have to do an emergency dismount while on the trail and I'm not careful, it's going to make for a really painful experience. The problem is that I felt way too scrunched up on a Medium, so I had no choice. Aside from the standover, the bike was super-comfortable and felt great. Out of the many MTBs I rode, this one felt the best and we just "connected." It would've been fantastic if I could find a bike with a little bit of a standover height but it is what it is. The bike felt really good and the price was right.

StephenDedalus

So an update. I ended up buying the larger bike. It was just closer out of the box. I went back and looked at the "Medium" bike and I didn't have much clearance on it either actually. I've adjusted to it and been riding my bike daily since then. So far, so good.

jethro56 

My Cross Check is on the tight side as far as stand-over. Fortunately I wear these https://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product...04_-1___202526
They're really thick up on the balls of your feet to allow room for the SPD cleats. I also wear size 14 shoes so to get enough setback using a Brooks B17 Saddle I Use this seatpost https://www.ebikestop.com/velo_orange...0mm-ST7700.php My shortness of leg length is mainly from the knee down.

Wooden Tiger

Good to hear it's working out for you!