ok_commuter

I've got Ultra Gatorskins (25s) on my Salsa La Cruz. Most of my ride is either paths, crushed gravel or dirt. But there are long sections where it's pretty much off-road and I have to act like I'm on a mountain bike. Is that OK? Am I going to blow up a tire or bend a rim? The gatorskins aren't the softest riding tire in the world anyway and they feel a little like cast iron off-road like that.

This is my first cx bike and I'm not yet used to treating this thing like a mountain bike, though it sure seems to respond when I do. I just want to make sure I'm not being abusive to my new baby.

envane

You can destroy your wheels just as easily hitting potholes on the road as offroad on roots or rocks. My main concern would be lack of traction, especially when cornering.

JeffS

Your description really doesn't give us an idea what you're riding over.

Offroad could mean hardpack, roots, or rock gardens. If most of my ride weren't on asphault I wouldn't be running anything smaller than a 28. My Las Cruces current has 35's and the only action it sees is asphault and the occasional speed bump jump. The wider the tires, the less thought you'll have to put into picking lines, avoiding obstacles, etc. You'll likely trade just a little bit of speed for the benefit.

For reference, I'm not someone who always runs huge tires... the fixie I commute on half the time has 23's on it.

ok_commuter

Ya. It's something like
- 1/2 asphalt or paved path
- 1/4 hardpack, dirt (mud today)
- 1/8 packed less than hard, muddier
- 1/8 sections of several hundred yards of rock garden that I would call "easy to moderate" on my mountain bike

I can always get off and walk across the short nasty bits, which I did once today. Most of it is pretty OK on these tires, though "picking a line" does require some care and I keep *expecting* to have traction problems, though it hasn't really happened yet.

I'm a little torn, b/c I can also come to work on all surface streets and these tires would ROCK that version of the ride. I'm way too lazy to change tires a lot. Maybe the Marathon Plus in something like 35 would be a good all-around compromise?

I keep wishing for the original knobby 31s, but I didn't like the street feel of those tires very much at all.

As always, suggestions welcome... apologies for another "which tire" thread...

AEO

25c is plenty for paved, hard pack dirt, light mud, loose dirt, hard gravel and loose gravel.
I've done it, just keep the momentum up and don't let go of the bars.
once you stop in certain sections, your tyres won't have enough friction to get started again.


...It's up to the skill and common sense of the rider.

climbhoser

I think 32 would be plenty for an everything tire, but it sounds like you're fine on your 25s. I ride gravel paths, some moderate singletrack stuff and more on my 25s with no problem. You're only gonna blow it up if you push it too hard, but it sounds like you have a good feel for the bike.

ok_commuter

Cool, thank for the info. Not sure I have a good feel for the bike yet, but the bike certainly has a good feel! I'm babying it a bit I imagine, partly b/c the ride to work is downhill and can be nice and leisurely (read: less sweaty) if I keep the hammer at bay...

I did get passed by a couple of fast mountain bikers, but I assume they turned off somewhere b/c I never caught them once I hit the smooth stuff... ;p

CastIron

As others have mentioned, you'll be fine, but do mind the cornering and such. My CX bike has been railed on 32c slicks down ditches and ATV tracks. My full carbon race bike on 23c tires has been through ditches, grass, gravels roads, and whatnot. I only try so hard to avoid such things, but I do try on the road bike.

ok_commuter

Thanks everybody for the info. I'll probably keep looking around for the perfect everything tire, but I'm gonna ride these as long as I can. They are muy nice once I get out of the dirt and onto Austin's crappy street surfaces.

knatchwa

All the numbers, I know some of the basics but further info would be appreciated.

climbhoser

We're talkin' about width in millimeters. A 21 mm tire is your typical race stock, whereas lots of 'cross racers are on something really wide like a 35mm with some knobbage.

Tourers seem to be happy on 28-32 (always exceptions to this) and some people, for comfort's sake, go up as high as they can like 45mm.

The wider the tire the less PSI it's rated for, so you can get a good, comfy ride out of a wider tire, but the narrower tires will lose less in acceleration and wind drag at speed.

I think that's 'bout it for the basics!

Jonahhobbes

Just a thought: I run 23's on my la Cruz, (hmmm I thought they only came in 25's and never checked no wonder they looked so skinny ). Anyhow I emailed they guys from Salsa about recommending a tire size who said:

"23 is too narrow for that rim. You really shouldn't run anything under a 28 or so and even that creates a pretty vertical sidewall that probably won't ride all that great."

What do people think? I actually like the feel of them, but they are mental on a bumpy road and I would never go off road with them.

I've also picked up another set of tires which I am going to try out probably tomorrow and flog the gatorskins to a roady if they feel better.

ok_commuter

Well, that's straight from the horse's mouth, isn't it? I just made a couple wrong turns on the MUP and went at least a couple miles out of my way, which had to be retraced. So my ride home was something like 12 miles today... at least... and it took 1.5 hours. I'm f'ing tired right now, and feel pretty beaten from off-roading those hard tires.

Somebody recommend a good combo tire in the 32-35 range. Marathon Plus?

The good news? A. It was only maybe 90-ish degrees. B. I've been dying to ride more since I got this bike, so I guess I can't complain.

Jonahhobbes

yeah the bike is beautiful I wish I had moved over from a hardtail years ago.

bkrownd

There was a period of time when my commute included a 15 foot section of gravel rocks. After a couple weeks I had torn up the sidewalls (those brown threads) on my Continental 4-Season 25mm pretty bad, and put some dings in my braking surface. After that I walked it through the gravel bit every time.

M_S

In regards to specialized's comments, I'm of the persuasiont hat as long as you have enough PSI you can run any tire on a rim as long as it's wider than the rim. I suppose it might not be an "ideal shape" but...whatever. It's obviously working fine for you.

And if you can shred continental ultragatorskins, I'd be impressed. As other have said traction is a limiting factor, but not toughnesss of the tires (or bike in this case).

ok_commuter

Anybody ride these Ritchey SpeedMax Delta 700?

https://ritcheylogic.com/web/Ritchey%...3838&live=true

Sixty Fiver

I am running Schwalbe CX Compe 700:35's on my Trek and they roll amazingly fast (at 75 psi), are very comfortable, and have such excellent hookup that I have ridden on the singletrack and trails with them (at 35-40 psi) and had the bike corner on hard pack like it was on rails.

I plan on using these tyres for long tours as what I might give up for speed (nominal) I will gain back in comfort and the ability to handle pretty much any kind of terrain.

climbhoser

Marathon Plus would be my ideal, but they are a tad heavy. The others I think you'd be happy with would be Conti Gatorskins or Ultra Gatorskins (28mm max, though). The Marathon Supremes got pretty good reviews, too, but I think the smallest size is 32mm, and while lighter and grippier they certainly don't wear like the Plus nor do they protect like the Plus. The Marathon XR is a pretty sweet tire, too, but only comes in 35mm and up. It isn't speedy like a true slick, but it'll handle the double duty of trails and road REALLY well, and I think it's the best bang for your buck for an all around tire...and honestly, from what you said about your riding I think it would be a blast.

Interestingly, I always made pretty good time on my 17 mi. commute with my MTB. Surprisingly it didn't get much faster when I went to my road bike. I think a good 32 or 35 tire pumped solid will give you everything you need. You won't feel super zippy on the road, but it'll certainly make up for it in comfort and fun when off the road.

As for tearing up the sidewall on 25s....I ride about 1/2 a mile of gravel road (unmaintained, closed section of road) on my Bontrager Hardcases, have been for almost a year (same pair) and they're fine!

In fact, I don't think the Bontrager Hardcases get represented enough...I am truly impressed with this tire. Great rolling resistance, reasonable weight (negligible, to me), and unbelievable flat protection.

The other day I rolled right through a field next to the sidewalk to queue up at a light (lots of cyclists) and all of them were shocked...said "you must have airless tires or plenty of patches!" Since goatheads are not in season, and my Hardcases are trusty I paid them no heed. Not to say I haven't had a few punctures, but the tires are dern resilient.

chipcom 

Try Continental Contacts in 32

ok_commuter

35 will be about perfect if I can cram them under some yet to be chosen fenders.

I've got the ultra gators 25s now, maybe the 28s would be a little better... but I do see what the salsa folks are talking about re: verticality, even though it's awesome fast and effortless on the road as it is. but i find myself riding the trail a lot more than i thought i would b/c it's (temp) cooler and shaded, very pretty, not much more distance. the trail is rougher than i remember from years back, probably mostly b/c recent storms tore it up badly.

i need to find a couple nice road routes where i can fly... but i doubt i'd fly all that much less on 35s.

climbhoser

https://www.schwalbetires.com/node/1320

ok_commuter

Holy crap those are expensive.

M_S

I think it's cool that Schwalbe has a thread going where they try to answer people's questions. Good approach to customer service.

pinkrobe

I'm a big believer in the versatility of road/CX bikes and skinny tires. I run 25C Ultragatorskins on my commuter, and they stay on the bike until there's more than 1" of snow on the ground. In the past I've had to ride through gravel, hardpack, a little singletrack, over some roots and on/off curbs on the way to work. As long as there were no steep climbs on the way, I would always stay with the skinnies. They handle most surfaces very well, even when cornering. True, it's possible to get some two-wheel drift going on if I hit a corner too fast, but you get used to it soon enough.