bruce19

I have AL Masi and a steel Guru road bikes. They both weigh a tad under 18 lbs w/o stuff like tool kit. I like both of them and have no real issues. But, I'm thinking of buying a CF bike. The Masi will be with me forever (long story) so the Guru will likely go. My LBS owner and friend sells several brands of bikes but his main one is Trek. He is suggesting that if I want to go CF I consider a Domane at about $3500 w/Ultegra 11 sp. He rode a Domane for a couple years and then went to an Emonda this year. He does this every two years. He says he misses his Domane. I have several questions. Wondering if members here have any experience with the two models. Wondering if there are other brands that are a little more "exotic" for similar money. And, generally, if there is a noticeable difference in climbing with a CF bike at say, 16 lbs., as opposed to either of my other bikes at their weight. Not concerned about speed so much as ease of effort. Which, of course, could easily relate to speed as well. Or anything else about CF that I don't know that I don't know.

Dudelsack 

If this were the 41 I'd tell you not to leave it out in the sun or it will asplode.

But it's not, so I won't.

obed7

I don't think you are going to get the Domane 5.2 under 16 lbs.
I am not sure what mine weights....but it is a really nice ride.

Carbonfiberboy 

The weight won't make nearly as much difference as the smoothness and stiffness. You'll notice more difference on the third mountain pass than on the first.

MinnMan

I don't think you'll notice the difference climbing, except maybe if the gearing is different. But the ride will definitely feel different.

geometry is key. The Edmonda and the domane are quite distinct. Make sure that the bike/model feels right.

As to other brands, there are many. I love my Felt

bruce19

Unless I've confused the model, Trek lists it at 16.29 lbs.

obed7

I have not visited their website lately, but they did not list bike weights in the past...if I remember I will weigh mine when I get home this evening...
make your purchased based on how the bike feels to you...
when I bought my Domane... i test rode all the major brands endurance performance bikes... Trek, Specialized, Cannondale, and several of the others... the Domane just felt the best to me... a friend was looking at the same time I was and test rode the same bikes... he chose the specialized...each of us is happy with the bike we bought...as far as "exotic' goes, I do not care what anyone else ride, if no one has the bike I like best or if everyone has the bike I like best... I ride a bike because I like it. 3 of my bikes are CF, the other is steel...I ride what feels good to me. each of my bikes is a different brand, so brand does not sell me either, feel does.

qcpmsame 

Bruce,
The Domane is Trek's endurance model, it has the Isospeed decoupler, the Emonda is their light weight climber's special. You could get pretty close to your target weight, but it would be expensive. That Domane is one nice bicycle, especially at the component level you are looking at. RVAV, in the road Forum has a top of the line Emonda, you might see what he has to say, and Tigat and Oldn'slow here, have the Project One Treks. I'll be interested in hearing their, and your thoughts about them.

Bill

bruce19

Thanks for all the info. I should have defined what "exotic" means to me. In addition to all the mechanical/technical qualities of a bike, I'm looking for one that "speaks to me" aesthetically. When I go to the garage and look at my Masi or Ducati...they do. The Guru is really nice but doesn't have that quality. I have to say, the Domane that was at my LBS might have that quality. It's black with a tad of red. Basic black seems to win me over a lot. One obstacle might be the issue of selling my Guru. It's a really nice bike and I'm not going to give it away. I'm looking forward to more info here so I can sort things out.

FWIW my friend and LBS owner, Steve, has already offered to let me take the bike for some "testing."

Jarrett2

I've got a nice CF bike and looking at steel bikes now. I guess the grass is always greener

bruce19

I think part of my motivation is that I've never owned a CF bike. If I didn't have to, I wouldn't part with the Guru. It's a Columbus Spirit frame w/SRAM Red crank and derailleurs. It has Rival brake set. I'm also thinking an 11-sp. might be interesting. I bought it from a club member about 1 1/2 yrs. ago. It had been ridden twice by her. She races and is sponsored. Often gets bikes given to her. I think this didn't fit quite right or didn't have the feel she likes or something. I do know that Guru sells the frame for $2200 and it is pretty light. I weighed it w/o the tool bag but with a mirror, computer, pump, blinkie light and it came to 18 lbs. Maybe it would come to 17 1/2 lbs without that stuff? Nothing wrong with it. I've just got an itch that might have to be scratched.

JohnJ80

I just built a steel bike with a custom frame that is 16.3 lbs and I think I can get it to around 16 lbs. I'll tell you this - it climbs better than my 2007 CF bike did but it has nothing to do with the material and everything to do with the fit and position on the bike.

J.

MinnMan

I dunno, it sounds like you love that Guru. CF is truly great and I love mine, as I said, but don't sell a bike you love just because there is something sexy out there that has an air of mystery. Be sure the bike you get suits you more than the Guru.

Or blow your savings and your children's inheritance and buy the new bike without selling the old. That's surely the best thing to do.

MinnMan

I know this is a non-sequitor, but so be it. The other day at a rest stop, a riding friend was showing off his $15k Project One. Another friend said, wistfully, "$15k for a bike? I guess you're not married, huh?"

RonH

Never owned a Trek but have owned 2 Cannondales. Take a close look at Cannondale SuperSix EVO carbon Ultegra.
I love my SuperSix.

StanSeven

Most companies list weight without pedals. So if you add pedals, cages, and a computer, plan on another 0.75 lbs or so.

zonatandem

Get one before you are to old to enjoy it!
Have 23,000+ miles on my c/f single and 40,000+ miles on our c/f custom tandem.
Yes, at ages 82 and 80 we still pedal TWOgether!

Mobile 155

Most of the Major CF bikes are of equal quality so a lot depends on how you like the way they look and the components they come with. The Domane is like a Specialized Rubaix or a Giant Defy. They are supposed to be more comfortable for long distances. The Madone, Emoda is like a Specialized Tarmac or Venge or a Giant TCR. Keeping that in mind you can get a bit more Exotic sticking with your Masi brand and going to CF. Masi Bikes - Evoluzione - Evoluzione Ultegra You could also go with Bianchi: Infinito CV Ultegra Compact | Bianchi USA Or Pinarello. But to me maybe the most exotic looking is the Look: Look Cycle 566 Ultegra Bike 2013 Review Road Bikes/Bicycles And remember GURU makes CF bikes as well.

bruce19

Thanks. I had forgotten that. BTW I went back and looked for the source of the 16.29 lbs weight for the Domane and couldn't find it. But, I did find a 16.9 lb. listing on something that I think was called the Trek Superstore. I also find it interesting that my Guru steel weighs in at exactly 18 lbs. with all that stuff you listed. And, I use Speedplay Chromemoly pedals, that I am told are heavy. So, maybe it weighs around 17 1/4 lbs or so naked. Not a big difference of course. The unknown is how the Domane feels on the road so I will be riding it soon. Maybe next week.

bruce19

Thanks. This is good info. The LBS owner is also really into fitting people to bikes. He invested a ton of money into some advanced tech bike and computer system. Then he asked me to be his trial dummy and did hours of fitting with me, including saddle pressure mapping. Did it for free so he could practice with the new equipment. Point is I have a ton of personal stats and dimensions so I can match all of it with the geometry of a given bike. I was surprised to find that so far the Domane in a 54 comes closest to TT, Stack & Reach numbers.

qcpmsame 

Bruce,
Are you wanting lowest possible weight, for climbing, or an endurance geometry, but light weight? Just so I don't confuse things, or stick my foot in my mouth.

Bill

JohnJ80

One of the claimed innovations to the Domane is the elastomer that is between the seat tube and the top tube and allows some frame flex for compliance in the ride.

If the geometry of your current bikes are to you liking, then you can pretty easily replicate the Domane's compliance by a judicious choice of seat post and saddle. Ritchey has some seat posts (FlexLogic) out that were designed to do just that - and I can verify that they do an excellent job - and are very light too. So I think you can replicate the "new" features found in the Domane without a lot of problem. That done, there is nothing that is different about a Domane over any other particular bike.

So to my mind, that leaves the geometry. If you have a frame that can be used to make a lightweight bike and you are very happy with the geometry, then component selection choices can fine tune the rest of it.

That all said, it seems to me you really want to buy this bike and the reasoning isn't necessarily rational. If so, just go buy it. If you're looking for rational reasons to buy it, there probably aren't a whole lot that justify a $3500 purchase just for a carbon frame.

J.

bruce19

Bill,

To try to answer you and JohnJ80.....my Guru is pretty close to the geometry that works for me without mods. The Domane numbers are so close to my TT, Stack & Reach it could be a "made for me" geometry. But, really, there's nothing wrong with the Guru. I've owned and ridden everything but CF and I am told that this particular bike will feel crisper and more responsive. Also am told it will make climbing feel easier. Since I actually like climbs but am climbing challenged I thought this might be a particularly beneficial quality. FWIW, at age 69 I am 10 lbs over cycling weight and have lost power to age. Not unusual. By season's end I'm hoping to weigh in at around 178 lbs, what I weighed at the end of Basic at Ft. Jackson in 1969. At the beginning of a season I am usually 2-3 mph slower on climbs than most of the B riders. By season's end I will be in the front 1/4 or so. The feel of the ride, especially climbing, is more important to me than the weight.

JohnJ80.....having owned 5 Ducatis, a slew of cars like Corvette, Lotus, Audi, BMW, etc. I know the absence of rational decisions and you are right. Rationality is merely a facade in this case. What I am curious about is the feel of the CF as opposed to AL or steel. I will definitely be trying before buying. I might go take a test ride next week. It should be interesting.

JohnJ80

I guess I've not found much difference in frame materials. I have two steel bikes after retiring a carbon fiber frame (circa 2007). Both are custom frames with one sort of custom and the other full custom. The full custom one has a carbon Enve 2.0 fork. I cannot tell much of a difference between the carbon frame and the steel frame/carbon fork in terms of frame material. I can, however, feel a huge difference due to the geometry.

The carbon frames is a compact geometry with a high BB, short chain stays, short trail. It's a very "responsive" to the point of almost twitchy, handling bike. Because I have long legs, long torso and short arms, it's probably a touch long for me in the top tube giving me a shorter stem than I would really like to have. The custom steel bike I now ride has taken those things into account and is built on the frame geometry that used to be used for the stage races like TdF etc.. performance based but intended to be for a long ride.

The difference in the two bikes due to geometry is significant. The difference in performance due to frame materials is insignificant. I have the Ritchey seat post I mentioned earlier, carbon bars and carbon fork. Right out of the gate this year before any base miles, my average speed is almost 1mph faster than my speed at the end of last year. Climbing is significantly faster and easier etc... on the custom steel over the stock carbon frame.

So I don't think the material matters anywhere near as much as the geometry. If the geometry between the two bikes is virtually the same, then I don't think I'd expect much from that. The Domane elastomer is nice (my daughter tells me - she has a women's version but in AL) but that compliance can be handled in other ways too.

J.

Mobile 155

Bruce19, N+1 is an infection that can only be cured by the +1. IMHO. I started with a steel bike, got an aluminum bike, got a Scandium bike, sold the steel bike, got a CF bike and sold the aluminum bike. The all ride different. None worse than the other but different. At one point I bought a 91 Klein road bike and sold every other bike but the CF. I have upgraded the components on the Klein to match the Tarmac so they shift the same. The Tarmac climbs better any day. But it is also lighter. Now I have enough parts to start building another bike since the N+1 bug delivered a mtb in the mix. And what am I thinking of building? A Steel century bike. So in reality there is no cure for N+1. If you don't get the CF bike you will always wonder what it would have been like. Just saying.