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Old 12-16-12, 12:10 PM   #26
PaulRivers
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Originally Posted by cehowardGS View Post
That is a bright one I tell you that..

There are two schools of thought here. The OP recommends and does a low mount. A lot of posters with way more experience and savvy then me, recommend the higher the rear light the better. As is a rear light on a helmet is better than a rear light mounted on the seatpost. The OP has their light mounted on fender and his intentions was not to have it in people's eye.

In a neutral perspective, a rear light is there for you to be "seen"..The proponents of the higher the light the better, are on the principle that it can be seen even over top of cars, IMO, good point. Whereas, the OP wants their light to be down away from drivers eye, that, IMO, might be defeating the purpose.

Again, that was a neutral comment, and I am sure this thread is back to life and well..
Actually...it's debatable whether the helmet mounting people are "way more experience and savvvy".

I both bike and drive a car. When I'm in my car - despite being a regular biker - I've never felt like I missed seeing a biker with a rear blinky mounted at seatpost level that was blinking. Obviously, one could argue "you didn't notice because you didn't see them, but I just haven't one appear out of nowhere.

But *several* times I've had a biker "come out of nowhere" who had a helmet mounted tail light but no seat-level tail light.

The thing is -
1. That when I'm driving my car, my brain looks for lights at tail and headlight level. A helmet mounted tail light isn't at the right level, and sometimes gets filtered out as non-car visual noise that my brain doesn't pay attention to.
2. A helmet mounted tail light *only* points backwards when you're looking straight forwards. Look to the side, the light is pointing off the the side (and the opposite side of where you're looking). Look behind you - your tail light isn't point behind you whatsoever any more.

I hadn't thought of #2 until I was in the middle of writing this post, but I think that's the most important reason to mount the tail light on your bike - if you mount it on your helmet, it stops pointing backwards when you move your head to look to the sides or behind you.
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Old 12-16-12, 01:02 PM   #27
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I consider helmet lighting to be secondary to bike mounted lights. I would never go with a rear helmet light alone. They are shining all over the place, not necessarily where you want them to be. Can't say I've ever seen one while driving, but riding with people with rear helmet lights make it pretty obvious that they should be secondary. Same many times over with bag lights. When someone in front of you virtually disappears in the darkness, it is scary.
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Old 12-16-12, 01:21 PM   #28
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I consider helmet lighting to be secondary to bike mounted lights. I would never go with a rear helmet light alone. They are shining all over the place, not necessarily where you want them to be. Can't say I've ever seen one while driving, but riding with people with rear helmet lights make it pretty obvious that they should be secondary. Same many times over with bag lights. When someone in front of you virtually disappears in the darkness, it is scary.
I agree. Helmet mounted rear lights are nice, but should be secondary to bike mounted simply because the head turns all the time - -
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Old 12-17-12, 06:10 AM   #29
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I have had the DiNotte 400R taillight for about 2 years now, its rock solid and have had no problems with it, I now supplement it with a Cygolite Hotshot in a very slow pulse (OSP) mode.

(Off topic) Thinking about picking up the DiNotte X-ML 3 headlight and dumping my Magic Shine 880, I have had connection problems, charging issue and the 880 run times are way over stated, like the lumen output just over 1500 as reported by MTBR.
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Old 12-17-12, 07:06 AM   #30
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Since this thread was bumped, I'll take the opportunity to add my impressions after a couple of years of owning this light .

Overall, a great light, with a few nitpicks:

1) The most serious is the durability of the mounts. This is a very heavy light, and depending on the mount orientation/configuration, the light ends up hanging at the end of a very long cantilever. Due to the weight, there is a lot of flex and vibration at the hinge, and I have had repeated problems with the fixing bolt coming loose, to the point where the light fell off completely once. Fortunately I was going slow and heard the thunk. To DiNotte's credit, the light was barely scratched. That was with blue Loctite on the bolt, by the way. I ended up having to use the red stuff to keep it in place, but eventually the whole nut/bolt assembly tore through the center of the mount and it fell apart. Currently, I am using mechBgon's mounting idea to salvage the mount. I didn't have a long chainring bolt so I used a couple of fender washers with bolt through them to keep the two halves of the hinge compressed like a sandwich. Ironically, the quick release, which a lot of us had initial reservations about, has never failed on me. This light really needs a beefier mounting solution.

I always mount on the left seatstay due to having saddle packs blocking the seatpost on most of my bikes, so I'm sure this contributes to the stress on the mount.


2) The silicone cover over the USB port does not stay put, especially after it has stiffened a bit with age. I fixed this by wrapping a cable tie snugly around the body of the light, such that it lays over the cover and keeps it pressed onto the USB port. The nice, flat semi-cylindrical shape of the light in this area is very accommodating for this. To access the charging port, I just slide the tie down a little way until I can open up the cover, then slide it back on when done. You could also use a rubber band but it probably won't last very long.

3) No problems at all with the quick release, but I agree it doesn't instill confidence even though the metal appears to be very strong. After my experiences, I'd worry more about the mount failing (either at the hinge, or even right where the metal tab bites into the plastic) than the quick release on the light. That's the problem with having a mechanical system made up of dissimilar materials. All the stress gets transmitted to the weaker material.

4) Permanent mounting is an option, but the overall design of the light seems to argue against it. Recharging could get awkward in a lot of cases, and the quick release doesn't appear to be the problem anyway. Plus, DiNotte recommends that this light be pointed down to create a pool of light on the pavement. Hard to do if bolted to a reflector bracket.

5) My current thinking is that the version of this light with the external battery pack (400R ?) might be a better, if less convenient option. If you have a place to mount the battery and cable, the reduced weight should leave less stress on the mount, as well as making recharging easier for permanently-mounted lights.

Last edited by Metaluna; 12-17-12 at 07:11 AM.
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Old 12-17-12, 09:45 AM   #31
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Great review Metaluna
Thank you
Never had problems with the DiNotte 400R steal mount bouncing down single track at night for the last 2 years , I’m thinking people go all Gorilla in a rush when removing the light from its steal mount and therefore making the mount weak.
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Old 12-17-12, 10:04 AM   #32
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from its steal mount
They have a mount made for stealing?
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Old 12-17-12, 11:22 AM   #33
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They have a mount made for stealing?
Ha Ha I should steal your steel bike away from you one day.
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Old 12-17-12, 09:14 PM   #34
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I have been looking at the 400R with the external battery. The price still gives me pause, so I was considering the 400R-AA (powered by a AA-battery pack), until I asked and DiNotte replied:

"The 400R-Lithium ion and 400R AA only differ in a few ways. It's different electronics inside to accomodate different power source, cable connections and safety requirements for lithium ion powered batteries.

It is also different because 4 AA batteries can only provide so much current, so the 400R Lithium ion is 2X as bright as the AA model."

The most compelling rationale was posted by someone (whom I've forgotten) here on BF. In essence, they wrote "comparing the cost of the light and the potential cost of an accident, the cost of the light is insignificant." Which I agree with.

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Old 12-17-12, 10:49 PM   #35
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I've had the 300R for a year without any bracket or mount problems. Where I have it mounted the seatpost pinch bolt boss helps support the bracket thereby shortening the lever arm of the seatpost clamp. The metal retaining tab is on the downward side, so the light is only secured by the indent & tab; no problems with looseness. I slam a lot of down hill bumps without worry of loosing the light. The 300R has good visibility off-axis in daylight, unlike other rear lights I ride behind.


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Old 12-18-12, 03:26 AM   #36
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I have been looking at the 400R with the external battery. The price still gives me pause, so I was considering the 400R-AA (powered by a AA-battery pack), until I asked and DiNotte replied:

"The 400R-Lithium ion and 400R AA only differ in a few ways. It's different electronics inside to accomodate different power source, cable connections and safety requirements for lithium ion powered batteries.

It is also different because 4 AA batteries can only provide so much current, so the 400R Lithium ion is 2X as bright as the AA model."

The most compelling rationale was posted by someone (whom I've forgotten) here on BF. In essence, they wrote "comparing the cost of the light and the potential cost of an accident, the cost of the light is insignificant." Which I agree with.
See ..... that's where I think their engineering team needs a kick in the pants. Since I can run a 2 SSC P7 headlights off a battery holder loaded with AA cells - there's no reason they can't run one lousy light with a lower output off them.

Agreed AA cells can deliver less amperage than a Lipo cell, but if you up the voltage you need less amperage to supply the same watts. That's not even advanced electrical engineering. So my lights still need 10 watts each, but at 12V the AA batteries only need to deliver 0.75A for each light - which they can do for short periods. A single light they can run for several hours without issue. The 7.4V 2S2P battery packs used by Dinotte would require a 1.3A draw to supply a 10 watt light.

I suspect the real problem is that manufacturers are afraid to build anything thats not ultra light so we end up with small battery packs and no performance worth talking about.

Last edited by Burton; 12-18-12 at 03:58 AM.
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Old 12-27-12, 06:21 PM   #37
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A rear light on a helmet is useless since most of them are somewhat directional.

The 300R mounted on a seatpost is, IMO, the most effective. With mine (have had it since it came out), cars slow down and go way around me - gives me a chuckle every time. I know it's effective and I don't think it would be as effective if mounted down low.

As far as the mount, no issues and I use mine a fair amount. Works great. I think it's the best taillight out there.

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Old 12-28-12, 08:44 AM   #38
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I consider helmet lighting to be secondary to bike mounted lights. I would never go with a rear helmet light alone. They are shining all over the place, not necessarily where you want them to be. Can't say I've ever seen one while driving, but riding with people with rear helmet lights make it pretty obvious that they should be secondary. Same many times over with bag lights. When someone in front of you virtually disappears in the darkness, it is scary.
I agree with that.. All my bikes are outfitted with seat-post mounts for rear lights. It is optional that I grab a helmet with a rear light on it. Just like I don't have a forward helmet light all the time, but I do have bar mounted forward lights all the time.

As far as which one can be seen, IMO, that is 50-50. The one on the helmet can be seen if a car is in front of other cars and the bike two or three car lengths ahead. The helmet light of the rider is visible. When a rider turns their head, that rear light on the helmet is still visible. Just my observation. IMO, the ideal would be front and back, is to bike mounted rear light or lights, and a helmet mounted rear light..
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Old 01-04-13, 10:30 PM   #39
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Most if not all of my cycling is done with other people and I just get too way many complaints about the brightness of my rear DiNotte 140L. So it basically just sits in a drawer not being used and I'm stuck using my old PB superflash.
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Old 01-04-13, 10:49 PM   #40
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I just received my 300R today, plan to ride with it Sunday on my hill route, which involves mostly city streets. It is bright, but can't really judge yet until I get on the road. It has become very clear to me that distracted drivers are a reality that will not go away and the best I can do is have a bright light that, I hope, will attract some attention. It may not work, but it is what I can do to protect myself. I became convinced the other day when I was driving along a road I often ride and there was a vehicle in front of me weaving in the lane, often going into the well marked and wide bike lane. I pulled alongside the fellow and he had his cell phone on his steering wheel with his eyes focused on the screen. Not much may have got his attention, but .....

I do have some concerns about group rides, but on the roads, I usually am in the back anyway and there is a way to adjust the brightness on the 3ooR .... my 5cents....
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Old 01-04-13, 11:08 PM   #41
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Most if not all of my cycling is done with other people and I just get too way many complaints about the brightness of my rear DiNotte 140L. So it basically just sits in a drawer not being used and I'm stuck using my old PB superflash.
Yeah, I know, I have a similar problem with mine as well - they couldn't have put a mode on it low power enough for group rides? Just one mode of many? Really?
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Old 01-05-13, 12:41 AM   #42
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Amazing why you'd risk your life with a PB superflash because cyclists complain about the Dinotte...
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Old 01-05-13, 08:17 AM   #43
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Amazing why you'd risk your life with a PB superflash because cyclists complain about the Dinotte...
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Old 01-05-13, 08:25 AM   #44
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Amazing why you'd risk your life with a PB superflash because cyclists complain about the Dinotte...
OK, I'll bite - How is Nachoman risking his life by using the Superflash?
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Old 01-05-13, 09:23 AM   #45
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Yeah, I know, I have a similar problem with mine as well - they couldn't have put a mode on it low power enough for group rides? Just one mode of many? Really?
Would the OFF mode work for you? For those times you're actually in group rides I mean. I'm assuming that everyone else has lights so I can't see that being an issue unless you were continuously trailing the group - at which point the brightness shouldn't bother anyone.
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Old 01-05-13, 11:31 AM   #46
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Quick test of the 300r this morning .... wife was behind me about 50 feet. She said she could not ride behind me because the 300r is too distracting/bright. Since I do few group rides, not too worried and if it is a problem, then I will switch to my Radbot 1000, which I intend to keep mounted on the bike.
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Old 01-05-13, 12:17 PM   #47
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Would the OFF mode work for you? For those times you're actually in group rides I mean. I'm assuming that everyone else has lights so I can't see that being an issue unless you were continuously trailing the group - at which point the brightness shouldn't bother anyone.
If you don't understand why a tail light that spends half the riding time in the OFF position is not effective as a tail light...it's unlikely explaining why would help.
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Old 01-05-13, 01:20 PM   #48
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If you don't understand why a tail light that spends half the riding time in the OFF position is not effective as a tail light...it's unlikely explaining why would help.
I personally run with marker lights front and back - in addition to my regular headlight and tail lights - just for the situations you described. So you're right - an explaination would probably be lost on me. I just turn the offending set off myself.
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Old 01-05-13, 01:30 PM   #49
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OK, I'll bite - How is Nachoman risking his life by using the Superflash?
Presumably Nachoman purchased a $200 Dinotte light because of its superior visibility, and therefore a safety advantage, compared to other lights like the Superflash...
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Old 01-05-13, 10:50 PM   #50
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Where I have it mounted the seatpost pinch bolt boss helps support the bracket thereby shortening the lever arm of the seatpost clamp...I slam a lot of down hill bumps without worry of loosing the light.
I have mine mounted the same way on my Roubaix. I do think Metaluna has a point though. I had removed my light last night to swap saddles and as I was pulling out of the driveway today the 300R fell off. Luckily there was no damage but had it happened at speed, in traffic, the light could be a total loss less than a month after I got it (and I read this thread a week or two ago so I should know better LOL.) Lesson learned, make sure the metal tab is bent back in place when you remove the light. I'll probably start charging the light on the bike to reduce the chances of this happening again. To be fair to Dinotte, I'm not sure if the mount is designed to be inverted like that. If it was flipped over gravity, and bumps, would naturally keep the light in place.

As far as group rides I'd probably turn the light on medium to high steady during the day and possibly aim it down a little. I definitely would not buy a bright rear light like the 300r to take out on group rides...And I think a 300R in flash mode after dark is cruel and unusual punishment to drivers behind you. Mine goes on the low steady setting after dark and I clip a 99 cent blinky to my saddle bag.
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