davasi

The law (or basic rule as they put it, on their website) is that I can not ride on the trail after dusk. I work until 12am and ride my bike to work. I was recently warned by a county sheriff's deputy to not be on the trail at night. The two major roads, which are the only way to get near my house, are extremely busy... even at night. A local radio announcer was killed in 2002 while using one of said roads instead of the trail for biking home because he was warned and cited for using the trail after dark. I don't feel comfortable riding on either of these roads after dark or during the day for that matter, and am going to continue using the trail and fight every citation I get for using it. Am I bending the law too much here?

Sirrus Rider

I don't think so. I think it boils down to what is reasonable under the circumstances. I'm sure we have a lawyer around here somewhere that might pipe in; however, to my single year of law school eye that is how I would frame the argument. If using the trail is the safest way to proceed at that time of the night then you may use the trail as an "easement"to get you from point "a" to "b" in lieu of using either the two roads. Especially if using the roads would be a risk to life or limb compared to using the trail.

davasi

I didn't think so either, considering I've fought many a parking/speeding ticket without legal counsel and have won. I understand their issue is safety, but most of the assaults/robberies happen in the urban part of the trail in Saint Petersburg. That is at least a 15 mile ride from where I live. In that area though, there are bike lanes all over the place which renders that part of the trail unnecessary.

davasi

Ahh, the easement law. I work for a utility, and if any of our property is on their property I can proceed to work without them being home i.e. poles, network interface devices, pedestal splices.

rekmeyata

This is tough, you have the law saying no and the busy streets saying no. Are there any side streets? I don't live where you live so I'm not sure what a busy street means to you. But I use to ride in Los Angeles at night never thought much of it! And that was back in the day of dim head and tail lights!! If only one cyclist was killed back in 02 on one of those major roads then it doesn't sound like the roads are all that bad? Geez, we had a cyclist killed on a lightly traveled road in the country in 11, does that make that road busy or unsafe? No. Just means the cyclist ran into a bad driver, and that's probably what happened to the radio guy or maybe the radio guy wasn't using adequate lighting?

If your lit up like a Christmas tree you shouldn't have any problems, but of course that is never a guarantee.

What's the two major roads your talking about there in Seminole FL? It may be fun to google earth it, drop down to street level and "drive" around and see what daytime traffic looks like.

davasi

The two major ones are 113th St, and Seminole Blvd (or Alt-19). After 12am it's not too bad, but there are plenty of drunk rednecks. We are currently approaching spring break, daytime is horrible around here from after thanksgiving till May 1st. I love Canadians, but you guys need to not freak out so much on the roads down here during this time, and tip your waitresses and bartenders a little better. Mind boggling.

SlimRider

I would write the governor, the mayor, your councilman, and your local district attorney concerning this matter.

Make a youtube typed video, intelligently explaining your case and send it and a copy of your letter to all of the local TV and radio stations within your listening and viewing area.

Enclose your phone number in all correspondence letters. Go home and sit by the telephone!

- Slim

PS.

Make a video of all the dangerous traffic that flies by!

rekmeyata

I google triped it from south at State Hwy 666 going north up route 19 to rt 668 then headed west to 113th and headed south all the way back down. Saw Trail Sport Bicycles, it got a little busy from 68th to 70th, a slight increase at Park but died out within a block, same with Village dr, once I got past Village the traffic almost disappeared till Johnson that became moderately light to moderate until 694 then dropped off again, shoulder to ride on was thin nothing uncommon for a lot of cities. I did notice one old guy riding on the sidewalk, is that something you could do if riding on the thin shoulder bothers you? Not sure when the camera vehicle went down that road but I didn't see any traffic that I would have been concerned about and I know that traffic I did see would be far less after midnight. The most dangerious night of the week is Friday night, people are tired and some are tired and drunk, so you may want to find another way to work on Friday just to be safe.

Route 113 heading in any direction has no shoulder to ride on except in small patches, I would feel far safer on 19.

If you haven't already bought some you may want to invest in some bright lighting both front and rear. If your bike has drop bars Soma makes bar end lights called Road Flare, they use a AAA battery instead of the button bats and those things are extremely bright. Combine that with a really bright tail light on the seat post or seat tube like the Cygolite Hotshot, or the Blackburn Mars 4, then add another to your helmet. Then up front get a nice bright head light, I'm partial to Cygolite headlights, they make a really nice ones that last and don't cost as much as other brands; then add a front flasher and a helmet light. The helmet lights or the front flasher don't need to be expensive. Use some reflective leg bands and tape on the helmet, plus reflective safety vest some riders wear though I never have. I don't know what you run for lighting but like I said you need to look like a christmas tree.

rekmeyata

Radio announcer Metcalf was hit on 113, the road with no shoulder! Also there was a big question about her being drunk, she admitted to having 1 and 1/2 drinks, then thought she hit a deer but didn't see any damage so drove home...didn't see any damage, her freakin windshield was broken!! She was drunker then she admitted. So she continues home instead of waiting around at the scene so she could sober up a bit more before calling the cops.

chefisaac

If it was me, I would do what was safe. Another issue arises, talk with the hear sheriff people. Do what you need to do to be safe. If for some reason, you cannot take the trail, get some powerful lights and reflective gear. If you need recommendations, let me know!

biknbrian

I always try to give people the chance to be reasonable. I'd make a point of stopping and talking to any police that seemed interested in me. I'd do everything that could be done to keep the conversation a level headed exchange between two people, some guy talking to some guy and not police talking to a rule breaker. Rather then trying to play hide and seek I'd ride right up to them and talk to them like a would talk to a peer. With any luck you could free them from their role as a law enforcer and get them acting as a fellow human being. In which case they might get used to you being on the trail at night, be a little more willing to look the other way for a guy they knew and talked to sometimes.

You are not wrong, nor are they. You are just a regular guy trying to get home and they are just some regular guy or girl with a job that requires a uniform. Why with the late hours you both work you probably have some things in common. Yep, no trouble here, just a couple of people that are looking for a the best way to get you home...

SouthFLpix

Drunk rednecks or risk a citation. I'll go with the citation and worry about fighting it later. You won't get a chance to fight a drunk driver. You'll be on the road bleeding.

alan s 

If you are breaking the law and are caught, don't come here crying about it. It could be OK in very limited circumstances if some greater harm would come from complying with the law, but just riding where prohibited, because you want to, is illegal. If you don't like it, try changing the law. Otherwise, you are running the risk of being ticketed. Just make sure you are carrying ID so they don't lock you up.

SuncoastChad

I live in Clearwater and worked in Largo/Seminole area for years so I understand what you are asking!
Yes, you are definitely bending the rules. The trail is closed (folks, its a 25 mile long "linear" county park) between dusk and dawn...however, if you have decent lighting and it's one of the "safer" areas I think you'd be forgiven. The chances of a deputy or park attendant being out there is pretty low. However, if a deputy has already warned you I'd consider that in my decision. But, if you have an accident or get mugged you'd have hard time explaining away your injuries as it is "closed" and posted as such. Good luck - I feel your pain! Ulmerton,
Ridge/113th, Walsingham, or any of the other roads around there are a mess.

SlimRider

Find out who's head of your Parks system, there. Make a $100 political contribution along with a request for special permission to ride your route, after explaining your dilemma in the letter.

dcrowell

That's the corrupt way to do it. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em.

Seriously though. This could be a good way to change a bad law. If you have the means fight the citation. Go to the press, the parks department, whoever.

I normally not a law-breaker, but I think this is a good candidate for an exception.

Axiom

I use the same trail as you do every other day and I have never had a problem, so you shouldn't worry about it either. The downside to the safer riding is the fact that some parts of the trail are occupied by individuals who are up to no good. But again, I have personally never had a problem with that either. If they warn you again, let them know your situation. If they REALLY have a problem with you riding at night, the fine is $150 (I believe).

Andy_K 

Well there you go. Pick your way through people's yards and say you needed to find something for work.

Seriously though, this sounds like a good reason to get involved in the local government process. Start writing letters to people telling them they are jeopardizing your safety. Chances are the reason they don't want you on the trail is that they think it exposes them to liability. If you can tip the scale the other way, you can get the rules changed.

AlmostTrick

Have you ever even tried the roads in question on your bike? My experience with late night riding is very light traffic that easily moves into the next lane to pass when I take the lane. You need good lights and reflective gear to make it easier for them to see you from great distance. It may be safer than a dark secluded trail where hoodlums could be hanging out.

Seattle Forrest

This seems to be your answer. What do you suppose will happen next time that deputy spots you on the trail at night...?

Is there some alternate route you can find while you write the local officials and media about how the last guy to ride a bike on those roads was killed in the process? If not, I'd try lighting the bike up like a Christmas tree and riding on the main roads, while I got ready to move.

Seattle Forrest

Seriously?

Did you read the OP before replying?



Yeah, wanting to avoid the dead guy's fate is being a punk kid and breaking the law just "because you want to."

snowman40

How many times have you ridden this route before getting the warning? That could be your answer....I doubt you'd be approached by the police every night, the night you got the warning could be the one time he was there and noticed you.

I'd risk the ticket but that is the responsible thing for me to do as I have kids and my wife supports law breaking if it means I'm doing it for reasons other than being selfish.

This is in no way any type of legal advice.

Breathegood

Try removing yourself from the equation and objectively try to answer these two questions: Why should THEY make an exception for YOU? If THEY were to make an exception for YOU, how many OTHERS should they make the exception for?

One of the reasons they close these types of trails at dusk is to keep ner-do-wells from conducting "business", and pressumably because it is much more difficult to patrol the path than the city streets. Put yourself in the shoes of law enforcement. You could very well be delivering "product" on your bicycle. Are you prepaired to be searched and/or interrogated if caught on the trail after dusk? IMO, that would be a reasonable thing for an officer to do. I might play dumb through the first warning (which you've already had), but I would probably not push my luck for a citation or arrest. I don't automatically have respect for any individual officer of the law, but I do believe that the laws are there [mostly] for our protection whether we agree with them or not. Breaking the law is breaking the law. Are you prepaired to suffer the consequences?

Bright lights front and rear, and increased involvement in your community governance are your best bet.....but that's just my opinion.

AlmostGreenGuy

Is this a federal, state or local government owned trail? If it's local government, just get in contact with somebody on the village/town board, and politely express your concerns and wish to use the trail during evening hours. I'm guessing that you won't meet up with much resistance. They'll contact the Sheriff's department and straighten things out.

SuncoastChad

It is a linear Pinellas County Park running the length of the county and crossing multiple municipal juristictions...don't bet on "won't meet up with much resistance".
It is a rails-to-trails park and is mostly unlit at night - except where street lights are actually on parallel roads. It is darker than pitch on most sections.