Hit & Run
10-16-13, 12:15 PM
#76
Senior Member
10-16-13, 12:32 PM
#77
one life on two wheels
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Safety is cool guys, but yes, some of you take it to extremes and that amuses me. Not so much the equipment itself, but the attitude behind it. I have some safety-o-phile friends, and they are so preoccupied with this stuff that it keeps them from enjoying their ride. They're out there like those little shaking Chihuahuas, expecting death at every turn. But y'all keep on keepin' on as they say...
10-16-13, 01:08 PM
#78
Senior Member
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science...01457509000645
"This study explored the beliefs and attitudes of cyclists and drivers regarding cyclist visibility, use of visibility aids and crashes involving cyclists and motorists. Data are presented for 1460 participants (622 drivers and 838 cyclists) and demonstrate that there are high rates of cyclist–vehicle crashes, many of which were reported to be due to the driver not seeing the cyclist in time to avoid a collision. A divergence in attitudes was also apparent in terms of attribution of responsibility in cyclist–vehicle conflicts on the road. While the use of visibility aids was advocated by cyclists, this was not reflected in self-reported wearing patterns, and cyclists reported that the distance at which they would be first recognised by a driver was twice that estimated by the drivers. Collectively, these results suggest that interventions should target cyclists’ use of visibility aids, which is less than optimal in this population, as well as re-educating both groups regarding visibility issues."
Still think it's funny?
J.
10-16-13, 01:17 PM
#79
Banned
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science...01457509000645
"This study explored the beliefs and attitudes of cyclists and drivers regarding cyclist visibility, use of visibility aids and crashes involving cyclists and motorists. Data are presented for 1460 participants (622 drivers and 838 cyclists) and demonstrate that there are high rates of cyclist–vehicle crashes, many of which were reported to be due to the driver not seeing the cyclist in time to avoid a collision. A divergence in attitudes was also apparent in terms of attribution of responsibility in cyclist–vehicle conflicts on the road. While the use of visibility aids was advocated by cyclists, this was not reflected in self-reported wearing patterns, and cyclists reported that the distance at which they would be first recognised by a driver was twice that estimated by the drivers. Collectively, these results suggest that interventions should target cyclists’ use of visibility aids, which is less than optimal in this population, as well as re-educating both groups regarding visibility issues."
Still think it's funny?
J.
"This study explored the beliefs and attitudes of cyclists and drivers regarding cyclist visibility, use of visibility aids and crashes involving cyclists and motorists. Data are presented for 1460 participants (622 drivers and 838 cyclists) and demonstrate that there are high rates of cyclist–vehicle crashes, many of which were reported to be due to the driver not seeing the cyclist in time to avoid a collision. A divergence in attitudes was also apparent in terms of attribution of responsibility in cyclist–vehicle conflicts on the road. While the use of visibility aids was advocated by cyclists, this was not reflected in self-reported wearing patterns, and cyclists reported that the distance at which they would be first recognised by a driver was twice that estimated by the drivers. Collectively, these results suggest that interventions should target cyclists’ use of visibility aids, which is less than optimal in this population, as well as re-educating both groups regarding visibility issues."
Still think it's funny?
J.
show me some real data
10-16-13, 01:19 PM
#80
one life on two wheels
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https://www.sciencedirect.com/science...01457509000645
"This study explored the beliefs and attitudes of cyclists and drivers regarding cyclist visibility, use of visibility aids and crashes involving cyclists and motorists. Data are presented for 1460 participants (622 drivers and 838 cyclists) and demonstrate that there are high rates of cyclist–vehicle crashes, many of which were reported to be due to the driver not seeing the cyclist in time to avoid a collision. A divergence in attitudes was also apparent in terms of attribution of responsibility in cyclist–vehicle conflicts on the road. While the use of visibility aids was advocated by cyclists, this was not reflected in self-reported wearing patterns, and cyclists reported that the distance at which they would be first recognised by a driver was twice that estimated by the drivers. Collectively, these results suggest that interventions should target cyclists’ use of visibility aids, which is less than optimal in this population, as well as re-educating both groups regarding visibility issues."
Still think it's funny?
J.
"This study explored the beliefs and attitudes of cyclists and drivers regarding cyclist visibility, use of visibility aids and crashes involving cyclists and motorists. Data are presented for 1460 participants (622 drivers and 838 cyclists) and demonstrate that there are high rates of cyclist–vehicle crashes, many of which were reported to be due to the driver not seeing the cyclist in time to avoid a collision. A divergence in attitudes was also apparent in terms of attribution of responsibility in cyclist–vehicle conflicts on the road. While the use of visibility aids was advocated by cyclists, this was not reflected in self-reported wearing patterns, and cyclists reported that the distance at which they would be first recognised by a driver was twice that estimated by the drivers. Collectively, these results suggest that interventions should target cyclists’ use of visibility aids, which is less than optimal in this population, as well as re-educating both groups regarding visibility issues."
Still think it's funny?
J.
I think you're having trouble understanding. I advocate precautionary safety procedures, but find the extreme measures some take to be silly. Yes, even safety can be taken to an irrational level. I apologize that I don't have a study to present regarding my feelings towards this matter to aid in your ability to understand my point of view.
10-16-13, 01:29 PM
#81
one life on two wheels
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Personally I do not fault the cyclist in the video. The driver of the vehicle is obviously a jerk. One that not only did not take the time to ensure it was safe to proceed, but one that also left the scene of an accident.
Some here feel as though a flood light is needed to be seen. Others (like myself) see the light the rider was using as adiquate. An anattentive driver can miss a brighter light, too. And I don't see that the cyclist had enough time to engage a horn had they had one, and even if they did, would the driver had had enough time to react to it? Lots of variables here, leaving the entire scenario up to speculative "solutions" to the problem presented.
Shockingly, sometimes cars even crash into other cars at night...headlights and all. Would the folks here argue that the car that was hit should have had a strip of KC lights attached to their roof in order to be seen by the unattentive driver of the other vehicle?
I don't see the logic.
Some here feel as though a flood light is needed to be seen. Others (like myself) see the light the rider was using as adiquate. An anattentive driver can miss a brighter light, too. And I don't see that the cyclist had enough time to engage a horn had they had one, and even if they did, would the driver had had enough time to react to it? Lots of variables here, leaving the entire scenario up to speculative "solutions" to the problem presented.
Shockingly, sometimes cars even crash into other cars at night...headlights and all. Would the folks here argue that the car that was hit should have had a strip of KC lights attached to their roof in order to be seen by the unattentive driver of the other vehicle?
I don't see the logic.
10-16-13, 01:50 PM
#82
Senior Member
Safety is cool guys, but yes, some of you take it to extremes and that amuses me. Not so much the equipment itself, but the attitude behind it. I have some safety-o-phile friends, and they are so preoccupied with this stuff that it keeps them from enjoying their ride. They're out there like those little shaking Chihuahuas, expecting death at every turn. But y'all keep on keepin' on as they say...
Last edited by Leebo; 10-16-13 at 01:55 PM.
10-16-13, 01:58 PM
#83
Senior Member
https://www.news.qut.edu.au/cgi-bin/W...sEventID=63515
https://www.thecochranelibrary.com/us...d/CD003438.pdf
Not to mention that it's obviously a big problem if a motorist cannot see a cyclist in an adequate amount of time.
But, do what you want. I want to be seen and have their be no question that I am a cyclist, where I am and to have it easy to ascertain my speed and position. While it's anecdotal, I've been riding at night for almost 20 years and have never had an accident. I'm well lit and visible.
J.
https://www.thecochranelibrary.com/us...d/CD003438.pdf
Not to mention that it's obviously a big problem if a motorist cannot see a cyclist in an adequate amount of time.
But, do what you want. I want to be seen and have their be no question that I am a cyclist, where I am and to have it easy to ascertain my speed and position. While it's anecdotal, I've been riding at night for almost 20 years and have never had an accident. I'm well lit and visible.
J.
10-16-13, 02:04 PM
#84
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https://www.sciencedirect.com/science...01457509000645
"This study explored the beliefs and attitudes of cyclists and drivers regarding cyclist visibility, use of visibility aids and crashes involving cyclists and motorists. Data are presented for 1460 participants (622 drivers and 838 cyclists) and demonstrate that there are high rates of cyclist–vehicle crashes, many of which were reported to be due to the driver not seeing the cyclist in time to avoid a collision. A divergence in attitudes was also apparent in terms of attribution of responsibility in cyclist–vehicle conflicts on the road. While the use of visibility aids was advocated by cyclists, this was not reflected in self-reported wearing patterns, and cyclists reported that the distance at which they would be first recognised by a driver was twice that estimated by the drivers. Collectively, these results suggest that interventions should target cyclists’ use of visibility aids, which is less than optimal in this population, as well as re-educating both groups regarding visibility issues."
Still think it's funny?
J.
"This study explored the beliefs and attitudes of cyclists and drivers regarding cyclist visibility, use of visibility aids and crashes involving cyclists and motorists. Data are presented for 1460 participants (622 drivers and 838 cyclists) and demonstrate that there are high rates of cyclist–vehicle crashes, many of which were reported to be due to the driver not seeing the cyclist in time to avoid a collision. A divergence in attitudes was also apparent in terms of attribution of responsibility in cyclist–vehicle conflicts on the road. While the use of visibility aids was advocated by cyclists, this was not reflected in self-reported wearing patterns, and cyclists reported that the distance at which they would be first recognised by a driver was twice that estimated by the drivers. Collectively, these results suggest that interventions should target cyclists’ use of visibility aids, which is less than optimal in this population, as well as re-educating both groups regarding visibility issues."
Still think it's funny?
J.
1. We tolerate sociopathic behavior by people who operate lethal heavy machinery.
2. Sport cycling injuries/deaths are combined with commuting injuries/deaths.
10-16-13, 02:09 PM
#85
Banned
https://www.news.qut.edu.au/cgi-bin/W...sEventID=63515
https://www.thecochranelibrary.com/us...d/CD003438.pdf
Not to mention that it's obviously a big problem if a motorist cannot see a cyclist in an adequate amount of time.
But, do what you want. I want to be seen and have their be no question that I am a cyclist, where I am and to have it easy to ascertain my speed and position. While it's anecdotal, I've been riding at night for almost 20 years and have never had an accident. I'm well lit and visible.
J.
https://www.thecochranelibrary.com/us...d/CD003438.pdf
Not to mention that it's obviously a big problem if a motorist cannot see a cyclist in an adequate amount of time.
But, do what you want. I want to be seen and have their be no question that I am a cyclist, where I am and to have it easy to ascertain my speed and position. While it's anecdotal, I've been riding at night for almost 20 years and have never had an accident. I'm well lit and visible.
J.
The first analyses beliefs and attitudes, while second is an Intervention.
I'd like to see some real analysis.
Here are a few summarised links to actual infrastructure studies.
https://ianbrettcooper.blogspot.co.uk...e-studies.html
10-16-13, 02:10 PM
#86
Banned
Cycling injury and death rates in North America are pathetically high in comparison to Northern Eruope because:
1. We tolerate sociopathic behavior by people who operate lethal heavy machinery.
2. Sport cycling injuries/deaths are combined with commuting injuries/deaths.
1. We tolerate sociopathic behavior by people who operate lethal heavy machinery.
2. Sport cycling injuries/deaths are combined with commuting injuries/deaths.
10-16-13, 02:23 PM
#87
one life on two wheels
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It is mind blowing how many people behnid the wheel are completely unaware of the right of way laws, cycling laws, proper lane change procedures, etc... and how little the infractions are actually enforced.
10-16-13, 02:31 PM
#88
Banned
https://duisburgbunny.blogspot.co.uk/...s-license.html
10-16-13, 02:45 PM
#89
bill nyecycles
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i've lived in houston for just over a month, and i can easily say, even after living in DC for 3 years, people here are by far the absolute worst drivers. unsafe, fast, rude, and oblivious to whats going on around them.
10-16-13, 02:47 PM
#90
Senior Member
i agree with unaware, but i'd also toss out there "don't care"
i've lived in houston for just over a month, and i can easily say, even after living in DC for 3 years, people here are by far the absolute worst drivers. unsafe, fast, rude, and oblivious to whats going on around them.
i've lived in houston for just over a month, and i can easily say, even after living in DC for 3 years, people here are by far the absolute worst drivers. unsafe, fast, rude, and oblivious to whats going on around them.
10-16-13, 02:58 PM
#91
Senior Member
Neither of the two studies you provided demonstrate that enhanced visibility correlates with a reduction in accident rate.
The first analyses beliefs and attitudes, while second is an Intervention.
I'd like to see some real analysis.
Here are a few summarised links to actual infrastructure studies.
https://ianbrettcooper.blogspot.co.uk...e-studies.html
The first analyses beliefs and attitudes, while second is an Intervention.
I'd like to see some real analysis.
Here are a few summarised links to actual infrastructure studies.
https://ianbrettcooper.blogspot.co.uk...e-studies.html
Got it. So we don't need lights and to be visible then?
J.
10-16-13, 03:01 PM
#92
Banned
10-16-13, 03:31 PM
#93
Senior Member
Well then what's the argument? Or is this just because you want to argue?
So cyclists needs lights at night and to be visible. We agree.
Are we done now? Or is there something else you want to beat into pulp just because?
J.
So cyclists needs lights at night and to be visible. We agree.
Are we done now? Or is there something else you want to beat into pulp just because?
J.
10-16-13, 03:34 PM
#94
Banned
Just save us all some time, OK?
10-16-13, 03:42 PM
#95
Senior Member
Well then, what are you doing here - this whole social internet thing probably drives you nuts. I wasn't aware we were under university debate rules for forum posting. But it is pompous, I'll give you that. You must be the life of the party.
All that over no argument? And you're worried about time wasted? Wow.
J.
All that over no argument? And you're worried about time wasted? Wow.
J.
10-16-13, 03:47 PM
#96
Banned
Well then, what are you doing here - this whole social internet thing probably drives you nuts. I wasn't aware we were under university debate rules for forum posting. But it is pompous, I'll give you that. You must be the life of the party.
All that over no argument? And you're worried about time wasted? Wow.
J.
All that over no argument? And you're worried about time wasted? Wow.
J.
I just don't like you, which means that you're ignored and I usually scroll over you ... but when I have a slight bit of time like now ... I click and try to determine if you're worth reading again.
Last edited by acidfast7; 10-16-13 at 03:51 PM.
10-16-13, 03:49 PM
#97
DancesWithSUVs
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All this talk about lights and horns...
I have a different take. I think he should've mounted his brake lever up on the horn where he seems to spend most of his time. I don't know if he would've been able to stop,but I'm certain he would've slowed down more,which would have reduced the severity of the impact.
I have a different take. I think he should've mounted his brake lever up on the horn where he seems to spend most of his time. I don't know if he would've been able to stop,but I'm certain he would've slowed down more,which would have reduced the severity of the impact.
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10-16-13, 05:04 PM
#98
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but I'm certain he would've slowed down more,which would have reduced the severity of the impact.
i also think that occupying the middle or left side of the lane would have made him more visible and would have given him more time to react to the pull out.
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