R.A.D.

I've been commuting to work for some time. My commute is short somewhere in the range of 6-7 miles round trip. I was originally commuting on a sporting good store mountain bike with slick tires. Once I got a bit more dedicated to bike commuting I decided to get a good road bike.

Since getting my new bike it has encouraged me to take longer rides whenever I have the time. 20+ miles (I know the roadies would laugh at me) but that's pretty far when you're in New York City traffic.

On these longer rides I have noticed once I get back that both my knees are sore. I read a bit about saddle positioning being important for the knees, so I checked mine out closely and realized my saddle was way to low (knees were bent too much). Raising my seat up has helped quite a bit and the ache has not been as bad.

I will continue to make adjustments as necessary, but my question is do knees develop and get stronger as you continue to ride or can I possibly be doing major damage to them? The pain is not intense to the point where I can't walk. It's just uncomfortable.

Some background:
I wear jeans when I ride. It's been a bit cold, so perhaps I should be wearing long johns. I read that the cold can do a number on knees.

I'm in my late twenties. 165lbs 5' 11".

Your input would be appreciated.

newbojeff

Key to know if you're using clipless pedals. The 2 biggest contributors to knee pain for me are seat position and, probably more so, cleat alignment.

R.A.D.

No. I have toe clips on my bike. My pedals are MKS Sylvan track.

chipcom 

Try spinning in a lower gear. Covering the knees helps, but with the little bit of winter we've had so far jeans should do that just fine.

newbojeff

I would still think that your foot alignment might still have something to do with knee pain, even with toe clips. Anyone who rides with toe clips experience knee pain given differing ankle position?

R.A.D.

Yeah I think the next thing I'll try are thin long johns. The cold seems to be an issue for my knees. The colder it is the worse it seems.

R.A.D.

Do your knees develop or get used to the exertion after a while?

R.A.D.

I'll keep an eye on my foot position. I did notice that at times my ankle tends to pivot outward, so I have been trying to concentrate on keeping my feet straight.

jimmuter

In my experience, no. I just got accustomed to having a little discomfort. I also found that stretching helped A LOT. If you're taking a long ride, stretch periodically.

yes

Well, I would say that strengthening your legs would help if the pain is just caused by over-exertion. If you continue to over-exert in the mean time, you can develop tendonitis that would need rest to feel better.
Like any sport, you have to start slow, and increase your mileage slowly. For running, a 10% per week increase is generally accepted with a rest week (20% lower mileage) every month or so.

If you don't get the bike and pedals fit correctly, then stronger legs probably won't do much good.

R.A.D.

As jimmuter said I think I need to stretch more. I don't follow a strict stretching regime prior to riding.

As yes suggested I think I may be overexerting too soon as well. It's sometimes hard to tell because I usually feel fine while riding. It's after I get off and rest for a while that I notice knee pain. I'll have to pay attatntion to how fast I increase the length of my ride.

yes: I'm working on the fit and with every slight adjustment I make it gets better and better.

Thanks for all the advice.

Artkansas 

My left knee was hurting because of having to start out my commute with a long uphill climb. Of course I keep the revs up and the gears low. What did help is that I got a Futuro knee support and wear it. I think one important part is that its gentle pressure keeps any fluids from accumulating around my kneecap. Recently I discovered that I was now going up my biggest hill on the commute to work in one gear above low with my revs still up. So I guess I'm getting stronger. It also keeps the knee a little warmer.

R.A.D.

I was thinking of trying those out. I wrapped my knees in ace bandages one morning and it seemed to help, but they didn't stay in place perhaps those would work better. Thanks.

JeffS

My experience with knee problems is weight lifting related, not cycling. I've found that my knees do get stronger with exercise, right up to the point I re-injure them with weight I know I shouldn't be pushing.

I'd say that regular rides within your limits should help things, but each time you overexert you're taking two steps back. Continued damage will cause long-term problems.

Many people do it, but I personally wouldn't ride in jeans. They're going to bunch around the knee and cause pressure. If you don't want to wear tights, how about a tight/longjohn/etc baselayer underneath a baggier, lightweight pant... like a baggy cargo or something?

rog

Personally, I think the post ride stretch is more important than the pre-ride. At least for me, just starting out slow, taking about a two mile warm up period, and then stretching when I'm done is far more effective than stretching before a ride. YMMV

R.A.D.

I'll have to learn my limits I suppose. I don't really have any issues while riding it's always after the fact. I'll have to plan my rides a bit more before I go out.

I just ordered some long johns for the colder temps. I think the cold makes it worse. I'll have to give pants made out of softer material for the outer layer a try. Thanks.

R.A.D.

I'll have to look up some stretching techniques because I don't really know what I'm doing. Any sites you know that show how it's done properly?

cooker

I'd argue against the jeans...they are stiff so they can bunch up and cause pressure or else chafe. They also get hot and wet so they can cause saddle sores or yeast infections.

Where do your knees hurt?

R.A.D.

It's hard to say where they hurt. Seems to be right below the knee cap. My knees also seem to pop and crack a bit when I bend them.

gerv 

I've recently experienced similar symptoms. Here's what I'm doing:
* wearing more clothing on my legs (which also helps keep my feet warmer)
* doing stretches, particularly quad and hamstring stretches, after a bike ride
* added a gluscosamine pill to my daily vitamin list.
I have the same clicky sensations in my shoulders too sometimes. But the above items helped somewhat.

firemaplegirl

+1

Never stretch 'cold' muscles, they need a warm up at minimum. While there is some argument over whether stretching should be done before or after the bulk of the workout, I've always found it both more effective and convenient at the end of the workout. This allows me a chance to cool down prior to showering. Plus, all the trainers I've worked with through the years (although none cycling specific) have recommended post workout stretching. Of course, YMMV.

cooker

If it's just behind the kneecap, you may have a common condition called chondromalacia patella (roughness on the back of the kneecap), which isn't necessarily serious, but you could read up on it. That kind of fits with the popping and grinding you experience.

If it's below the kneecap towards the shin, that's possibly a strained patellar tendon, the chord-like band of tissue that holds the kneecap and connects the quadraceps muscle on the front of the thigh bone (femur) to the shinbone (tibia). Mine sometimes gets sore in the fall when I switch from road bike commuting to mountain bike commuting, and I think it's because at first I expect the mountain bike to be as quick and responsive as the road bike, so I mash too hard rather than dropping gears when I reach a hill or try to accelerate quickly. So to echo chipcom, perhaps you need to use lower gears.

Also you say your ankle turns out and you are trying to force it back. Sometimes our bodies know best, so what about letting your ankle find it's most comfortable position?

R.A.D.

Thanks everyone for your advice!

I think a lot of the issues are probably due to my inexperience based on all the feedback you all provided. I have this mentality of "Whatever… I'm just going to get on my bike and ride until I drop." I'm clearly not taking proper preparations i.e. clothing, post ride stretching, proper riding technique, saddle position, setting limitations etc.

Again thanks for the advice. Hopefully with experience and treating by knees with a bit more respect it'll get better. It's just a bit scary I really love bicycling and I wouldn't want to take myself out before I even start.

tlc20010

Don't rule out Iliotibial Band Syndrome, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iliotibial_Band_Syndrome

The IT band is not easy to stretch, but it needs it. check the part of the article on rehabilitation options.

greenstork

Pain right below the kneecap is not indicative of an IT Band issue. IT Band issues are usually associated with pain on the side of the knee.