daven1986

Hi,

I am thinking about building up a generator hub system and I really like the look of these lights. A few questions I have:

1) How easy are they to remove and take with you when you leave your bike, and also how easy are they to put back on when you get back (assuming the use of the handlebar mount)?

2) Which hub would be best for these, shimano or SON - i.e. is the SON worth the extra ££ (I will be building up 2 wheels)?

3) I want the tail-light as well, I have heard good things about this, but is it worth paying the extra for the seatpost mount? The reason is I don't really want to leave it on the bike when I lock it up..

4) I will be using a Fenix flashlight as a backup incase of failure, however would it be possible to run 2x E3 headlights and a tail-light from a single hub? I'm guessing that would be a bit overkill (I commute through fairly well lit streets, but I want the cars to notice me). Also the Fenix has a poor flashing mode which leads me onto question 5!

5) What other decent battery operated lights have a good flashing mode? I generally like to run 1 light flashing and 1 light solid so cars don't think I am a car in the distance when pulling out, I don't want to spend too much (i.e. dinotte is out, unless I can find one cheap enough!) or is this not worth it?

Any other opinions are welcome. However I want BRIGHT lights, so no point in telling me I'd be fine with less!

Thanks

Daven

CaptCarrot

I am interested ion these lights also (have been for a while). And since I first saw the single LED clear lens, they have now brought out a focused lens and a tri-led version fro off road use.

Check out their beam shots and comparisons to other battery and dynamo lights...

https://yacf.co.uk/forum/index.php?to...6956#msg206956

daven1986

Ye the beam shots look pretty good, supernova say the symmetrical beam is best for road use so I'd probably want that lens. Wonder what other new LED dynamo lights are going to come out this year for around the same price...

ronsmithjunior

I bought a Schmidt SON 28 and an E3 in November. One problem I had with the E3 is that the wiring is directly connected to the light. Unless you cut the wires and put in a disconnect, you have to take the wiring off with the light. I take off the wiring with the light. It is pretty easy to put back on with velcro straps.

The SON is worth the $$$, but for two wheels I'd probably think hard about the Shimano. Mind you, I have never used a dyno hub before I got the Schmidt. To pay for the hub and light I sold an old bike.

A Fenix L2D serves as a helmet light, and a backup light, for me. Two E3 lights won't get you much more than one. Go for the E3 Triple. Sometimes I wish I had waited for them to come out. That said, the one E3 gives plenty of light, and I am one of those people who like a lot of light. Forget about a wired tail light. Go with a regular LED tail light (I use two Cateye LD500s) and REALLY secure it to your bike.

daven1986

Thanks for the reply, I thought the wiring was directly connected to the light from the pictures - i was hoping it wasn't so!

If the SON is going to last many many years, and it significantly better than the shimano then I am prepared to lay out the cash for them.

Is there any particular reason you say to go for the regular tail lights over the wired ones?

Also I read that the E3 triple was blinding to drivers, if this isn't the case then I would prefer to get one over the E3 - when I first saw it I thought "WOW, that is my light!".

Thanks

jdmitch

Supernova Light Comparison (including E3 Triple)

FYI, the 'difference in performance' that you will see between a SON and a Shimano is the extra drag / load on your legs due to (in) efficiencies, not really a difference in lighting performance (from what I understand). However, someone (can't find my link) likened the magnitude of difference (extra effort to maintain speed) to the difference between wearing a loose fitting or form fitting jacket on a road bike. Aka, there's some but not much. Now, as far as durability / longevity, I've not seen any differentiators between the two.

To me, the question of whether or not to buy the SON would depend on how much I had invested in the rest of the bike. There are bigger gains to be had in other places, and unless I had those all perfectly jacked in, I wouldn't worry about the SON benefits over the Shimano for the money (realize I tend to focus on bang for the buck, marginal benefits comparisons between components, not the absolute best components).

Also, if you want a crazy good flashing front light: Planet Bike Blaze 1-watt... end of story. It has the same crazy flash pattern of the revered Super Flash Tailight. Note, I don't know if one could wire a PB Blaze Dynamo (same crazy flash pattern) with a single E3 and a dynamo tailight.

Proviso - I've yet to decide on my dyno / light setup... but it should be obvious what I'm most likely going for (Shimano / SRAM + B&M IQ Cyo Plus + IQ rear light / can't remember the name at the moment)... later I'll build a dream bike with SON / Supernova. I'm simply sharing some of my research and thoughts.

ronsmithjunior

For me rear led lights are so cheap and dependable I might as well use them. Plus, it saves from having to run wires to the rear of the bike. The Cateyes I use are dead simple. I only think about them when I have to recharge the AAA batteries, which is once every few months.

I get the impression that the regular E3 is bright to drivers, but no brighter than a Fenix L2D running on turbo mode. Aiming it properly is the key. Btw, there is a narrow window where the aim is good. Too low and you see the hot spot (it has a small one), and too high and the light washes out.

The E3 doesn't seem to have a lot of throw. Now that I have the hub and a dependable light I am thinking about making a DIY light, with a lot of throw, that I can turn on when I want.

daven1986

thanks will probably go with the shimano then as it is quite a difference in price.

That superflash is very bright, might have to get me a few of those!! The planet bike blaze 1-watt light seems pretty good too.

I guess 2 superflashes will be much cheaper than a wired tail light and give the same effect, or should I go 1 Dinotte and 1 super flash?

Either way it looks like the shimano hub and an E3 headlight (possibly a triple pending other road usage reviews!)

Thanks

ronsmithjunior: which E3 lens do you have? I do want a lot of throw as I like to cycle at around 15mph+ on my commute and find the range of my current setup too short to see potholes / bumps / cracks etc.
Do you have the E3 on your handlebars or do you have it on the fork? Would having the E3 triple on the fork make it less blinding? I don't really mind blinding them a little, as long as they see me!

jdmitch

On the rear of my current commuter, I use a PBSF Stealth (on blinking) + PB Rack Blinky 5 (on solid, but doubles as reflector if I leave it off) + Reelight 120... I'd like to believe I'm hella noticeable but haven't ever driven behind myself to check.

Again, I don't have experience with wired tail lights. However, I'll probably wire a tail light to the rack and shove a PBSH w/ Eneloops on my seatpost for backup.

The newer AA batteries (like Eneloop) hold charge well.

CaptCarrot

Regarding which hub to choose? I can't really say, as I have no experience...

But my dream bike...
Cannodale Trekking Prestige 2009


Uses a Shimano Alfine dynohub to power the E3. Strangely they don't use the Supernova tail light though.

Also, I have heard recently that other manufacturers are catching up with Schmidt in the drag department.

daven1986

Ye I kept thinking that for pretty much double the price you don't gain much. I can see that a battery rear blinky is better probably for both price and they last a while too. Plus by having many you get redundancy!

Those are some nice looking bikes (both the above)

Which is better - handlebar mount or fork mount?

Thanks all

PaulRivers

Personally, I have no idea why anyone would get a battery rear blinky if they could get and install a dynamo rear light, other than that they'd rather change batteries than run a wire to the back of the bike. Hmm, or if they really want the ability to have the back light do the "blinky" thing - I don't think any of the dynamo rear light actually blink. At least that's a point.

Cost-wise, a planet bike rear blinky costs $30 each, plus 2 batteries each. So that's $30 + $30 + $10 (4 rechargeable batteries) = $70. Coincidentally, the e3 rear blinky light also costs $70. If you buy a cheaper, non-supernova rear light (you're not supposed to, but I've read on here about people wiring them up) the Busch&Müller DToplight XS Plus is $33 - https://www.peterwhitecycles.com/taillights.asp
Or the Toplight Flat Plus is $17.25.

If I wanted redundancy, I'd get both 1 planet bike blinky light and and dynamo rear light.

A dynamo rear light has several advantages over the battery powered variety, not counting costs -
1. Stays on the bike - It's bolted on, so it's not going to fall off. Also, with some blinky designs half the light sometimes fall off when you bit a bad bump (if the light separates in order to get new batteries in - see other people complaining about it in other posts on this forum).
2. Safety - you don't forget to turn it on. Since it's connected to the switch for the front light, if it gets dark you'll notice if you don't have your lights on.
3. Safety - it doesn't die because the batteries run out. This is particularly important because unlike the front light, you won't notice if the rear light goes out. So you turn on your light, the batteries die, and you don't know about it. The dynamo light doesn't have this problem because it doesn't have batteries. Also, this might happen several times as batteries that sit overnight seem to regain a small amount of charge, so you turn it on, it works, you start off then the batteries die again and again.
4. Convenience - you *never* have to change batteries on a dynamo light.
5. Convenience - one less light to turn on (either comes on automatically when you start biking, or it comes on when you switch on the front light).

If you wanted the best in safety I think a rear dynamo + a rear battery blinky would be the best. You'd never be SOL because you forgot to turn the dynamo on, and you could still have a flashing light with the battery powered one. They're completely separate, so if one failed you'd still have the other one. Battery failure wouldn't leave you SOL either. If the wire somehow failed, you'd still have the battery powered one. Two identical, side by side blinky lights seems like the worst "backup" system - identical lights with identical batteries seem likely to have their batteries die at the same time.

Personally, I got dynamo lights because I'm lazy and I don't want to have to screw around with replacing batteries and turning lights on and off every time I ride. With a dynamo light, I just get on the bike and ride and the light comes on automatically. The idea of constantly having to reach back and turn the rear blinky on and off every time I get on and off the bike, especially trying to hit a tiny button while I have gloves on (winter biking or even cooler fall biking) seems rather annoying.

barturtle

If you don't want to wire and you don't want to deal with batteries, you could go with Reelights I don't think they'll be as bright as the Superflash or the e3, but they're cheap enough.

daven1986

they are good point paulrivers, my only concern with bolting it on is leaving the light on the bike - don't fancy people stealing it! However I suppose it is quite inconspicuous. I would have to get 2 bolt on lights though, unless I use the seat stay light. I completely agree about the point that it is safer as you don't have to replace batteries / turn it on / etc.

Looks like a superflash and a wired tail-light! I have no problem with having a solid rear light - I prefer it to be honest.

barturtle: thanks for the idea but I think the superflash is worth having batteries for as a backup matched with a dynamo light.

CaptCarrot

Well that depends on application (IMHO)

To be seen: Handle bar - Higher position more likely to be noticed by oncoming drivers.

To see by: Front fork crown, Low-rider Boss or at the front axle - Lower position less likely to dazzle oncoming traffic - or you in foggy / bnad weather conditions.

Re the low-rider boss and front axle, here is an option (Atoc Lightbeams) (if you are going to use the handlebar mount, but lower down) - so far I think they are only sold online by https://www.wallbike.com/

daven1986

Well the application is a bit of both! I want to see potholes, but also be seen by drivers. Also I want to be able to remove the light when I leave the bike so perhaps the bosses you linked to would be useful.

CaptCarrot

Maybe. TBH I have never seen a bike with a low-rider mount point, but then that may be specific to touring bikes or something like that.

Mind you, if you have a nutted front axle there is nothing to stop you putting a stunt peg on there and using that like a handlebar (if it is thin enough)

daven1986

maybe the E3 triple on the handlebars angled downwards a bit will do the job?

ronsmithjunior

I have the symmetrical lens. When I bought the light Peter White didn't have the asymmetrical in stock, which is just as well because I like to have some of the light above road level in order to illuminate signs.

My E3 is mounted just above my bottom bracket. To answer your question, it is exactly 36" off the ground. In general I like lights that are higher off the ground, angled down slightly. I did try the E3 at axle height. It was terrible.

CaptCarrot

May I ask just how high your bike is if your bottom bracket is 36 inches (3 foot) off the ground?

Do you mean headset or 36cm

ronsmithjunior

I can certainly see the attraction of a dynamo powered rear light. In my case I had two battery powered lights already hard mounted (bolted) to the bike. They were a proven solution, having been on the bike for a long, long time.

Except for group rides I do like blinking rear lights. In urban environments I think they stand out better.

What does happen with a dynamo driven rear light when you stop moving? Is there a stand light feature for them, or do you go dark? One thing I was not impressed with is the very dim stand light on the E3. It is not good for anything except a feeble "hello, I am here". From what I hear the Edelux has a much better stand light.

For some reason my blinky batteries never fade at the same time. Maybe I got them at different times. No matter, you can tell in plenty of time when they are starting to fade, and charge them.

I suppose I just don't want that wire running the length of my bike.

ronsmithjunior

Think different:

https://www.bacchettabikes.com/recumb...ikes/corsa.htm

This is my "everything" bike, from commuting to group rides to ultra events.

CaptCarrot

Somehave standlights, some don't, some are better than others.

+1 on the Reelight SL120's as fit and forget backup (regular flash & standlight)

Also consider Pedalite's. Not cheap, but again battery free and standlight. Or Ledals cheaper than Pedalites, auto on/off day/night but battery powered.

daven1986

hmm the reelights look quite good from that link.

can't use the pedalites as i use crank brothers egg beater pedals.

perhaps the reelights front and back will be a good backup + the superflash + the tail-light + the E3 triple + planet blaze 1 watt light :-) maaaaaaan people are going to see me coming!!

thanks guys

CaptCarrot

Smarty pants