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  1. #1
    Senior Member Jarrett2's Avatar
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    I need reccomendations on a 325lb Clyde proof wheel

    So I had a Specialized Expedition Sport, rode it 200+ miles @ 9 MPH average, no probs.

    Bought a Trek 7.2 FX and broke 3 spokes in 150 miles @ 12 MPH average. Dealer replaced wheel, haven't ridden it much since.

    Bought a Trek DS 8.3 and zero problems for first 300 miles @ 14 MPH average. Had a wreck, now I have broken 3 spokes in 8 days.

    Right now I'm enjoying my Trek DS 8.3 and want to make it reliable. I'm tired of dealing with broken spokes and I'm willing to pay to have a good builder make me a worry free rear wheel. I've found a local wheel builder that appears to really know what he's doing. Seasoned local bike rider and tech, builds wheels for all of his century friends, etc.

    My question is, what do I have him build for my Trek DS 8.3 that I never have to worry about again?

  2. #2
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    Fairly standard answer here will be a velocity deep v with a shimano ultegra or deore hub depending on the spacing of your rear drop outs, along with wheel smith or DT Swiss double butted spokes. I myself weighed 315 and commuted with 10 pounds of gear on a deep v with a cheaper tiagra hub and straight gage spokes with zero problems. The deep v's are narrow though and may not fit the wide tires that came on your trek. Velocity also makes chukkers which are a wide and therefore a heavier version of the deep v, as well ad the dyad which is shallower as well as wider than the deep v in addition to being lighter.

    Others here use mavic a719 or 319, Belgian Hed C2,I think I'm remembering that right as well. Also standard advice is 36 spoke wheels as opposed to the 32 on your treks wheel. If you. Want to go nuts it looks like velocity now makes 40 spoke hubs for both road and mountain bike spacing. All the velocity rims I mentioned are available in 36 or 40 spoke holes.

  3. #3
    Senior Member Bill Kapaun's Avatar
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    IF they are breaking in the bend-
    I'd just replace the spokes with a good brand-
    Straight 14 ga. DS (or 13-14ga. SB such as DT Alpine although you are stuck with black)
    14-15 ga. DB NDS.
    Proper TENSION is the key!

  4. #4
    Just Plain Slow PhotoJoe's Avatar
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    Lots of wheel talk lately. Here's some "light reading" material for you. I'd offer advice, but I have no first-hand experience. Still riding on the stock RD-160's and see problems brewing, so I'll be in the market soon enough.

    http://www.bikeforums.net/search.php?searchid=7797302
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  5. #5
    Senior Member Jarrett2's Avatar
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    The FX was pushing the nipple through the rim. The DS is snapping off at the nipple by the rim. Today I broke one at the hub on the drive side. The search link didn't seem to work. I like the idea of more spokes.

    The LBS tech said to go with a 36 spoke with DT stainless spokes and the big part he emphasized was getting a grommet under the nipple. The thought that is the problem I'm having with a stock wheels. Rhino Lite was thrown around.

  6. #6
    Senior Member
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    I've read good things about Rhino Lites. I now ride on a sun cr-18 due to the fact that my current bike is set up or 27 inch wheels rather than 700c.
    Last edited by jazzgeek79; 08-12-13 at 10:36 AM. Reason: Typo

  7. #7
    Senior Member Jarrett2's Avatar
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    My guy said he wanted to try just rebuilding the wheel first. Hand building it with the heaviest DT stainless steel spokes and then properly tensioning it. He said he stands by his works, so if that doesn't work, he will apply the cost of that to building a new wheel. Hoping it works out. Tired of the demotivation of hearing a spoke break every other ride.

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    Getting a well built wheel pretty much trumps any number of spokes you can point your finger at. If a wheel isn't well built, then even a 40 spoke wheel will break spokes.

    For the record, I started riding my first roadie at around 140kg/310lb. The bike I purchased second hand had 28 spoke Mavic CXP30 rims (3x rear and radial front). In 3 years of riding that bike around and hitting potholes, etc I never had to true/adjust either wheel. Most people would NEVER recommend such wheels for someone of my weight, and I myself went in with the idea that I would be replacing the wheels at some point. That experience has taught me that a well built wheel trumps anything. There's other well built wheels getting around under heavy clyde riders that have even fewer spokes.

    If your guy is good (and it sounds like he has a good rep) then 32 spokes should be fine. I would recommend the Kinlin XC279 as the rim of choice. I'm riding a set of A23 rims right now and the wider rim does make a difference in cornering and will sit wider tyres better. If I can be bothered sinking more money into another set of wheels for my road bike (my true love atm is track racing) then I they will be based around that Kinlin rim with cxray spokes for a little more aero over the A23 rims.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Bill Kapaun's Avatar
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    I'd still go 36 spokes vs 32. The OP DOES weigh 325! Maybe he also stands on the pedals?
    The weight & cost of 4 more spokes & nipples is zilch compared to the added confidence.

    He does want a wheel that "I never have to worry about again".

    My recipe would be-
    Velocity A23 OC rim.
    DT Swiss Apine spokes DS (13/14ga Single butted)
    DT Swiss Competition spokes NDS (14/15 Double butted)
    Brass nipples.

    The OC rim has the spoke bed offset 4mm.
    This reduces the diah on the wheel and equalizes spoke tension between the 2 sides.
    Typically, NDS spoke tension is about 70% (or less) than DS.
    The OC rim moves that to around 85%.
    That way, both sides share the load more equally.
    Last edited by Bill Kapaun; 08-14-13 at 04:26 PM.

  10. #10
    Senior Member Null66's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarrett2 View Post
    My guy said he wanted to try just rebuilding the wheel first. Hand building it with the heaviest DT stainless steel spokes and then properly tensioning it. He said he stands by his works, so if that doesn't work, he will apply the cost of that to building a new wheel. Hoping it works out. Tired of the demotivation of hearing a spoke break every other ride.
    Build quality is critical. See all the threads mentioning even spoke tension.
    This is a confident guarantee and even I would take him up on that. I hate equipment failure and walking home even more so.

  11. #11
    Senior Member Null66's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill Kapaun View Post
    I'd still go 36 spokes vs 32. The OP DOES weigh 325! Maybe he also stands on the pedals?
    The weight & cost of 4 more spokes & nipples is zilch compared to the added confidence.

    He does want a wheel that "I never have to worry about again".



    My recipe would be-
    Velocity A23 OC rim.
    DT Swiss Apine spokes DS (13/14ga Single butted)
    DT Swiss Competition spokes NDS (14/15 Double butted)
    Brass nipples.

    The OC rim has the spoke bed offset 4mm.
    This reduces the diah on the wheel and equalizes spoke tension between the 2 sides.
    Typically, NDS spoke tension is about 70% (or less) than DS.
    The OC rim moves that to around 85%.
    That way, both sides share the load more equally.

    Ah, to get the "never worry again":
    I went with Phil Wood 48 and Velocity Chukkers built by a local wheelsmith. I'm running 38x700c with discs. He assured me that he could build a 32 that I would be highly unlikely to break. But avoiding 1 walk home is to me well worth it. My emergency contact is my riding partner.

    The marvelous bearings seem to make up for a lot of the wheel weight when compared to my previous wheels.

    I was 285. now 265 and run loaded as a matter of course. I can see a trailer within the reasonable future. So for me: "too much of anything is just enough".

  12. #12
    Senior Member Bill Kapaun's Avatar
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    I think 36 is more than adequate if well built with properly selected spokes.
    48 spokes kind of gets to be a pain to work on/air up, since they are getting so close together.

    All my hubs are cheap loose ball hubs, but they roll very easy.
    I lube/service/adjust my self to a gnats butt. I may have a few grams extra weight, but I have to keep things within a reasonable budget. That means the cheapest Shimano hubs. I have no qualms about their life, since they get serviced twice/year. I've got about 1000 bearing balls in each size for front and back just waiting to be used.

  13. #13
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarrett2 View Post
    The FX was pushing the nipple through the rim. The DS is snapping off at the nipple by the rim. Today I broke one at the hub on the drive side. The search link didn't seem to work. I like the idea of more spokes.

    The LBS tech said to go with a 36 spoke with DT stainless spokes and the big part he emphasized was getting a grommet under the nipple. The thought that is the problem I'm having with a stock wheels. Rhino Lite was thrown around.
    I would suggest more spokes and using a heavier gauge spoke like an DT Alpine III, Wheelsmith DH13, Sapim Strong or Pillar triple butted. I've use the DT Alpines on all wheels I build now from mountain bike to touring bike and have had very good luck with them. I had a mountain bike wheel last 10 years of hard mountain biking with the Alpines. I haven't used the other spokes so I can't vouch for them but Wheelsmith and Sapim are very reputable . The Pillars are fairly new to the market but they aren't as expensive as the Alpines and can be had in silver.

    Rims aren't as important to wheel strength as the spokes but the Velocity rims are good rims.

    While you would benefit from more spokes and a heavier gauge spoke, your litany of troubles point to user error rather than just equipment. Pulling a nipple through the rim is probably equipment but breaking a spoke at the nipple and breaking the hub on the drive side sounds like you may be slamming into pot holes and road cracks while sitting on the seat like a sack of potatoes. Bikes have 'saddles' not seats because the saddle supports you but you don't sit on it like a chair. You should ride like you are hovering over the saddle and use your arms and legs to take the hits that the wheels endure. Don't slam into holes and cracks. Try to float over them. It's called "riding light" and even heavy people can learn how to float like a butterfly.
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  14. #14
    Senior Member Jarrett2's Avatar
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    Thanks for all of this info.

    So how big of a change in pavement do I need to stand up for?

    I'm riding on smooth MUPs. My biggest bump is a twig that fell off a tree. Or a 1 inch change in concrete from one path to another.

  15. #15
    Senior Member MRT2's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarrett2 View Post
    Thanks for all of this info.

    So how big of a change in pavement do I need to stand up for?

    I'm riding on smooth MUPs. My biggest bump is a twig that fell off a tree. Or a 1 inch change in concrete from one path to another.
    Try to ride lightly over that. Unweight the front and lift the wheel slightly as you hit the concrete, than shift your weight forward as the back wheel hits it.

    With 3 broken spokes, for sure, you may need to rebuild the wheel with new spokes, unfortunately. I ran into this problem about 15 years ago, LBS had to rebuild the wheel as a warranty repair. It was a 36 spoke wheel, surprisingly. Never had a problem after the rebuild, or with any wheel since. Weight wise, I was about where I am now, around 250.

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