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 Commuting Bicycle commuting is easier than you think, before you know it, you'll be hooked. Learn the tips, hints, equipment, safety requirements for safely riding your bike to work.

 10-25-06, 05:33 AM #1 bike2math Senior Member Thread Starter   Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Texas Bikes: Posts: 959 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Finally hit I've been bike commuting on and off for seven years now, and year round for two. And today I finally got winged! It was where the MUP crosses a road and runs parallel to the exit ramp off a freeway, when I got the green light I went and a lady in a white minivan turned right and smacked me with the grill/bumper. She was nice, she stopped, she seemed more concerned about me than I was, although she was distressingly dissmisive of the damage to the bike The Damage: My bike rack was bent way the heck out of shape, as were the stays on both fenders (of course a strong wind will bend the fender stays). Both wheels are knocked severly out of true, and my half dozen blinkies were scattered to the four winds (I've found one and pieces of one other but the rest must have been left in the intersection). The bike is basically unrideable until the wheels are trued and the rack is either repaired or removed. The fenders have been giving me trouble lately so I'm a little happy to take them off and rework the atttatchement. The Good: Thank god it is winter, with the layers of clothing I had on I don't even have a bruise anywhere. I'd like to give a shout out to the Planet bike alias, I saw the thing hit the pavement on the end of my handle bars and it is still working (just a little scuffed up). Also my steel frame appears to have not even by scratched, yeah steel! Also kudos to the driver for offering me a lift, even though it was quite a ways out of her way. Finally three huzzahs! for my wife who offered to take the bike to the shop today during her lunch break while I'm busy with some meetings with people coming in from out of town. The Annoying Part: This was the last intersection on my commute that I had to go through. damn! The Lesson: I was rushing, I started across the intersection as soon as I had the light instead of checking that the right turners have seen me like I usually do. If you are late, don't rush at the intersections. and beware the right turner.
 10-25-06, 05:41 AM #2 ryanparrish Life is short Ride hard   Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: In the middle of nowhere Bikes: not enough Posts: 1,114 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Did you call the police?
 10-25-06, 06:49 AM #3 LittleBigMan Sumanitu taka owaci     Join Date: Mar 2001 Bikes: Posts: 8,945 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Man, I know what you mean. Nice people who really regret hitting you can be a problem to be wary of. Glad you and the bike are ok. Hat's off to your wife. I probably would have gotten a lecture about my current life insurance plan. __________________ No worries
 10-25-06, 07:00 AM #4 jyossarian SERENITY NOW!!!     Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: In the 212 Bikes: Haro Vector, IRO Rob Roy, Bianchi Veloce Posts: 8,756 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Glad to hear you're ok and the bike is relatively fine. Did you call the police and file an accident report? I know the driver was nice and all, but you still have to file a report. __________________ HHCMF - Take pride in your ability to amaze lesser mortals! - MikeR We demand rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty!
10-25-06, 07:00 AM   #5
cooperwx
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 Originally Posted by ryanparrish Did you call the police?
I don't think I would have. The damage is ~$100, the lady was very nice, and like the OP I would have felt it was partly my fault. Maybe I'm a wuss...or maybe just not litigious  10-25-06, 07:02 AM #6 Ms. Tude Banned. Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Rochester, NY Bikes: Posts: 77 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) I've had a relatively bad year for commuting. Outside of the abbi-normals who scream at me to get on the sidewalk (I ride busy city traffic), I've had a couple of contacts (last one was a couple weeks ago - stupid woman in 4lane traffic snapped my mirrior as her ear was buried in her shoulder/cell phone) had at least three very close calls, was a "deer in the headlights" as I looked up to see a PT Cruiser in a full skid towards me and had one car, powered by Jerk, purposely swerve into me ---- of which I reported to the police. Who did nothing. And I'm on the Board of Directors of a bicycle club, and work with Criminal Justice. Not one damn thing, even when I went to the main office and had the cop on duty agree that YES THIS WAS ROAD RAGE. I've lost a lot of respect for the laws that are supposedly there for us cause it needs someone who cares to enforce them. Am currently mounting a project aimed at enlightening motorists of bicycling rights --- Illinois League of Bicyclists is currently distributing this video ---- aimed at enlightening motorists of bicycler's rights -- and I luv it and want to incorporate it into my 2007 activities --- plan on incorporating the Advocacy chair as well. My not too pleasant year of commuting --- fortified by people pulling over - even holding up traffic to call me unpleasant names reinforces my anger to start a new campaign to let drivers know we're out there and are not going away. Video: http://bikelib.org/  10-25-06, 07:05 AM #7 chipcom Infamous Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ohio Bikes: Surly Big Dummy, Fuji World, 80ish Bianchi Posts: 24,366 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Glad you're ok. Gotta watch them intersections. __________________ "Let us hope our weapons are never needed --but do not forget what the common people knew when they demanded the Bill of Rights: An armed citizenry is the first defense, the best defense, and the final defense against tyranny. If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government -- and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws" - Edward Abbey  10-25-06, 07:38 AM #8 rule Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Wylie, Texas Bikes: Posts: 1,922 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) And yep...late in the ride is when a lot of this stuff tends to happen too. Glad to hear that you made it out okay. __________________ 10-25-06, 07:46 AM #9 bike2math Senior Member Thread Starter Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Texas Bikes: Posts: 959 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Quote:  Originally Posted by cooperwx I don't think I would have. The damage is ~$100, the lady was very nice, and like the OP I would have felt it was partly my fault. Maybe I'm a wuss...or maybe just not litigious
Yup, if it had been any other intersection I would have had asked her to call or called them myself. But at this particular intersection I've been aware of the danger and normally dealt with it carefully. The first words out of my mouth were "Stupid bike2math, you knew better than that!" Damage to the bike amounts to a new rack, and two wheels in need of truing, I would guess at or near 100 dollars.

To top it off I was late (had a mechanical glitch earlier in the ride that had me stopped for 10 minutes) and before I declined her offer to call the police I checked that my knees, hips, back, and neck hadn't taken the impact. It appears my bike took the hit. \begin{petsbike** good steel steed, good. \end{petsbike**

10-25-06, 07:53 AM   #10
slvoid
2-Cyl, 1/2 HP @ 90 RPM

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Quote:
 Originally Posted by cooperwx I don't think I would have. The damage is ~$100, the lady was very nice, and like the OP I would have felt it was partly my fault. Maybe I'm a wuss...or maybe just not litigious OP: Wow, you too huh, happened to me this morning! Glad you're not litigious, neither am I. Accidents happen, no harm no foul, not worth the time.  10-25-06, 07:58 AM #11 Flimflam Raving looney Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada Bikes: 70s Leader Precision w/Shimano 600 (road), IRO Rob Roy (Fixed) Posts: 2,482 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Refreshing to hear of the 'human' nature of the driver, at least the effort was there. Glad to hear you're OK, hope the rig gets fixed up for you soon, blinkies an' all!  10-25-06, 08:37 AM #12 TRACKMAN hide not your essence Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Dodge City Bikes: Airborne,Guerciotti,Jamis,Merckx,Paris Sport,Raleigh,Vitus Posts: 155 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Am currently mounting a project aimed at enlightening motorists of bicycling rights --- Illinois League of Bicyclists is currently distributing this video ---- aimed at enlightening motorists of bicycler's rights -- and I luv it and want to incorporate it into my 2007 activities --- plan on incorporating the Advocacy chair as well. My not too pleasant year of commuting --- fortified by people pulling over - even holding up traffic to call me unpleasant names reinforces my anger to start a new campaign to let drivers know we're out there and are not going away. Video: http://bikelib.org/[/QUOTE] Excellent; I have passed the link on to W.A.B.A. ( Washington Area Bicycle Assoc) __________________ May you find the joy and peace you long for. Life is a journey ... NOT a guided tour. .......__O .......\<, ....( )/ ( )... 10-25-06, 12:10 PM #13 noisebeam Al Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: AZ Bikes: Cannondale SuperSix, Lemond Poprad. Retired: Jamis Sputnik, Centurion LeMans Fixed, Diamond Back ascent ex Posts: 14,118 Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 899 Post(s) Quote:  Originally Posted by TRACKMAN Am currently mounting a project aimed at enlightening motorists of bicycling rights --- I don't think from the at fault drivers perspective* this kind of accident is as much about cycling rights as it is about poor driving habits and/or poor intersection design. This sort of sounds like a right turn on red without checking if sidewalk/MUP is clear or about to be entered. But this is unclear to me as well - is the MUP crossing signal controlled where MUP gets a green and vehicles crossing get a red, or do both straight/turning vehicles and MUP get a green at the same time? I doubt this person stopped at the stop line of the intersection and looked carefully, or perhaps they even had a green too? *However the design of the MUP where it crosses the road may be a cycling 'rights' issue. If cyclists are crossing without dismounting and walking as a pedestrian (which most likley may be required by law - need to find out as this is a MUP with a signal control, not a sidewalk) -then cyclist will enter intersection much faster than pedestrians and even attentive drivers may not be able to see them coming from behind. At minimum the design should give possible turning vehicles a red light when MUP has a green and have clearly posted "No Turn on Red" signs and/or "Watch for Cyclists" Not a perfect solution, but the lowest cost stop-gap that can be immediately implemented. Al 10-25-06, 12:27 PM #14 mikdes Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Oregon Bikes: 2003 Jamis Nova - commuter setup Posts: 270 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Quote:  Originally Posted by jyossarian Did you call the police and file an accident report? I know the driver was nice and all, but you still have to file a report. I don't know Ohio laws, but many states require an accident report (different from a police report) only if someone is injured or if total damage exceeds a certain dollar figure. I think here in Oregon the figure is$1000 now. So if this were to happen in Portland and there was no injury, an accident report would not be required.

As far as an officer on the scene, in Oregon typically the police will not be sent unless there is an injury or an impedence to traffic. So, again, they likely would not have responded to this call.

 10-25-06, 12:55 PM #15 wibnrml Senior Member   Join Date: May 2005 Location: Lake Tapps, Wa Bikes: 06 Specialized Roubaix Elete Triple Posts: 66 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Nice video. You might add a segment on cars not to move over into the opposing lane to pass when a bicyclist is in the lane. I got buzzed by kid last weekend doing just that. Missed me by a foot, going at least 50. Thought I was a goner for sure.
10-25-06, 01:58 PM   #16
randya
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 Originally Posted by cooperwx I would have felt it was partly my fault.
If you're turning right on red, you're supposed to yield to through traffic before you turn. No fault should be assigned to the OP in this case, if s/he's stating the facts correctly.

10-25-06, 02:04 PM   #17
noisebeam
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 Originally Posted by randya If you're turning right on red, you're supposed to yield to through traffic before you turn. No fault should be assigned to the OP in this case, if s/he's stating the facts correctly.
The OP didn't give enough info to know for sure if the motorist also had a green or not.
Al

 10-25-06, 03:23 PM #18 vrkelley Enjoy   Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Seattle metro Bikes: Trek 5200 Posts: 6,164 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) To the OP...Glad you're OK. Trust no cagers, or peds.
10-26-06, 05:01 AM   #19
bike2math
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 Originally Posted by noisebeam The OP didn't give enough info to know for sure if the motorist also had a green or not. Al
The MUP crosses a road at this intersection, it is essentially a glorified crosswalk. As with a crosswalk the bikers/peds are to the right of the traffic on the exit ramp to the free way. Provided you hit the button when you get there, you will get a pedistrian "walk" signal at the same time that the motorists to your left gets a green light.

Under Ohio law, a bicycle in a cross walk is a pedestrian, and a motorist must yield to a pedestrian in a cross walk, regardless of the status of the walk light. There is also a specific statement that says something like, "Drivers turning right with a green _must_ yield way to any pedestrians in the cross walks at all times." So legally she was without a doubt at fault.

when I first started this route I had a handful of close calls at this intersection where right turning drivers hadn't expected to see someone in the cross walk. So I started making sure I had eye contact with the lead turner before going in to the intersection. This worked until the one day I was in a hurry.

 10-26-06, 05:51 AM #20 dalmore Neat - w/ ice on the side     Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Big Ring. Little Cog. Bikes: 2005 Dahon Speed TR, 2006 Dahon Mu SL, 2000 GT XiZang, 1999ish Rock Lobster, 2007 Dean Animas CTI Posts: 1,200 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) bike2math - glad you're not seriously hurt. And thank you for posting this. You reminded me why I'd been avoiding this intersection I went through today. It was uneventful today and I was wondering why I didn't take that route more often. But I had forgotten about how inattententive drivers are taking right turns there. Right turns that would have them driving right over me if I'm not careful. __________________ Current favorite bumper sticker: Wag more. Bark less. Change you can believe in - Bigfoot Nessie 08
 10-26-06, 06:04 AM #21 bike2math Senior Member Thread Starter   Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Texas Bikes: Posts: 959 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) dalmore-- I use the MUP because it cuts my commute down to just five lights and only a mile and a half of street riding. Saves me a load of time, although the distance is a touch longer, and just in general gives me fewer hassels. The one draw back are two very sketchy intersections, the one I had the incident in, and another one that I've posted about before. Once the bike is rolling again I'll mix up the route a little to see if there is a better way, but i'll probably end up back on the MUP before to long. We just have to remember to be careful at all times. I need a note on my handle bars that says, "In a rush? SLOW THE F@CK DOWN!!!"
10-26-06, 06:34 AM   #22
cooker
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by cooperwx I don't think I would have. The damage is ~\$100, the lady was very nice, and like the OP I would have felt it was partly my fault. Maybe I'm a wuss...or maybe just not litigious
It was his mistake but not his fault. he could have avoided it by being more careful, but she was the one who broke the law.

 10-26-06, 08:55 AM #23 vrkelley Enjoy   Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Seattle metro Bikes: Trek 5200 Posts: 6,164 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) OK Someth'n's up. This forum had 3 crashes this week. We all better hope HelmetHead doesn't bust'in here from the Safety Forum and ramp up! Hope next week is better for all.
10-26-06, 05:02 PM   #24
noisebeam
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Quote:
 Originally Posted by bike2math The MUP crosses a road at this intersection, it is essentially a glorified crosswalk. As with a crosswalk the bikers/peds are to the right of the traffic on the exit ramp to the free way. Provided you hit the button when you get there, you will get a pedistrian "walk" signal at the same time that the motorists to your left gets a green light. Under Ohio law, a bicycle in a cross walk is a pedestrian, and a motorist must yield to a pedestrian in a cross walk, regardless of the status of the walk light. There is also a specific statement that says something like, "Drivers turning right with a green _must_ yield way to any pedestrians in the cross walks at all times." So legally she was without a doubt at fault. when I first started this route I had a handful of close calls at this intersection where right turning drivers hadn't expected to see someone in the cross walk. So I started making sure I had eye contact with the lead turner before going in to the intersection. This worked until the one day I was in a hurry.
I don't and never did doubt that the motorist was at fault.
What I do question is if this design is part of the problem. Drivers often hit peds/cyclist in sidewalk when they turn right on red. Having them turn right on green at same time peds/cyclist get green seems like a very poor, even negligent design - contrary to how traffic/ped flow should work.
Al

10-26-06, 05:10 PM   #25
Serendipper
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 Originally Posted by cooker It was his mistake but not his fault. he could have avoided it by being more careful, but she was the one who broke the law.
\

Just remember that when I was hit by a truck recently, and insisted on a police report...the officer wrote ME a ticket and assumed I was at fault. He did not write an accident report, and after two court visits and a dramatic , overblown hearing with a dim prosecutor and strict judge (who feels bicycles in the street are unsafe)...I finally won my case.

I am non-litigous as well, but damn... In my opinion, try to keep the facts to you and your lawyer. You could get burned. The driver could even sue you.

I'm still in negotiations to get my hospital bills, bike,and missed income replaced. Fingers crossed, eyes open.
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