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Thread: Helmet Question

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    Helmet Question

    First, I wear a helmet and do not plan not to. Second, this is NOT a helmet debate.

    I was curious if anyone wore the full helmet like this.

    versus a regular cycling helmet.

    Thinking of switching to it in the winter time for 1) more protection on when riding in the winters snow and ice 2) more warmth and 3) piece of mind.

    Thoughts?

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    http://www.538.nl acidfast7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chefisaac View Post
    I wear a helmet and do not plan not to.
    :confused:

    too early in the morning

    edit: oops, I just saw the second "not." :ugh: too early in the morning
    Last edited by acidfast7; 07-18-12 at 04:39 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chefisaac View Post
    I was curious if anyone wore the full helmet like this. \
    I have a helmet pretty much exactly like that one for rollerblading. It doesn't have an Australian Standards sticker and is therefore illegal for bicycle use, so no, I have never worn it riding.

    Regardless of the law here, I wouldn't wear it anyway. I've hit my head on the ground with it enough times to understand how little protection it has. Fine for rollerblades, not fine for a bicycle. A bicycle helmet should crack if you hit it hard enough, absorbing a lot of the energy.

    Even the light head impacts I've had with that helmet hurt like a ************ and made me at least consider going to hospital. I think there's a good chance you wouldn't survive a bicycle stack with any speed.

    Perhaps the helmet you linked to is made different to the one I have, but it looks exactly the same.
    Last edited by abhibeckert; 07-18-12 at 04:42 AM.

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    Yes, I have not worn a helmet like that and will continue to not do so in the future.

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    Powerful-Ugly Creature Greyryder's Avatar
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    Those are made for much harder hits, than a standard bike helmet. Probably good for the patch of ice you don't see, that puts you on the ground, before you even realize you're falling. The nice thing is that the ABS shell will deform ans take some the impact, even if the foam inside cracks or shatters. (which, is a failure mode, and not how helmets are supposed to work) I wear a park style helmet, at the mountain bike trails I ride at. I have no faith in a standard cycling helmet to protect me from branches and sharp rocks. The paper thin shell makes it too easy to point load the foam, preventing it from absorbing any impact, and letting the things poke right through.

    Just remember, no helmet will protect you from the impact that happens inside your skull. Be careful out there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chefisaac View Post
    First, I wear a helmet and do not plan not to. Second, this is NOT a helmet debate.

    I was curious if anyone wore the full helmet like this.

    versus a regular cycling helmet.

    Thinking of switching to it in the winter time for 1) more protection on when riding in the winters snow and ice 2) more warmth and 3) piece of mind.

    Thoughts?
    It's probably a much better helmet than the standard stuff when it comes to actual usefullness in an accident.

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    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chefisaac View Post
    1) more protection ... 3) piece of mind.

    Thoughts?
    equals helmet debate
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    yes this questions is very good .i like it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chefisaac View Post
    I was curious if anyone wore the full helmet like this.

    versus a regular cycling helmet.

    Thinking of switching to it in the winter time for 1) more protection on when riding in the winters snow and ice 2) more warmth and 3) piece of mind.
    This is the Giro helmet I ride in for many seasons now. It covers a larger area of the head than a standard bike helmet. It has fewer holes than bike helmets generally intended for fair weather and those holes in Giro are normally plugged up - great for rainy weather and low temperatures. The chin strap is superior to any I had on a bike helmet. I switch to my Giro.9 I soon as it is practical given temperatures and feel much more secure than in any bike helmet. I am not sure I've engaged in serious tumbles with that helmet on a bike, but certainly in many when skiing. I would be scared, on the other hand, to put on a bike helmet for skiing, as providing a mediocre protection and even getting in the way such as in the possibility of getting caught somewhere - too many compromises there to ensure an air flow.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chefisaac View Post

    Thinking of switching to it in the winter time for 1) more protection on when riding in the winters snow and ice 2) more warmth and 3) piece of mind.

    Thoughts?
    Why would you feel that you need more protection in winter? I understand that there is a greater chance of falling in winter, but falling can happen anytime. But falling, is falling, whether winter or summer.

    Which is what a bicycle helmet is designed for....a fall, that's it.

    www.helmets.org

    Edit: I should add that the one time I split a helmet in-two was a fall....in winter. I was off-road riding, front tire went through the ice at 20 kph and I did a superman over the handlebars. Landed on my forehead/face, and helmet was split down the middle.
    Originally posted by Bones_McBones: Wow Digger, wow! You've earned my respect.... I know ashoposo got werked up. You are the gutter pig of Trollheim.

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    Seasonal adaptation..
    The bike-skate helmet does sell OK in cooler seasons, it is less ventilated,
    and some companies like Bern, add ear warmers and a winter liner set.
    for skiers, and of course, useful for winter bike commuters.

    Bern offers a model with a CF shell..

    I would not wear one when its over 100F out,
    then the more ventilated one will be your pick.
    Last edited by fietsbob; 07-20-12 at 12:59 PM.

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    Let's first take a look at what other things you are doing to actually prevent winter falls, rather than something you imagine might help after the fall. During the winter, do you:

    1. change tires to ones more appropriate for the season?
    2. slow your speed to that appropriate for the poorer riding conditions
    3. increase your visibility to aid idiot motorists in spotting you during reduced visibility/reduced light conditions
    4. Wear appropriate clothing -- in particular, balaclava, ski goggles, etc.

    Let's get *those* safety items cleared up first. Then you can more appropriately consider whether a full-face helmet is necessary.

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    Senior Member digger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by skye View Post
    Let's first take a look at what other things you are doing to actually prevent winter falls, rather than something you imagine might help after the fall. During the winter, do you:

    1. change tires to ones more appropriate for the season?
    2. slow your speed to that appropriate for the poorer riding conditions
    3. increase your visibility to aid idiot motorists in spotting you during reduced visibility/reduced light conditions
    4. Wear appropriate clothing -- in particular, balaclava, ski goggles, etc.

    Let's get *those* safety items cleared up first. Then you can more appropriately consider whether a full-face helmet is necessary.
    +1.

    In the bicycle safety courses I teach, the order of safety is:
    1) proper riding skills
    2) properly working and safe bicycle
    3) as a last resort, protective equipment (helmet, gloves, etc).
    Originally posted by Bones_McBones: Wow Digger, wow! You've earned my respect.... I know ashoposo got werked up. You are the gutter pig of Trollheim.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chefisaac View Post
    First, I wear a helmet and do not plan not to. Second, this is NOT a helmet debate.

    I was curious if anyone wore the full helmet like this.

    versus a regular cycling helmet.

    Thinking of switching to it in the winter time for 1) more protection on when riding in the winters snow and ice 2) more warmth and 3) piece of mind.

    Thoughts?
    I've thought about that type as well as ski helmets but I use a helmet light during the winter and affixing the light mount to that helmet (as well as to ski helmets) would be problematic. I also have an issue with temperature differentials. While it may be in the teens to 20s during the ride in, it could be in the 60s or 70s for the ride home. A ski helmet would be way to hot then. The Bern type wouldn't be as bad, however.
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    Threads from A&S and Commuting were merged.
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    http://www.538.nl acidfast7's Avatar
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    Also, I picked up one of these last time I was in Stockholm ... and I haven't "used" it yet (one-time use)

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    Quote Originally Posted by skye View Post
    Let's first take a look at what other things you are doing to actually prevent winter falls, rather than something you imagine might help after the fall. During the winter, do you:

    1. change tires to ones more appropriate for the season?
    2. slow your speed to that appropriate for the poorer riding conditions
    3. increase your visibility to aid idiot motorists in spotting you during reduced visibility/reduced light conditions
    4. Wear appropriate clothing -- in particular, balaclava, ski goggles, etc.

    Let's get *those* safety items cleared up first. Then you can more appropriately consider whether a full-face helmet is necessary.
    First chefisaac isn't talking about a 'full face helmet'...not unless he was going to wear it backwards. I'm pretty sure that anyone who rides in winter learns quickly to change tires, slow down, increase their visibility and wear appropriate clothing. But all those things aren't any kind of guarantee against falling on some random patch of ice. Tires, even studded ones, aren't infallible. Slowing down won't keep you from falling over on ice patches if you hit them wrong. And increasing your visibility won't protect your head nor will wearing a balaclava. Think of a helmet as the last line of defense after you've done all the other things.

    Quote Originally Posted by digger View Post
    +1.

    In the bicycle safety courses I teach, the order of safety is:
    1) proper riding skills
    2) properly working and safe bicycle
    3) as a last resort, protective equipment (helmet, gloves, etc).
    Proper riding skills: good thing. Bike in good working order: good thing. But neither will keep you from crashing. I have excellent riding skills (very long term mountain biker) and my bikes are always in top mechanical form but I still crash...on occasion. It happens. Most of the time when you least expect it. My most recent crash occurred on a flat smooth bit of single track that can be ridden at nearly 20 mph. I didn't see a rock, clipped it with my pedal and found myself flying through the air before I augerred into the ground on my knee, my shoulder and then my head. It followed the same pattern as every other crash I've experienced...no warning and then you hit the ground. Sure, I could have not been riding there and I could have slowed down but then I could have driven my car that day too. I won't say that the helmet saved my life but it didn't hurt anything to wear it and I'd rather have rocks embedded in it then in my skull.

    And let's face it, most people's riding skills leave a lot to be desired...give them a piece of gum and they will probably fall over. The mechanical soundness of most bikes is also less then stellar.
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
    Proper riding skills: good thing. Bike in good working order: good thing. But neither will keep you from crashing. I have excellent riding skills (very long term mountain biker) and my bikes are always in top mechanical form but I still crash...on occasion. It happens. Most of the time when you least expect it. My most recent crash occurred on a flat smooth bit of single track that can be ridden at nearly 20 mph. I didn't see a rock, clipped it with my pedal and found myself flying through the air before I augerred into the ground on my knee, my shoulder and then my head. It followed the same pattern as every other crash I've experienced...no warning and then you hit the ground. Sure, I could have not been riding there and I could have slowed down but then I could have driven my car that day too. I won't say that the helmet saved my life but it didn't hurt anything to wear it and I'd rather have rocks embedded in it then in my skull.
    I thought the OP was talking about commute riding rather than single track mountain bike riding.
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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    equals helmet debate
    I've been following the thread, but not posting because I don't wear a helmet and don't want to get all A&S in their thread - please don't comment on this aspect of my post, I don't want to derail the thread over my choices - but the OP is comparing one style of helmet to another, not helmet or not.

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    As a winter cyclist in a winter town I'll weigh in:

    I think that type of skate helmet is a pretty good choice for winter, and I see a lot of winter bikers wearing them. It is designed to take multiple hits as opposed to a regular bike helmet and all debate aside about riding carefully and safely, if you ride a lot in icy conditions studs or not, you will eventually go down. It's just a given. I've broken/cracked 2 bike helmets in icy snowy crashes in my time. That's a plus with these types of lids.

    As far as warmth goes, it depends on you of course, Skate helmets are certainly warmer than regular vented bike helmets as they aren't designed specifically for high output efforts. Depending on your ride, the temp, and your output can that can still be a problem even in winter. I use a regular bike helmet with varying under layers depending on temps down to about 20F, i ride hard in the winter and I like the venting. Then I use a vented Giro ski helmet below 20F which is great, but it's way too warm for anything above that.

    My conclusion, if you aren't too concerned about overheating they are perfect for winter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
    I thought the OP was talking about commute riding rather than single track mountain bike riding.
    Same difference when it comes to the items listed by skye and digger as well as the incidence of crashes. Crashes are, for the most part, random events that you can't anticipate no matter where or how you ride. You can plan for them by having good equipment and good skills. Only my latest crash was on dirt. The two crashes before that were on ice while commuting. And both involved head strikes. Having a helmet, for me and a lot of people, is just part of having good equipment and good skills.
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    Bern, POC, Nutcase, Bell, and Giro all make skate-style bike rated helmets. I don't have any plans to use one, but that's because I don't have any issues with getting cold. I have a Smartwool beanie that fits under my helmets in cool weather, and a full balaclava if it gets really cold.
    I've smacked the ground a few times in the winter in a regular roadie helmet and there wasn't anything unusually horrible about it that I felt like I needed additional coverage.
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    I have a bern with the winter kit that works well for me in the winter. Full disclosure time though, I dont pedal fast, I almost exclusively ride to work or across town for social time with friends. Basically I dont pedal at a pace that makes a lot of sweat if I'm dressed correctly. Everyone's style is different obviously. Much like cyccommute, I had several days in the spring of last year when the morning temps were 30 degrees colder than the afternoon temps, and I was too lazy to to carry a different liner ans switch them out for every ride. Bought a regular bike helmet that is adjustable like a hard hat so I can get a cap on and off easily under the helmet. If you like to push yourself and pedal hard then the bern or ski helmets might not work for you as well as they do for someone like me, and they only work well for me for about one season.
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    Senior Member digger's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
    First chefisaac isn't talking about a 'full face helmet'...not unless he was going to wear it backwards. I'm pretty sure that anyone who rides in winter learns quickly to change tires, slow down, increase their visibility and wear appropriate clothing. But all those things aren't any kind of guarantee against falling on some random patch of ice. Tires, even studded ones, aren't infallible. Slowing down won't keep you from falling over on ice patches if you hit them wrong. And increasing your visibility won't protect your head nor will wearing a balaclava. Think of a helmet as the last line of defense after you've done all the other things.

    Proper riding skills: good thing. Bike in good working order: good thing. But neither will keep you from crashing. I have excellent riding skills (very long term mountain biker) and my bikes are always in top mechanical form but I still crash...on occasion. It happens. Most of the time when you least expect it. My most recent crash occurred on a flat smooth bit of single track that can be ridden at nearly 20 mph. I didn't see a rock, clipped it with my pedal and found myself flying through the air before I augerred into the ground on my knee, my shoulder and then my head. It followed the same pattern as every other crash I've experienced...no warning and then you hit the ground. Sure, I could have not been riding there and I could have slowed down but then I could have driven my car that day too. I won't say that the helmet saved my life but it didn't hurt anything to wear it and I'd rather have rocks embedded in it then in my skull.

    And let's face it, most people's riding skills leave a lot to be desired...give them a piece of gum and they will probably fall over. The mechanical soundness of most bikes is also less then stellar.
    Agreed. Please see post number 10.

    Let me approach from a differant angle:

    All too often I hear well intentioned people (police, doctors, etc) say, "wear your helmet." When a cyclist is struck by a motor vehicle, I often read, "cycllist was (or was not) wearing a helmet." I often see kids, with there helmets on their heads so far back as to be useless, and once I saw a kid that had it on backwards (saw a police officer with one on backwards as well).

    It seems that bicycle safety is nothing more than, slap a helmet on your head and off you go. Bicycle safety, is much more than that. Proper riding skills and a sound bicycle are far more important than a helmet. Protective gear (i.e. helmet and gloves), is your last line of defence.

    The OP stated that we wanted "more protection in winter", "piece of mind". What was offered by myself, and others, is not merely just to wear a "better" helmet but to look at other options to increase safety. If a helmet is better, or offers more protection, then wear it year-round. Of course, one has to balance comfort and tempreature control with head protection. If comfort didn't matter, then wear a motorcycle helmet....but yer gonna sweat. :-)

    ****

    chefisaac,

    it is unlikely that a skateboard helmet would be your best choice. Like a hockey helmet, they are intended for multiple low speed impacts and unlikely that they offer good air flow.

    I think that you might want to stick with a bicycle helmet and you can use a number of techniques to help keep you warm:
    1) wear a balaclava, and have a full face one and just a touque (ones that are thin enough for under the helmet)
    2) something over the helmet to block wind

    You can mix and match the 3 things above to help regulate warmth.

    In February, I wear the full faced balaclava, the touque and a rain cover.

    As spring approaches I usually remove the full face balaclava.

    Further into spring the rain cover comes off.

    Then evenetually the touque.

    Then when fall approaches into winter, the system reverses.
    Last edited by digger; 07-19-12 at 10:40 AM.
    Originally posted by Bones_McBones: Wow Digger, wow! You've earned my respect.... I know ashoposo got werked up. You are the gutter pig of Trollheim.

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