Bike Forums > Perpetual motion Ebike..:)
 Register All Albums Elite Membership Forum Rules Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

 Electric Bikes Here's a place to discuss ebikes, from home grown to high-tech.

 09-13-08, 04:01 PM #1 Crankforward Member Thread Starter   Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Central Texas Bikes: Rans Fusion,a bunch of goodwill bikes I work on Posts: 37 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Perpetual motion Ebike..:) Could someone more knowledgeable than me explain why it it not possible to run an ebike from a rear wheel motor and use a front wheel with a dynamo ,run it through a voltage regulator and run it back to charge the battery as you are moving down the road?
 09-13-08, 04:30 PM #2 SeizeTech Senior Member   Join Date: Aug 2008 Bikes: Posts: 536 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) the law of conservation of energy states that energy can not be create nor destroyed, it can only be changed from 1 kind of energy to another kind. with this in mind, you have to consider where your enery source is( your battery)....everytime you converts that energy into something else, there are inefficiencies associated to every conversion. the battery has internal resistance, the wires have internal resistance, the controller requires power just to operate, the motor is only 80% efficient at converting the energy to motion. each of thes processes produce heat. your battery power is lost due to this heat. then once the energy is mechanical energy, you have to consider the friction and rolling inefficiencies of your bearings,chain, wheels rolling on a less than smooth surface, even wind resistance. Bottom line, by the time your generator has produced electricity for your battery, it is only a fraction of the electricity required to move your bike forward. ........pause.............. now if you consider that you are pedalling, too. then you are actually getting power from your muscles too. You might wonder if your muscles are capable of compensating for all the losses in your electric system, and it certainly can if you pedal hard enough and fast enough. But, in the real time, the losses from you electric system are greater than what you can provide from your muscles. Eventually, you need to stop the bike and plug it into the wall to recharge the battery.
 09-13-08, 04:33 PM #3 SeizeTech Senior Member   Join Date: Aug 2008 Bikes: Posts: 536 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) to rephrase, the generator does not create energy, it only converts it. it is not able to convert enough energy to recharge the battery because some of the energy was lost through inefficiencies.
 09-13-08, 04:58 PM #4 trekker pete pedalphile   Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ellington, ct Bikes: trek 1200, 520, Giant ATX 970, Raleigh Talon Posts: 1,035 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 3 Post(s) don't listen to this conservation of energy propaganda put out by "big oil". you can do it. you just need the right gearing!!
09-13-08, 05:27 PM   #5
Antranik
Banned.

Join Date: Jun 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 40
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
 Originally Posted by trekker pete don't listen to this conservation of energy propaganda put out by "big oil". you can do it. you just need the right gearing!!
lol

09-13-08, 05:56 PM   #6
Allen
Senior Member

Join Date: Sep 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 4,758
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
 Originally Posted by trekker pete don't listen to this conservation of energy propaganda put out by "big oil". you can do it. you just need the right gearing!!
I had no idea that Mayer and Einstein were oil men.

 09-13-08, 07:28 PM #7 turoczi Junior Member   Join Date: Jul 2008 Bikes: Posts: 21 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) If you put a generator on the front wheel and a hub motor on back you will have created a pedalbike!!!!!! DO it.. I saw a you tube video of this guy that had a sports car he converted to electric with fans mounted all over it to recharge the bateries as he drove lol, he actually got investors to pour money into it.. I used to never be afraid of flying in a plane.. I thought if it were to crash I would just jump up at the last moment =P
 09-14-08, 07:31 AM #8 15rms Senior Member     Join Date: Oct 2007 Bikes: Posts: 285 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Trekker do it. If you did do it you would either be dead if it worked or looking tired because of all the peddling you would be doing to get the bike down the street.
 09-14-08, 08:29 AM #9 crackerdog Senior Member   Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Port Townsend, WA Bikes: xtracycle, electric recumbent, downtube folder and more Posts: 982 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) It would be easier to pedal if you also install anti-gravity discs too.
 09-14-08, 09:12 AM #10 misslexi Senior Member     Join Date: Aug 2008 Bikes: Posts: 218 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) This can work, just put a really large wheel on the rear and a real small one on the front. This way you're always going downhill
 09-14-08, 09:33 AM #11 Crankforward Member Thread Starter   Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Central Texas Bikes: Rans Fusion,a bunch of goodwill bikes I work on Posts: 37 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) I knew this would be a fun thread.
 09-14-08, 12:17 PM #12 Optimaman Member   Join Date: Sep 2008 Bikes: Posts: 31 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) Hey, the small wheel in the front and large wheel in the back serves more than the purpose of just going downhill all the time. That way, the generator motor is spinning much faster than the motor driving the bike so we can make MORE electricity than it uses. This way, we could even hook up all the charged up batteries to our homes to run our appliances after a long bike ride! This is such an awesome idea. Too bad I didn't think of it.
 09-14-08, 12:54 PM #13 SeizeTech Senior Member   Join Date: Aug 2008 Bikes: Posts: 536 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) just get a really long extension cord.
 09-14-08, 03:26 PM #14 2manybikes Dog is my co-pilot     Join Date: Jun 2003 Bikes: 2 many Posts: 16,311 Mentioned: 2 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 399 Post(s) This will do it.
 09-14-08, 05:28 PM #15 trekker pete pedalphile   Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: ellington, ct Bikes: trek 1200, 520, Giant ATX 970, Raleigh Talon Posts: 1,035 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 3 Post(s) ever see the tool on the youtube video who orives that his energy producing gizmo produces power by unplugging the motor from the wall? The motor, a really heavy fast spinning one, ofcourse, becomes a generator powered by the inertia of a few hundred pounds of spinning motorwinding. It easily kept a lightbulb running brightly. Probably would have powered that bulb for atleast 5 minutes. Wonder how many dopes bought that idea
 09-14-08, 05:42 PM #16 misslexi Senior Member     Join Date: Aug 2008 Bikes: Posts: 218 Mentioned: 0 Post(s) Tagged: 0 Thread(s) Quoted: 0 Post(s) My father-in-law has two of them
09-16-08, 09:49 AM   #17
Zeuser
e-Biker

Join Date: Aug 2006
Bikes: Gary Fisher, Strong GT-S eBike
Posts: 951
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
 Originally Posted by trekker pete don't listen to this conservation of energy propaganda put out by "big oil". you can do it. you just need the right gearing!!

09-16-08, 10:02 PM   #18
Metricoclock
Senior Member

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Bikes: Surly CrossCheck, Miyata 310 (conversion)
Posts: 854
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
 Originally Posted by trekker pete don't listen to this conservation of energy propaganda put out by "big oil". you can do it. you just need the right gearing!!

hahaha physics is just a tool of the devil

...