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-   -   Mirrors... There, I said it. (http://www.bikeforums.net/commuting/880306-mirrors-there-i-said.html)

daredevil 03-30-13 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alan s (Post 15449652)
I tried a helmet mounted mirror once, and it only distracted me. There is nothing a mirror would do to make me feel safer

If you can't even recognize the potential benefits, I'm afraid that only proves you don't know how to use one.

bluegoatwoods 03-30-13 08:00 PM

Count me as one of the mirror fans.

I tried a glasses mounted mirror about 30 yrs ago. But I found it distracting. I also seemed to have a hard time interpreting what I saw when I was actually trying to look in it.

But I'm very uncomfortable riding without a handlebar mirror. I use two, in fact.

Whether in a car or on a bike, I'm fond of thinking that NO ONE comes up on me without my knowing it. And it's very nearly true.

zacster 03-30-13 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daredevil (Post 15448608)
The idiotic comments regarding mirrors and why people do not use them when sharing the road never ceases to amaze me. There is not a single good reason not to wear one. Any comment against it can easily be disregarded as nonsense.

Lastly, any mirror is better than none at all but if you truly want to be efficient with your vision, it needs to be head mounted.

The very last thing I need while riding in NYC is another distraction. I've been riding for almost 50 years and never felt that I made a bad decision because I didn't see BEHIND me. I ride and assume that there is something coming and I don't make stupid moves. I wish I could say the same for other cyclists. They are the only ones that will startle me.

daredevil 03-30-13 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zacster (Post 15447914)
In NYC I don't need a mirror. I just assume there is someone right behind me as there always is. Don't make stupid moves, if you are unsure about what is behind you don't pull out. There's already enough visual stimulation on our streets in front and to the side of us. The instant I look behind will be the same instant that pedestrian steps right into my path.

The location doesn't matter if you're sharing the road. You're more aware with a mirror and with peripheral vision you can see front and back simultaneously. Thing is, you need one of these devices for it to work.

daredevil 03-30-13 08:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zacster (Post 15449915)
The very last thing I need while riding in NYC is another distraction. .

I just don't understand the concept of being more visually aware as a distraction.

HK2K13 03-30-13 08:12 PM

I don't ride with mirrors and have never tried it either..... Maybe one day.. Who knows? For some reason I think that they'll be a distraction for me.

zacster 03-30-13 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daredevil (Post 15449943)
I don't give a rip if ur in timbuktu. You're more aware with a mirror and there exists a new exciting thing called peripheral vision that actually let's you see front and back simultaneously. Thing is, you need one of these devices for it to work.

Actually, you don't. That's what peripheral vision is, the ability to detect what's around you WITHOUT a device. With a device you have assisted vision. In a car you need a mirror because you're surrounded and your vision is cut. On a bike you still can see what's on the periphery of yourself even without looking directly at it. I can also HEAR what's coming at me, with 2 exceptions. #1 and the most usual suspect is another bike. #2 is an electric bus or car. We don't have either of those in NYC that I've seen since 1960 (really, you can look it upTrolley bus in Brooklyn). When I lived in Seattle I'd avoid the trolley-bus routes because I couldn't hear them. I haven't lived in Seattle in 30 years now, so not an issue.

harshbarj 03-30-13 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daredevil (Post 15448608)
The idiotic comments regarding mirrors and why people do not use them when sharing the road never ceases to amaze me. There is not a single good reason not to wear one. Any comment against it can easily be disregarded as nonsense.

Lastly, any mirror is better than none at all but if you truly want to be efficient with your vision, it needs to be head mounted.

So what your saying is if someone disagree with you they HAVE to be wrong? Wow, what an ego!

A mirror may work for you, but I, like others find them distracting. You can try and insist that's wrong, but the fact remains.

As for head mounted mirrors, that only really works for those that wear helmets, and even then they are still distracting. Not to mention I could never feel safe with glass that close to my eye.

I KNOW you'll disagree, but for me it's true and that's all that matters.

kookaburra1701 03-30-13 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alan s (Post 15449652)
I tried a helmet mounted mirror once, and it only distracted me. There is nothing a mirror would do to make me feel safer or actually be safer. Not like a car is going to do anything different, and I already have 360 degree awareness.

I know I sure feel safer with a big blurry spot in front of me!

LOL I wonder if they make prescription mirrors for glasses.

Slaninar 03-31-13 01:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zacster (Post 15449988)
On a bike you still can see what's on the periphery of yourself even without looking directly at it. I can also HEAR what's coming at me, with 2 exceptions.

1) When I wear a hood, peripheral vision is very much reduced. As well as vision when i turn my head.

2) In a car you are sitting in a chair and changing your balance, turning etc. won't affect your steering - on a bike it takes some conscious effort and concentration to keep a straight line when turning around.

3) Hearing can be deceptive, as you've said.


So mirrors do come in handy. There are, however, 2 reasons I DON'T use them:

1) One more thing on a bike that can attract thieves - I make it plain, simple and as ugly as can bee.

2) Cars in my country always drive as if they'll run you over, swerving to go past you in the last second. So having mirror always had me scared and stressed - better not to see. Especially since most of the time in places I commute, there's a 20 cm high road side barrier - so no place to run.

David Bierbaum 03-31-13 07:36 AM

Yes, what is up with these roads with no shoulder and a steep curb, anyway? I absolutely despise those things.

As for turning where you're looking, I have a bad tendency to do that in both my car driving and my bicycle riding. I blame power steering sensitivity for the former. So if I looked over my shoulder to see incoming traffic, I'd be steering INTO said traffic as I look, or overcompensating and hitting those despicable curbs instead. :trainwreck: :injured:

StephenH 03-31-13 07:41 AM

I use a mirror all the time, for road cycling, not for commuting. I never did see the need until I was helping a slower rider into a headwind, and had no good way to monitor the gap between us. Nearly all of the riders in randonneuring use one as well.

genec 03-31-13 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by merkong (Post 15443043)
I have a buddy who is an old roadie and still trains as though he was racing. That's cool and all. He likes the big rides and does them often. Years ago, I purchased a mirror, the one that attaches to the bow of your glasses. He was like, "those ain't cool man..." Needless to say I never wore it. Recently, I came across it and have done a few rides while wearing it. I like it. I ride on the road and can't believe how easy it is to glance back versus the constant headturn. I still am prone to firsthand looks (non-mirror image) when maneuvering right hand turn lanes and a few other crucial and potentially dangerous situations. I like the mirror. Am I not cool anymore? Anyone else (I've seen a few in the profile pictures) wear a mirror or maybe, gasp, have one mounted on their steed? Safety first, convenience second, coolness third.

The moment you started riding a bike you left the "cool" sector according to about 90% or so of the people out there that refuse to ride bikes and have their feelings reinforced by car commercials.

If your mirror works for you... it is perfect for you... that is all that really counts.

alan s 03-31-13 09:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daredevil (Post 15449901)
If you can't even recognize the potential benefits, I'm afraid that only proves you don't know how to use one.

Let's see .... the mirror attaches to your helmet, glasses or handlebars, and you look at it to see behind you?

daredevil 03-31-13 10:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by alan s (Post 15451165)
Let's see .... the mirror attaches to your helmet, glasses or handlebars, and you look at it to see behind you?

that's part of it, now you have to know where to look when...a lot of people are clueless. Ever heard of bad drivers?

daredevil 03-31-13 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harshbarj (Post 15450016)
So what your saying is if someone disagree with you they HAVE to be wrong? Wow, what an ego!

A mirror may work for you, but I, like others find them distracting. You can try and insist that's wrong, but the fact remains.

As for head mounted mirrors, that only really works for those that wear helmets, and even then they are still distracting. Not to mention I could never feel safe with glass that close to my eye.

I KNOW you'll disagree, but for me it's true and that's all that matters.

Yes I do disagree and your post points out the things you have to learn. There are helmet mounted and glasses mounted mirrors. Before you tell me you don't wear glasses, there are sunglasses and clear safety type glasses (not a bad idea anyway).

This has nothing to do with anybody's ego and everything to do with common sense. If you are distracted paying attention to all the traffic around you, you do not belong on the road with vehicles.

daredevil 03-31-13 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zacster (Post 15449988)
Actually, you don't. That's what peripheral vision is, the ability to detect what's around you WITHOUT a device.

Oh my...so you can see in the back of your head with your peripheral vision? Congrats on that!

btw, mirrors are in car for visual efficiency, not because of blind spots. And head checks are necessary because of blind spots, not a problem with a head mounted mirror, there are no blind spots.

Mirrors are used in the same way for ALL vehicles that share the road. Those that know how to use them are not a burden on traffic while those that don't often are.

daredevil 03-31-13 10:39 AM

The nonsense I spoke of:

I don't wear glasses so I can't use a glasses mounted mirror.

I get distracted with too much visual information.

The mirror blocks my vision.

I'm more concerned being injured by the mirror than a car.

All I need is my hearing to keep me safe.

Mirrors are necessary in cars because they are different than bikes. The same benefits that mirrors provide in a car don't work for a bike or are not applicable to a bike.

There's plenty more to come I'm sure. :)

harshbarj 03-31-13 03:10 PM

I'd say it's time to stop feeding the troll. Perhaps a mod can lock the thread?

the sci guy 03-31-13 06:45 PM

I have a real question about mirrors, since I am just starting to commute.

I have a MTB handlebar set with bar ends on. Will this mirror: http://www.amazon.com/Blackburn-2041...n+multi+mirror
slide into the hole at the end of them? I'm assuming I'll just swivel the mirror on that pivot so that it sits to the side (because the hole on the bar end obviously faces inward).

thanks!

merkong 03-31-13 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harshbarj (Post 15452083)
I'd say it's time to stop feeding the troll. Perhaps a mod can lock the thread?

I'd say not. The commuting forum is usually free of instigators. Hopefully the thread will live on a bit as some truly know little of the mirror benefit and maybe those who feel compelled can help them. Just saying...

daredevil 04-01-13 04:51 AM

If you're referring to me as the troll, I'm sorry, that is not my intent. One of the biggest, if not the biggest keys to staying safe while sharing the road in any vehicle, is 360 degree visual awareness all the time. Active eyes, not an active body spinning like a top.

Ekdog 04-01-13 05:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by harshbarj (Post 15452083)
I'd say it's time to stop feeding the troll. Perhaps a mod can lock the thread?

What troll?

I find this thread to be most interesting as I'm thinking about getting a mirror. If you are offended by the different opinions that are being expressed, why don't you just stop reading instead of calling for censorship? :rolleyes:

JoeyBike 04-01-13 06:43 AM

I cycled daily to work and/or school for 15 years without a mirror and felt safe enough. Then I tried a helmet mounted mirror when i was 29 (1988) and have not been without it since.

I find it more a matter of convienence in a city with streets full of potholes and other debris. But it is not a safety cure-all as mirrors do have their limitations.

I would feel less comfortable without a mirror while cycling.

noisebeam 04-01-13 01:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeyBike (Post 15454219)
I find it more a matter of convienence i

I see it that way too. I can ride on average faster and fit into the flow of traffic better with one.


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