Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Fifty Plus (50+) Share the victories, challenges, successes and special concerns of bicyclists 50 and older. Especially useful for those entering or reentering bicycling.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 02-18-07, 09:05 PM   #1
tenpas
Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sheboygan, WI (actually, rural Oostburg)
Bikes: 2000 Litespeed Classic; OLD Road bike - old Panasonic w/Ultegra 600; Trek 930 Off-Road.
Posts: 41
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Do You Count Trainer Miles?

After giving up on running in the cold (single digits to below zero by 20 degrees for several weeks), I broke down and got a bike trainer - Cycleops2 fluid trainer. I am in the 'frozen tundra', and my cutoff is about 45F.

After being on the trainer for several weeks, I am wondering how many people call 'trainer miles' into their annual mileage total. That would definitely help my annuals, but don't know if this is the 'ethical' thing to do. After all, the fluid trainer is supposed to be very close to the feel of the road for energy expenditure. Or do you only count the 'road or off-road miles' and not trainer miles.

Thoughts?

Thanks.
tenpas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-07, 09:33 PM   #2
BluesDawg
just keep riding
 
BluesDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Milledgeville, Georgia
Bikes: 2015 Specialized AWOL Comp frameset (custom build), 2015 Zukas custom road, 2014 Specialized Crave Pro 29, 2003 KHS Milano Tandem, 1986 Nishiki Cadence rigid MTB, 1980ish Fuji S-12S
Posts: 13,251
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
No. I think trainers provide great excercise (maybe more than riding) and help develop strength and skills for cycling, but I think it is silly to count the distance your wheel moves while attached to a trainer as mileage. If you must keep track of everything, count the time you spend on the trainer. If you just cannot stop yourself from pretending you are riding miles on your trainer, at least list them as an aside, not as part of your total mileage.
But that is just my opinion. I know that many others think differently.
BluesDawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-07, 09:35 PM   #3
doctor j
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Central Louisiana
Bikes:
Posts: 2,892
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
I gave up riding in the great out of doors when temps reached the mid to upper 40's. Also the switch to Standard Time eliminated my after-work rides.

I have access to an exercise room with a Diamondback 1100R recumbent stationary with all sorts of controls and data output for resistance, calories, time etc. I've been recording those miles in my log, but I'm not sure, either, whether to include those miles with my great-out-of-doors miles or not. Even with a reasonable resistance dialed in, it's like riding with no wind at optimum temperature on perfectly level, perfectly smooth roads. I'm inclined to believe that these miles aren't equivalent to actual bike miles, but I also believe that they should count in some manner toward the annual total. I suspect that some factor, such as 0.7 to 0.9 should be applied, but I'm not sure how to arrive at an accurate factor. However, I can tell that the indoor spinning is keeping my legs in shape and my weight in check and keeping me somewhat sane until Spring arrives.

By the way, I was up in Madison, Wisconsin (a/k/a the "frozen north") last week on business. The word "cold" falls short and fails miserably at describing the conditions I experienced (I'm southern boy; live in central Louisiana and work in northwest Arkansas). Google "A Southerner Moves Up North". I did visit the Budget Bicycle Center in Madison, the used shop and the new shop. I was amazed, especially at the number of used bikes available, about 2,100.

So let's see how others weigh in on trainer miles.
doctor j is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-18-07, 11:07 PM   #4
Garfield Cat
Senior Member
 
Garfield Cat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
Bikes: Cervelo Prodigy
Posts: 6,065
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 60 Post(s)
Keep track of trainer miles and actual road miles. This would be helpful data for you. Count anything you want, but keep them separate.
Garfield Cat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 04:42 AM   #5
roadbuzz
Just ride.
 
roadbuzz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: C-ville, Va
Bikes:
Posts: 3,246
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I count them. I track mileage and time on the bike for the purpose of measuring where I'm at in conditioning, so that time counts. I classify them, like any ride, according to the goal, e.g. base, LT intervals, etc. That being the case, trainer rides never get classified as recreational, i.e. riding just for fun.
roadbuzz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 06:28 AM   #6
stapfam
Time for a change.
 
stapfam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: 6 miles inland from the coast of Sussex, in the South East of England
Bikes: Dale MT2000. Bianchi FS920 Kona Explosif. Giant TCR C. Boreas Ignis. Pinarello Fp Uno.
Posts: 19,915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
If you are in the situation where you cannot ride for 4 months of the year due to weather- you should count your trainer miles-providing you are working at them and not just turning the wheels round.

Trainers may not give as much enjoyment as Road miles but if that is all you can do for extended periods of the year-count them
__________________
How long was I in the army? Five foot seven.


Spike Milligan
stapfam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 07:01 AM   #7
DnvrFox
Banned.
 
DnvrFox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Bikes:
Posts: 20,916
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
This thread might also prove helpful:

Do "Trainer Miles" count?
DnvrFox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 10:35 AM   #8
BetweenRides
Dog Chaser
 
BetweenRides's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Chicagoland
Bikes: Lemond 853; Merlin Cyrene; Bike Friday Pocket Rocket, Kona Jake the Snake Cross, Trek 8000 MTB
Posts: 515
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I count them. Of course I'm doing the majority on a Computrainer with realistic power & weight parameters loaded, as well as 'real' courses loaded in the system. I challenge anyone here to prove these miles aren't as hard or harder than any ride outside...

I too live in an area that prohibits outside riding for 3-4 months.
BetweenRides is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 10:43 AM   #9
maddmaxx 
Small Member
 
maddmaxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Bikes: Leader home built hardtail, Diamondback Response
Posts: 7,136
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 372 Post(s)
Why not count trainer miles. The rider does the work doesn't he (she).
Do you divide road miles by 2 or 3 because they are easier than off road miles.
do you double miles up hills.
There is no real way to compare miles between different riders so count them if you wish or not.
maddmaxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 11:16 AM   #10
Digital Gee
I need more cowbell.
 
Digital Gee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Reno, Nevada
Bikes: 2015 Specialized Sirrus Elite, 2012 Masi Evoluzione
Posts: 8,111
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Count 'em. There are no rules. Make up your own. Count 'em.
__________________
2015 Sirrus Elite
2012 Masi Evoluzione

Proud member of the original Club Tombay
Digital Gee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 11:31 AM   #11
Mojo Slim
Lincoln, CA
 
Mojo Slim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Lincoln, CA
Bikes: 94 Giant ATX 760, 2001 Biachi Eros, 2005 Giant OCR2 Composite +
Posts: 2,229
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I don't count trainer miles or miles at the gym. If it ain't road, it ain't real.
__________________
Truth is stranger than reality.
'96 Giant ATX 760 MTB
'01 Bianchi Eros
'05 Giant OCR Llimited Carbon Fiber + upgrades
Mojo Slim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 11:42 AM   #12
oilman_15106
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 6,900
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Here is a thought. Have one bike with a rear wheel computer pickup so it will log mileage on the trainer. So how is it if you ride for an hour on the trainer at high rpm, say 90, your mileage stinks. Like 12-15 miles. And on a moderate hilly road ride you can do almost 20 miles in an hour? Just a thought, any ideas?

Count trainer time as a way to know if I am keeping on track toward my fittness goals.
oilman_15106 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 12:10 PM   #13
jmccain
Senior Member
 
jmccain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Fort Worth, TX
Bikes: Kvale, Peugeot, Cervelo, Bridgestone
Posts: 597
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
On my trainer (rollers with a headwind unit), I sweat buckets, my heart rate is high, my legs hurt (during and after), I lose weight, and the miles seem much more difficult because of the boredom factor.

Road miles are easy in comparision.
jmccain is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 12:47 PM   #14
nmichell
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Fort Collins, CO
Bikes: '05 Salsa La Raza, '13 Aluboo (bamboo) SS, '12 DaVinci Grand Junction tandem
Posts: 359
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Sure , I count them -- but strangely, they're always zero. Might be because my computer only reads from the front wheel.
nmichell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 01:02 PM   #15
p8rider
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: North Carolina Piedmont
Bikes: 1984 Peugeot P8; 2006 Trek 5200
Posts: 766
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I do not consider "trainer" miles as something to be counted with riding miles. Part of what makes it riding is the happenstance of what you find out on the road or trail. Cold, windy, wet, or perfect, the changes brought about by different road surfaces as you ride etc. All of these make an actual riding experience much more meaningful to me.
Trainers provide great exercise, but don't come near to an experience like riding.
Last week on NPR there was an interview with a person whose family had purchased the new Nintendo Wii. She was lamenting the false reality it was creating for her children. They were using a tennis program and playing sets of tennis. She said they truly worked up a sweat and got a pretty good workout. When she wanted them to quit they complained that they wanted ,"just one more set". At this point she asked them whether they thought that by playing tennis with the wii, they could actually play tennis? They replied that, yes it was the equivalent of playing tennis. Her point of course was that they had mastered serve and volley on an electronic game, but put them onto a true tennis court with a racquet and she doubted they would be able to get a serve inbounds.
Sort of my take on the trainer versus really riding.
p8rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 02:11 PM   #16
BetweenRides
Dog Chaser
 
BetweenRides's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Chicagoland
Bikes: Lemond 853; Merlin Cyrene; Bike Friday Pocket Rocket, Kona Jake the Snake Cross, Trek 8000 MTB
Posts: 515
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by p8rider
I do not consider "trainer" miles as something to be counted with riding miles. Part of what makes it riding is the happenstance of what you find out on the road or trail. Cold, windy, wet, or perfect, the changes brought about by different road surfaces as you ride etc. All of these make an actual riding experience much more meaningful to me.
Trainers provide great exercise, but don't come near to an experience like riding.
Last week on NPR there was an interview with a person whose family had purchased the new Nintendo Wii. She was lamenting the false reality it was creating for her children. They were using a tennis program and playing sets of tennis. She said they truly worked up a sweat and got a pretty good workout. When she wanted them to quit they complained that they wanted ,"just one more set". At this point she asked them whether they thought that by playing tennis with the wii, they could actually play tennis? They replied that, yes it was the equivalent of playing tennis. Her point of course was that they had mastered serve and volley on an electronic game, but put them onto a true tennis court with a racquet and she doubted they would be able to get a serve inbounds.
Sort of my take on the trainer versus really riding.
I see your point, but I don't think the wii analogy fits. When I'm riding the computrainer at the LBS Fitness center, I'm on my bike, using my shoes, kit, gloves and water bottles. I have fans blowing wind in my face, our 'course' is displayed on a large screen in front of us, and I'm surrounded by other riders. The computrainer knows my power output and adjusts the load based on incline %, headwind and even drafting. There is an element of competition present because of the displayed mph, distance, cadence and power. We do drills for High/Low cadence, pedaling efficiency, power and sprints. Doing these classes actually improves my fitness, power and real cycling efficiency. When we start up the group rides in early April, I will hit the ground running, far surpassing my normal abilities. The only thing missing is long rides, because even with the artificial environment of the CT, it still sucks riding indoors for more than 2 hours.
BetweenRides is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 02:40 PM   #17
p8rider
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: North Carolina Piedmont
Bikes: 1984 Peugeot P8; 2006 Trek 5200
Posts: 766
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BetweenRides
I see your point, but I don't think the wii analogy fits. When I'm riding the computrainer at the LBS Fitness center, I'm on my bike, using my shoes, kit, gloves and water bottles. I have fans blowing wind in my face, our 'course' is displayed on a large screen in front of us, and I'm surrounded by other riders. The computrainer knows my power output and adjusts the load based on incline %, headwind and even drafting. There is an element of competition present because of the displayed mph, distance, cadence and power. We do drills for High/Low cadence, pedaling efficiency, power and sprints. Doing these classes actually improves my fitness, power and real cycling efficiency. When we start up the group rides in early April, I will hit the ground running, far surpassing my normal abilities. The only thing missing is long rides, because even with the artificial environment of the CT, it still sucks riding indoors for more than 2 hours.
I am not familiar with this computrainer system at an LBS fitness center. It sounds about as perfect as can be and I'd love to try it. I have no doubt that these classes do improve your fitness, power and real cycling efficiency. I don't say in my piece that you, or anyone else cannot count these exercise sessions as "miles". I only state that I do not consider them as miles. I don't consider the computer golf simulators with full course scenarios using your own clubs etc. as being the equivalent of truly playing the course at Pebble Beach either.

Last edited by p8rider; 02-19-07 at 03:15 PM.
p8rider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 02:48 PM   #18
Digital Gee
I need more cowbell.
 
Digital Gee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Reno, Nevada
Bikes: 2015 Specialized Sirrus Elite, 2012 Masi Evoluzione
Posts: 8,111
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hey, we're over fifty, right? We've reached the age where we can do what we want! It's a win-win. Some count the miles, some don't, and it's all good!

That said, I'm surprised no one brought up the analogy of cybersex. Using that analogy, I'd have to side with p8rider here. Of course, that's just based on what I've heard. I'm not speaking from experience.
__________________
2015 Sirrus Elite
2012 Masi Evoluzione

Proud member of the original Club Tombay
Digital Gee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 02:48 PM   #19
BluesDawg
just keep riding
 
BluesDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Milledgeville, Georgia
Bikes: 2015 Specialized AWOL Comp frameset (custom build), 2015 Zukas custom road, 2014 Specialized Crave Pro 29, 2003 KHS Milano Tandem, 1986 Nishiki Cadence rigid MTB, 1980ish Fuji S-12S
Posts: 13,251
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
I agree with all the arguements about what a worthwile, strenuous and beneficial activity trainer riding is. But that still does not mean that it is miles on a bicycle. If I climbed Mt. Everest or swam the English Channel it would be a great physical and mental feat. But in the course of doing it, I would have logged exactly zero miles on a bicycle, same as when I ride my trainer.
But then, the only meaningful measurement to me is not miles or speed or time, but holes in my belt.
BluesDawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 03:19 PM   #20
Trsnrtr
Nefarious Reprobate
 
Trsnrtr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Central Illinois
Bikes: Colnago CX, Giant Propel, Co-Motion Supremo
Posts: 8,337
Mentioned: 16 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 812 Post(s)
I keep track of trainer miles but don't add them to my road miles. I agree that trainer miles can be tougher than outdoor miles, but c'mon, it's not really bicycle riding, is it?
__________________
Dennis T
Trsnrtr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 03:43 PM   #21
Beverly
Senior Member ??
 
Beverly's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Englewood,Ohio
Bikes: 2007 Trek Madone 5.0 WSD - 2007 Trek 4300 WSD - 2008 Trek 520 - 2014 Catrike Trail
Posts: 5,094
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I track road, trail and trainer miles separately. Of course my miles on the trainer are usually low as I can't do more than an hour before I'm bored to tears. I really prefer running on the treadmill over the trainer in cold weather.
__________________
=============================================================

Enjoy the little things in life, for one day you may look back and realize they were the big things.
-- Antonio Smith
Beverly is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 07:50 PM   #22
Red Baron
Senior Member
 
Red Baron's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: On a Road in Central Bluegrass KY
Bikes: Not enough
Posts: 1,249
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Relative to what my A** sits on I go the same distance so I counts 'em
__________________
**Fate is a fickle thing, and in the end the true measure of a person is not fate itself, but how they master it**
Red Baron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 07:58 PM   #23
Jet Travis
Ride Daddy Ride
 
Jet Travis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Villa Incognito
Bikes: 1983 Trek 720; 1983 Trek 620; 1989 Gi Cannondale Bad Boy Ultra; LeMond Victoire; Bike Friday Pocket Rocket Pro
Posts: 2,648
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digital Gee
Count 'em. There are no rules. Make up your own. Count 'em.
Heck, DG, I don't even count my road miles. What does that make me?
__________________
"Light it up, Popo." --Levi Leipheimer
Jet Travis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 08:10 PM   #24
JanMM
rebmeM roineS
 
JanMM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: In Central IN
Bikes: RANS V3, RANS V-Rex, RANS Screamer
Posts: 13,397
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
What's the linear distance you've travelled on a trainer? Zip.
JanMM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-19-07, 09:13 PM   #25
oldspark
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Peterson Iowa
Bikes: Trek 7000 and a Trek 1200
Posts: 765
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jet Travis
Heck, DG, I don't even count my road miles. What does that make me?
+1-seems like some of you people are selling the bike trainer short, very possible to raise your fitness level over the winter months by "getting after it".
oldspark is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:13 AM.