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Old 11-17-10, 04:18 AM   #1
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b17 vs team pro

Anyone have both?

Liked my b17 a lot, but thought maybe a little thinner would be better. So got the team pro. I can't get that comfortable on it. Used it for a week and today put my b17 back on. My b17 is very comfortable.

Not sure if I should give the team pro more time or what. The way the b17 is shaped is very hammocky, feels nice.

Or maybe try to soak the team pro in oil? Anyone do that with a team pro?

Also wondering if anyone has both and which they like better?

Thanks.
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Old 11-17-10, 06:16 AM   #2
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if it ain't broke, don't fix it. you said your b17 is comfortable. ride it.
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Old 11-17-10, 08:04 AM   #3
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The Pro is more of a racing saddle, (and for folks with a narrower sit bones location). The B-17 will likely give you more comfort and the flexibility to slide forwards and backwards as needed on the saddle.
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Old 11-17-10, 08:44 AM   #4
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You might try selling the pro and buying a b-17 narrow if the regular seems too wide for you. However it does not read like you have allowed for much "break in" on the new saddle for both you and the saddle.
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Old 11-17-10, 10:14 AM   #5
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Not soaking in Oil, but absorbing Brooks Proofide .. you apply it underneath the saddle,
body heat absorbs it into the leather ,
I have sped the process up by warming the saddle upside down in a warm oven ,
no more than 100 degrees F.

brooks pro favors a racing posture, B 17 a more upright one.
the back plate is arched on the pro, it's flatter on the 17
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Old 11-17-10, 11:34 AM   #6
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I got them both. I like the B-17 better. I don't think the Team Pro is broken in yet. The leather on it is thicker. It is narrower too. Your handlebar height should dictate which brooks to get. The B-17 is good for handlebars around the height of your saddle, whereas the Team Pro is better with more handlebar drop relative to saddle.

You might want to check out the B-17 narrow. I never sat on one, but I considered it.
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Old 11-17-10, 12:13 PM   #7
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I have both. B-17 was uncomfortable for 200 miles and then just vanished, like it is not even there. Love it. Team Pro on my road bike still hasn't made it to the same happy place yet, not sure it ever will. Yes, the leather is much thicker and therefore is supposed to take a while. Because of that, on the Team Pro I did the Sheldon technique to try to accelerate it out of the chute -- make a bathtub out of tinfoil, soak in mink oil for 45 min. Then proofide after a few days. I've got ~1200 miles on it now. Good but not great. Though I may need to play with the stem position on that bike and everything is intertwined.

Narrower profile, thicker leather.

I haven't been gauged by an assometer but expect my sit bones are on the broader range.
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Old 11-17-10, 03:24 PM   #8
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My bar to saddle drop is like 2 or 3 inches. Drop bars, no hoods. Ride on the drops most, but lately in the cold seem to be on the tops more.

I do have a skinny sit bones. I checked myself on a specialized meter and was around 120mm.

I think it's how the saddle is formed. I find it much easier to roll my hips forward on the b17. The team pro seems to be shaped like my wtb sst where the back goes up. Maybe the wideness of the b17 is a plus too.

My b17 is honey and want a black one. My next bike will be a blue or green touring bike and saving the honey b17 for that one. Got the team pro since I figured it would be better for my saddle to handlebar drop. Most people say good things about it. But have heard the never got comfortable story a few times too.

The place I bought it from said I can send it back and get the price minus 25 percent towards a new saddle since it was used. Might just do that. Not sure if I will go for a b17 or b17N or something else. Wondering if something non brooks that is completely flat would be good for me? The problem is these saddles are so expensive.

I did proofhide it btw. And sounds like that oil trick doesn't as good as it sounds.

Thanks for the replies.
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Old 11-17-10, 03:29 PM   #9
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I love my B17s, but my Team Pro fits me the best and is the most comfy - but it took me a couple of years to get it there.
B17 is just a hair too wide, Swift and narrows are just a hair too narrow, Team Pro is just right..but hell to get positioned right and broken in. YMMV
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Old 11-17-10, 04:47 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diff View Post
I do have a skinny sit bones. I checked myself on a specialized meter and was around 120mm.
120mm is not narrow and probably too wide for the team pro. Measure your saddle and you'll see that your sits will land on the metal frame of the saddle

Here's how mine shape up with 110mm sits:
B-17 laced - great
Team pro - good, but I'm right at the edge of the supports
Swift - too narrow
Specialized Toupe 143mm fits great.

Hope this helps

Last edited by rogerstg; 11-20-10 at 07:59 AM. Reason: grammar
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Old 11-17-10, 08:22 PM   #11
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Hmmm, I will have to stop at the bike shop tomorrow and measure again. I have a very slim build. I would think that I would be on the small end of sit bones.

What about the fizik saddles? Does anyone have any experience with those? Seems like the flatter the better for me and their arione and anteres saddles are pretty flat.

It's funny since looking at their at their site and the flexibility ratings - I am fairly flexible. Can touch the ground with my fingers. And saddles made for "bulls" have that curve in them and that is exactly how my sst wtb is shaped and I hate it. And those seemed to be designed for people with limited flexibility.

When I sit on a bike I like to stick my butt way out and roll my hips forward. Especially when on the drops it feels good to sit like that. Seems like the saddles that flare up in the back make this harder and more uncomfortable to do.

I guess I will just send the team pro back then and get a credit. Would like to hear about fizik saddles. Not a racer or trainer. Just want a comfortable saddle for long rides on various terrains. Thanks.
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Old 11-18-10, 06:33 AM   #12
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I played around with it a bit when I got home from work. Looking closely at the saddles, they really aren't shaped that differently. I really don't get it. It's not the hardness against my sit bones, it's just my positioning that isn't comfortable. I played with the tilt, and the fore aft a bit. Since it actually seems the b17 rails are located a bit differently. Or to better put it, when in identical positions, the b17 will be longer towards the back than the team pro.

Sending it back in the morning.

Those fizik saddles are waaaay expensive. Too risky just to order one. Have to find a shop that sells them. But then again they probably won't be mounted on any bikes.
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Old 11-18-10, 10:42 PM   #13
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...make a bathtub out of tinfoil, soak in mink oil for 45 min. Then proofide after a few days. I've got ~1200 miles on it now. Good but not great.
Modern saddle: Bolt onto seat post. Ride. Enjoy.

Nice thing about modern saddles...if it ain't comfy the first long ride, it's NEVER going to be. Return it and try another.

Brooks: 1200 miles with a messy oil bath and still hope? Sounds like The Emperor's New Clothes to me. Maybe just 500 more miles will do the trick! Or 500 more...


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Old 11-18-10, 11:37 PM   #14
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Brooks: 1200 miles with a messy oil bath and still hope? Sounds like The Emperor's New Clothes to me. Maybe just 500 more miles will do the trick! Or 500 more...

To each their own. All of my Brooks saddles have been comfortable from day one.
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Old 11-19-10, 04:55 AM   #15
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Nice thing about modern saddles...if it ain't comfy the first long ride, it's NEVER going to be. Return it and try another.
That's certainly true. Whether it's a nice thing or not is your call. For many, the modern saddle shuffle you cite is bolt onto saddle, ride, don't enjoy, return or CL, repeat, until you finally wear down your hope and settle for something that's livable. I have my go-to model modern saddle that's still on my MTBs that is thoroughly adequate out of the box. I thought it was great until I broke in my B17 and found out what great really was. The Team Pro that you seem to think I'm complaining about is only as comfortable as the saddles I rode for 20 years. The bon temps roullez a lot more comfortably now, with only better days ahead. Plus, the future is so bright, my Brooks-equipped butt has to wear shades.

Last edited by slcbob; 11-19-10 at 04:58 AM.
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Old 11-19-10, 07:30 AM   #16
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Went to the LBS and measured my sit bones again. 120mm.

Also today put on a velo orange 90mm stem 17 degree (old stem was 100mm 17 degree), and nitto b-115 drop bars. Have them stem flipped so it gives the bar rise. I think it ended up lowering them a tad, but put them closer to me and can definitely feel it. Kinda crazy how much 1cm makes. The bike fits me a lot better now.

So, decided to give the team pro another shot. I think I had it tilted up a tad last time, now it's level, or maybe 1 or 2 degrees pointed downward. Much better. Also got a new seat post so in the process of swapping, my saddle is about .5 cm higher now too.

Just going to keep it and give it some more time. Really like how it looks (team pro classic black), and once it forms to be a bit I think the thicker leather might actually be a plus. I guess I'll see.
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Old 11-19-10, 07:42 AM   #17
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After a number of years on a B-17 Champion (not sure what Champion indicates) on one bike, I put a B-17 narrow on my new commuter.

I like both saddles, but prefer the narrow version.
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Old 11-19-10, 08:23 AM   #18
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To each their own. All of my Brooks saddles have been comfortable from day one.
Lost of folks never get comfy on them, or suffer needlessly for a long time. The OP was not totally happy, but continues to try.

I think too many people follow the Brooks mystique when they would be happier INSTANTLY with something else. I rode Brooks exclusively for 25 years. You could not have taken them away from me with a gun pointed to my head. So I can't argue their comfort on certain bikes under somewhat ideal situations. But given all of the new technology, materials, and medical attention given to saddles over the past 2 decades, lots and lots of people sell themselves short (and suffer needlessly) by forcing the issue on a Brooks because of some pre-conceived notions and charisma of the brand.

Most saddle discomfort is the result of poor bike fit anyway. If you looked at my 6 bikes, all of which I put in long hours upon, you would be shocked to see 6 different saddles. Not a single Brooks yet all of them are lovely to ride. I have a Cinelli road bike that sees rides up to 150 miles per day, a beater road bike for use in my city with bad road surfaces, a cheap beater ATB, a touring bike (Long Haul Trucker), a Pugsley, and a folding bike. I try to match the saddle to the application. And my arse is very forgiving - I seem to find comfort easily. But there have been a few dogs over the years and there have been times when three of the bikes had identical saddles on them.

One place Brooks shines is durability and longevity. Your Brooks WILL NOT FAIL on a 6 month bike tour. One less thing to worry about. Modern saddles are like fine running shoes. You gotta replace them fairly often. But look how far athletic shoe technology has come in the past 50 years. Same for saddles.

Look at what R.A.A.M. competitors ride. Look at what saddles go on the big tours (Tour de France etc) . For saddles and bar tape, it's not just about money and sponsorship. Most long distance pro riders are very particular and ride what THEY want and they know works. Cheaper models of pro saddles are always available and generally just sacrifice some weight savings for $$$.

This post is not directed toward those happy and in love with their Brooks. It's for all of those folks who think they should be, but aren't.

Last edited by JoeyBike; 11-19-10 at 08:30 AM.
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Old 11-19-10, 09:56 AM   #19
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^That was the most reasonable non-Brooks rider response I have ever read. You have experience and knowledge.
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Old 11-19-10, 06:08 PM   #20
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I love my B17s, but my Team Pro fits me the best and is the most comfy - but it took me a couple of years to get it there.
B17 is just a hair too wide, Swift and narrows are just a hair too narrow, Team Pro is just right..but hell to get positioned right and broken in. YMMV
Bingo.

I think my last Team Pro broke in early at about 1,200 miles.
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Old 11-19-10, 07:04 PM   #21
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I own both and like 'em both. I can't ride anything other than a Brooks anymore.

The Pro is noticeably thicker leather and not-so-noticeably more narrow. I put the Pro on my fixie as the handlebars are lower than the saddle. The B-17 is on my regular road bike where the bars and the saddle are the same height. (Also have two bikes with Flyers.)

I used a small amount of gloveolium (baseball glove dressing) on the Pro to try to speed up the break-in. But it did not seem to have any affect other than darkening the leather a bit.
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Old 11-19-10, 09:51 PM   #22
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Don't get me wrong here. My team pro isn't terribly uncomfortable or painful to ride.

My b17 was decently comfortable out of the box. Took about a week or two and was good.

Like I mentioned, my main reasoning for getting a new saddle was because I wanted a black one. And I didn't get another b17 because it does feel a tad wide. Especially when on the drops can feel my inner rear thighs brushing against it. So was looking at the b17 narrow at first, and then figured the team pro would be the perfect middle ground.

I'll give it a good month and see. The team pro is significantly thicker than the b17 and harder. That might actually be a plus in the end. We'll see I guess.
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Old 11-19-10, 10:18 PM   #23
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The thickness of the Flyer ranges from 0.150" to 0.210". Has anyone measured the Pro?
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Old 11-20-10, 05:42 AM   #24
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Well, turns out this team pro is defective. I think that was part of the issue. The 1st time I had it on for a few days and when I took it off checked the level and it was tilted up a bit.

In between that I had it on for a few very short test rides.

So put it back on last night and made sure it was pointed just a bit down.

We did a 12 mile ride tonight and about halfway through the ride was thinking the saddle it really putting a lot of pressure on me. So hop off the bike and look and it was clearly pointed up. Was thinking maybe I didn't tighten it enough, so took out my allen key and fixed it again. Did it quick, but made sure it was pointed down and tightened it really good. Get to my destination, look at the saddle and it was pointed up again!!

Took the seatpost apart and wanted to see what was going on. I noticed the rails on the team pro aren't spaced properly.

Attached some pics. 2 completely different seat posts for reference, and the saddles that are correct are a b17, and wtb sst.

I guess it wasn't allowing the seat post to clamp properly and saddle kept slipping. Already wrapped up and going back.
Attached Images
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File Type: jpg 20101120_005..jpg (90.9 KB, 143 views)
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Old 11-20-10, 10:20 AM   #25
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Try the Brooks Colt. It is narrow like the team pro but has thinner leather. Mine was broken in after a few rides. I gave up trying to break in a team pro.
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