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Old 08-20-10, 02:41 PM   #1
Santaria
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to avoid hijacking the BD thread

So I'm down to the wire on buying my new bike (saved and now its time to enjoy the profit of riding)

It's down to two bikes

Surly LHT (My dream bike. Something I've done a lot of research, talked to a lot of folks and really just am impressed with this bike all around. I have a Karate Monkey and couldn't be happier with it)

2010 Motobecane Fantom Cross Outlaw. I know it seems odd, but this bike looks REALLY sharp and offers the disc brake setup I wanted on a road bike. The only problem I have with this bike is I hate (HATE) the fork. I'm not a fan of carbon fiber. At a wet/dry weight of between 185/225 lbs. depending on the time of the year, and what I'm doing, I don't want a fork that is going to break down on me.

Here's the catch. I use my bike for everything. I ride to work, school, grocery store. I'm looking into a trailer and my wife has even agreed NOT to utilize her mini-van anymore than we absolutely need to. So what that means is that the bike has to either hold up to a load on a rear rack, or be stable enough to hold me+my backpack with anywhere from 15-45 lbs. of junk/books/food at any given time.

So my question - which would you jump on? There is a $200ish dollar difference. I figure I might put my money where my mouth is and be able to give a valid report on the strengths of the BD.com bike under commuter/lifestyle use.
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Old 08-20-10, 02:49 PM   #2
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The Motobecane has a double chain ring.

Does the SLHT have a triple?
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Old 08-20-10, 02:52 PM   #3
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My input is go for your dream bike...... the $ difference will be made up rapidly with your stated usage.
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Old 08-20-10, 02:55 PM   #4
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Why over think?

You are happy with the karate monkey, and have done alot of research into a LHT.
Why not get the trucker? I don't know how much time you spend riding in the rain,so I can't tell if you need discs or not.
But if I were you ,I would go the LHT route. It does everything you want it to, has a proven track record, and some resale value.
The moto I am not so sure on.
In the long run, it will be the comfort, load hauling, and reliability of the bike that will give you the good feeling.
Not the pretty looks.

It's JMO;

BTW; I have a cross check and wish I would have bought the trucker.
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Old 08-20-10, 02:56 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Santaria View Post
Here's the catch. I use my bike for everything. I ride to work, school, grocery store. I'm looking into a trailer and my wife has even agreed NOT to utilize her mini-van anymore than we absolutely need to. So what that means is that the bike has to either hold up to a load on a rear rack, or be stable enough to hold me+my backpack with anywhere from 15-45 lbs. of junk/books/food at any given time.
Sounds like you may want to consider an Xtracycle. --> http://www.xtracycle.com/
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Old 08-20-10, 02:57 PM   #6
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My input is go for your dream bike...... the $ difference will be made up rapidly with your stated usage.
+1...once you're spending that kind of money, is the dollar difference really significant? If you get the other you'll be thinking "damn, I wish I had an LHT" whenever you see one.

From experience...I wish damn, I wish I had splurged on some Campy whenever I ride my Koga Miyata.
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Old 08-20-10, 02:59 PM   #7
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It's a substantial investment either way. $200 is nothing to sneeze at but it's not so significant that I'd let it decide for you which bike to get.

So, let's say the bikes cost exactly the same. Which one would you get?
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Old 08-20-10, 03:05 PM   #8
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Honestly, the Surly. I just can't get over that fork. Ugh.
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Old 08-20-10, 03:50 PM   #9
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The Motobecane has a double chain ring.

Does the SLHT have a triple?
solution: buy the frame... build it yourself to your very exacting specifications and have a wicked awesome bike.

say it: wicked....awesome.

WICKED AWESOME /beefcake, Beefcake...BEEEEFFCAAAAKKKEEE
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Old 08-20-10, 04:35 PM   #10
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As a fellow former Clyde who has gone from 240 to 180, the carbon forks I have used (from a Winwood Dusty to the one on my Fuji Cross Comp to a no-name fork), I have never had trouble and love the way it takes the buzz out of the road. I was concerned about the stopping power of my V-brake setup with Kool Stop salmons and discs on the one bike, but the guys over in Mechanics assured me that I would go over the bars at this weight before a fork ever snapped on me.

Just to quell your concerns about the stability of CF on a fork. The Outlaw looks like a rad bike.
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Old 08-20-10, 05:01 PM   #11
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LHT is more of an all around bike I would say. Get it.
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Old 08-20-10, 05:29 PM   #12
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I too was facing the same decision earlier in the year- LHT of Synapse in my case; I went with the LHT for the simple fact that you can do anything on that bike. I have never even come close to regretting it. Love the bike, and have no lingering fear about sudden catastrophic failure of my fork.
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Old 08-20-10, 06:00 PM   #13
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If I hadn't lucked into my Koga-Miyata frame, I'd have gone the LHT route.
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Old 08-20-10, 06:08 PM   #14
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I'm pretty happy with my LHT. It was well worth the price.

10 Wheels, Yes it has a triple chain ring.

But I don't know anything about the Motobecane. It might be just fine for you.
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Old 08-20-10, 06:28 PM   #15
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Buy the LHT - you yourself describe it as a "dream bike."

But don't overthink carbon forks - I weigh in at 240 or so, and was riding with 30 lbs. of panniers as well when I bent the frame on my Jamis Aurora around the carbon fork. Trashed frame, no visible damage to the fork (and no, I don't plan to reuse it without getting an expert to inspect it - but I anticipate that it will get a clean bill of health if I do that).

FWIW, though, I replaced the bent bike with a LHT, and couldn't be happier.
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Old 08-20-10, 06:35 PM   #16
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Buck the trend to name brand love and get the Motobecane.
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Old 08-20-10, 06:50 PM   #17
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I vote the LHT unless you really think you need the disc brakes. Rim brakes are cheaper and easier to maintain. Modern rim brakes on aluminum rims are totally usuable when wet. It's not like the steel rim plus crappy center pull brakes of the 70's anymore.

Sure, after years the rims might get damaged from road grime but that's just a good excuse to upgrade. $200 more is worth it for something you describe as your dream bike.
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Old 08-20-10, 06:57 PM   #18
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My "crappy" Weinmann 990 center pulls with kool stops work nearly as well as any of my double pivot side pulls, as well as single pivot and better than the older center pivot side pulls...granted they're a bit trickier to adjust. This is assuming a decent aluminum rim.
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Old 08-20-10, 07:00 PM   #19
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...And just whats wrong with hijacking a BD thread??
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Old 08-20-10, 07:25 PM   #20
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...And just whats wrong with hijacking a BD thread??
That thread got me thinking about it, but its not fair to take something that I'm thinking about and chase a rabbit in the same thread.

My problem with the BD bike is the fork is not designed to hold a rack, or weight. My fear isn't that it's not able to handle my body weight, but rather - I don't think the fork is designed to handle loaded weight.


Where is the 'savings' associated with the bike. There is absolutely zero way that BD is able to sell a bike at less than 50% of his competitors without some part of the bike being below the standard of the rest. Is it in the rims? The hubs? The frame? The fork? Obviously the components are not the weak link. My true question is what really is?
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Old 08-20-10, 07:28 PM   #21
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If you're going to attach anything but a fender to the Cross bike, then the other option is your answer.
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Old 08-20-10, 07:45 PM   #22
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That thread got me thinking about it, but its not fair to take something that I'm thinking about and chase a rabbit in the same thread.

My problem with the BD bike is the fork is not designed to hold a rack, or weight. My fear isn't that it's not able to handle my body weight, but rather - I don't think the fork is designed to handle loaded weight.


Where is the 'savings' associated with the bike. There is absolutely zero way that BD is able to sell a bike at less than 50% of his competitors without some part of the bike being below the standard of the rest. Is it in the rims? The hubs? The frame? The fork? Obviously the components are not the weak link. My true question is what really is?
With the name brand, shop sold bikes, it's things like transport, distribution, reputation, retail markups, wages and shop overheads, wages and manufacturers overheads, some small attention to detail, esoteric name "value," territorial protection, price fixing, etc.

All these add to the cost, without affecting the product itself.
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Old 08-20-10, 07:46 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Santaria View Post
That thread got me thinking about it, but its not fair to take something that I'm thinking about and chase a rabbit in the same thread.

My problem with the BD bike is the fork is not designed to hold a rack, or weight. My fear isn't that it's not able to handle my body weight, but rather - I don't think the fork is designed to handle loaded weight.


Where is the 'savings' associated with the bike. There is absolutely zero way that BD is able to sell a bike at less than 50% of his competitors without some part of the bike being below the standard of the rest. Is it in the rims? The hubs? The frame? The fork? Obviously the components are not the weak link. My true question is what really is?
My Tourist came with crummy tires and brake pads the pedals sucked (too narrow) and the saddle wasn't very good. I changed the saddle to a Brooks B-17 from another bike I sold. The rims were not true and the preload on the front hub and the bottom bracket bearings was too tight. The fork stem is an old fashion style threaded 1" where the upper echelon models of touring bikes are normally 1 1/4" threadless I think thats the size anyway. The rims are plain jane but so far very serviceable. I changed out the crummy cheapo stuff for more quality items. With the changes I made I'm still way under what I would have paid for a LHT which is what I wanted but the budget wasn't going to bear it this year. So, yeah there are trade offs but what I have is a so far very reliable and extremely comfortable bike. As posted above the overhead of a storefront and employees and shipping costs are going to add up fast on a bike purchased from a LBS.
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Old 08-20-10, 07:46 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Santaria View Post
That thread got me thinking about it, but its not fair to take something that I'm thinking about and chase a rabbit in the same thread.

My problem with the BD bike is the fork is not designed to hold a rack, or weight. My fear isn't that it's not able to handle my body weight, but rather - I don't think the fork is designed to handle loaded weight.


Where is the 'savings' associated with the bike. There is absolutely zero way that BD is able to sell a bike at less than 50% of his competitors without some part of the bike being below the standard of the rest. Is it in the rims? The hubs? The frame? The fork? Obviously the components are not the weak link. My true question is what really is?
This is a great question...

I suspect that they are selling and buying at such volume that they're able to make a few dollars less and also get favorable pricing on components. I've also noticed that a lot of them do frequently go off brand for some things...like cheaper hubs, or no name stem. I think they're also often using no name frame materials which probably save some dollars. By selling strictly on line they don't have the costs associated with a bricks and mortar store.
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Old 08-20-10, 07:49 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by KonAaron Snake View Post
My "crappy" Weinmann 990 center pulls with kool stops work nearly as well as any of my double pivot side pulls, as well as single pivot and better than the older center pivot side pulls...granted they're a bit trickier to adjust. This is assuming a decent aluminum rim.
+1
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