PaulRivers

It...can be, but it can also make things worse. My parents went to couples counselling when I was a kid, it took disagreements and turned them into bigger problems. It's a real mixed bag.

joeyduck

Try bring married to a psychologist.

canklecat

All of that sounds very familiar. Been there, through a lot of it. Wish I could offer some foolproof advice, but it didn't work for me.

Very, very few families/friends genuinely understand a relationship in which the man is the primary person responsible for domestic/household duties.

As a primary caregiver for a succession of elderly relatives who didn't want to go to nursing homes, I've learned to shrug off those concerns. I long ago reconciled myself to the reality that most family members will default the burden of home caregiver to one person, rarely offering any assistance, while simultaneously criticizing and questioning the motives of that caregiver. They'll only show up when there's loot to be divided, usually birthdays, Christmas and deaths.

I don't race anymore, or even ride particularly fast or aggressively, and seldom participate in group cycling activities. But regular exercise is absolutely essential to my physical and mental well being, and cycling suits me better than anything else. It's low impact, the sensation of moving unencumbered by the confines of a car, and the energy boost afterward, make me more effective in my health care duties. I won't apologize or make excuses for taking the time needed to take care of myself. Anyone who refuses to comprehend that won't be part of my life.

Regarding in-laws, that's a tricky one. Based on two failed marriages in which in-laws (including my own family) contributed some tensions, I'd say the best thing for many couples is to get as far as possible away from both sides of the family/in-laws. Too much closeness is seldom a good thing. If I'd been more attentive to the mistakes I'd made during my first marriage - particularly regarding in-laws - my second marriage might have weathered some tough times through job losses, health challenges, etc. Recriminations and what-ifs rarely contribute anything positive.

Best of luck to you and your immediate family.

esther-L

My husband and I have had the conversation where he thinks I ride "too aggressively" and that I take the lane too much of the time. We talked about it for a while, about how I have looked at some of the crash data. My husband later took a Cycling Savvy class with me. Hearing the instructor lay out what that program teaches about reducing the chances of accidents helped him to see my point of view.

From the constable's description of the accident, I think you were not able to stop quickly enough for the bus that slowed in front of you. Loaded panniers and wet pavement affect stopping distance.

I am a slow rider. I'm never going to race. I do practise the emergency stop technique a couple of times per year, to make sure I remember how to do it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4qfV8KbEH4

The reason that I'm slow is some longterm effects from a childhood pedestrian-bus accident. I am alert and I drive and bicycle defensively because I don't want to get hurt in a crash. I already have a disability, and I don't want it to become a bigger disability.

About the family issues - I don't have a lot to contribute. I know that many people exist who look down on people who happen to have a disability. I know that many people look down on men who do caregiving and homemaking. It is really important to have exercise when you do caregiving. I hope that you are able to get some exercise, whether it's part of your physical therapy or something else.

RubeRad

Joey, I feel for you in your situation, both as having been in a terrible accident, and having conflict with the wife about riding.

My situation is probably quite different from yours, but FWIW, here's my take, I hope some of it will be helpful for your situation.

My wife is also concerned for my safety while commuting, but I don't think as much as yours (then again I don't think I ride as aggressively as you). It's good that your wife has been a bike-commuter herself in the past, that gives you an ability to talk about biking in an informed way. I would try to get your wife involved in a conversation about bike safety, so that she can feel like she's being heard and has some respected input into your riding. Like talk to her about lights and reflectivity, let her help choose what lights you have and some of what you wear (hi-vis jersey? reflective vest? helmet mirror?). Talk to her about routes and problem intersections, let her weigh in on what routes you should take, what strategies you should use for various intersections (where to position yourself at the red light, when does lack of bike lane dictate taking the lane, when to cross traffic into a left turn lane vs when to go straight through the intersection and wait for a green light for a longer left turn, etc). What are stretches of road where it's not an issue to head down and sprint, vs when is it better to plan to take it slow and focus on negotiating with cars? When we drive through areas that I bike, I often point out to my wife issues that I deal with on my commute, like "in this intersection I wait here at the red light so I can head into the bike lane there" or "coming down this hill I look for a break in traffic to move left, or if the timing is wrong, sometimes I just end up waiting in this spot until it's clear" etc. I think that it helps to show her that I think about things and am not just blindly ripping along.

Maybe it would be helpful if you could do some rides together, starting on a weekend, but maybe also some trial runs during commute time, so there can be some real-time feedback about how you two differently perceive and respond to road threats. Also talk about apps like mentioned above, maybe she will get some security if she has some way of keeping tabs on you while you are riding. For me, my wife just likes me to call before I leave work. Once I didn't call so she didn't have any idea when to expect me home, and she was worried and upset, so now I try to remember to make a quick phone call every time, not because it makes any difference, just because for her it gives her peace of mind.

Plan to make some sacrifices, defer to your wife for some things, just because you love her, and this is a way to show her.

Riding aggressively in traffic induces risks. Risks don't have to be your fault, you may be the best cyclist in the world, but by definition almost all the drivers in the world are not the best drivers in the world, and you have to consider the risk that them screwing up will impact you (like it did). Since you probably are still recuperating physically, and have to ride differently (slower) now anyways, it's probably a good opportunity to take stock of safety issues and riding style.

exarkuhn15

This is exactly my thought. I am an "assertive" cyclist, but not an aggressive one. Take the lane when I need to, have 24/7 lights on, etc., but I don't ride in a "pushy" way. Could you just slow down a bit? Ride more slowly and focus on visibility rather than competing for speed?

PatrickGSR94

My wife has said before how she worries when I commute to work. I control the lane ("take the lane" to some people) 100% of the time, except on a super-wide lane 16 feet or wider, with no cars parked on the side. I'm a slow rider, so I don't think I could ever be described as "aggressive" but I am definitely assertive. I believe that this is a large part of what has kept me safe these past 3 years of bike commuting.

Like Esther's experience, my wife took the Cycling Savvy class with me back in June. She's never been real comfortable riding in traffic, but seeing the principles laid out and then riding together with our small group around St. Louis really helped her see things the way I do.

She's still not really comfortable in traffic. But she knows how I ride why I do what I do, i.e. she knows that riding in the gutter or near parked cars is unsafe. So I think all that helps her not worry as much.

Yeah, a bike ride could always potentially be the last time your spouse or anyone else sees you. But always remember that a car trip, or any other time you leave the presence of another person, COULD be the last time that person sees you. A motor vehicle is definitely not an oasis of safety, not by a long shot.

treadtread

Lots of good comments in this thread. My two cents:
A lot of what your wife said is out of worry, focus on the worry and ignore the specifics. It is hard to be objective when emotional. Given the circumstances, her request to not ride is reasonable. Consider driving in for the immediate future - you may be able to commute again later. Life isn't that short. And you can always ride for fun - bike paths may be boring, but they might be the reasonable compromise you need here.

Whatever you decide, good luck.

Edited to add: don't worry about the work related comments much right now. Only you know how true that is - but her bringing it up is probably clutching for the proverbial straw to stop you from cycling in.

DogBoy

I have seen some of your videos. I would tend to agree with your wife. I'm not here to judge though, since you ride in a different place than I do. My suggestion is that you tell your wife that you hear her. Think back or look through some of your ride vids. Find a few spots where you were over the top, show them to her and acknowledge them. If you can find a few where you even agree you were over the top, even better.
[Edit]Ignore that above...had you confused with JoeyBike[/Edit]

I went through this when I wiped out on my motorcycle. Ultimately I ended up selling the motorbike mostly to maintain peace in the relationship. I came to this conclusion based upon the realization that it was really just for my fun, and that it really would do a number on my family if I were injured. motorbikes and bicycles are very different. When I was hit by a car on my bicycle, I walked through what happened, what I did, what I could have done differently and she finally agreed that this was just a fluke due to an inattentive driver. From a health perspective I need to ride to prevent my already oversized frame from getting larger. We agreed that I would keep riding to work, but that I'd review my routes with her so she knows where to look for me if anything ever went wrong, and so she could see where any danger spots might be as places to start looking if I was delayed.


I'm guessing she's saying the same thing about you. Open the door by giving on something. Then talk through the issues. It sounds like her priorities are that you are safe and live a long life. I bet yours are too. You share the same goal, there is a solution here, you just have to get past the impasse.

PatrickGSR94

Something else to note - I text my wife when I get to work, and when I'm leaving. We can also track each other using the Find My iPhone apps on our phones, at any time, to see where the other (or their phone) is located.

wphamilton

You're probably thinking of a different "joey", who frequently posted videos and advocated running red lights. Some of them were pretty exciting. Joeyduck hasn't posted anything much more aggressive than passing people on his cargo bike.

DogBoy

You are correct. My bad. I stand by the rest of the advice though.

wphamilton

This isn't going to help, riding more slowly, "focus" on visibility, advising him to be less "aggressive" when no one knows how aggressive he actually is let alone why (what the traffic and conditions are). Nor how "assertive" he is.

I don't mean to single anyone out, but how about a reality check here. You're talking about going 12-15 mph instead of 18-22. None of those speeds will have any meaningful affect on having enough time to react, or to stop or maneuver for that matter. I think that people here are letting their imaginations run away with them.

Frankly, the most likely thing going on here - not certainly, but most likely - is an emotional, not entirely rational fear. Of course one has to take it into consideration, take it seriously, in any relation but ultimately we cannot allow ourselves to be controlled by irrational fears. Our's, or somebody else's. I think that Joey, more than any of the rest of us, has an idea of whether it is or isn't a fear grounded in reality.

RubeRad

I was confused too, I initially thought joeyduck was the guy from New Orleans who posts "geek-hunting" videos of ambushing posers in spandex on tri bikes and riding faster than them. But then I saw that joeyduck is from canadia, so a different guy.

Leisesturm

Joey. I was saddened to see the "one of our BF members has been hit" thread. I did not participate. I don't really know you, but deep down I shared your wife's opinions, and rather than be a hypocrite I stayed away from the thread. I read her blog, I've read your posts in that thread, and I've shared with my wife details of your recovery. She is blind, and each morning she trusts me to maneuver us both through urban Portland traffic on our tandem. She trusts me to safely captain our club racer tandem on longer rides with other couples in the summertime. It is a big responsibility. At tandem gatherings you can always hear stories of wrecks where the stoker was hurt worse than the captain or a couple where the captain was unhurt but the stoker broke a wrist or a collarbone. There is nothing worse.

I am very dismayed by this thread. Mainly because it shows your mindset is little altered by your experience! Really?! I was rather upset with a poster in the other thread who even hinted that a guys wife might leave him after an accident like yours. Why go there. But, Joey, not absolutely throwing yourself 100% behind anything your wife says, even if it is wrong is indefensible. Your wife is always right. The stoker is always right. Do we really need to tell you that?

I so hate to be proven right. Wake up Joey. You have been given an incredible gift. It's yours to lose. I've had two bad falls on singles when my wife wasn't around. I got nothing but sympathy and support from her and my account of things was never questioned. Why? Because when I am with her she sees how I roll. Full disclosure: I have taken her through a number of red lights and stop signs. It is possible to ride assertively, even aggressively, such that a non-cyclist or cyclist observing you does not think that you are riding in an unsafe manner. It's a fine line.

My advice. Stop posting in this thread. LISTEN to what the other posters are telling you. Go to your wife. Apologize to her if you put up even token resistance to what she was telling you. You may have your legs but you don't have any legs to stand on in any opinion she might have. It probably took incredible candor (or anger) for her to even risk telling you what she thinks of how you ride in traffic.

tjspiel

Great Post Leisesturm.

I suppose when you are blind you have to learn to trust other people. I would be scared crapless to ride on a tandem without being able to see and having to trust my wife or anyone to keep us safe. Kudos to you both for making it work and for being able to enjoy being on a bike together.

Though we often downplay the risks, staying safe on a bike is a theme in many BF posts. Whether it has to do with equipment, visibility, positioning, or technique. Making a mistake in traffic can have very serious consequences that aren't there to the same degree in a vehicle. Just being able to see what's around me is sooo critical. When the people that matter to us fear for our safety that is something we need to take seriously.

PaulRivers

I think you've failed to consider that the OP's wife is very very very different than your wife, and the dynamic is very different as well.

Just because it sounds like your wife generally supports, is enthusiastic, and believes everything you say by default (unless there's a big reason not to) doesn't mean that his wife is the same way.

I wouldn't go into this if you weren't going over-the-top "whatever the woman says is a message directly from god" about it, but frankly the OP's description of the situation made me think that he's a little antagonistic, but his wife even moreso, and their back and forth is causing him to take more and more risks just to feel mentally balanced - risks he likely would not feel the need to take if not for his antagonistic back and forth with his wife.

Just because you feel that you're a little dense, and your wife is a great person, and you have to tell yourself this whole speech to listen to her, doesn't mean that everyone else's relationship is like that or wife is like that. And I earlier suggested to the OP that he should chose a different activity with less extreme risks if things go wrong to do instead of biking if he wants to take that kind of risk.

Not everyone else's wife is your wife.

Leisesturm

Who are you trying to convince? You must have told me four times in your post that I shouldn't think everyone's wife is like mine. With all due respect, I think I know that. However, in this instance, the point is moot. The o.p.'s wife is behaving the way any wife would in the same situation. I had only read one page of posts when I posted earlier. I went back and read the rest. I don't know about Canada but I know about the U.S. In America 75% of divorces are initiated by the wife. 75% of men didn't see it coming. If the o.p. wants to keep his marriage he will consider marriage counseling, in addition to, or even instead of, individual counseling. IMO the o.p. is very, very good at communicating with everyone except his spouse. That needs to change, I think.

PaulRivers

Your post is "I understand everyone's wife is not mine, but also everyone's wife is just like mine and that's the cause of divorce". It's not longer than 1 sentence after saying you know everyone's wife is not exactly the same as yours before you push that everyone's wife is the same as yours and that's the cause of divorce.

I'm not interested in getting pulled into gender politics like you're trying to do. I don't think it's welcome on the forum, and I've never seen it lead anywhere productive.

RubeRad

And in this post where there's a lot more at stake than batteries vs dyno or disc brakes vs rim, let's not turn it into a pissing match.

1983

A very wise individual told me, on the eve of my wedding, "son, sometimes you'll have to eat a lot of crow."

Additionally, something I hold dear to is, above all things, preserving the dignity of my wife. I never air our laundry out for others to see/hear. I keep a small circle of trusted friends to whom I privately take my concerns. Food for thought.

You may feel like you're being safe, but your wife has expressed this is not the way she sees it. If it is truly a point of tension then you are faced with a decision to either appease her or perpetuate the tension. Critical thinking and learning to observe yourself and your behaviors from an outside perspective will serve you very well here. I cannot count to you the number of times I've been in your shoes and neither the wife nor I are willing to budge; ultimately I've made the decision to relent as the troubles these kinds of tensions produce are just not worth the effort to remain "right." Especially in the age of the ease and social normalization of divorce.

Reading this post it seems that I may be pointing the finger at you, when what I intend is to express that I try to always default to giving my wife the right of way no matter what.

Kindaslow

Even within the "yes ma'am" crowd, the divorce rate is high in our country. Your wife, as a psychologist, understands that you cannot be a good husband, nor father, if your needs are not met, too. Bicycling is not some radical or ridiculously dangerous activity, you just had an event. Now, the two of you need to work together to find a win-win situation so both of you can feel good about it. If not, this problem will reappear throughout your marriage in the future.

RubeRad

I went back and read the original thread, I was struck by a few of your posts near the end like this one,

I would keep going down this path. I think your accident has made you more aware of risky behaviors than you were before. Even if these are risky behaviors you didn't do yourself before, other people were doing them before, but now you are more aware of them than you were before; thus it is reasonable to assume that you will be more aware of risky behaviors in general, and in your own riding. And talking with your wife about it will (a) reassure her that your mindset is changing, and (b) allow her to give you good advice that will help you ride safer, and (c) allow her to take comfort from being able to give you advice, and be heard.

tjspiel

FWIW I don't think it's a matter of always deferring to your wife, it's more a matter of recognizing that expecting her to see it your way is a wasted pursuit.

Always deferring is going to lead to resentment that will have a negative impacts on other aspects of your relationship. A more productive, but often difficult approach (in the short term) is to acknowledge that both of you have a legitimate perspective and to try and come up with a solution that addresses what it is that is most important to each of you. An big part of that is to not dig your heels in on things that don't matter to you as much even if you believe you're in the right.

So if what the OP really needs is the exercise and time to clear his head, there are probably other ways to accomplish that rather than commuting by bike. Those other ways might be "safer" but require a little more effort on his wife's part to give him those opportunities.

AlmostTrick

I agree with this and would like to add another thought on the matter. There is no reason to hurry to attempt to "work it out". Allow time to slowly change feelings. Your desire to ride will be apparent to your wife, and she will see you taking steps to address her concerns. I wouldn't even talk about (me) riding for a while if I was in your spot.

But I would drop little comments here and there, like maybe when you guys are out together and see another cyclist on the road, or see a nice bike somewhere. Also, I'd still be working on bikes in the garage. Working to that perfect win-win can (and should!) take time.