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Old 05-18-14, 03:16 PM   #176
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I've tested Shimano, SRAM and Sturmey, I haven't seen any hard power or voltage limiter/clamp. I was able to draw more than 10W out of the SRAM and Shimano dynos, I haven't measured the SP or SON but I expect the same results.
It only required to be installed by the German law (in line).
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Old 05-18-14, 03:20 PM   #177
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Wonder if he still ships the newer Saferide model from overseas? Maybe I should contact him about the timer issue, hmm....
I've corresponded with Tibor directly, he's very friendly and will answer any questions you have. That's why I bought my dyno SafeRide from him, he assured me it was the newest version with all the upgrades.

Here's a link to an article about the WSJ article about grey market goods on Amazon (they have a huge problem with fakes too but I don't think it applies here):
Supply Chain News: e-Fulfillment Drama Continues, as Amazon Tussles with Johnson & Johnson, Partners with USPS for Sunday Deliveries

Quote:
J&J has been complaining to Amazon for the past year or more that some of the thousands of "third party" sellers that use Amazon as their web channel are selling expired, damaged (e.g., packaging) or otherwise uncontrolled product through Amazon's platform.

Last edited by Mr IGH; 05-18-14 at 03:38 PM.
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Old 05-18-14, 03:26 PM   #178
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It only required to be installed by the German law (in line).
OK, now I understand, thanks! Wow, what archaic regulations, esp with LED headlights owning the market.
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Old 05-18-14, 03:33 PM   #179
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OK, now I understand, thanks! Wow, what archaic regulations, esp with LED headlights owning the market.
germany
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Old 05-18-14, 03:42 PM   #180
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germany
I was reading a translated version of a German MTB lighting forum and they were complaining about the regs. They want high beam/low beam like on their BMW cars but it's illegal. Imagine lighting up the MUP, magicshine style, then dimming to a SafeRide when coming upon traffic. Kinda like driving a car on a country road.
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Old 05-18-14, 03:44 PM   #181
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I was reading a translated version of a German MTB lighting forum and they were complaining about the regs. They want high beam/low beam like on their BMW cars but it's illegal. Imagine lighting up the MUP, magicshine style, then dimming to a SafeRide when coming upon traffic. Kinda like driving a car on a country road.
I don't like that idea at all.

I want the hard cut off at all times and can't stand a MagicShine as it's dangerous.
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Old 05-18-14, 03:56 PM   #182
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Ok, maybe not full-monty magicshine but I would like a high/low beam headlamp with a handlebar switch. Like on my car.
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Old 05-18-14, 05:12 PM   #183
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Ah, no, I had not noticed that, thanks for posting it.

I notice he doesn't post any additional battery info below that, say, for the 2nd gen model, unfortunately. Have you run across any specific runtimes for the 2nd gen model?
Yes. Someone with a 2. gen. Saferide tested it with both the Philips cells charged with a decent BC700 charger, and some new Eneloop X charged with the internal charger:

The Philips cells lasted 83 minutes on high and then 10 min. on low.
The Eneloops X lasted 90 min. on high and then 40 min. on low before it started to flicker:
Neuer Test zur Fahrradbeleuchtung bei der Stiftung Warentest - Seite 14 - Fahrrad: Radforum.de and onwards.

Someone tested the run time of the Ixon IQ Premium:
Product Review: B&M Ixon IQ Premium LED Headlight | Captain Overpacker

With "premium" brand batteries it lasted 5,2 hours on high and then additional 2,2 hours on low.

The Ixon IQ Premium 80 lux simply outclasses the Philips Saferide 80 lux when it comes to battery run time.

Another thing to remember is that run time will be impacted by riding in the cold (Eneloop style batteries less so) and when batteries get older etc. so the 1½ hour run time on high is probably the max run time and will require other batteries than the default ones.

AFAIK both lamps are around 300 lumens total output, so it is mostly a matter of where they put those lumens in the beam shape that makes a difference. The B&M Ixon IQ Premium seems to put more light to the side and at a wider angle too, which helps when turning etc. while the Saferide has a more intense center beam.

As I see it, the Philips Saferide 80 lux is displaced by the B&M Ixon IQ Premium as the best non-dazzling commuter light on the market. In the EU the Ixon Premium is even a lot cheaper than the Saferide too.
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Old 05-18-14, 05:43 PM   #184
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OK, now I understand, thanks! Wow, what archaic regulations, esp with LED headlights owning the market.
As I understand it, over-voltage protectors are required as part of the dynamo light system, but for decades this protection have been inbuilt in any sane dynamo light design I have ever seen. So there is no need for external over-voltage protectors like the Shimano on modern dynamo systems, nor does the German StZVO law require it as long as there is some over-voltage protection in either the lights or the dynamo.

I think that such external over-voltage protector device used to be mandatory to sell together with dynamos that didn't have in-built protection, but this hasn't been a requirement since the 2006 revision of the StZVO law.
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Old 05-22-14, 06:33 PM   #185
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Yes. Someone with a 2. gen. Saferide tested it with both the Philips cells charged with a decent BC700 charger, and some new Eneloop X charged with the internal charger:

The Philips cells lasted 83 minutes on high and then 10 min. on low.
The Eneloops X lasted 90 min. on high and then 40 min. on low before it started to flicker:
Neuer Test zur Fahrradbeleuchtung bei der Stiftung Warentest - Seite 14 - Fahrrad: Radforum.de and onwards.
Hey, thanks for posting this! Mine is in the mail, and my Enloop XX batteries are in the charger on the "Refresh" mode -
Refresh mode will start with discharging the rechargeable battery, then charging it. The repeated discharging and charging cycles will be launched until no further increase in the measured capacities is estimated.

It takes a ridiculously long for this mode to finish, but since I'm waiting for the light from Europe it's not as big of a deal.

I have a Panasonic fz200 that records for way over 2 hours, so I might test it out by recording the light until it runs out. (Edit: Might use my cell phone instead, easier to plug into external power for unlimited power, and have a larger micro sd card than I have a regular sd card in my fz200.) My only hesitation in doing that is that I think the latest Saferide model will run the batteries down all the way, not sure if I want to risk damaging my batteries. Hmm.

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Old 06-01-14, 08:52 PM   #186
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My Busch + Müller IXON IQ Premium arrived with the fork crown mount. On the rear I have the Busch + Müller Rǝlite D and their 313/3Z rear reflector. I am super happy with this set-up! My plan is to supplement with the L&M Vis 360+ (which will bring my total to $250 for everything).





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Old 06-02-14, 04:39 AM   #187
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[SIZE=2][FONT=arial]My Busch + Müller IXON IQ Premium arrived with the fork crown mount. On the rear I have the Busch + Müller Rǝlite D and their 313/3Z rear reflector. I am super happy with this set-up! My plan is to supplement with the L&M Vis 360+ (which will bring my total to $250 for everything).
Yeah. I got a fork crown mount for my Ixon IQ Premium too and I'm a huge fan. It's nice to have the light off the handlebar and frees up space there, it looks a lot better, and I find the mount holds the light very securely in position. With handlebar mounted lights I find myself having to re-aim them a lot after bumps but my fork crown mount hasn't really budged since I set it. The light is still aimed properly. That's nice.

And if I recall the B&M lights are all designed for fork crown mounting. Though the battery versions will mount at the handlebar the reflectors are intended for a light at the fork crown level.
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Old 06-02-14, 07:56 PM   #188
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My ixon light mounts to a forward light mount in frame with screw.

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Old 06-06-14, 12:27 AM   #189
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My Busch + Müller IXON IQ Premium arrived with the fork crown mount. On the rear I have the Busch + Müller Rǝlite D and their 313/3Z rear reflector. I am super happy with this set-up! My plan is to supplement with the L&M Vis 360+ (which will bring my total to $250 for everything).
So, I mounted my Vis 360+ to my helmet tonight, turned on the lights, and my husband looked at me and said, "You're kidding, right? That is crazy over-kill, with two lights on your bike and two more on the helmet. What are you thinking, with all those lights?" Sigh.

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Old 06-06-14, 01:19 PM   #190
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It's only overkill if it's inconvenient. I've scaled the amount of lighting I use for the sake of convenience. I use one headlight, mounted on the bike, one tail light, mounted on the bike, the seat bag, or my body, and a spoke light on my rear wheel. More might make me safer, but I don't know how much, and I don't like removing things and reinstalling them.
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Old 06-14-14, 04:03 AM   #191
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I got the v2 Saferide from overseas, and finally got my battery charger doing charge/refresh with Eneloop XX batteries and Maha Powerex 2700's. (Hint: The default charging speed of 200mah is to low, it takes forever and doesn't seem to charge the batteries right, I read something about missing the delta v. Changed to 500mah and it's a lot quicker and I get more expected #'s.)

The Saferide v2 has a much better "low" mode than the previous version, it's very usable rather than the "desperate backup" that the older Saferide.

But the "high" mode on the v2 version seems like it's not as bright as the high mode on the v1.1 version I had from amazon. More specific thoughts on that in the future.

Right now, in my testing, I took video of the light using my webcam, and got the following results for the Phillips Saferide v2:
1:32 - battery indicator dropped to medium. Light didn't seem to change modes, but I can't be sure - will redo test while setting exposure settings to manual mode next time.
1:48 - battery indicator went to low, light output dropped
3:20 - around here light output stayed "on" but started dropping. Again, will redo test with manual settings which should give easier to figure out results.

I'll be doing more specific testing in the future.
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Old 11-07-14, 01:12 AM   #192
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Based on the reviews and various beamshots including YouTube videos I had seen on the web I bought one of these recently from Bike-Discount.de. I ordered the bare light with no cells or charger and in fact that package seems to be out of stock until December anyway at Bike-Discount.de anyway.

I charged up a set of 4 GP Recyko 2050mAh AA cells before I started a two-hour ride (largely on unlit country roads) and left the light running after the ride to test the runtime. I got 4 hours 30 minutes with the light on high the whole time. The light barely got warm even when static indoors.

Here are my impressions.

I didn't really expect a great deal from a light with a claimed output of only 80 lux and I wasn't disappointed. It is barely adequate at slower speeds but above about 16 mph there isn't enough light to see road defects and have enough time to react and safely avoid them. Faster descents are positively dangerous if you rely on this light alone.

The two main failings of the light are it is not bright enough and the beam pattern is patchy. The best way I can describe it is imagine a triangle of light stretching away from the bike. Furthest away there is a definite section of about a third of the triangle with an even brighter spot in the middle. The remaining two-thirds of the triangle back towards the bike is dimmer with artefacts around the edges.

I tried the light on the bars and mounted lower down towards the front wheel. It didn't seem to make any appreciable difference either way.

The low setting (10 lux) is very feeble and is more a light to be seen that to see by. Useful I guess if you are riding largely in urban areas with street lights but a bare, emergency, get-you-home level for unlit roads.

Weight: Light 108g, 4 AA cells 113g

Pros

1. Definite vertical cut-off to the beam pattern. Riding behind a friend it didn't even light up the reflective strips on the base of his jacket. Good for not dazzling oncoming drivers.

2. Although an all-plastic construction the quality looks high and it is a very neat, self-contained package with the 4 AA cells inside the light.

3. Tested run time of 4H 30M on high is good although I would personally sacrifice half this time for twice the brightness. If you do the sort of rides which are even longer than this time then carrying a fresh set of cells would be no problem to quickly change them as well.

Cons

1. Not bright enough.

2. Beam pattern very uneven which I found irritating.

As a general commuting light for riding in largely urban areas with street lighting this is probably very good. For any sort of sports cycle riding where the average speeds are likely to be higher then it is barely adequate and certainly a safe limit would be 16 mph in my opinion but your eyesight might be better than mine. I personally wouldn't feel comfortable using this light without a much brighter back-up that I could switch on for faster sections which is how I will actually use it in future I think.

All of the beam shots and videos I have seen on the web flatter this light greatly and in reality what your eyes see will be vastly different to how a camera reacts to it. I would recommend that you try and see one for yourself before buying otherwise you might be disappointed.
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Old 11-07-14, 07:44 PM   #193
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Thanks for your review. Having just sold a 50 lux Ixon that was woefully adequate, I was thinking that even 80 lux didn't sound like enough of a step up to make me comfortable. The 50 lux was at best a limp home light. I have now switched back to the MS clone, sold as a 1600 lumen light and is probably about 800 true lumens. I'm guessing it's 5 times more light than the 50 lux light was. I really wouldn't want to ride with less. Even on my summer route where I'm on pavement, there are some stretches where the road is nothing but patches and picking a route through it is not easy even in daylight, challenging with a bright light, and impossible with a 50 lux light. I hit some craters hard when riding with it. The dyno guys used to say that a 30 lux light was plenty. Then they said 50 was plenty. Now they say 80 is plenty. Whatever is the best you can get in a generator light is always "plenty". From what I've seen, even today's best is not adequate unless you're on pretty good roads where you don't have to dodge cracks and potholes.
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Old 11-07-14, 10:49 PM   #194
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Thanks for your review. Having just sold a 50 lux Ixon that was woefully adequate, I was thinking that even 80 lux didn't sound like enough of a step up to make me comfortable. The 50 lux was at best a limp home light. I have now switched back to the MS clone, sold as a 1600 lumen light and is probably about 800 true lumens. I'm guessing it's 5 times more light than the 50 lux light was. I really wouldn't want to ride with less. Even on my summer route where I'm on pavement, there are some stretches where the road is nothing but patches and picking a route through it is not easy even in daylight, challenging with a bright light, and impossible with a 50 lux light. I hit some craters hard when riding with it. The dyno guys used to say that a 30 lux light was plenty. Then they said 50 was plenty. Now they say 80 is plenty. Whatever is the best you can get in a generator light is always "plenty". From what I've seen, even today's best is not adequate unless you're on pretty good roads where you don't have to dodge cracks and potholes.
The 80 lux B&M Cyo that I use is close to the output of my motorcycles headlight on low beam, if that's not enough light I'd be heading to the optometrist.
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Old 11-07-14, 11:55 PM   #195
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Based on the reviews and various beamshots including YouTube videos I had seen on the web I bought one of these recently from Bike-Discount.de. I ordered the bare light with no cells or charger and in fact that package seems to be out of stock until December anyway at Bike-Discount.de anyway.

I charged up a set of 4 GP Recyko 2050mAh AA cells before I started a two-hour ride (largely on unlit country roads) and left the light running after the ride to test the runtime. I got 4 hours 30 minutes with the light on high the whole time. The light barely got warm even when static indoors.

Here are my impressions.

I didn't really expect a great deal from a light with a claimed output of only 80 lux and I wasn't disappointed. It is barely adequate at slower speeds but above about 16 mph there isn't enough light to see road defects and have enough time to react and safely avoid them. Faster descents are positively dangerous if you rely on this light alone.

The two main failings of the light are it is not bright enough and the beam pattern is patchy. The best way I can describe it is imagine a triangle of light stretching away from the bike. Furthest away there is a definite section of about a third of the triangle with an even brighter spot in the middle. The remaining two-thirds of the triangle back towards the bike is dimmer with artefacts around the edges.

I tried the light on the bars and mounted lower down towards the front wheel. It didn't seem to make any appreciable difference either way.

The low setting (10 lux) is very feeble and is more a light to be seen that to see by. Useful I guess if you are riding largely in urban areas with street lights but a bare, emergency, get-you-home level for unlit roads.

Weight: Light 108g, 4 AA cells 113g

Pros

1. Definite vertical cut-off to the beam pattern. Riding behind a friend it didn't even light up the reflective strips on the base of his jacket. Good for not dazzling oncoming drivers.

2. Although an all-plastic construction the quality looks high and it is a very neat, self-contained package with the 4 AA cells inside the light.

3. Tested run time of 4H 30M on high is good although I would personally sacrifice half this time for twice the brightness. If you do the sort of rides which are even longer than this time then carrying a fresh set of cells would be no problem to quickly change them as well.

Cons

1. Not bright enough.

2. Beam pattern very uneven which I found irritating.

As a general commuting light for riding in largely urban areas with street lighting this is probably very good. For any sort of sports cycle riding where the average speeds are likely to be higher then it is barely adequate and certainly a safe limit would be 16 mph in my opinion but your eyesight might be better than mine. I personally wouldn't feel comfortable using this light without a much brighter back-up that I could switch on for faster sections which is how I will actually use it in future I think.

All of the beam shots and videos I have seen on the web flatter this light greatly and in reality what your eyes see will be vastly different to how a camera reacts to it. I would recommend that you try and see one for yourself before buying otherwise you might be disappointed.
THANK YOU!!! I've heard nothing but gushing reviews about this light... Based on those I also bought one from the same site as you. Barely adequate.... Ended up with a Fenix BC30 and am looking to sell my Ixon IQ Premium as I don't want the hassle of trying to return it to Germany.
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Old 11-08-14, 08:59 AM   #196
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The 80 lux B&M Cyo that I use is close to the output of my motorcycles headlight on low beam, if that's not enough light I'd be heading to the optometrist.
If that's the case it's the motorcycle mechanic you need to be seeing!
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Old 11-08-14, 10:14 AM   #197
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If that's the case it's the motorcycle mechanic you need to be seeing!
I'm aware of brighter lamps for my motorcycle, but as with my bike, I'm unwilling to use those brighter but poorly engineered, and illegal lamps for "better" lighting that comes at the expense of others safety.
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Old 11-08-14, 10:25 AM   #198
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I'm aware of brighter lamps for my motorcycle, but as with my bike, I'm unwilling to use those brighter but poorly engineered, and illegal lamps for "better" lighting that comes at the expense of others safety.
I'm sceptical about those claims of dazzling oncoming drivers and jeopardising safety. There's plenty of drivers here in the UK who "forget" to dip their headlights on the country roads where I live, and they are a lot more prevalent than cyclists with dazzling lights. In town on lit roads maybe there's no excuse for it but in the country I'd rather stay safe and see where I am going because there are potholes here that can swallow a bike whole!

Don't get me wrong though, I'm not inured to the problems of dazzling oncoming drivers which is why I bought this light in the first place. I build my own lights and wanted to investigate the technology involved in producing the vertical cut-off beam. If I could build something along the lines of the B&M Ixon IQ Premium with three times the output but in an aluminium case to handle the heat dissipation, then I would be sorted I think.

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Old 11-08-14, 12:08 PM   #199
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Originally Posted by hypster View Post
I'm sceptical about those claims of dazzling oncoming drivers and jeopardising safety. There's plenty of drivers here in the UK who "forget" to dip their headlights on the country roads where I live, and they are a lot more prevalent than cyclists with dazzling lights. In town on lit roads maybe there's no excuse for it but in the country I'd rather stay safe and see where I am going because there are potholes here that can swallow a bike whole!

Don't get me wrong though, I'm not inured to the problems of dazzling oncoming drivers which is why I bought this light in the first place. I build my own lights and wanted to investigate the technology involved in producing the vertical cut-off beam. If I could build something along the lines of the B&M Ixon IQ Premium with three times the output but in an aluminium case to handle the heat dissipation, then I would be sorted I think.
I don't drive a car, as a truck driver I'm up high enough to not be significantly effected most of the time, so my perspective is as a cyclist and motorcyclist. I cant see how one can question an issue so widely recognized by the average road user, and universally recognized officially for all other vehicles.
Its been my experience being on the receiving end of mega lumen "stadium" lights is that they make it virtually impossible to see anything, so fulfilling the the desire to "stay safe" by using them, rather than adjusting ones speed to match the output of responsible lights is simply transferring ones risk to another.
I don't appreciate it when others do it to me, so I'm unwilling to do it to others. The bright side is they are few and far between in my area.

I have no problem with bike lights being bright.... if they're engineered to proper vehicular standards, and the improvements you propose seem to be perfectly reasonable.
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Old 11-08-14, 03:42 PM   #200
Sullalto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kickstart View Post
I don't drive a car, as a truck driver I'm up high enough to not be significantly effected most of the time, so my perspective is as a cyclist and motorcyclist. I cant see how one can question an issue so widely recognized by the average road user, and universally recognized officially for all other vehicles.
Its been my experience being on the receiving end of mega lumen "stadium" lights is that they make it virtually impossible to see anything, so fulfilling the the desire to "stay safe" by using them, rather than adjusting ones speed to match the output of responsible lights is simply transferring ones risk to another.
I don't appreciate it when others do it to me, so I'm unwilling to do it to others. The bright side is they are few and far between in my area.

I have no problem with bike lights being bright.... if they're engineered to proper vehicular standards, and the improvements you propose seem to be perfectly reasonable.
AKA, your headlights are exactly the level of most low-slung cars, and are constantly blinding-even without hi beams.

Damn trucks.
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