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Old 12-29-12, 10:31 PM   #1
commuterist
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Fenders and Disc Brakes

I recently bought a bike with disc brakes for commuting (Jamis Nova Race) and I don't know what fenders will fit it. I have eyelets so that's not a problem. I have an old set of SKS (45mm) fenders from an old bike that I tried to fit but they're impossible to mount with my disc brakes. I suppose that I could get really long spaces and really long bolts but that doesn't seem feasible given the distance. I also tried putting the brakes between the wires but that doesn't fit either. However, it seems like if the wires had a larger angle and didn't bolt on placement it could fit. I don't really care about reusing my old fenders, I just don't know what look for when buying new ones.

All of the fenders I see online look roughly the same as the ones I currently have that don't fit. The only ones I can find that say they're specifically for disc brakes are these:

http://www.amazon.com/Axiom-Rainrunn...d_rhf_dp_p_t_2

Higher resolution picture:

http://www.axiomgear.com/img/prod/ra...x-reflex-1.jpg

which just look like all the others only with built in spacers. Even those spacers don't look long enough. Attached are pictures of trying to fit my old fenders on my new bike. Those pictures are trying to fit the front fender I haven't tried the rear but I took a picture of the clearance for my rear tire. I'm not sure what width will fit, probably 45mm but I'm thinking 35mm might be best. I don't honestly care as long as it fits. I tried searing here and elsewhere and there just isn't a lot of information that I can find about fitting fenders with disc brakes. I'd prefer not to have to buy anything or modify the fenders to get them to fit. I've had bad experiences trying to fit fenders in the past.
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File Type: jpg DSC00006.jpg (91.2 KB, 43 views)
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Old 12-29-12, 10:39 PM   #2
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Planet Bike Cascadia 35mm or 45mm would work. These come standard with disc spacers and long mounting bolts.

Or, since you already have some fenders, your LBS may have a couple of extra spacers and long bolts.

A rule of thumb for "proper" fender width is tire width +10mm, but it is not set in stone.

The spacers are the silver barrels in this pic:


You'd also use one of these for a rear rack (or share the same bolt as the fenders)
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Old 12-29-12, 10:54 PM   #3
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I was looking at these too:

http://www.modernbike.com/itemgroup.asp?IGPK=2126178049

I think they're called "Freddy Fenders"? It looks like they bolt onto the disc brakes which seems like it would be better than using huge spacers. Am I wrong? Thanks for the info about the Cascadia's. If these other fenders aren't better maybe I'll just get the Cascadias.
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Old 12-29-12, 11:05 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by commuterist View Post
I was looking at these too:

http://www.modernbike.com/itemgroup.asp?IGPK=2126178049

I think they're called "Freddy Fenders"? It looks like they bolt onto the disc brakes which seems like it would be better than using huge spacers. Am I wrong? Thanks for the info about the Cascadia's. If these other fenders aren't better maybe I'll just get the Cascadias.
Those look cool, too, though I have no personal experience with them and can't comment on mounting.
That's a very cool bike, by the way.

FWIW, I've used both the Avid BB5 and the BB7 brakes, and can highly recommend getting BB7's as an upgrade at some point. The calipers don't cost much, and the performance improvement is noticeable - particularly in the wet.

EDIT: - deleted- wrong model year assumption <D'oh>


This pic isn't the best, but I'm using PB cascadia (the HUGE 60mm ones) with spacers front and rear, so you get a sense of how they look from a distance. I'll try to snap some pics soon if you're curious.

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Old 12-29-12, 11:20 PM   #5
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Those look cool, too, though I have no personal experience with them and can't comment on mounting.
That's a very cool bike, by the way.

FWIW, I've used both the Avid BB5 and the BB7 brakes, and can highly recommend getting BB7's as an upgrade at some point. The calipers don't cost much, and the performance improvement is noticeable - particularly in the wet.

This pic isn't the best, but I'm using PB cascadia (the HUGE 60mm ones) with spacers front and rear, so you get a sense of how they look from a distance. I'll try to snap some pics soon if you're curious.
Thanks, the Jamis Nova Race is a really nice bike for the price (I got it for 1100 but the MSRP is 1300) and I'm excited to get it outfitted. Those are actually BB7s you see in the picture. I think the old 2012 model had BB5s which look very similar but the 2013 model has BB7s. They are very nice brakes but I still need to wear them in since they're really weak the moment.
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Old 12-29-12, 11:29 PM   #6
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Thanks, the Jamis Nova Race is a really nice bike for the price (I got it for 1100 but the MSRP is 1300) and I'm excited to get it outfitted. Those are actually BB7s you see in the picture. I think the old 2012 model had BB5s which look very similar but the 2013 model has BB7s. They are very nice brakes but I still need to wear them in since they're really weak the moment.

Oh, hey, whaddya know? I was looking at the 2012.
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Old 12-30-12, 04:27 AM   #7
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Forgive me if I'm oversimplifying, but I had the same problem with my front fender (Plant Bike Hardcore fenders) and I just bent the wire in such a way that it bends under the brake. It's not the prettiest solution, but it works just fine.
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Old 12-30-12, 07:28 AM   #8
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Forgive me if I'm oversimplifying, but I had the same problem with my front fender (Plant Bike Hardcore fenders) and I just bent the wire in such a way that it bends under the brake. It's not the prettiest solution, but it works just fine.
My LBS did the same, routed the steel stays of SKS chromolpastic under the front disc brake.

Some racks have fender attachment points. You can use mid-fork rack eyelets for fenders.
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Old 12-30-12, 07:40 AM   #9
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Planet Bike Cascadia 35mm or 45mm would work. These come standard with disc spacers and long mounting bolts.

Or, since you already have some fenders, your LBS may have a couple of extra spacers and long bolts.

A rule of thumb for "proper" fender width is tire width +10mm, but it is not set in stone.

The spacers are the silver barrels in this pic:


You'd also use one of these for a rear rack (or share the same bolt as the fenders)
related question
Where?? can such long metric 5x.8 bolts like those be purchased on their own?
hardware store only has up to 35mm long ones with an allen socket head
up to say 50mm with a hex nut head (less ideal, allen socket prefferred for recessed head applications)
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Old 12-30-12, 10:19 AM   #10
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McMaster Carr has metric bolts, their shipping is more than reasonable. 55mm 5mmx.8 is part number 92290A268
They also have spacers, 40mm is 92871A231
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Old 12-30-12, 10:32 AM   #11
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In addition to bending the stay around or under the front brake caliper, or spaced outside of it's width, it is possible with some fenders to avoid this interference entirely due to the fact that the fender is longer, and the stay approaches the fork mount at a lower angle, such that the stay can mount beneath the caliper, unbent. This is the case for Velo Orange steel and Al fenders and similar fenders which enclose more of the tire's circumference than the shorter SKS/PB fenders.

For example, here's some VO Al fenders on a "commuterized" mtb, attached below.

edit: Having a single stay instead of double stays helps fitting a lot. Most all the metal fenders use a single stay in front. You can modify a std SKS/PB fender to lower stay only, and it works pretty good without much fender movement. I have this on a bike now.
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Old 12-30-12, 10:38 AM   #12
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are those fenders completely covered in reflective tape? Seems like a lot of work, was it difficult?
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Old 12-30-12, 10:54 AM   #13
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Yes, 3M Scotchlite 680 reflective sheeting.

It's a bit of a PITA. Although Scotchlite will stretch some, since it's intended to be printed and applied to the sides of LE/EMT vehicles, if it is stretched much it will diminish the retroreflective properties of the laminate. I bought this stuff in sheets 24"x10', so I had to cut it down to tape width (20-30mm), then apply in strips to the fenders. The TT/DT were a bit easier since they are nearly cylinders.

I once wrapped an entire bike frame in 50% overlapping strips of Scotchlite. In addition to the visibility enhancement, the tape provides protection to the frame from dings/rock/chain/locks. Adds about 2 lbs to the bike and the Scotchlite adhesive is some of the most tenacious stuff in the world, removable only with acetone/rags/much elbow grease.

It's not that hard a job, but not something I can do in 5 minutes, either.

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Old 12-30-12, 02:52 PM   #14
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I went ahead and bought the Planet Bike SpeedEZ Hybrid Fenders:

http://ecom1.planetbike.com/7015.html

I'm still not 100% sure they attach to the disc brakes. People on Amazon show them at attaching to the frame but none of those people don't have disc brakes and the geometry seems perfect for attaching to the disc brake mounts. I guess I'll see when they show up. If they end up attaching to the frame I may just return them and get something else. These Civia Brownies:

http://civiacycles.com/components/brownie_fenders/

have a more or less horizontal attachment like Seeker333 suggests. They'd probably fit with only a minor tweak of the wire but I would be worried about them rattling and hitting the wheel with only one attachment point since they're polycarbonate. I tried to look at the Velo Orange stuff but their site is down at the moment.
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Old 12-30-12, 06:32 PM   #15
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The SpeedEZ mount to the fork and seatstays. I've got a friend who has them;he thinks they're ok,but they do tend to rattle.

I've got a set of Civia Wirths on my Dr Good(almost the same thing as the Brownies). Went straight on,just had to bend the front left strut a touch.

I generally avoid SKS fenders for two reasons. First,the dual struts make it a pain to get them around disc brakes;the double strut is harder to bend and at least one is usually in the way. The other reason is that the struts are held in place by individual nuts on the fenders. It seems at least once a month the struts would get a wack from locking up or something,and I'd need to pull out an 8mm wrench to straighten them back out(PB uses 10mm for their Hardcore fenders,I've done this enough I've committed the sizes to memory). YMMV,but I prefer the good old PB Freddys. The single struts don't get knocked out of wack very easily,and they're easy to get around discs. A trip to the hardware store for some longer bolts and spacers,a little bit of bending,and no worries.
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Old 12-30-12, 08:50 PM   #16
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The SpeedEZ mount to the fork and seatstays. I've got a friend who has them;he thinks they're ok,but they do tend to rattle.

I've got a set of Civia Wirths on my Dr Good(almost the same thing as the Brownies). Went straight on,just had to bend the front left strut a touch.

I generally avoid SKS fenders for two reasons. First,the dual struts make it a pain to get them around disc brakes;the double strut is harder to bend and at least one is usually in the way. The other reason is that the struts are held in place by individual nuts on the fenders. It seems at least once a month the struts would get a wack from locking up or something,and I'd need to pull out an 8mm wrench to straighten them back out(PB uses 10mm for their Hardcore fenders,I've done this enough I've committed the sizes to memory). YMMV,but I prefer the good old PB Freddys. The single struts don't get knocked out of wack very easily,and they're easy to get around discs. A trip to the hardware store for some longer bolts and spacers,a little bit of bending,and no worries.
Thanks for the heads up. I think I'm just going to cancel my order and go with a different fender. I don't like the SKS fenders either but mainly because they have plastic quick releases. I'd prefer my fenders not come off easily. The Civia Wirths have two attachment points that look to be the same angle as my SKS fenders but they look more bendable (the plastic on the SKS makes it har d). I'd prefer not to do any major bending. I'll probably go with the Cascadias since they seem like a safe bet. I measured the clearance for the disc brakes and it's about 30 mm which I'm guessing is pretty standard.

Why does it have to be so hard to find fenders for disc brakes? The main problem is that very few fenders list specifically that they fit disc brakes (implying they come with spacers). Maybe I'm just better of buying ones I like and then going out and buying my own spacers from a local hardware store.
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Old 12-30-12, 10:28 PM   #17
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Had the same issue. It took a big fist full of hardware and a good bit of bending, but it all worked. That distance isn't as large as it seems.


Motobecane Phantom Outlaw fender strut spacers by ccorlew, on Flickr



Motobecane Phantom Outlaw commuter bike by ccorlew, on Flickr
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Old 12-30-12, 10:59 PM   #18
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Had the same issue. It took a big fist full of hardware and a good bit of bending, but it all worked. That distance isn't as large as it seems.


Motobecane Phantom Outlaw fender strut spacers by ccorlew, on Flickr



Motobecane Phantom Outlaw commuter bike by ccorlew, on Flickr
I think I'm going to get the Cascadias since they're a safe bet. I'm also getting a rack and the current one I'm looking at is the Topeak Tourist Disc. Do I need to get a disc specific rack if I install it with the fenders in the rear? I imagine that if I end up using spacers in the rear the extra spacers that come with the disc rack will be too much.
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Old 12-30-12, 11:13 PM   #19
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Thanks for the heads up. I think I'm just going to cancel my order and go with a different fender. I don't like the SKS fenders either but mainly because they have plastic quick releases. I'd prefer my fenders not come off easily.
The quick release stuff has saved me from at least one, and probably two, crashes. It takes ten seconds to dismount, stick the stay back into the mount, and get back on, in the rare event it comes loose. It's only happened to me after I've been parked in a very crowed rack (like outside my gym), never while riding.
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Old 12-30-12, 11:18 PM   #20
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The other problem is that I don't know whether I should get the 29er rack to make sure that the fender fits under the rack without scraping the tire. It really sucks that bike stores in my area don't seem to carry racks and fenders (especially not fenders and racks for disc brakes). I might try just going down the list of bike shops in my area to find one that carries fenders and racks so I don't have to buy over the internet with terribly limited information.
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Old 12-30-12, 11:53 PM   #21
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The quick release stuff has saved me from at least one, and probably two, crashes. It takes ten seconds to dismount, stick the stay back into the mount, and get back on, in the rare event it comes loose. It's only happened to me after I've been parked in a very crowed rack (like outside my gym), never while riding.
Unless most SKS fenders are different from mine, there's a difference between the quick release and the stay-failure point - there's a quick release which removes the whole fender, and also the stays can pull out of the mount.
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Old 12-31-12, 01:22 PM   #22
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Getting fenders and a rack for this is turning into a small nightmare. I've called 10 bike shops near me so far and most don't carry fenders and the one that does doesn't know anything about trying to fit a fender and rack on a bike with disc brakes. What I'm trying to figure out is this:

1. If I get the Planet Bike Cascadias (or any fenders) and use a large spacer to mount them do I still need to get a rack with disc spacers or should I get a non-disc rack and simply mount it on top of the Cascadia's spacer. The problem I imagine with the latter case is that the rack arms may need significant bending to get to the spacer and thus not fit well. However, it seems like the disc specific rack would have the same problem only worse unless the spacer that comes on the rack is optional.

2. Does the Topeak Explorer or Super Tourist rack (or other rack) have enough clearance on a 700x28c tire to accommodate fenders or do I need to get a rack for a 29er?
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Old 12-31-12, 01:37 PM   #23
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Pictures Overdue.. since Im not there to see, IDK..
You have 10 bikeshops and none have mudguards
where do you live ?
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Old 12-31-12, 04:34 PM   #24
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Maybe I'm just better of buying ones I like and then going out and buying my own spacers from a local hardware store.
That's what's always worked for me. Never bought disc-specific fenders,never needed to.

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1. If I get the Planet Bike Cascadias (or any fenders) and use a large spacer to mount them do I still need to get a rack with disc spacers or should I get a non-disc rack and simply mount it on top of the Cascadia's spacer. The problem I imagine with the latter case is that the rack arms may need significant bending to get to the spacer and thus not fit well. However, it seems like the disc specific rack would have the same problem only worse unless the spacer that comes on the rack is optional.
From what I can see here,if you bought a Topeak rack,you could just bend the fender struts out and attach them to the ends of the lower mounts. Or even just ziptie the struts to the lower rack legs(in fact,that's how I'd do it).
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Old 12-31-12, 07:47 PM   #25
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That's what's always worked for me. Never bought disc-specific fenders,never needed to.



From what I can see here,if you bought a Topeak rack,you could just bend the fender struts out and attach them to the ends of the lower mounts. Or even just ziptie the struts to the lower rack legs(in fact,that's how I'd do it).
I spent most of my day running around my major metropolitan area visiting bike shops and REI. I live in a heavily populated area and there are probably ~50+ bike shops within a 100 mile radius. Most of them don't carry racks and fenders since they sell so few (I asked them why). The bike shops that carry fenders and racks are usually the big shops (like Performance Bicycle) and even they mostly stock the clip-ons. The selection is very limited. The best luck I had finding racks and fenders was REI (and similar big sports stores) but I had to call around to several REIs in my area to find one that had the 45mm Planet Bike Cascadias in stock but I did find one. The 700c and 26" dual size rack by Topeak definitely has clearance for fenders on a 700c bike. You can get the Cascadias and try to use it with the non-disc Topeak rack like dynaryder suggests but it's a big stretch. That's the problem with all the normal size racks. I have to clear about 30mm on each side and every non-disc rack just needed to be pulled too much to comfortably fit. However, it is definitely possible to fit the Cascadias with the non-disc version of the Topeak rack BUT I wouldn't do it as the bend is too much.

In the end I went to Performance Bike and they have a disc-compatible rack that has optional spacers (it's their own brand, Transit). This was perfect for what I needed. I have the Planet Bike Cascadia 45mm Fenders and Performance Bike Transit Disc Rack with me now but I haven't tried to install them yet. I lined everything up, however and it looks like it will fit perfectly.

Some other random things I've learned in case anyone is curious:

1. Tubus makes a disc-specific rack but it doesn't have mounts on it for fenders like some of the other ones they make do.
2. The Topeak Disc Specific Rack easily clears my disc brakes as expected
3. You can't mount the Cascadias on the outside of the Topeak Disc Rack because the arms of the rack and arms of the fenders intersect. Also, this requires too much inward bending of the Cascadia's stays. Also, the Topeak Disc Rack has inset screws so even if you wanted to mount fenders on the outside you would need some perfectly formed long spacer to fill the recessed mounting gap.
3. One of the main problems with fitting the non-disc version of the Topeak rack with the Cascadias is that the Topeak rack has two flare outs near the eyelet mount which hit the adjustment knob of the BB7. This isn't a huge deal but it does mean you have to bend it even more. I could barely hold the arms of Topeak rack open wide enough to fit it with the Cascadia spacers. It didn't break, however, and it would probably hold but still not desirable.
4. Velo Orange like a previous poster mentioned is a pretty good bet but it requires bending the arm around the disc brakes. Not a huge deal though and could easily be accommodated. I didn't try this in person, however. If I went this route I probably would have bought the Topeak Disc Rack. I didn't do this because Vle

Last edited by commuterist; 12-31-12 at 08:01 PM.
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