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Wife very worried that I've started to commute. Help please!

Old 06-27-12, 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by supernovae
Unless you know a town with padded roads with no cars allowed and everyone is super nice, you can't move to avoid what you don't know is coming. Sure, there are bike friendly towns, pedestrian friendly and family friendly towns but you can't hide from it all and putting a moving option on the table sure seems like you're capitulating to fear..
I think we need to own up to something. A fair amount of posts in this forum deal with mitigating risks be it with lighting, reflective clothing, helmets, taking the lane or not, riding on sidewalks vs. the street or choosing a different route altogether. People that drive to work do not worry about this sort of thing.

I've been hit by a car, as I imagine a lot of you have, and we've had fellow forum members badly injured. Further, a major reason why more people don't ride to work is because of concerns about safety.

I think it's foolish to pretend that this stuff isn't real. The OP's wife isn't some nut job that whose fears should just be waved away.

In any relationship, but especially a marriage, it's all about win-win. Ignoring the wishes or fears of one spouse puts you on the fast track to a failed marriage.

The OP owes it to his wife to acknowledge her fear in a real way. She owes it to him to not stand in the way of him doing things that bring him enjoyment, fulfillment or whatever you want to call it. But in this case, the two are in conflict and they need to explore solutions. Maybe they'd be happier in a different location for other reasons, but by putting that option moving on the table, he's both letting her know how important it is for him to continue to bike and how important her happiness is to him.

Now, moving is just one example of a solution. There might be others including riding a shorter or longer distance to avoid areas she's the most concerned about.
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Old 06-27-12, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by supernovae
Unless you know a town with padded roads with no cars allowed and everyone is super nice, you can't move to avoid what you don't know is coming. Sure, there are bike friendly towns, pedestrian friendly and family friendly towns but you can't hide from it all and putting a moving option on the table sure seems like you're capitulating to fear..
I moved from an area that requires lots of riding on busy roads to now over 95% on a quiet and freshly paved MUP... So, it's possible.
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Old 06-27-12, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by supernovae
There is no relationship if you let unfounded fears prevail, so in essence, it absolutely does matter. It doesn't mean you ignore them, it just means you talk about them rationally...
But they aren't unfounded. Exagerated, yes, but you don't have to hang around here long to know that getting hit is a possibility. I have been and so have many others. As a husband and father of young children, the OP needs to acknowledge that and work to show he is minimizing the risk while articulating the many benefits. They need to work toward a compromise that works for the family.
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Old 06-27-12, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by CACycling
But they aren't unfounded. Exagerated, yes, but you don't have to hang around here long to know that getting hit is a possibility. I have been and so have many others. As a husband and father of young children, the OP needs to acknowledge that and work to show he is minimizing the risk while articulating the many benefits. They need to work toward a compromise that works for the family.
I'm starting to think that if you ask most wives, most would say the fears are not exaggerated. Have your wife poll her friends.

“If the costs were equal would you rather you husband commute on bike to work on the road, or spend the same time in the gym on a stationary...” 9 out of 10 I assume would vote gym. You could even make the question harder by saying stating, "The GYM option will cost you $500.00 more a year than the bike". I'm positive the gym will win statistically.
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Old 06-27-12, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by tjspiel
I think we need to own up to something. A fair amount of posts in this forum deal with mitigating risks be it with lighting, reflective clothing, helmets, taking the lane or not, riding on sidewalks vs. the street or choosing a different route altogether. People that drive to work do not worry about this sort of thing.

I've been hit by a car, as I imagine a lot of you have, and we've had fellow forum members badly injured. Further, a major reason why more people don't ride to work is because of concerns about safety.

I think it's foolish to pretend that this stuff isn't real.
Risks exist, but in the grand scheme of things, cycling is among the safer activities you can engage in, to the point where spending time on your bike extends, rather than shortens your life expectancy.

That we spend so much time discussing this stuff is simply because the perception of cycling safety and the reality of cycling safety are such very different things. And I'm not sure how else you counter a false impression than what's been suggested here.
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Old 06-27-12, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by SlimRider
Solution:
5) Always tell her that you're just going to do it for a few more weeks, until you get into "Triathlon Shape". Once, she has reduced her fear and possibly even develop a similar attraction towards cycling, tell her that you think you're just going to stick with the cycling, afterall.
I didn't think of that. But can triathletes even stay married, unless they train together? That has to be some time-consuming training.
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Old 06-27-12, 04:27 PM
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Originally Posted by neil
Risks exist, but in the grand scheme of things, cycling is among the safer activities you can engage in, to the point where spending time on your bike extends, rather than shortens your life expectancy.

That we spend so much time discussing this stuff is simply because the perception of cycling safety and the reality of cycling safety are such very different things. And I'm not sure how else you counter a false impression than what's been suggested here.
To be fair, based on the OP's description of his route (lots of high speed 5-lane shoulderless roads), I wouldn't deny the possibility that cycling is more dangerous than driving. What should count is that steps are being taken to mitigate this risk (high-vis gear, bright flashing lights, etc)
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Old 06-27-12, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Hoshnasi
Have your wife poll her friends.
Don't need to. I got hit last October and was off work for a month and a half with a broken clavicle. The night before I was hit a good friend of ours was hit and had a good deal more injuries (he's still not able to ride but is making progress). My wife received plenty of feedback from her friends when I returned to commuting the first of the year. It is pretty clear how they see the situation. Fortunately, my wife knows that the advantages of my commuting outweigh the risks. Plus I had carte blanche to buy hi vis clothes and lighting to go with my new commuter.
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Old 06-27-12, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by enigmaT120
I didn't think of that. But can triathletes even stay married, unless they train together? That has to be some time-consuming training.
Hey! Remember, you're just training....I mean, commuting!
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Old 06-27-12, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by tjspiel
I think we need to own up to something. A fair amount of posts in this forum deal with mitigating risks be it with lighting, reflective clothing, helmets, taking the lane or not, riding on sidewalks vs. the street or choosing a different route altogether. People that drive to work do not worry about this sort of thing.

I've been hit by a car, as I imagine a lot of you have, and we've had fellow forum members badly injured. Further, a major reason why more people don't ride to work is because of concerns about safety.

I think it's foolish to pretend that this stuff isn't real. The OP's wife isn't some nut job that whose fears should just be waved away.

In any relationship, but especially a marriage, it's all about win-win. Ignoring the wishes or fears of one spouse puts you on the fast track to a failed marriage.

The OP owes it to his wife to acknowledge her fear in a real way. She owes it to him to not stand in the way of him doing things that bring him enjoyment, fulfillment or whatever you want to call it. But in this case, the two are in conflict and they need to explore solutions. Maybe they'd be happier in a different location for other reasons, but by putting that option moving on the table, he's both letting her know how important it is for him to continue to bike and how important her happiness is to him.

Now, moving is just one example of a solution. There might be others including riding a shorter or longer distance to avoid areas she's the most concerned about.
Let me just say that this is such an insightful and thoughtful post. Very helpful. It's good to hear from someone who recognizes that my wife's concerns are valid. I also think they are valid in that I can't control what an idiot driver does. That really is her argument. She trusts me, but not others and that's what scares her.

As for relocating, that simply isn't an option. I've got two kids, I live in a great school district, and quite frankly, I can't afford it.

Something I thought of today was finding someone who is an experienced biker and have them run the route with me. I would imagine that if this person had concerns about the route and the traffic, then that would tell me that I'm taking some significant risks. If an experienced rider is concerned then maybe I'm being naive.
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Old 06-27-12, 07:56 PM
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Well, the discussion runs in circles and consumes broadband. OK, here we go again, Mars-Venus moment.

Every single one of you has offered a SOLUTION. Geez, boys, do you understand that we are intelligent enough to see the solutions ourselves and offering another one comes across as patronizing?

What she needs is to VALIDATE her feelings, something along the lines "Honey, I would be worried too". And at least try to sound sincere. She puts up with aforementioned patronizing, she's gotta love you, that's why she is worried.

While in the process of acknowledging her fears, try to abstain from offering reasons why it is safe. How to find the right words - well, it is time to exercise that muscle between your ears. Partial understanding of the process is offered by posts ##65 and 76.

Of course, there always is that strong silent way of doing things - heading into the traffic without saying a single word and asking forgiveness is optional. Is anybody willing to venture a guess how many booty points this approach is doing to get? Or are you ready to find out that some doghouses come with root cellars?

caloso and tjspiel - C-
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Class dismissed

SF

Last edited by sci_femme; 06-27-12 at 08:01 PM.
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Old 06-27-12, 08:20 PM
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Originally Posted by sci_femme
Well, the discussion runs in circles and consumes broadband. OK, here we go again, Mars-Venus moment.

Every single one of you has offered a SOLUTION. Geez, boys, do you understand that we are intelligent enough to see the solutions ourselves and offering another one comes across as patronizing?

What she needs is to VALIDATE her feelings, something along the lines "Honey, I would be worried too". And at least try to sound sincere. She puts up with aforementioned patronizing, she's gotta love you, that's why she is worried.

While in the process of acknowledging her fears, try to abstain from offering reasons why it is safe. How to find the right words - well, it is time to exercise that muscle between your ears. Partial understanding of the process is offered by posts ##65 and 76.

Of course, there always is that strong silent way of doing things - heading into the traffic without saying a single word and asking forgiveness is optional. Is anybody willing to venture a guess how many booty points this approach is doing to get? Or are you ready to find out that some doghouses come with root cellars?

caloso and tjspiel - C-
the rest - F
Class dismissed

SF
Thanks for your insights. You're right, it is a Mars/Venus issue. Though I think you're being too hard on some posters. You're right that reason and stats and reassurances are not going to be the solution, I think. But I think you're being too hard on those that are suggesting I show her the route, get her comfortable with it, and slowly and carefully discuss why this is important to me and hope that she will gradually become more comfortable with it. It's going to be a process.

Dammit why won't she just listen to reason! Kidding.
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Old 06-27-12, 08:22 PM
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Originally Posted by bkjames00
Let me just say that this is such an insightful and thoughtful post. Very helpful. It's good to hear from someone who recognizes that my wife's concerns are valid. I also think they are valid in that I can't control what an idiot driver does. That really is her argument. She trusts me, but not others and that's what scares her.

As for relocating, that simply isn't an option. I've got two kids, I live in a great school district, and quite frankly, I can't afford it.


Something I thought of today was finding someone who is an experienced biker and have them run the route with me. I would imagine that if this person had concerns about the route and the traffic, then that would tell me that I'm taking some significant risks. If an experienced rider is concerned then maybe I'm being naive.
It's like looking in a mirror...

Honestly, so far, you're doing everything right. You invested in a decent front light that can be used day or night, multiple rear lights (redunancy) is a smart move back there, you've been commuting for a couple of weeks and undoubtedly been tweaking your route a bit since you started. You've identified certain areas where your confidence levels are low and implemented things, like the lights and taking to the sidewalk/grass at times, to minimize any potential risk to yourself.

Though you've probably already done so, have you tried using Google's Bike option to plan your route? Sometimes it can reveal an option that may tack on another mile or so, but without as much stress as your current route.
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Old 06-27-12, 08:26 PM
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Originally Posted by truman
And for corn's sakes, IXNAY on telling the near-miss and "another cyclist got run over" stories to the uninitiated! Tell 'em here, not at the dinner table.
+1

I do not share those stories, and try real hard not to have stories like those that involve me. Add to her traffic worries are the fact that I had a heart attack while riding in'08. She will always be unhappy about it, but is resigned to it. I am now riding under a docs supervision, and with his approval. I have also lost weight, which lowers my risk factors considerably (as to the meds Im on)
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Old 06-27-12, 08:59 PM
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Deaths in automobile accidents in USA in 2007: 32,885
Deaths due to bicycle accidents in USA in 2010: 610
Annual deaths due to obesity related causes: 100,000–400,000 (estimated)
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Old 06-27-12, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by sci_femme
Well, the discussion runs in circles and consumes broadband. OK, here we go again, Mars-Venus moment.

Every single one of you has offered a SOLUTION. Geez, boys, do you understand that we are intelligent enough to see the solutions ourselves and offering another one comes across as patronizing?

What she needs is to VALIDATE her feelings, something along the lines "Honey, I would be worried too". And at least try to sound sincere. She puts up with aforementioned patronizing, she's gotta love you, that's why she is worried.

While in the process of acknowledging her fears, try to abstain from offering reasons why it is safe. How to find the right words - well, it is time to exercise that muscle between your ears. Partial understanding of the process is offered by posts ##65 and 76.

Of course, there always is that strong silent way of doing things - heading into the traffic without saying a single word and asking forgiveness is optional. Is anybody willing to venture a guess how many booty points this approach is doing to get? Or are you ready to find out that some doghouses come with root cellars?

caloso and tjspiel - C-
the rest - F
Class dismissed

SF
In case you failed to notice, the OP is seeking solutions/suggestions, which is exactly what he is getting.
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Old 06-27-12, 09:21 PM
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Originally Posted by alan s
In case you failed to notice, the OP is seeking solutions/suggestions, which is exactly what he is getting.
And the wife is undoubtedly getting validation from whatever social network she's hooked into.

If doing a threat assessment and then taking steps to reduce those threats is trivializing and she is unable or unwilling to comprehend that said precautions were done in part to allay her fears... they've got bigger issues that is beyond the scope of my experience and knowledge.
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Old 06-27-12, 09:28 PM
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Originally Posted by LarDasse74
Deaths in automobile accidents in USA in 2007: 32,885
Deaths due to bicycle accidents in USA in 2010: 610
Annual deaths due to obesity related causes: 100,000–400,000 (estimated)

I would think that these statistics would sum the argument up in its totality! I mean, what's there to say now?
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Old 06-27-12, 10:05 PM
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Originally Posted by LarDasse74
Deaths in automobile accidents in USA in 2007: 32,885
Deaths due to bicycle accidents in USA in 2010: 610
Annual deaths due to obesity related causes: 100,000–400,000 (estimated)
Originally Posted by SlimRider
I would think that these statistics would sum the argument up in its totality! I mean, what's there to say now?
If the number of people that decided to venture out on a bicycle was 610 in 2010 then the entire U.S. cycling population would have been totally wiped out.

If I make 2000 car trips in a year, but only 200 bike trips and I'm in one bike accident and 3 car accidents, which mode of transport proved to be safer for me?

Do you see the problem with those numbers?. Alone they don't paint an accurate picture. It could be that cycling is actually safer but you can't say that based on what he posted.

And really it comes down to individual circumstances. My commute is 60% trails, 20% quiet residential streets, and 20% busy (but low speed) city streets. I think it's pretty safe and it probably is. Several years ago I had a commute that involved a one mile stretch on a 50 mph road with no shoulder and heavy traffic. I hated that part of my commute. If my whole commute had been like that, I don't think I would have done it.

My brother was recently hit and fractured his pelvis. Had he been in a car, he most likely would have walked away without a scratch. In fact you could argue that he may not have been hit at all since the other driver would have been more likely to have seen him.

Think about it. People who are concerned about their safety in a car will try to buy a car with a high crash test safety rating. What kind of score do you think a Surly Cross Check would get in even the lowest speed crash test?

The saving grace for bikes is that they're most often used in areas where the speeds are low. But that's not true for everybody.

Last edited by tjspiel; 06-27-12 at 10:11 PM.
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Old 06-27-12, 10:19 PM
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Originally Posted by tjspiel
If the number of people that decided to venture out on a bicycle was 610 in 2010 then the entire U.S. cycling population would have been totally wiped out.

If I make 2000 car trips in a year, but only 200 bike trips and I'm in one bike accident and 3 car accidents, which mode of transport proved to be safer for me?

Do you see the problem with those numbers?. Alone they don't paint an accurate picture. It could be that cycling is actually safer but you can't say that based on what he posted.

And really it comes down to individual circumstances. My commute is 60% trails, 20% quiet residential streets, and 20% busy (but low speed) city streets. I think it's pretty safe and it probably is. Several years ago I had a commute that involved a one mile stretch on a 50 mph road with no shoulder and heavy traffic. I hated that part of my commute. If my whole commute had been like that, I don't think I would have done it.

My brother was recently hit and fractured his pelvis. Had he been in a car, he most likely would have walked away without a scratch. In fact you could argue that he may not have been hit at all since the other driver would have been more likely to have seen him.

Think about it. People who are concerned about their safety in a car will try to buy a car with a high crash test safety rating. What kind of score do you think a Surly Cross Check would get in even the lowest speed crash test?

The saving grace for bikes is that they're most often used in areas where the speeds are low. But that's not true for everybody.
The numbers do need to be taken in a larger context, I agree. Larger context like: everyone dies, and there are much more likely things than dying while riding a bicycle. Like cigarette smoking, for instance.
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Old 06-27-12, 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by no1mad
And the wife is undoubtedly getting validation from whatever social network she's hooked into.

If doing a threat assessment and then taking steps to reduce those threats is trivializing and she is unable or unwilling to comprehend that said precautions were done in part to allay her fears... they've got bigger issues that is beyond the scope of my experience and knowledge.
The fact that she is getting validation from her friends only makes matters worse if she is not getting it from him.

If she does get that validation from him, she might be more able to appreciate the steps he's taking to alleviate her fears.
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Old 06-27-12, 10:58 PM
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Riding a bike is so risky, you should never ride it on a road or under a tree, whether going to work or just riding around for fun. You could get hurt or killed. Be really safe and give up cycling altogether. Also, don't go for a walk because pedestrians get hurt and killed all the time. Cars are really dangerous too - have you seen how many accidents there are on a daily basis? Just turn on the radio during rush hour. I'd say working from home is the way to go, but make sure your smoke detectors have batteries and the doors are locked at all times.
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Old 06-27-12, 11:02 PM
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Okay, here's a woman's perspective: it's not just a matter of educating the wife. It does sound like the route has some danger zones, but then, so does any commute that involves contact with traffic. If I were the wife in this situation, what I would need to hear would be something like, "This is important to me and is something I need to do. I understand that you're worried about my safety and that means a lot to me. What can we do to alleviate your worries?" And from there it's a matter of figuring out how to make it happen.

Maybe (as someone else suggested) texting or calling when you arrive at work. Maybe a partial commute where you pick up a bus. Maybe you'll have to move to a more bike friendly area. Or you could go at it in a different direction: offer to stop commuting but start riding after work or on the weekends.

You could also keep in mind that sometimes the issue isn't really the issue. Often times one person in a couple becomes upset when the other starts some sort of life changing behavior: quitting smoking or drinking, dieting or exercising. It doesn't always make sense, but this can threaten someone who might feel insecure in the relationship. Talking and reaching a compromise would be my advice; browbeating her with facts or passive aggressive threats would really be the worst thing you could do. FWIW.

ETA: Just want to clarify, nothing that the OP has said makes me think he would browbeat his wife or make passive aggressive threats. That was more a reaction to some of the advice in this thread.

Last edited by debit; 06-27-12 at 11:17 PM. Reason: Clarification
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Old 06-27-12, 11:07 PM
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You will definitively get hit by the car if you do this everyday for the next 10 years. Chances are you will survive the hit. I been hit by 2 cars in 5 years. I have a buddie that flew into some ones car through their open window and i know people who have landed on hood unscaved. I been white bikes on the street but they are few and far between. I did see one guy get pernament nerve damage after he got hit by a car. But he got hit by a cabbie hard on the wrong spot that trapped his leg on the wheel of the car.. So just hope that dosnt happen.
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Old 06-27-12, 11:14 PM
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My girlfriend always tends to worry when I bike more than a few miles. But being outright rude is a little uncalled for, I would take her along sometime. Worked for my GF!
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