Steely Dan

dreaming about the perfect frame for building my perfect commuter:

- material: carbon or titanium
- clearances for fenders and up to a 700x35 tire
- tabs for disc brakes
- sliding rear vertical drops
- frame break for belt drive

i'm finding some options for all of the above in steel and aluminum, but haven't found anything in carbon or titanium without exploring the custom frame building route.

TransitBiker

I know a guy, i'll ask him next chance i get & get back to you.

I've been looking myself to get belt drive, but i'd need the (alu) frame notched, which i can't do in my garage. It's a long term goal for when i have the money to get it done professionally. You may want to think about this for titanium frame...

- Andy

alan s 

Lynskey should be able to mod a frame such as the Cooper CX. You did say you were dreaming, so money is no object.

Steely Dan

^ right, there are plenty of custom titanium builders out there who could create such a frame for me, but i was curious if there was anything already on the market that i could get off the shelf to save some dough.

TransitBiker

No.5 Titanium and Steel City Bike | Budnitz Bicycles Store

Has rack & fender mounts.

- Andy

Steely Dan

^ close, but that frame uses an EBB for chain/belt tension instead of sliding vertical drop outs.

for better or worse, an EBB is a deal-breaker for me. i will never again own an EBB bike.

TransitBiker

I believe that is to ensure proper belt tension. You cant roll belts on like a chain, they can break & you can damage the teeth.

You could change the drive to the center track, eliminating debris buildup under the teeth & how the belts tend to wander on the cogs.

- Andy

TransitBiker

Here is another one you could look at? I dunno if they are titanium, this computer is too slow to efficiently poke around.

belt drive bikes

They have a few IGH models.

- Andy

Steely Dan

right, but i'm looking for a frame that uses sliding rear vertical drop-outs for tensioning the belt.

i absolutely do not want any frame that uses an EBB for belt tension. Budnitz bikes, while very nice, all use EBBs, therefore they're not what i'm looking for.

TransitBiker

Hmm, well i'll keep an eye out and post anything i find. I still have to talk to the guy & see what he says. Will be a few days most likely.

I can't imagine an off the shelf carbon frame having a belt notch... it's a lot of numbers and calculations to get the rear triangle structure correct with the hardware needed to keep the notch linked when in use. To add the vertical dropout may be a bridge too far. I can imagine they may have a rear facing horizontal and EBB if any even exist, to keep the correct tension not just for the belt but for the frame itself.

- Andy

fietsbob

my Koga WTR has a sliding dropout, but its aluminum, and the company sells around the World but only has at most 1 dealer in the US..

a U pick build list spec includes a Rohloff Gates belt combo..Koga Signature - Koga Signature... Custom Order Bicycles

TransitBiker

Titanium for bike frames to me makes more sense than carbon, because it won't break if you damage it in a crash then hit a pothole. So, i do understand your interest in that. But the belt drive means the rear triangle and the whole frame needs to be set up to have a part of it be not there & a part that would be continuous to not be. Titanium is hard to make things out of due to its high working temperature & the equipment needed. So, that will make your out of pocket expense go up no matter what you end up buying.

I think you're going to be looking at a custom frame. To reduce cost, you may be able to use an existing frame for reference, plus custom means you get what you want. I would suggest going with a standard basic 2 triangle design, as curves = money.

- Andy

Steely Dan

i found this titanium frame that i think might fit bill:

Titanium Bicycle Frame For Belt Drive and Wtih Sliding Dropouts-in Bicycle Frame from Sports & Entertainment on Aliexpress.com

but i'm skeptical about the quality. the frame is branded "Titanproduct" (chinese), which i've never heard of, and i've also never heard of "aliexpress.com" before and have no idea if they're a reputable dealer. it could be a good deal for an offthe shelf frame that i'm looking for, or it could be total crap. i'm still a bit surprised that's so hard to find a similar off the shelf frame from a reputable Ti manufacturer.

fietsbob

... I Think its the Chinese ebay ...

TransitBiker

Alibaba, it's legit site/company. Larger than ebay, actually.

Looks like a good buy!! Only thing is you'll now need to buy pedals, cranks, basically everything not the frame. If you have naother bike you can transplant things from, might save you a ton, depending on the actual fit of course.

Prepare for it to sit in customs for up to a month, just a heads up. I would call CBP and ask for an estimate if possible, specifying which area it's going to be coming into. For example in NJ and parts of PA it would come through newark airport.

- Andy

noglider 

Some of the Chinese makers are top notch. The trick is to figure out which of them are. Just because it's from China doesn't mean it's cr*p. Look at Apple computers, for example.

I'm thinking of taking a chance and buying a no-name crabon fiber frame from China.

TransitBiker

Exactly. They have some of the best manufacturing equipment & facilities on earth, which they smartly bought from elsewhere...

- Andy

fietsbob

Contract manufacturers build to spec, when the bottom line is wallyworld cheap.. they do that, OR when the Importer wants top quality ..

and Taiwan has the capabilities that are unbeatable , even in Denmark (Larry Vs Harry Bullit long johns are Taiwan made in heat treated Aluminum, in Taiwan )


Like SRAM , they bought out Sachs , and put all the German production machinery on a ship to Taipei.

alan s 

I wouldn't take the risk on that frame.

andyprough

That is one SWEET looking bike!!

Steely Dan

yeah, it would be a HUGE gamble.

900 bucks is pretty inexpensive for a good Ti frame.

900 bucks is pretty expensive for a crap Ti frame.


i wish i could find out definitively if "titanproduct" frames are the former or the latter.

i know that not everything made in china is crap, but china has earned that reputation for a reason.

Steely Dan

i think i'm getting over my lust for exotics. titanium is awesome, but the frame i'm looking for is so specific that the only way to obtain it in titanium seems to be to roll the dice on some chinese fabricator that i know absolutely nothing about or have it custom built state-side for a bazillion dollars. i don't like either of those options.

the Spot Brand Acme has everything i'm looking for (belt drive, disc brakes, alfine 11, full fender compatibility, and sliders vs. EBB) except it's aluminum instead of titanium, so it'll be an extra couple pounds. i gotta remember, i'm looking for a foul-weather commuter bike not a race bike; a couple extra frame pounds are going to cost me maybe 15 seconds at most along my commute route.

i'm gonna go test ride a Spot Acme this weekend to see how i like it, and hopefully i can say goodbye to my scott SUB 10 and it's incorrigible EBB forever.

anyone here familiar with Spot Brand belt drive bikes?