Willbird

I invested in a Park Tensionmeter, and fiddle with my own stuff, I do agree there is a totally different feel when the spoke tension is evened out where it belongs :-). I had a couple spokes loosen up on my stock rear wheel on my Sportiff so I went over all of them and evened them out as best as I could, totally different on road feel afterwards.

from what I have read the alloy nipples are plenty strong in tension, just not as strong torsionally with a spoke wrench if I understood it right.

Yendor72

Willbird that is what Tom at GVH told me as well, an alloy nipple is plenty strong until you go at it with a spoke wrench. That's why I'm okay with them being all black brass.

Yendor72

I wanted to make an update to this as I have a little issue and wonder if anyone else here has had a similar issue.

I was hearing some odd noises coming from my front wheel for the past month or so. At first it was only when I was out of the saddle and putting more pressure on my front wheel but the last ride it was constant. I pulled the wheel off and had noted while I was riding when I would hear the noise. It wasn't a pinging like a bad spoke but more of a grind. It would occur around the time the sticker was passing over the road. Anyway, I pulled the wheel off and looked at the spokes nearest the sticker; my wheel is black so I noticed some aluminum around those spokes above the sticker.

I took it to my LBS since this was built in Oregon and I live in Minnesota and assumed that I would be paying out of pocket for this repair. The tension and trueness of the wheel was checked and all was good with the exception of the tension of those 2 spokes above the sticker, they were only slightly different though, 1/2 lb or less. You can definitely see that the nipple is trying to come through though. The mechanic I spoke to said that it may be the seam of the rim, the sticker is right over it and the spokes are the ones closest to it.

I looked on Velocity's website and noticed they have a lifetime warranty, so I called Tom from GVH and spoke to him (after dropping the wheel off at the LBS). Tom said that yes they may warranty it, but that it all sounded a bit strange to him as he has never seen this situation before. I still will be speaking to the wheel builder at the LBS before he does anything and I may suggest we try a warranty replacement for this. I am sure I will be out labor, but there are worse things that can happen.

Has anyone here had a seam separate on a wheel before? Or have odd issues like this happen in the past? I would think that a Velocity Dyad would not have these issues, its an appropriate rim for a tandem bike!!!

Yendor72

An update for those following my issue. I had to have the rim replaced and had the wheel rebuilt by the local LBS to the tune of $150. They didn't realize that Velocity has a lifetime warranty and never called me about working with them for the replacement. They also never called me for a consult by their wheel builder. Oh well. I need to ride my bike more than complain about my LBS.

Yendor72

One more update to my saga. I emailed Velocity to see if they would have replaced the rim. After some pictures and a back and forth conversation they are shipping me a new rim. They were more than willing to stand behind their product. They were surprised that the Dyad had suffered any issues under my weight. I think I have my rim makers for the rest of my life. Made in the USA does mean something. I actually stretched out the process more because I wanted them to know that I was sincere and wanted them to understand the issue completely.

My wheel was never out of true or "failed". I didn't want to risk having a catastrophic failure while riding. I had the hub and spokes re-laced to a new Velocity Dyad rim and have put about 30 miles on it and it is nice and true as well.

chaadster

I think you're being too generous with GVH, the original builder. I was pissed when they didn't get the spoke nipple color right, but then to have a front wheel with uneven spoke tension and nipples pulling through when new? No way. That's crappy work. Even if you want to blame the rim-- which I doubt is at fault, but may be-- GVH should not have built a front rim that required uneven tensioning, or exceedingly high tension.

Further, you make no mention of them doing anything to correct the problems (yes, plural) nor help you resolve them.

I'm not impressed with them at all, and would not order from them based on what has been revealed here.

Yendor72

Sorry, you're way off base. I did speak to Tom at GVH about the issue. The wheels have about 2000 miles on them. I guess I don't get as mad about the minor things as you do. Yes, I blame the rim completely. The Wheel was still true and the only spokes that were not the same tension were the ones on each side of the seam. And they were slightly out, all other spokes were the same tension. As it is I had the whole bike serviced less than 400 miles ago which included a wheel truing. Tom was more than willing to help out, but I made a choice (due to logistics) to use my LBS and have them do the rebuild instead of adding about 2 weeks for shipping to Oregon. I have a need to ride my bike and losing 2 weeks off of it made me less than happy. It is also the reason I didn't go straight to Velocity with the issue. They have a lifetime warranty, by the way.

Velocity also had no issues in sending a replacement. In fact I have tracking information for the replacement already.

Bottom line, I would definitely work with GVH again and will gladly ride Velocity Rims.

Here's the picture of the seam.

chaadster

Okay, I guess I misunderstood what the problem was; I'd thought you said the nipples were pulling through, which I thought would be symptomatic of overtensioning an out of true/round rim.

I'm not sure what I'm seeing in the pic, or what that means to build quality or wheel integrity, but I'm not a wheel building expert, so no shocker there. I have been riding seriously for about 30 years, and have bulit wheels, so common and various problems and failures are not unfamiliar to me, but this is neither, so I may have been trying to force this into a more familiar, tidy explanation than I should have, especially with such little info.

That aside, though, screwing up one of the major components of a made to order wheel is straight up sloppy; no heads-up, no explanation or anything? That's just not cool, IMO, whether you call it a "little" thing or not. It smacks of carelessness and an inattention to detail which must further raise the specter of that kind of attitude in other matters of the build.

That's in no way to assign blame for the issue to GVH, but that such a rare problem arose in an incorrectly done custom build is not an affirmative endorsement of the shop. But they're your wheels, and it's your time and money, and if you feel that you've gotten a good deal in this, who's to argue?

EDIT: I should add that I'm speaking sincerely, and not being crass or sarcastic: if you're satisfied that's the bottom line. I'm not suggesting you should not be, because sh*t definitely happens, and being able to roll with it is an admirable trait.

Yendor72

Once I get the new rim I will post a side by side comparison. What you see in that picture above is the aluminum where it has been rubbing together. The wheels are made then painted. So that seam should be relatively invisible. I believe this is a very odd failure. At 225lbs I would think I should not be able to damage these tandem bike rims. Being that it is a front rim and all.

chaadster

So you think the joint has failed, and the sleeve is not holding the rim ends together securely? Can you manipulate the joint by hand? So what was the aluminum at the spoke holes where you said it looked like they were pulling through?

I'm just trying to get my head around the mechanics of what's happening; what did Velocity say? Are they replacing it because it's in a failure mode, or out of caution?

Yendor72

It's a very strange situation. In that picture you can see, on the right had side where I rubbed the joint to see if I could feel anything, little specks of aluminum. That joint was obviously moving. Its not easy to move the joint by hand, you have to put some weight on it and it was creaking really bad the last time I rode on it. I could watch my wheel go around and hear and see when it made the noise due the Dyad yellow sticker being right at the joint.

Without the spokes on the rim anymore it is hard to take pictures of the spoke holes where they were coming through.

Yes, Velocity believes it failed due to a quality issue. I think the chances of this happening to another one of their rims is slim to none. I do toss my bike around a bit. On climbs I am using every bit of my bike to get max power to the wheels. This may be a result of that, but I still don't see why the front would fail and not the rear. So I would really point towards it being a mechanical failure of the joint itself. I am not 100% sure how the joint is formed.

chaadster

I'm pretty sure the Dyad is sleeved, i.e. there's a fitting inside the rim cavity, that's pressed and bonded into place, joining the ends. It certainly could have loosened, allowing one end of the rim to slip a bit, but I agree it's probably a very rare failure.