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Old 08-11-16, 11:34 AM   #1
theycallmewonka
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Hybrid vs Mountain for short commute (bumping up kirbs)

Hi. I am looking into joining the Cyclescheme and getting myself an easier/faster to cycle bike but i'm finding it hard to decide what is more suitable for me. I was looking into Hybrids as a lighter bike is something i would really like but these seem like they are more suitable for staying on roads and lighter potholes etc and i do roads but honestly try to avoid them if i can as i'm not comfortable using them so often bumping up onto kirbs if i can. I am ideally wanting a bike that is lighter than my current bike (a yellow and red Apollo Vendetta bought years ago) but still sturdy enough to handle the bumps. I'd prefer not too buy a bike far better than i need but as it is using the Cyclescheme i have the option of going to 1000 if the benefits were worth it. Any general indication of what type/price range of bike i'm looking for would be helpful.

Thanks

Tony
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Old 08-11-16, 11:37 AM   #2
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Hi. I am looking into joining the Cyclescheme and getting myself an easier/faster to cycle bike but i'm finding it hard to decide what is more suitable for me. I was looking into Hybrids as a lighter bike is something i would really like but these seem like they are more suitable for staying on roads and lighter potholes etc and i do roads but honestly try to avoid them if i can as i'm not comfortable using them so often bumping up onto kirbs if i can. I am ideally wanting a bike that is lighter than my current bike (a yellow and red Apollo Vendetta bought years ago) but still sturdy enough to handle the bumps. I'd prefer not too buy a bike far better than i need but as it is using the Cyclescheme i have the option of going to 1000 if the benefits were worth it. Any general indication of what type/price range of bike i'm looking for would be helpful.

Thanks

Tony
What is the Cyclescheme and how does one join?
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Old 08-11-16, 11:58 AM   #3
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I call them curbs. And what does your current bike weigh? Or should we guess?
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Old 08-11-16, 12:09 PM   #4
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Cyclescheme is a UK scheme to help get more people cycling to their workplaces https://www.cyclescheme.co.uk/.
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Old 08-11-16, 12:24 PM   #5
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Personally, I don't worry too much about bike weight. I go with the Grant Peterson philosophy: When it comes to bikes, most of the weight of the vehicle is the "engine" anyway. Getting a bike that's five pounds lighter only reduces the overall vehicle weight by couple percent or so. A huge difference if you're racing the Tour de France, but not really a game-changer for the work commute.

In my case at least, it's a lot cheaper and healthier to try to shave those five pounds off the engine instead.

YMMV
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Old 08-11-16, 12:26 PM   #6
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I call them curbs. And what does your current bike weigh? Or should we guess?
I've just put the bike on some scales and it's around about 18.5KG.
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Old 08-11-16, 12:34 PM   #7
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Personally, I don't worry too much about bike weight. I go with the Grant Peterson philosophy: When it comes to bikes, most of the weight of the vehicle is the "engine" anyway. Getting a bike that's five pounds lighter only reduces the overall vehicle weight by couple percent or so. A huge difference if you're racing the Tour de France, but not really a game-changer for the work commute.

In my case at least, it's a lot cheaper and healthier to try to shave those five pounds off the engine instead.

YMMV
I'm a relatively small person anyway 5,6 although i've been putting on the weight the last few years (i'm about 10.5 - 11 stone so maybe it's just wishful thinking that it's my bike that's the problem lol. To be honest i've never had much strength in the legs anyway so just hoping a lighter/better made bike would help with my cycling a bit, especially on the steeper roads.
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Old 08-11-16, 01:49 PM   #8
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I've come across these 2 bikes that seem to get good reviews. Quite a price difference as well.

VooDoo Canzo Full Suspension Mounta... 14.5kg

VooDoo Bizango 29er Mountain Bike 13.2kg

My dad's more into using his racer bikes and thinks a hybrid would be the best option for me so if anyone has any recommendations for sturdy hybrids that might be a good choice it'd be useful for comparison.
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Old 08-11-16, 02:29 PM   #9
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Hybrid that takes 37 mm tyres is a sturdy bike. It will roll a bit faster than a MTB, but will be tough enough for urban riding on poor roads.

Shimano MTB Deore hubs, 36 spokes, double walled aluminium rims and you're good to go.

26" MTB wheels are even tougher, but 37 mm 28" wheels are tough enough for most things, including riding down stairs.
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Old 08-11-16, 02:38 PM   #10
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Hybrid that takes 37 mm tyres is a sturdy bike. It will roll a bit faster than a MTB, but will be tough enough for urban riding on poor roads.

Shimano MTB Deore hubs, 36 spokes, double walled aluminium rims and you're good to go.

26" MTB wheels are even tougher, but 37 mm 28" wheels are tough enough for most things, including riding down stairs.
Thanks for the info that was exactly what i needed to know. As long as a Hybrid with those specs or better can handle the bumps it gives me more options i can look at.
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Old 08-11-16, 09:18 PM   #11
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- A full suspension mountain bike is not a good idea. Any cheaper rear suspension will absolutely eat your power while biking (source: I've taken my cheaper full suspension mountain bike road biking, and there's a significant speed difference between having the rear shock on and locking it out off).

- You don't want knobby tires for road riding either. Any slick is faster than knobbies. Fatter slicks are slower than skinnier slicks, but fatter slicks handle roads bumps, sticks, braking, and overall comfort better, it's basically a tradeoff. 40c is the largest side I'll use, but I'm not jumping on and off the road, so maybe 50c (2") would be better for what you're talking about.

- Front suspension is similar - normally it's not necessary for road riding, but if you're jumping up and down off curbs then maybe it would be helpful. Front suspension is not the power drain that rear suspension is so it's not a big deal to have it.

I go towards the hybrid, but I'm not jumping up and down off curbs, so maybe a front suspension mountain bike with slick fatter tires would be best for that.

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Old 08-11-16, 10:47 PM   #12
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Cyclescheme is a UK scheme to help get more people cycling to their workplaces https://www.cyclescheme.co.uk/.
Sounds like a great idea. Wish we had that here.
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Old 08-11-16, 11:26 PM   #13
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I'd avoid both front and rear suspension for urban riding.

Unless you're jumping kerbs at full speed, hitting them straight on, there's no need for suspension, nor tyres wider than 37 mm.

I climb 25 cm tall kerbs with lowering my speed, no problems. Even with 28 mm wide tyres. Now my rear has "grown" to a 32.

Last bike (got stolen) had 37 mm tyres - it was bomb proof. Hybrid. And even with such wider tyres, it rolled faster than a 26" MTB with slicks.
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Old 08-13-16, 02:21 PM   #14
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- A full suspension mountain bike is not a good idea. Any cheaper rear suspension will absolutely eat your power while biking (source: I've taken my cheaper full suspension mountain bike road biking, and there's a significant speed difference between having the rear shock on and locking it out off).

- You don't want knobby tires for road riding either. Any slick is faster than knobbies. Fatter slicks are slower than skinnier slicks, but fatter slicks handle roads bumps, sticks, braking, and overall comfort better, it's basically a tradeoff. 40c is the largest side I'll use, but I'm not jumping on and off the road, so maybe 50c (2") would be better for what you're talking about.

- Front suspension is similar - normally it's not necessary for road riding, but if you're jumping up and down off curbs then maybe it would be helpful. Front suspension is not the power drain that rear suspension is so it's not a big deal to have it.

I go towards the hybrid, but I'm not jumping up and down off curbs, so maybe a front suspension mountain bike with slick fatter tires would be best for that.
Thanks for the advice. Trying to take it all in but im thinking Hybrid may be the right choice for me with good sized tyres.
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Old 08-13-16, 02:22 PM   #15
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Sounds like a great idea. Wish we had that here.
I've only just learned about it myself due to my looking for a good commuting bike but we have had it here in the UK for some time.
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Old 08-13-16, 02:25 PM   #16
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I'd avoid both front and rear suspension for urban riding.

Unless you're jumping kerbs at full speed, hitting them straight on, there's no need for suspension, nor tyres wider than 37 mm.

I climb 25 cm tall kerbs with lowering my speed, no problems. Even with 28 mm wide tyres. Now my rear has "grown" to a 32.

Last bike (got stolen) had 37 mm tyres - it was bomb proof. Hybrid. And even with such wider tyres, it rolled faster than a 26" MTB with slicks.
Yeah, i make sure to slow down before jumping up a Kurb even with my mtb but my inexperience with bikes left me unsure if Hybrids are really made for that but you guys have reassured me and i think it will be the hybrid type i will go for. Now to trawl more site trying to find one that i like the look off
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Old 08-16-16, 10:22 AM   #17
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I am ideally wanting a bike that is lighter than my current bike (a yellow and red Apollo Vendetta bought years ago) but still sturdy enough to handle the bumps.
Yellow and red? Too bad, if you had the blue and pink Apollo Vendetta, that would have been a lot better.

JK. Googling for pics, your bike looks like a rock, and not in a good way. Unnecessarily full-suspension, super heavy, and not efficient at all.

For a budget of 1000 (pounds or dollars), there are tons of excellent options. That Voodoo Bizango looks fine if it appeals to you, just make sure you get the right size so you can ride it comfortably. Maybe consider replacing with an urban tire if you want less rolling resistance, or hybrid tires (smooth/hard/fast-rolling in the center, knobs on the side for light trail use)

The full suspension of the Canzo is definitely overkill for commuting, in terms of more suspension than you need, as well as more weight than you want. Even the front suspension of the Bizango should be more than you need, if you can improve your skill at handling potholes, curbs, etc.
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Old 08-16-16, 02:33 PM   #18
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The British spelling is "kerb," and the American spelling is "curb."

Don't ride up them when you're commuting. Just don't. Riding down them isn't that smart, either. If you have a bike that can survive riding up curbs (I'm American), you're riding a bike that's unnecessarily heavy for commuting. If you're riding a bike that is suitable for commuting, you will damage it if you ride up curbs. You can ride down most curbs but very slowly. You have to go slowly enough that you might as well just pick your bike up over the curbs going down.
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Old 08-16-16, 04:26 PM   #19
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Yellow and red? Too bad, if you had the blue and pink Apollo Vendetta, that would have been a lot better.

JK. Googling for pics, your bike looks like a rock, and not in a good way. Unnecessarily full-suspension, super heavy, and not efficient at all.

For a budget of 1000 (pounds or dollars), there are tons of excellent options. That Voodoo Bizango looks fine if it appeals to you, just make sure you get the right size so you can ride it comfortably. Maybe consider replacing with an urban tire if you want less rolling resistance, or hybrid tires (smooth/hard/fast-rolling in the center, knobs on the side for light trail use)

The full suspension of the Canzo is definitely overkill for commuting, in terms of more suspension than you need, as well as more weight than you want. Even the front suspension of the Bizango should be more than you need, if you can improve your skill at handling potholes, curbs, etc.
Yup, it is a heavy bike at that. Bought it in the days before using Google and being able to research for quality over something that just looks good.

Think this is the bike i'm going with https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle...-bike-EV244091 . Not too expensive 600 + new bike lock and mud guards + some accessories takes it to 700-ish and does what i need it to do with the larger tyres.
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Old 08-16-16, 04:29 PM   #20
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The British spelling is "kerb," and the American spelling is "curb."

Don't ride up them when you're commuting. Just don't. Riding down them isn't that smart, either. If you have a bike that can survive riding up curbs (I'm American), you're riding a bike that's unnecessarily heavy for commuting. If you're riding a bike that is suitable for commuting, you will damage it if you ride up curbs. You can ride down most curbs but very slowly. You have to go slowly enough that you might as well just pick your bike up over the curbs going down.
Yes i think i will be sticking to the road more with this new bike and definitely avoiding big bumps up any kerbs. Still going with the Hybrid though as i prefer the bike to just be that bit more rigid. Think i will be going with the bike below, it seems to tick the boxes while not being overly expensive.

https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle...-bike-EV244091
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Old 08-16-16, 04:36 PM   #21
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Don't ride up them when you're commuting. Just don't. Riding down them isn't that smart, either. If you have a bike that can survive riding up curbs (I'm American), you're riding a bike that's unnecessarily heavy for commuting. If you're riding a bike that is suitable for commuting, you will damage it if you ride up curbs. You can ride down most curbs but very slowly. You have to go slowly enough that you might as well just pick your bike up over the curbs going down.
Sorry but it's not what you ride but how you ride it. I ride up...and down... curbs all the time on everything from a dual suspension mountain bike to race bike to a fully loaded touring bike. But I ride each one the same way. I unload the front wheel by "popping" it up when going up the curb and hopping the rear wheel up when it gets close. And I unload the front wheel by leaning back when going off the curb followed by leaning my body weight forward so that the rear wheel drops lightly off the curb.

It's not impossible to even do it with a bit of speed if you have the timing right. Just make sure that you land lightly with your arms and legs absorbing the impact rather than the wheels.

But you are right that you shouldn't just slam into the curb and hope that the front wheel rides up and over it even with a dual suspension mountain bike...that's a good way of meeting oral surgeons
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Old 08-16-16, 04:38 PM   #22
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@cyccommute, you're right, it's possible to develop that skill, but it has to be learned. I don't recommend going over curbs to most people, because I can't teach it, and I've seen it done wrong so many times and had to fix people's bikes as a result. If I'm speaking to someone with the skill, I don't recommend against it.
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Old 08-16-16, 05:33 PM   #23
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Yup, it is a heavy bike at that. Bought it in the days before using Google and being able to research for quality over something that just looks good.

Think this is the bike i'm going with https://www.evanscycles.com/pinnacle...-bike-EV244091 . Not too expensive 600 + new bike lock and mud guards + some accessories takes it to 700-ish and does what i need it to do with the larger tyres.
That looks like a fine bike too, it will work very well as a commuter. Interesting feature that it has dedicated mounts for a 'crudcatcher'.
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Old 08-16-16, 11:51 PM   #24
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The British spelling is "kerb," and the American spelling is "curb."

Don't ride up them when you're commuting. Just don't. Riding down them isn't that smart, either. If you have a bike that can survive riding up curbs (I'm American), you're riding a bike that's unnecessarily heavy for commuting. If you're riding a bike that is suitable for commuting, you will damage it if you ride up curbs. You can ride down most curbs but very slowly. You have to go slowly enough that you might as well just pick your bike up over the curbs going down.
Yes - very slowly, like you explained.

However, potholes in my city, poor roads, road crossings made so you have a kerb you can't avoid, with cars coming on, so you have to be quick - all boils down to the fact that a kerb proof bike is not unnecessary for my city commuting - unfortunately.
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Old 08-17-16, 07:47 AM   #25
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@cyccommute, you're right, it's possible to develop that skill, but it has to be learned. I don't recommend going over curbs to most people, because I can't teach it, and I've seen it done wrong so many times and had to fix people's bikes as a result. If I'm speaking to someone with the skill, I don't recommend against it.
You can't learn a skill if you never do it. It sounds like theycallmewonka is already riding over curbs so it would help if theycallmewonka learned how to do it properly. Like I said above, it's not all that hard to learn how to do it.

And, if you learn how to unload the wheel while going up or down curbs, it comes in handy if you happen to hit potholes. The same principles apply there.
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