Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Commuting Bicycle commuting is easier than you think, before you know it, you'll be hooked. Learn the tips, hints, equipment, safety requirements for safely riding your bike to work.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-02-10, 12:24 PM   #1
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
AirZound improvement, sooo cool, I gotta share it!!!

Credit for the discovery goes to colleen c. Perhaps this was common knowledge but new to us: she discovered that the AirZound airbottle was just a glorified soda bottle, same threading. She was also messing around with her solution so maybe she'll post some shots later, but here is my final product.

I had an empty 1.5L bottle in the office so I gave it a shot.

It was a bit tricky to unscrew the cap, they used some kind of adhesive or sealant. I wrapped the cap with old tube and gently unscrewed it with a wrench. There is a thin rubber seal inside, watch for that, don't lose it. These water and soda bottles are apparently rated at 80-100 psi or more. I wrapped it with a fiberglass reinforced packing tape to lower the chances of rupture or effects thereof

Keep in mind that some bottles are weaker than others, the one I had seemed thicker and harder than most.

I'm going to stuff it in my front pannier, this is too much of a monster to carry on the bike and sure to draw cops attention It's been holding 90psi for couple of hours now.

EDIT: That wasn't any sealant under the cap, it was just some glue to prevent the cap from being easily unscrewed: it wasn't distributed evenly and was hard, too hard to be a sealant, so the rubber seal is what keeps it sealed.

First test.



After wrapping



Size comparison, it should give around 3x more capacity.


Last edited by AdamDZ; 09-02-10 at 01:16 PM.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 12:38 PM   #2
irclean
Born Again Pagan
 
irclean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Southwestern Ontario
Bikes: Schwinn hybrid, Raleigh MTB
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
That is cool! Thanks to you and Colleen for the tip.

BTW, do you know if there is a replacement clamp for the Air Zound so that I can move it from bike to bike without having to move the clamp as well? Further to that, does anyone know if the little plastic detents on the clamp/horn wear out with constant removal and reinstallation? I don't want to leave it on the bike when parked outside.

Last edited by irclean; 09-02-10 at 12:42 PM.
irclean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 12:44 PM   #3
Wanderer
aka Phil Jungels
 
Wanderer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: North Aurora, IL
Bikes: 08 Specialized Crosstrail Sport, 05 Sirrus Comp
Posts: 7,594
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 20 Post(s)
I hope it works out for you - but you might have made something that will fail more catastophically, if it does. When reinforcing a pressure vessel, very heavy and thick materials are usually used.

That reinforcement might not be up to the task, and just make it strong enuf to be more dangerous. Kinda like schrapnel.

Just something to consider.

Yes, it might be fine; but, it might not!
Wanderer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 12:49 PM   #4
ItsJustMe
Seņior Member
 
ItsJustMe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Michigan
Bikes: Windsor Fens, Giant Seek 0 (2014, Alfine 8 + discs)
Posts: 13,360
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 203 Post(s)
FYI 2L soda bottles burst at about 160 PSI, at least when I tested them. However, at lower pressures they may burst easily if poked with something sharp or impacted, so I wouldn't run them much over 100.

I wouldn't worry about bursting much though. I've had bottles burst within a couple of feet of me a few times and PETE doesn't fragment, it just splits when it bursts. Your danger is to your eardrums and scaring the crap out of you if it blows, not really injury, though I suppose if it blew right next to your leg you might get a cut.
__________________
Work: the 8 hours that separates bike rides.
ItsJustMe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 01:02 PM   #5
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I will keep it at 80psi, I don't think that's too dangerous. Plus it'll be inside a pannier so I should be fine. 160psi? Oh wow, so I should be well within safe limits around 80psi.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 01:02 PM   #6
colleen c
I am a caffine girl
 
colleen c's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Bay Area
Bikes: 2012 Stumpjumper FSR Comp...2010 Scott CR1 CF...2007 Novara FS Float2.0...2009 Specialized Hardrock Disc...2009 Schwinn Le Tour GSr
Posts: 1,815
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I sure hate to be the driver that tries to cut you off. That's an earful of Airzound blast
colleen c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 01:03 PM   #7
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by irclean View Post
That is cool! Thanks to you and Colleen for the tip.

BTW, do you know if there is a replacement clamp for the Air Zound so that I can move it from bike to bike without having to move the clamp as well? Further to that, does anyone know if the little plastic detents on the clamp/horn wear out with constant removal and reinstallation? I don't want to leave it on the bike when parked outside.
Oh yes, that's what I did too. Get the directly from the manufacturer: http://deltacycle.com/. And yes, they do wear out with time.

Adam
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 01:07 PM   #8
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by colleen c View Post
I sure hate to be the driver that tries to cut you off. That's an earful of Airzound blast
Actually, the handlebars are quite close to my ears too I wish I could mount it further towards the front of the bike.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 01:22 PM   #9
irclean
Born Again Pagan
 
irclean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Southwestern Ontario
Bikes: Schwinn hybrid, Raleigh MTB
Posts: 2,242
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamDZ View Post
Oh yes, that's what I did too. Get the directly from the manufacturer: http://deltacycle.com/. And yes, they do wear out with time.

Adam
Thanks... I figured you'd know where to find one. I wish MEC sold the extra clamps because I got the horn there for less than $20.
irclean is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 01:37 PM   #10
achoo
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Bikes:
Posts: 4,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamDZ View Post
Actually, the handlebars are quite close to my ears too I wish I could mount it further towards the front of the bike.
You could always put it on the end of long stick pointed forward.
achoo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 05:52 PM   #11
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
OK, many hours later and it's holding the pressure. I had very uneventful PM commute so I didn't use it a lot. It's still at around 80 psi.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 08:18 PM   #12
dscheidt
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 1,374
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdamDZ View Post
I will keep it at 80psi, I don't think that's too dangerous. Plus it'll be inside a pannier so I should be fine. 160psi? Oh wow, so I should be well within safe limits around 80psi.
If I remember correctly, Coca-cola is carbonated with 3.7 volumes of CO2. (meaning every liter of coke has 3.7 liters of C02 disolved in it, at least until you open the bottle). That's pretty typical, though pepsi is higher. Looking at a handy chart published by Zahm & nagel (who make carbonation equipment, among other things) for the solubility of CO2 in water (soda is close enough to water to not make huge changes in the result), we find that 3.7 volumes of CO2 at 32 F has a gauge pressure of about 17psi. At 68 F, gauge pressure is 48 psi, and at 100F (which is as high as the chart goes), it's about 85 psi. Soda bottles are going to be exposed to temperatures of at least that (think about leaving one in trunk of a car in summer), so I doubt your outside of the expected safety range.
dscheidt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 09:07 PM   #13
Grim
Senior Member
 
Grim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Atlanta
Bikes: Cannondale T700s and a few others
Posts: 2,993
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
How much do you use your horn that you need that much volume? You must have a LOT of jerks on the road.
I top off my Airzound maybe once a week when I am topping up my tires.
Grim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-10, 11:17 PM   #14
vol
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Bikes:
Posts: 3,335
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Cool! If my mini pump doesn't have a gauge, how can I know when to stop pumping?
(Also, do they send you extra clamps for free or how much do they charge?)
vol is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 02:28 AM   #15
illdoittomorrow
Beer and nachos today!
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Treaty Seven
Bikes: Schwinn Peloton, Schwinn Prelude SS, Specialized Sequoia
Posts: 221
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by vol View Post
Cool! If my mini pump doesn't have a gauge, how can I know when to stop pumping?
(Also, do they send you extra clamps for free or how much do they charge?)
IIRC the air inlet for the AirZound is a Schrader valve, so any Schrader-compatible tire pressure gauge will work.
illdoittomorrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 02:36 AM   #16
illdoittomorrow
Beer and nachos today!
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Treaty Seven
Bikes: Schwinn Peloton, Schwinn Prelude SS, Specialized Sequoia
Posts: 221
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by ItsJustMe View Post
FYI 2L soda bottles burst at about 160 PSI, at least when I tested them. However, at lower pressures they may burst easily if poked with something sharp or impacted, so I wouldn't run them much over 100.
Random naughty thoughts:

I wonder if the AirZound is appreciably louder at over 100 psi...?

How hard would it be to jury-rig a manifold with several 2L bottles, each with its own valve to hold in the pressure... so that I can shoot the bottles with an air rifle?
illdoittomorrow is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 04:42 AM   #17
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grim View Post
How much do you use your horn that you need that much volume? You must have a LOT of jerks on the road.
I top off my Airzound maybe once a week when I am topping up my tires.
This is NYC: people walk around like zombies and bells don't do squat. I can use up my regular AirZound bottle during a single morning commute. I have to top off at work every day before going home. Also, this is the only thing that works when you're getting hooked by a car. But there are times, like yesterday afternoon that I hardly use it. Mornings are the worst. I started leaving earlier to avoid the mobs of unconscious pedestrians. I would not be able to ride closer to 9 am. It's surreal: people would see oncoming bus, look straight at it and step right in front of it as if the bus didn't exist. Forget bikes... Pedestrians in NYC are horrible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vol View Post
Cool! If my mini pump doesn't have a gauge, how can I know when to stop pumping?
(Also, do they send you extra clamps for free or how much do they charge?)
I've been using pumps with gauges for years so I can't really give you a good advice here. You need to order clamps from http://deltacycle.com/.

Quote:
Originally Posted by illdoittomorrow View Post
IIRC the air inlet for the AirZound is a Schrader valve, so any Schrader-compatible tire pressure gauge will work.
Correct. It's a Schrader valve.

Quote:
Originally Posted by illdoittomorrow View Post
Random naughty thoughts:

I wonder if the AirZound is appreciably louder at over 100 psi...?

How hard would it be to jury-rig a manifold with several 2L bottles, each with its own valve to hold in the pressure... so that I can shoot the bottles with an air rifle?
I don't want to go higher than 90psi, not sure if the seals and tubing can take that. You mean to pop the bottles with an air gun? LOL, I have no idea.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 04:46 AM   #18
Grim
Senior Member
 
Grim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Atlanta
Bikes: Cannondale T700s and a few others
Posts: 2,993
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Wow and they say GA is not bike friendly. I think I used my horn once last week. I do not recall using it all this week.
Grim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 04:54 AM   #19
Mauriceloridans
Senior Member
 
Mauriceloridans's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Shreveport
Bikes: 1983 Trek 520, early 80's Univega Gran Tourismo, '98 Santana Arriva
Posts: 282
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Plastic bottles made for carbonated drinks are pressure vessels. Bottles for water and tea are not. I learned this from homebrewing literature and used to bottle ale in 20 oz pet bottles.
Mauriceloridans is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 05:24 AM   #20
genec
genec
 
genec's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: West Coast
Bikes: custom built, sannino, beachbike, giant trance x2
Posts: 24,975
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 909 Post(s)
Not a bad improvement.

Since you are experimenting... here's an idea I have thought of, but have not tested. It is based on Boyle's law.

I have often thought one of the drawbacks of Airzounds was the fact that you can't tell if you are low on pressure... at a glance.

Well it seems to me that a small balloon, just slightly inflated and stuck inside the pressure vessel would show you if you are low on "honk pressure."

It works like this... the small "indicator balloon" will have a certain amount of internal pressure to inflate it (and I only mean enough inflation to make it into a small loose balloon), this would be only a couple of PSI over atmospheric pressure... so say 17 PSIG. That balloon inside the pressure vessel would be subjected to say 80PSIG when there is enough air to provide good honks. Under that sort of pressure, the balloon would collapse (Boyle's law), and look quite deflated. But, when the pressure of the "tank" got low, then the balloon would appear larger, and thus become a visual indicator that you are low on "honking gas."

You could tell at a glance... oops outta air, gotta fill it up again!

You would have to test this a bit to see what the right pressure it would take to get a balloon to decently inflate/deflate at suitable pressures to give a good indication.

Seems like a simple solution.

Of course the whole idea can be easily tested in any pressure chamber... put a loosely inflated balloon (obviously stick the balloon into the bottle first and then inflate the balloon a bit to get some size, but not big enough to fill the bottle) and then pressurize the chamber (large soda bottle) and watch the balloon deflate. Release pressure from the large soda bottle and watch the balloon reinflate. Bingo!

I just have not gotten around to trying it yet. Go for it!
genec is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 05:25 AM   #21
colleen c
I am a caffine girl
 
colleen c's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Bay Area
Bikes: 2012 Stumpjumper FSR Comp...2010 Scott CR1 CF...2007 Novara FS Float2.0...2009 Specialized Hardrock Disc...2009 Schwinn Le Tour GSr
Posts: 1,815
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by illdoittomorrow View Post
How hard would it be to jury-rig a manifold with several 2L bottles, each with its own valve to hold in the pressure... so that I can shoot the bottles with an air rifle?
I don't think it will be that hard. Probably drill a hole on a soda bottle cap and a schrader valve from some old tire tube slip it in and silicon/glue it to the cap? But that would be a waste of a good bottle. More fun if you invest that bottle for water bottle rocket. Personally I never tried that but I always wanted too and I read the world record was 2000+ feet altitude and had a camera on it!

As for my Airzound setup, I decided to use a 1.0 L bottle for my setup. I thought the fiberglass tape for reinforcement was a great idea. I wrapped my bottle and was in the process of taking Velcro and wrapping that around my bottle, but then it will take a lot of Velcro. Beside it was too bulky of a look and I don't think it was s good idea to have it visible on a train. So today I will go to REI to look for some 1 liter bottle sleeve jacket to slip it inside then attach it to the bottom of my top tube. So far, my bottle held air overnight much better than my original bottle did. I think my OEM bottle was leakingvery slow at the cap.
colleen c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 06:45 AM   #22
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mauriceloridans View Post
Plastic bottles made for carbonated drinks are pressure vessels. Bottles for water and tea are not. I learned this from homebrewing literature and used to bottle ale in 20 oz pet bottles.
I thought about that too, but soda bottles don't come in size and shape I wanted. A 2L soda bottle is too much and 1L is too little.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 06:49 AM   #23
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by genec View Post
Not a bad improvement.

Since you are experimenting... here's an idea I have thought of, but have not tested. It is based on Boyle's law.
Cool idea! Although, since I wrapped the bottle with tape and carry it in a pannier, that won't help. I thought about fitting a gauge somewhere, but that would be way too much crap on the handlebars - I need to draw a line somewhere Unless I can find something really small, the thin, tubular type like on early Morphs.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 08:37 AM   #24
JPprivate
Very, very Senior Member
 
JPprivate's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Chicago
Bikes: 2012 Surly Troll, 1999 Hardtail MTB
Posts: 1,223
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Congrats Adam for your invention!!! Looks pretty cool.

Excuse my ignorance, I have always looked at the Airzound horn, but haven't decided yet to get it, so I don't know to much about it. So why would changing the bottle be important. Can you put more air into a regular soda bottle. Or is the bottle the airzound horn comes with in some way inconvenient?
Thanks and congrats again!
JPprivate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-03-10, 08:54 AM   #25
AdamDZ 
Bike addict, dreamer
Thread Starter
 
AdamDZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Queens, New York
Bikes:
Posts: 5,165
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It's a matter of capacity. According to Colleen the regular bottle holds enough air for about 10 seconds of constant blowing. This larger bottle should last at least 2x as long, I hope even more. I would need some time to really tell the difference since my yesterday and today commute rides were unusually uneventfull so I didn't get to use it much. With the stock bottle I'd use it up sometimes during a single morning commute: 3-4 longer blows and a few short honks, and not have enough air left for the last couple of zombies wandering in the bike lane.

It's a little over-the-top hack, but hey, people already question my sanity so be it.
AdamDZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:01 PM.