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  1. #1
    Senior Member PDX Reborn's Avatar
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    Cycling offenses go on your driving record?

    Saw this article on the Oregonian this morning. Oregon and Washington cyclist don't have anything to worry about, for the moment. However, in California your cycling offenses do show up on your driving record

    http://www.oregonlive.com/commuting/...bicyclist.html

  2. #2
    Senior Member dynodonn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDX Reborn View Post
    However, in California your cycling offenses do show up on your driving record

    Which is an irony in my locale, since many cyclists do not have a driver's license or insurance in the first place.

  3. #3
    http://www.538.nl acidfast7's Avatar
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    In Germany, every offense is loaded into a central database (Punkte in Flensburg) including tourists and people without German licenses (including cyclists).

    One is not allowed to do a direct US-for-Germany license exchange when they have PiF already.
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    Senior Member Rudz's Avatar
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    Oh California, how silly you are
    Giant Rapid 3- COMMUTERIZED *IBERA*Nashbar*Tiagra*105*Velocity*Selle SMP*Gatorskin
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    I don't see a problem with that.

    I desire to be treated as a regular road user by the other users of public roads. Subsequently, I ride by the rules and laws of the road and expect them to do the same.

    Seems as though rule infractions should hold the same weight regardless of the type of vehicle one is driving. Why wouldn't they?
    Birth Certificate, Passport, Marriage License Driver's License and Residency Permit all say I'm a Fred. I guess there's no denying it.

  6. #6
    http://www.538.nl acidfast7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigfred View Post
    I don't see a problem with that.

    I desire to be treated as a regular road user by the other users of public roads. Subsequently, I ride by the rules and laws of the road and expect them to do the same.

    Seems as though rule infractions should hold the same weight regardless of the type of vehicle one is driving. Why wouldn't they?
    Here running a red on a bike is the same as in a car.

    I like it.

    A lot.

    As it makes people use the cycling infrastructure properly.

    FWIW, the fine is €200 and a one month ban on driving.

    *However, a speeding ticket can be as low as a €10 fine, which I like because on certain sections of the Autobahn it goes from unlimited (traffic moving at 100+ mph) to 80km/h (50mph) quite quickly.
    Last edited by acidfast7; 03-09-13 at 10:06 AM.
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  7. #7
    Senior Member dynodonn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acidfast7 View Post
    Here running a red on a bike is the same as in a car.

    I like it.

    A lot.

    As it makes people use the cycling infrastructure properly.
    A waste of time in my locale, trying to get blood out of turnip.

  8. #8
    http://www.538.nl acidfast7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dynodonn View Post
    A waste of time in my locale, trying to get blood out of turnip.
    here they're quite serious and they occasionally have days where they stop bikes, which I like because it makes people following the rules:

    moving violation (fines/suspensions): http://www.howtogermany.com/pages/tr...iolations.html

    stopping the bikes in Frankfurt:

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  9. #9
    Senior Member David Bierbaum's Avatar
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    If we want to be treated equally on the roads as legitimate vehicle traffic, that means we'll have to be treated equally under the law for violating traffic laws. I'm amazed that they don't require licensing yet, for "driving" bicycles on the road. (Here in the US, that is. Maybe they do elsewhere...)

    How would the driving exam for that work, anyhow? A tandem? Or just two bicyclists, with the one behind being the examiner?
    Last edited by David Bierbaum; 03-09-13 at 10:17 AM.

  10. #10
    Senior Member dynodonn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by acidfast7 View Post
    here they're quite serious and they occasionally have days where they stop bikes, which I like because it makes people following the rules:

    moving violation (fines/suspensions): http://www.howtogermany.com/pages/tr...iolations.html

    stopping the bikes in Frankfurt:
    Again, a waste of time in my locale, to ticket someone without a driver's license and insurance, fine someone who has no money, throw them in jails that are currently going through realignment that are keeping only the worst public offenders, home confinement for person who has no home.

  11. #11
    Senior Member David Bierbaum's Avatar
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    I'd think unpaid fines would put a ding on one's credit rating. And you failed to mention another tactic they could take: impounding your vehicle till the fine was paid, or till the time limit is reached and they auction it off!

  12. #12
    http://www.538.nl acidfast7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dynodonn View Post
    fine someone who has no money, throw them in jails that are currently going through realignment that are keeping only the worst public offenders, home confinement for person who has no home.
    austerity?
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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by PDX Reborn View Post
    However, in California your cycling offenses do show up on your driving record
    l
    Everything I've seen indicates that bicycling traffic violations do not show up on your motor vehicle driving record in California as long as they are properly recorded as bicycle citations (if the ticket doesn't clearly indicate that you were on a bicycle you should ask the court clerk to correct this):

    http://www.sfbike.org/?bikelaw_ticket_faq

  14. #14
    Senior Member rebel1916's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Bierbaum View Post
    If we want to be treated equally on the roads as legitimate vehicle traffic, that means we'll have to be treated equally under the law for violating traffic laws. I'm amazed that they don't require licensing yet, for "driving" bicycles on the road. (Here in the US, that is. Maybe they do elsewhere...)
    Yeah, that would be literally impossible to make work, even if it was a good idea. Which it isn't. Between rentals to tourists, kids, young Latin American immigrants (who make up the VAST majority of full time bike commuters here in the Northeast) there would be no way to keep track of it or enforce it. At least not with a very heavy hand.

  15. #15
    Certified Bike Brat Burton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dynodonn View Post
    Which is an irony in my locale, since many cyclists do not have a driver's license or insurance in the first place.
    Or maybe there's a method to the madness. Here in Quebec cycling offences are kept in a database for two years and demerit points assigned against a non-existant license. If during that period of time anyone applies for a driver's license, the virtual demerit points become immediately effective.

    Its actually pretty hard to get ticketed here on a bicycle. Anyone stupid enough and reckless enough to acumulate a bunch of demerit points on a bicycle they don't want behind the wheel of a car. So that part actually works just fine!

  16. #16
    Been Around Awhile I-Like-To-Bike's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by David Bierbaum View Post
    I'm amazed that they don't require licensing yet, for "driving" bicycles on the road. (Here in the US, that is. Maybe they do elsewhere...)

    How would the driving exam for that work, anyhow?
    It (bicycle rider licensing) wouldn't work, that is why no one seriously proposes it in the U.S.

  17. #17
    Senior Member
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    In Quebec, violations such as failure to stop, riding on sidewalks, riding the wrong way on a one way, will get you an 85$ ticket as well as the loss of 3 points on your driver's license. What if you don't have a license? When you apply for one, a 6 month suspension will come into play and you cannot get a learners for the next 6 months.

  18. #18
    Senior Member
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    Correction. A four month suspension is applied if the person has more that 4 points over a 2 year period.

  19. #19
    Senior Member dynodonn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jimblairo View Post
    In Quebec, violations such as failure to stop, riding on sidewalks, riding the wrong way on a one way, will get you an 85$ ticket as well as the loss of 3 points on your driver's license. What if you don't have a license? When you apply for one, a 6 month suspension will come into play and you cannot get a learners for the next 6 months.
    You wanna guess how many motorists in my locale are driving on a suspended license. Locally, just a couple months ago, there was one very bad collision involving one motorist driving on a suspended license, and the other motorist was unlicensed altogether. The real loser was a (licensed) local home owner who's parked vehicle was totaled in the collision process.
    Last edited by dynodonn; 03-09-13 at 06:23 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by bigfred View Post
    I don't see a problem with that.

    I desire to be treated as a regular road user by the other users of public roads. Subsequently, I ride by the rules and laws of the road and expect them to do the same.

    Seems as though rule infractions should hold the same weight regardless of the type of vehicle one is driving. Why wouldn't they?
    Well, since a primary purpose of the laws that govern the roadways is to prevent death and injury, I'm just fine with equal treatment, as long as it involves momentum as a factor. Note: we already have enhanced fines for heavy commercial vehicles (trucker adage: Big Rig, Big Fine), so what I am proposing is already in place. By not assessing points to cyclists, the state is merely rounding off the momentum of cyclists to zero, which is a reasonable round-off.

  21. #21
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    The really weird part is that in CA they'll ticket you for public transit violations (riding the train without a ticket and such) as if it were a parking ticket. One time I got ticketed for not having a bus pass, and they were completely stumped when I couldn't present a driver's license.

    I'm on board with cycling offenses showing up on a driving record. After all, I am using the road on my bike and should act accordingly.

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigfred View Post
    I don't see a problem with that.

    I desire to be treated as a regular road user by the other users of public roads. Subsequently, I ride by the rules and laws of the road and expect them to do the same.
    +1

    Seems as though rule infractions should hold the same weight regardless of the type of vehicle one is driving. Why wouldn't they?
    +1

  23. #23
    Senior Member dynodonn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baytree View Post

    I'm on board with cycling offenses showing up on a driving record.
    I'm not, I've yet to see home owners and business owners erect barriers to protect themselves from reckless cyclists, and why are motor vehicle manufactures crash standards so high, again it's not because of cyclists.

  24. #24
    http://www.538.nl acidfast7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dynodonn View Post
    I'm not, I've yet to see home owners and business owners erect barriers to protect themselves from reckless cyclists, and why are motor vehicle manufactures crash standards so high, again it's not because of cyclists.
    the EU has an anti-spoiler law so that when a cyclist is hit and let go over the car, they won't be decapitated.

    compare the spoiler on the US-spec and JPN-spec MK IV Supra and the EU-spec model
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  25. #25
    Cycle Year Round CB HI's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bigfred View Post
    I don't see a problem with that.

    I desire to be treated as a regular road user by the other users of public roads. Subsequently, I ride by the rules and laws of the road and expect them to do the same.

    Seems as though rule infractions should hold the same weight regardless of the type of vehicle one is driving. Why wouldn't they?
    How many motorist in your area comply with your mandatory helmet law?
    Land of the Free, Because of the Brave.

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