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Old 03-13-10, 01:39 PM   #1
RLSchell
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"How fast does it go?"

As soon as people notice my ebike, their immediate first question is, “How fast does it go?” When I patiently try to explain that it’s more about power assist than outright speed and the pedal-driven gears will go much faster than the motor, they just stare at me and repeat, “So, how fast does it go?” I tell them I average 15MPH with a combination of motor and pedaling, but I can go much faster just coasting down a hill with no power input at all. Then they suddenly lose interest and leave me alone. How do you answer the perpetual, “How fast does it go?” question in a way that provides a meaningful response?
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Old 03-13-10, 02:00 PM   #2
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"As fast as I make it go"
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Old 03-13-10, 02:08 PM   #3
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Mine goes 35 mph so I say "35 mph". Most people don't think like us.
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Old 03-13-10, 11:13 PM   #4
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I like bicycles I can do tricks on them, you can ride it any where and I can ride it with out a drivers license. Ebikes does seem kinda pointless less then 20 mph or if you have to pedal. =(
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Old 03-14-10, 03:53 PM   #5
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I like bicycles I can do tricks on them, you can ride it any where and I can ride it with out a drivers license. Ebikes does seem kinda pointless less then 20 mph or if you have to pedal. =(
i can run ,i can jump, i can turn cartwheels any bike is kinda poinless using that argument. i was once told by an ordinary biker that my electric bike was a lazy mans bike. so i asked him if he had gears on his bike he said yes of course so i said why? he said they help you climb hills, so youv'e got a lazy mans bike as well then i said. any form of transport is just a way of getting from a to b without having to walk and if you can do it with the least amount of effort and expence then that's a step forward. (excuse the pun )
the point is its less effort than riding an ordinary bike and an ordinary bike is less effort that walking.

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Old 03-14-10, 05:19 PM   #6
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I like bicycles I can do tricks on them, you can ride it any where and I can ride it with out a drivers license. Ebikes does seem kinda pointless less then 20 mph or if you have to pedal. =(
LOL... Over 20mph seems pointless to me as it is illegal. I can ride me ebike without a license and without registration for longer distances than you can on your non electric bike. I cant do tricks but a commuter bike is not made for tricks (electric on not). Your statement is not only pointless, but it just flat out has no logic behind it. Dang BMXrs hating all the time.
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Old 03-16-10, 04:25 AM   #7
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I would rather walk or drive then ride a bike just to get around. lol Come on some one help me out any one else ride ebikes for fun?
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Old 03-16-10, 03:55 PM   #8
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I use my ebike for daily commuting. I own two cars, but last year I put more miles on my bike than both cars combined. For me, an ebike is the cheapest and most efficient electric vehicle I can buy, plus I get some fresh air and exercise out of the deal. I would say that most of the time, it is "fun" to ride.
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Old 03-16-10, 07:48 PM   #9
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I almost crashed my e-bike today. I hit this huge pothole. The thing is I've seen that damn pothole so many times and today, I finally hit it.

A guy asked me how much my e-bike cost and I told him about $1000 and he said he'd buy one if he ever won the lottery. Then he took off back home to his $400,000 house which I know they have with the Lexus sitting in the driveway.
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Old 03-17-10, 03:01 AM   #10
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do you guys still ride bike trails with it or go over big jumps?
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Old 03-17-10, 05:45 AM   #11
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do you guys still ride bike trails with it or go over big jumps?
i dont think youl'l find many that have ebikes for that use as most use them are for comuting or crusing. if you get your fun from doing what your doing then good luck i dont think i could aford to keep replacing the components that would get trashed.
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Old 03-17-10, 07:03 PM   #12
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LOL... Over 20mph seems pointless to me as it is illegal.
Actually, ebikes that go up to 30mph are legal in California. See DMV Code 406(a) and 24015. But they have to have junk like headlight, taillight, brake lights, and horn; and you have to have a moped license (M2 license).

Ebikes with a max speed of 20mph, don't need those things.
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Old 03-17-10, 07:27 PM   #13
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Actually, ebikes that go up to 30mph are legal in California. See DMV Code 406(a) and 24015. But they have to have junk like headlight, taillight, brake lights, and horn; and you have to have a moped license (M2 license).

Ebikes with a max speed of 20mph, don't need those things.
Actually the device your describing is a MOPED which is not classified as an ELECTRIC BIKE. They are 2 different classifications under the law in which I was referencing.
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Old 03-18-10, 09:06 PM   #14
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How fast does it go?

That's for me to know and you to find out.

For about $1500 dollars, you can find out, too.

Now, leave me alone.
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Old 03-19-10, 06:59 PM   #15
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How fast does it go?

That's for me to know and you to find out.

For about $1500 dollars, you can find out, too.

Now, leave me alone.
I like your answer best.

I enjoy riding my e assisted xtracycle. I have never felt a compelling urge to jump my bikes at all.

It has been my experience, that unless I keep the wheels on the ground the ride goes south quickly!
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Old 03-20-10, 09:23 AM   #16
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The spendy and trendy EU compliant 250w PAS bikes are just window dressing. They obviously are working for many folks though as there are millions of them worldwide, but mainly in China and the EU. But I can ride a bike averaging 15 mph so they don't do a thing for me.

However I can't average 25 mph but can on a bike that is still legally compliant and costs less than the EU ones. If it means I have to be in the moped class so be it. I have lights and all that on my bike already because that is how I roll on the road. If I have to go get a plate for a small fee and wear a helmet that is not a problem with me in order to be able to be in the 30 mph top speed category. I have both a 20 mph electric and a gas 30 mph and the former works best in town and the other works way better on longer trips and I have lots of saddle time on both. If I could only have one though it would be a 30 mph moped class for sure.

The most important aspect of a motor assist bicycle for me is that I can pedal at all times in a hard enough gear to complement the motor. This relieves pressure on myself and the motor at the same time and I can go further faster using less energy overall. What can I say, I like to pedal. Mab's are alot like riding a tandem with a really strong stoker and are just way too much fun to pass up on.
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Old 03-22-10, 02:15 PM   #17
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I would think its more about not showing up all sweaty to the office in the morning than anything.
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Old 03-22-10, 02:50 PM   #18
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The spendy and trendy EU compliant 250w PAS bikes are just window dressing. They obviously are working for many folks though as there are millions of them worldwide, but mainly in China and the EU. But I can ride a bike averaging 15 mph so they don't do a thing for me.

However I can't average 25 mph but can on a bike that is still legally compliant and costs less than the EU ones. If it means I have to be in the moped class so be it. I have lights and all that on my bike already because that is how I roll on the road. If I have to go get a plate for a small fee and wear a helmet that is not a problem with me in order to be able to be in the 30 mph top speed category. I have both a 20 mph electric and a gas 30 mph and the former works best in town and the other works way better on longer trips and I have lots of saddle time on both. If I could only have one though it would be a 30 mph moped class for sure.

The most important aspect of a motor assist bicycle for me is that I can pedal at all times in a hard enough gear to complement the motor. This relieves pressure on myself and the motor at the same time and I can go further faster using less energy overall. What can I say, I like to pedal. Mab's are alot like riding a tandem with a really strong stoker and are just way too much fun to pass up on.
If your state is like mine, wearing a dot approved helmet while pedaling seems a bit too much to go through as those helmets are hot and heavy.
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Old 03-24-10, 05:53 PM   #19
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There's acuatally 3 answers - "A fast as legally possible" for people I just don't have the time for. "My speed limiter is set to 35mph" is one for police. "It's limited by voltage" for people who might understand.

Fox, you get another answer - my bike weighs 48lbs on the back axle. You don't jump those, you don't climb mountains, you ride like the wind from point A to point B. You don't ride like that and probably your parents drop you and the bike off at the local skatepark, so go to a forum where they discuss those things.
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Old 03-24-10, 08:25 PM   #20
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do you guys still ride bike trails with it or go over big jumps?
Wow, either you're an idiot or a troll. E-bikes aren't made for high performance sports. You ride to work or school or the store. Sure I still ride on bike trails and I have a set of knobby tires for when I want to do something like that. But jumps are out of the question. Think about it this way, you just bought a high performance laptop and it's made to be used indoors, but you can take it outside if you want right? Would you take it outside in the rain? No, of course not. You could buy a laptop from a military surplus that is completely waterproof but it would be clunky and not much to look at. Same with E-bikes, you buy it for what you use it for. If you want something to go off jumps buy something like the Optibike but expect to pay through the nose for it. For us commuters a $300 conversion kit will do just fine.
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Old 05-15-10, 08:33 PM   #21
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NSW Roads & Traffic Authority to nobble the emerging electric bike (ebike) concept

The NSW Roads and Traffic Authority (Australia) want to nobble the emerging electric
bike (ebike) phenomenon. Worse, they want their policy applied as a
national standard. Worse still, Bicycle Victoria (BV) have endorsed this
policy. This issue is symptomatic of how govt fail to grasp the issue
of climate change abatement. The economic benefits of people on bikes
include reducing infrastructure costs, reigning in health costs, personal
fitness, greenhouse abatement, etc.

Content below posted on Bicycle Victoria forum:
http://www.bv.com.au/forums/posting....t=18582#review

I was just discussing with Bicycle Victoria (BV), their electric bicycle
(ebike) policy endorsement of NSW Roads and Traffic Authority's position
on ebikes: 250w motor, speed limited to 25kmh pedal assisted. Available
on: http://www.bv.com.au/file/file/RTA%20May%2009.pdf.

BV's endorsement is
on: 'New electric bike standard proposed' (3 June 2009) URL:
http://www.bv.com.au/bikes-&-riding/10607/.

I ride a 200w (36v 10 Ah Li Ion battery) flat bar Jamis road bike 34.4km
from Werribee to Melb CBD 1-2 times a week. In up to 15kn headwinds I can
manage 28.5-32.0 kmh, and in 15-25kn headwinds about 25 kmh. Above 34 kmh
(eg downhill), I use the bar extensions, let go of the throttle and crank
it manually.

While I was thrilled to see potential to raise power max 25% to 250w, I
was simultaneously deeply dismayed to see a 25kmh speed limit brought to
bear. My trip time from Werribee to CBD is 1hr 15mins. If you limit me to
25kmh, it would add 20 mins making trip time 1hr 35 mins. I have an 800cc
motorcycle that will do the trip in 40 mins. I am not going to spend 3hrs
10 mins travelling time per day. Effectively, this policy would kill the
potential for ebikes to service medium to long distance commuters.

On the Federation trail I ride 16kms off-road. I have struggled over 6 kms
to catch up to 2 chaps on racing bikes. If I was doing 28 kmh, they were
doing 26.5 kmh. If a non-electric bike can go over 25kmh, why would
bicycle Victoria endorse 25kmh speed limiting for an ebike. If a stretch
of road requires a 25kmh limit, then sign post it as such.

On the Beach Road bike route on Saturday mornings, the packs of racing
bikes run at 45-60 kmh though Brighton and Sandringham.

BV contact mentioned that BV endorsed this 250w/25kmh propsoal because it
is the European standard. To get 25 European countries to agree on a
standard requires a lowest common denominator approach. Australia should
be aiming for excellence and maximum efficiency. Pedalec is the term for
motor/pedal speed interfacing. It's an added mechanical complication. I'm
reminded of the KISS principal: keep it simple stupid. Europe's roads are
old, small, constrained and winding in many instances.

Australia is more like Canada and USA, where 750w & 900w motors are
respectively permitted on ebikes, to my knowledge. Australia has decent,
fairly wide and straight roads. I think the increase in power to 250w is
warranted. Speed limiting to 25 kmh is ridiculous. Why would someone limit
an ebike's speed, when it is a fraction of that available to cars and
motor cycles? They can travel way over the 110 kmh speed limit, but no
one's proposing speed limiting them.

An ebike can move a person using 1% of the caloric energy of fuel that is
required to move someone in a car. The lithium batteries have only been
popular for 2-3 years. It's a new and evolving technology. An agency like
VicRoads is bringing 80-100 years of negative inertia to the table. With
climate change a major issue today, we need solutions. Propping up the
bottom line financial take of VicRoads should not be the main focus here.
Bikes also have a low footprint in terms of road wear and tear. They're
good for your physical well-being. The ebike brings a cycling capacity to
outer suburban dwellers.

My ebike cost me $A2000 two years ago, and is now worth about $2700 new.
This is around the cost of a 50cc scooter, which will take a rider to 80
kmh without bothering to pedal. Why would someone buy an ebike for $2700
speed limited to 25 kmh, and take 3 times longer to arrive?

Please don't follow NSW Roads and Traffic Authority down the garden path
to killing the ebike's potential as an efficient healthy transport medium.
The 200-250w output isn't enough to take ebike speeds up to what fit
people do on regular road bikes already. Ebikes definitely don't need
speed limiting, as my bike's 22kg weight holds it down to 34 kmh top speed
anyway. Promote wearing a safety vest instead. BV's endorsement of speed
limiting ebikes strikes me as a lazy uninformed policy developed by
someone who's never ridden an ebike. I'm asking BV to reconsider it.
--

The second posting

I'll quote the NSW RTA's proposal on ebike control: '...continuous rated
power not exceeding 250 watts, of which the output is progressively
reduced and finally cut off as the vehicle reaches a speed of 25kmh'.
Clearly with this recipe, pedalling is considered paramount to acheive
25kmh.

In my earlier posting, I said I can do 34 kmh before the motor ceases to
provide aid on my Jamis Coda Sport ebike (200w motor, 10 Ah Li-ion
battery). My 12kg bicycle is carrying an extra 8kg of motor/battery. Why
carry this weight, if you won't gain much benefit in doing so? The reg's are
saying I can go 9 kmh slower, because if I want to go faster I can just
pedal. Have you carried an extra 8kg on a long ride lately?

I spent $A840 on a new road bike, converting ebike gear over to save 2kg
and go from 21 to 27 speed, which has shaved 5 mins off my trip time
(34.4km in 1'15"). Here a bureaucrat who probably never rode an ebike, is
going to cut 9kmh off the ebike concept for what purpose? Will this help
keep people in cars? Probably. Would that suit road traffic authority
accountants, motor vehicle manufacturers and oil companies? Possibly.
Would you go to war to protect your need for oil. Yes.

My ebike's motor makes a tram starting off sort of noise below 26kmh. It's
just getting into its useful/efficient torque range when running at
27-32kmh. Whose interest is this legislation looking after, because it
certainly isn't the cyclists'?

In road use terms, it's safer to ride at a speed matched with the stream
of cars around you so you can merge with the traffic. A slow cyclist is
dodging in and out around parked cars. Speed doesn't always equal danger,
it's an asset for a cyclist. You can follow a car around a round-about,
instead of sitting out there as a lone duck target.

Why not promote bikes you favour, rather than ban ones you don't? When I
ride home from work around Melb Docklands, I can't keep up with 15% of the
cyclists out there; and some are on mountain bikes (!), as well as road
bikes. Don't get me wrong, I'm up for slipstreaming as much as the next
cyclist, but you have to pace yourself when you're riding 34km.

I can't see the threat from ebikes. I'm 57 years old, and wouldn't cycle
34 km to work without a motor. It's been a joy to be in amongst cyclists
in all their diversity. It's always a good cardio-vascular workout. If you
think I ride feet up with a motor doing all the work, think again. I got
home last night in about 9 deg temp with my shirt wet with sweat, and I
drank a glass of water within minutes. I pedal the whole time I'm
commuting. The challenge is to get an extra few kmh out of the bike by
cranking at the pedals. Having the motor be cut out just when it gets
interesting, is a bit like how people dated in the 1950's. Do we really
want to be a backward looking country?

The ebike is an emerging low-carbon technology, with the govt in Australia
wanting to keep it at the limit of a moderately capable cyclist. It's like when cars
first appeared in the late-1800s: a speed limit of 5 mph (to match
horses), with a walking man waving a flag out the front.

Third post
The NSW 'Proposal for a new AB vehicle definition' paper mentions ebike
sales in Europe and Japan, and compliance to their standards with an eye
to export opportunities. 'The European market, with 250,000 estimated power-assisted pedal cycles
(PAPCs) sold in 2007 and Japan, with an estimated 300,000 PAPCs sold in
the same year, are the two most significant markets
outside China'. The paper fails to mention that China manufactured 19 mil
ebikes in 2007, 97% for domestic use. So Australian standards could speed
limit Aussie ebikes down to 25 kmh to pander compliance with a 2.9% market
share of Europe/Japan/China ebike 2007 sales. Didn't we fight a war at
some stage to maintain our sovereignty? Does innovation still exist in
Australia?

Do you think this NSW product proposal ebike (250w/25kmh limited) would do
well at the Australian pavilion in the Shangahi World Trade Expo which
opened May 2010? That might be a lonely job.
--

Last edited by pageal; 05-17-10 at 10:59 PM.
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Old 05-18-10, 02:17 AM   #22
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73kph
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Old 05-19-10, 09:47 PM   #23
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73kph
73kph with 220lb rider
76.8 with 160lb rider
ya thats stupidfast on a bike
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Old 08-01-10, 09:07 AM   #24
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Why not just get your bike licensed as a moped? If it's capable of higher speeds it makes sense to enforce construction & use regulations, safety equipment and trained rider requirements. Your kinetic energy goes up as the square of your velocity, and as such, you're going to do four times as much damage when you hit someone at twice the speed.
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Old 08-02-10, 02:11 AM   #25
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Why not just get your bike licensed as a moped? If it's capable of higher speeds it makes sense to enforce construction & use regulations, safety equipment and trained rider requirements. Your kinetic energy goes up as the square of your velocity, and as such, you're going to do four times as much damage when you hit someone at twice the speed.
Licensing a bike as a moped doesn't mean it's going to be up to "safety standards"
From what I understand all it takes to license an ebike as a moped is turn signals, brake lights, and a head light. The DMV does an inspection to make sure those are equipped and then you can get your license plate. Having an ebike that goes over 40mph is fun but not necessarily smart. In the wrong hands that could easily lead to death. But the same could be said for biking in general. Standard bikes aren't "designed" to go that fast. Many are able to go those speeds without incident because bikes are overengineered, but there's a reason motorcycles have disc brakes and shocks.

I think the main reason the OP doesn't license his bike is then he would be responsible for obtaining insurance and other financial obligations. I don't know about anyone else but that's one of the main reasons I ride an E-bike, to get away from a monthly required obligation "tax" just to ride.
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