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Old 05-19-07, 10:09 PM   #51
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The bars on Ruby don't look to be that far off where I have them on Kermit. I'm glad to hear your comfort level is rising.
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Old 05-19-07, 10:29 PM   #52
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There always seems to be a ballancing act between having the nose of the saddle too high. (unhappy boys) and too low,. (slipping slightly forward at unexpected intervals)

My experience is that moving the saddle forward takes weight off the hands and also allows just a touch of extra down at the saddle nose.

It actually helps to keep a notebook of critical demensions for the bike. Bar to ground, Saddle nose to bar, Saddle nose to ground. It also helps to keep track of the STI lever position and bar angle.

You might experiment with rotating the bar slightly to raise or lower the hoods.

Its hard to tell but I think that in Stapfams pictures that his hoods are rotated more downward since the raising of the stem. All of this affects the angles of your hands and ultimately comfort and there does not seem to be any hard and fast rules to follow from rider to rider.
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Old 05-19-07, 10:43 PM   #53
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Just came back from reading a thread on the mechanics forum about hand pain. Sheldon Brown gives a link there to his article on pain. Good info there.
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Old 05-20-07, 04:15 PM   #54
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Well, two tweaks forward, one tweak backward.

Got out on the bike today, and immediately got some numbness and tingling in my hands, and the same old lower back pain came back right away. A few miles into it, and things were feeling okay, but something was missing, because I wasn't having fun. Or as much fun. Still having some fun. I felt very sluggish out there. Didn't help that it was cold and cloudy, either. Winds gusting to 18 mph.

I'm beginning to wonder if part of this is me sort of having over-ridden the new bike so far? Someone mentioned that early in this thread as a possiblity and I think that might have been today's problem. I think I need to force myself to take a day off. I hate that idea, because I'm so loving the new wheels.

But after just a little over 5 miles I came home. My head wants to ride and ride, but my body seems to think otherwise today.
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Old 05-20-07, 04:55 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by maddmaxx

My experience is that moving the saddle forward takes weight off the hands and also allows just a touch of extra down at the saddle nose.
Yes, moving the saddle forward is going to shorten the distance from your body center to the hand position. So that is going to push you upright a bit, altering your weight distribution - taking some away from the hands and putting more upon your saddle.

However it will also alter several "body geometry" angles. The angle of your arms relative to your shoulders, your legs relative to your body. This can affect your knees, shoulders, hands, back.

When I've played around with these settings, some of the effects on my body can't be determined until I've ridden several times.
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Old 05-20-07, 05:17 PM   #56
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Originally Posted by Digital Gee
Well, two tweaks forward, one tweak backward.

Got out on the bike today, and immediately got some numbness and tingling in my hands, and the same old lower back pain came back right away. A few miles into it, and things were feeling okay, but something was missing, because I wasn't having fun. Or as much fun. Still having some fun. I felt very sluggish out there. Didn't help that it was cold and cloudy, either. Winds gusting to 18 mph.

I'm beginning to wonder if part of this is me sort of having over-ridden the new bike so far? Someone mentioned that early in this thread as a possiblity and I think that might have been today's problem. I think I need to force myself to take a day off. I hate that idea, because I'm so loving the new wheels.

But after just a little over 5 miles I came home. My head wants to ride and ride, but my body seems to think otherwise today.
Listen to the body!

It took me almost 500 miles before I had the Madone dialed in. I adjusted every little thing I could find on the bike and it was the new saddle and shoes that finally made the difference.
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Old 05-20-07, 05:22 PM   #57
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Instead of riding your bike, go for a walk tomorrow, start stretching before riding and work out your upper body.
(and try to loose some weight)
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Old 05-20-07, 05:32 PM   #58
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Got beat by one post by the Brooks saddle.
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Old 05-20-07, 06:04 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by robtown
A good pair of gloves (ironman) also helps. .
+1 on the Ironman gloves. They sure solved the numb hand problem for me.
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Old 05-20-07, 08:20 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by zymans
start stretching before riding
Stretching helps me a LOT! Stopped for 5 minutes in the middle of my ride yesterday to stretch. My legs feel much better afterward.

I try to remember to do this a couple of times a day at my workplace. Pick up one leg, extend it fully, pull it up to being level, than slowly point my toes back toward me. After a few minutes of this, my legs feel great.
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Old 05-20-07, 09:34 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Bombadil
However it will also alter several "body geometry" angles. The angle of your arms relative to your shoulders, your legs relative to your body. This can affect your knees, shoulders, hands, back.
This is a good article with some advice about seat placement, and it acknowledges what you're alluding to, TB.

Peter White's advice worked for me. Some don't like it, however.

Just sayin' ...

http://www.peterwhitecycles.com/fitting.htm

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Old 05-20-07, 10:52 PM   #62
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Well Gary, I've gotten used to it now. No heart attack or stroke. So, CONGRATULATIONS. Oh, and enjoy! bk
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Old 05-20-07, 11:00 PM   #63
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Well Gary, I've gotten used to it now. No heart attack or stroke. So, CONGRATULATIONS. Oh, and enjoy! bk
Thank God. I'll sleep better tonight.
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Old 05-20-07, 11:13 PM   #64
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Maybe this will keep you up all night, dg...

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Old 05-20-07, 11:22 PM   #65
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What a fred!
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Old 05-20-07, 11:40 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by Digital Gee
... A few miles into it, and things were feeling okay, but something was missing, because I wasn't having fun. Or as much fun. Still having some fun. I felt very sluggish out there. Didn't help that it was cold and cloudy, either. Winds gusting to 18 mph.
I'm beginning to wonder if part of this is me sort of having over-ridden the new bike so far? Someone mentioned that early in this thread as a possiblity and I think that might have been today's problem. I think I need to force myself to take a day off. I hate that idea, because I'm so loving the new wheels.
But after just a little over 5 miles I came home. My head wants to ride and ride, but my body seems to think otherwise today.
part of being a frequent rider, as in 5-7 days a week, is that you're gonna go through the gamut of 'spirit' and 'energy'. takin a day off shouldn;t be looked at as 'bad', in the same breath, riding through a 'down' feeling is also a good thing.
If it doesn't feel like the best day, just meander around, stop for a caffe and a pose, ride somewhere you;ve been meaning to go see but hasn;t been convenient.
If a ride turns out to be only 5 miles, don;t worry, be happy.
One can trick oneself into an 'off-the-bike' day while still ridin. Just cruise around, picka really small gear, pick a route that is extremely safe-mostly, and let yourself get distracted enough for the time and miles to fly.
If your doin more miles than before, then your body and legs are going thru further conditioning.
Nows a good time to really pay attention to nutrition and the bod.
Lurking in the Nutrition and Training forum can often get one one thinking about good things for tunin the motor.
numbness and tinging hands - do less riding with the hands/palms cupping the bar top bends, don't stiff arm the bars. Tty a position with the fingers curled on the bar tops, or move forward to the hoods. Roll down and Bend the elbows.
If the leg muscles and joints feel fine (other than fatigue), resist screwin with the saddle fore-aft. Very small adjustments in the saddle tilt can have huge effects on what you experience. Make those adjustments as small as possible and give it somedays before further reajustments.
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Old 05-21-07, 02:19 AM   #67
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flip it
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Old 05-21-07, 06:32 PM   #68
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part of being a frequent rider, as in 5-7 days a week, is that you're gonna go through the gamut of 'spirit' and 'energy'. takin a day off shouldn;t be looked at as 'bad', in the same breath, riding through a 'down' feeling is also a good thing.
If it doesn't feel like the best day, just meander around, stop for a caffe and a pose, ride somewhere you;ve been meaning to go see but hasn;t been convenient.
If a ride turns out to be only 5 miles, don;t worry, be happy.
One can trick oneself into an 'off-the-bike' day while still ridin. Just cruise around, picka really small gear, pick a route that is extremely safe-mostly, and let yourself get distracted enough for the time and miles to fly.
If your doin more miles than before, then your body and legs are going thru further conditioning.
Nows a good time to really pay attention to nutrition and the bod.
Lurking in the Nutrition and Training forum can often get one one thinking about good things for tunin the motor.
numbness and tinging hands - do less riding with the hands/palms cupping the bar top bends, don't stiff arm the bars. Tty a position with the fingers curled on the bar tops, or move forward to the hoods. Roll down and Bend the elbows.
If the leg muscles and joints feel fine (other than fatigue), resist screwin with the saddle fore-aft. Very small adjustments in the saddle tilt can have huge effects on what you experience. Make those adjustments as small as possible and give it somedays before further reajustments.
This turned out to be excellent advice. I tricked myself into thinking it was an off-the-bike day, and just tooled around. Caught myself hammering only twice, and knocked that off in a heartbeat.

The ride was a breezy, chilly 15 miler, but NONE of my complaints of yesterday came up today. No tingling, no cramping, nothing. Just a nice ride. So, thanks for the great advice!
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Old 05-22-07, 10:32 AM   #69
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I almost didn't get on the bike yesterday, but told myself that if I wasn't enjoying it, I'd take the short (7.5 mile) loop. The first few miles were no fun--couldn't get my cadence up, just felt old and slow. But by the time I got to the short loop turn, I felt a bit better so I kept going--ended up doing 22 miles. At the end I felt better than I'd felt all day. Given the season I'm thinking of going back to early AM rides, where there's generally no wind and the temps are nice and low. OTOH, part of me likes the challenge of fighting those head- and crosswinds....I'm conflicted. Given the way my cycling obsession has developed, though, I'll probably end up riding twice a day. Perhaps I should seek professional help.
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Old 05-22-07, 10:34 AM   #70
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I almost didn't get on the bike yesterday, but told myself that if I wasn't enjoying it, I'd take the short (7.5 mile) loop. The first few miles were no fun--couldn't get my cadence up, just felt old and slow. But by the time I got to the short loop turn, I felt a bit better so I kept going--ended up doing 22 miles. At the end I felt better than I'd felt all day. Given the season I'm thinking of going back to early AM rides, where there's generally no wind and the temps are nice and low. OTOH, part of me likes the challenge of fighting those head- and crosswinds....I'm conflicted. Given the way my cycling obsession has developed, though, I'll probably end up riding twice a day. Perhaps I should seek professional help.
Check here: www.shrinkonabike.com
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Old 05-22-07, 03:30 PM   #71
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Those r-------t bikes have nice wide spacious seats Gary.I hear they now come with a beer holder on the side and chip basket.
Remember back in the 70,s,the beer holder that fit into the window slot and hung inside the car door?
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Old 05-22-07, 04:16 PM   #72
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Check here: www.shrinkonabike.com
Hey--that's not a real link!!!! Throw a drowning man a brick why don'tcha! Why, if you weren't a moderator, I'd...I'd....I'd....(splutter)
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Old 05-23-07, 10:08 AM   #73
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Maybe this will keep you up all night, dg...
Obviously not dialed-in. But, who says steel rims don't stop when wet?
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Old 05-23-07, 02:33 PM   #74
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I don't know to what extent your LBS set the bike up for you but;

Hand pain - I see you've had advice to the contrary but, move the saddle back slightly.
This will take weight off your hands and place it on your butt.
Moving the saddle back will increase your saddle to pedal distance so you will need to lower
it slightly to maintain the correct distance. This will also raise the bars relative to the saddle.
You should be able to ride controllably and comfortably in a hands on hoods position with your
hands just off the bars. That can't happen with a too-far forward saddle position.

Back pain - could be temporary, a new position you need to acclimate to. But raising the bars
will generally help somewhat. Flip the stem or move spacers from above the stem to under it.
Pushing too big a gear can increase back pain. If the pain magically goes away during your ride
it may be based on effort. Try a smaller gear and higher cadence, see what happens.

Saddle pain, numbness - Well, if the saddle is fitting well, (the width matching your sit bones) then
tilt is the next consideration. Start with a level saddle. It's counter intuitive but raising the nose often
helps with the numbness problem by placing more weight back on the sitbones and less weight forward.
It also prevents the gradual slide forward that compresses the plumbing.

Foot pain - New shoes? Don't pull the forward straps too tight, leave the toebox loose and make sure
the cleats aren't back too far (foot too far forward on the pedal).

Dialing in your position is a never ending process.
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