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  1. #1
    Senior Member trackhub's Avatar
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    Any Vermont folks here?

    As I've mentioned before, I'm in my early 50's, and I'm scoping out places for retirement. (Hopefully, someday, Please??)

    The response to my Maine questions were pretty good. So, What about Vermont? I've heard pretty much all good stuff. An ultra low crime rate, a relaxed, 'live and let live" philosophy, most people are decent, etc.

    How's taxes, cost of living, stuff like that? I've heard some towns in the "Northeast Kingdom" are pretty isolated, with some people living totally off the power grid, but I have no desire to go that far.

    Winter? Yeah, I can take winter. Got wool/fleece lined tights, good jacket, etc.

    I don't ski, but I am told that the town of Ludlow is pretty nice.

    All responses appreciated.
    "The People will believe what the Media tells them they believe". George Orwell.

  2. #2
    rck
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    trackhub-I'm not sure about how it is now but my parents retired to the Springfield, Vt area which is nearby. It was quite nice as they lived just outside of the city up in the hills with a nice view of the valley and surrounding mtns. Springfield is also close by Woodstock which is a nice area. When I was a much younger man we spent our summers in Johnson which is not far from the Stowe area but not nearly so touristy. At least not in the late 50's and early 60's. I'm unsure as to the tax situation and as I've not been back in some years also not sure of the cost of living. However, I would assume that it is no worse than any other area in New England. My sister and her husband have lived there for years and they are far from being wealthy. Good luck!

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    Quote Originally Posted by trackhub View Post

    Winter? Yeah, I can take winter. Got wool/fleece lined tights, good jacket, etc.

    I don't ski, but I am told that the town of Ludlow is pretty nice.

    All responses appreciated.
    You won't be doing much road riding, wool/fleece tights or not. My experiences are that few roads have wide shoulders, and while that's no big deal in the riding season, as there's not a ton of traffic and folks are tolerant of cyclists, in the winter the white crap AND THE ICE are all over what few shoulders exist, forcing you onto the main roadway. That's generally a bad place to be when the roads are generally twisty with a lot of curves and blind corners. If you are not prepared to partake in activities other then cycling in the winter, then perhaps a location with less snow might be more suitable.

    BTW, Ludlow is a great town, the local cycle shop, who's owner is a great guy, is Mountain Cycology. I'd suggest calling and asking them about winter cycling. I suspect the answer will evolve into "You don't ski ?, why are you coming to Vermont ?".

    Steve B

  4. #4
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lightingguy View Post
    You won't be doing much road riding, wool/fleece tights or not. My experiences are that few roads have wide shoulders, and while that's no big deal in the riding season, as there's not a ton of traffic and folks are tolerant of cyclists, in the winter the white crap AND THE ICE are all over what few shoulders exist, forcing you onto the main roadway. That's generally a bad place to be when the roads are generally twisty with a lot of curves and blind corners. If you are not prepared to partake in activities other then cycling in the winter, then perhaps a location with less snow might be more suitable.

    BTW, Ludlow is a great town, the local cycle shop, who's owner is a great guy, is Mountain Cycology. I'd suggest calling and asking them about winter cycling. I suspect the answer will evolve into "You don't ski ?, why are you coming to Vermont ?".

    Steve B
    +1
    I live about 40 miles west of the NY VT border. I love Vt to visit but if I were a non-skiier, winters would be tough. If you really want to consider it I would look at Bennington, a small town in the SW corner where you can get to NY and Mass where the roads are better for riding. I have to admit - I know nothing of the tax situation - but it is nick named the peoples republic of Vermont.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
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    I live in the NEK.
    Ludlow is a couple hrs south of NEK.
    We don't need another flatlander here complaining about how bad the dirt roads are,
    how cold it is in the winter, how high the taxes are [limited industry=higher taxes],
    how bla bla bla things are.
    I'm a Vermonta, I do what I wanta.

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    On the contrary, winter is the best riding season here. Never been swarmed by black flies on the snowmobile trails.
    Don't know enough about elsewhere to compare the riding (born, and continue to live in Springfield), but I do know lots of "flatlanders" come here for their cycling vacations.
    As for staying: taxes are high, energy costs are high, wages are low. But I imagine most people think that is the case, where ever they live.

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    Senior Member trackhub's Avatar
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    Oh, I never said I would not be willing to learn to ski. It's just that I expect to be in my 60's by this point, and it would seem kind of silly. Although I guess you can learn at any age.

    As "the peoples' Republic of Vermont", well, I live in Massachusetts now. Nothing would shock me.
    Massachusetts, better known as "Taxachusetts". I'd rather not get started on that one.

    I'm also looking at NH. Ok, no sales tax, no state income tax. But, they have what are among the highest property taxes in the country, and I am told they tax investments, including retirement plan earnings. Besides, on my visits to VT, I find I would probably be a "better fit."

    As for high energy costs, I could:

    -blow it on heat during the winter, or
    -Live in buggy, druggy Florida and blow it on Air conditioning.

    I'll take the Winter.

    martianone, you anywhere near Newark, by any chance?
    "The People will believe what the Media tells them they believe". George Orwell.

  8. #8
    Freewheel Medic pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by trackhub View Post
    ...I'm also looking at NH. Ok, no sales tax, no state income tax. But, they have what are among the highest property taxes in the country, and I am told they tax investments, including retirement plan earnings. Besides, on my visits to VT, I find I would probably be a "better fit."
    We only pay property tax and a very small percentage on income earned from dividends. Our total NH tax liability in 2008 was under 6K. The beauty of NH taxes is you decide what you'll pay by carefully choosing where you live.
    Bob
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    Senior Member trackhub's Avatar
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    Thanks Pastorbob. As I have mentioned, this is years away, and it's going to be between Vermont, NH, and Maine. All three states have their positive points. I do like a lot of things about NH.

    Portland Maine is supposed to be a great place for retirement. Not sure where I read that. Money Magazine, maybe? Once into my retirement years, I don't want do drive a motor vehicle if I don't have to.
    In portland, I could take the Amtrak Downeaster if I needed to come to Boston.

    What can some Vermonters tell me about Burlington and Montpelier?
    "The People will believe what the Media tells them they believe". George Orwell.

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    martianone, you anywhere near Newark, by any chance?[/QUOTE]


    Depends upon how you define "anywhere",
    Newark is about 50 km south.

  11. #11
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh View Post
    We only pay property tax and a very small percentage on income earned from dividends. Our total NH tax liability in 2008 was under 6K. The beauty of NH taxes is you decide what you'll pay by carefully choosing where you live.
    Please tell us where that is. I really like NH, have friends I visit there west of Manchester. Although I do like NY - the roads are great, the scenery in the Adirondacks is spectacular,but the taxes are rediculous.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

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    Hanover, NH is a great town. It's beautiful, got culture, a small town feel, it's not particularly far from anything you'll need and there's a 1st class medical center there.

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    Pedaled too far. Artkansas's Avatar
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    My family is an old Vermont family. Apparently, they sprang out of the mists in Vermont. The first records we can find is a birth in Guilford before the town kept a log of such things. The parents apparently just popped up from out of nowhere. But we left the state in 1803 to head to the frontiers of Illinois and then emigrated to the nation of Texas, then Japan and then New York.

    But I can't help you much more than that. I've only spent one day in Vermont, driving through looking at the pretty leaves and searching for maple syrup.
    "He who serves all, best serves himself" Jack London

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    I don't care if you are on a unicycle, as long as you're not using a motor to get places you get props from me. We're here to support each other. Share ideas, and motivate one another to actually keep doing it.

  14. #14
    Senior Member trackhub's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by martianone View Post
    martianone, you anywhere near Newark, by any chance?

    Depends upon how you define "anywhere",
    Newark is about 50 km south.[/QUOTE]


    Wow, you are up there a ways. I'll take a wild guess that you don't have the perpetual summer traffic jam that is a constant in North Conway, NH.
    "The People will believe what the Media tells them they believe". George Orwell.

  15. #15
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Well if you decide to locate in Vt you are required to do this ride in one day, I understand it is a state residency requirement for new Vt cyclists...

    http://www.northeastcycling.com/six_gaps.html
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  16. #16
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    I've lived in Vermont for the last 25 years untill moving across Lake Champlain to New York this past year. It really is an exceptional state in many ways. There are still only 620,000 or so residents, you see your state senators and reps on a daily basis in the grocery stores etc. In fact, it is still easy to contact the Washington contingent (Leahy, Sanders and Welch). How many people can say they have that much access to their politicians? Crime is low, schools are exceptional though costly. There is something inherent in the fiber of Vermonters that seperate them from the rest of New England. Having been a seperate entity from the U.S. early on, they have developed a strong identity that questions central authority. Historically, Vermont has been an agricultural based culture verses New Hampshires more northern industrial background, hence the liberalism as contrasted to the real conservative bent of New Hampshire ,i.e capitalism etc. Although things are changing, I'm trying to give some background. Maine has always intrigued me and seems to blend the two others quite well given its size. As far as bicycling goes, I have to say that Vermont roads are not the best as residents travel far to work and drive fast on roads that are not well maintained and have narrow shoulders. Currently, I'm still working in Vermont but have moved to the Adirondack region of New York. The cycling is just great, I can go for 30 mile rides and only see 8-10 cars and be on good roads. I've also got Lake Champlain across the street (cheaper on this side then in Vermont) for sailing , so life is ok but I am remiss that I am no longer a Vermonter and to have given up those green license plates.

  17. #17
    Freewheel Medic pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh
    We only pay property tax.... The beauty of NH taxes is you decide what you'll pay by carefully choosing where you live.
    Quote Originally Posted by cyclinfool
    Please tell us where that is. I really like NH, have friends I visit there west of Manchester. Although I do like NY - the roads are great, the scenery in the Adirondacks is spectacular,but the taxes are ridiculous.
    Here's how you select how much you want to pay for taxes in NH:

    First a little about property taxes in NH: Remember that NH has no income tax and only charges sales tax on meals, lodging, and the transfer of real estate. NH is governed by local towns, each of which set their own property tax rate. On top of that school districts set their particular rate. Added to that is a very small county tax (funds the sheriff, the county nursing and veteran's home, and not much else). The final piece of the property tax puzzle is the NH State portion.

    So if you are a homeowner, you can first select the town with the rate you find as reasonable. Second try to do the same with the school district (often the district is just the town, but in my case I live in a regional district). Once you do this, by not having lake frontage, lake access, or a view, your taxes are lower. Finally, decide on what value house you need. A $200,000 home, if it meets your needs, pays less taxes then the $500,000 home.

    This is how an individual decides what he or she will pay in taxes in NH.

    Or you can decide to pay no taxes in NH by renting (I know the tax is in the rent, but rents are generally very reasonable).

    Quote Originally Posted by TrackHub
    Once into my retirement years, I don't want do drive a motor vehicle if I don't have to. In portland, I could take the Amtrak Downeaster if I needed to come to Boston.
    We have an express bus that leaves our town about 6-8 times a day that takes you to South Station or Logan for $40 round trip. Living as car free as possible in NH would mean living in Concord, Manchester, or Nashua (and maybe Keene and Lebanon/Hanover).
    Bob
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  18. #18
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Addison View Post
    I've lived in Vermont for the last 25 years untill moving across Lake Champlain to New York this past year. Currently, I'm still working in Vermont but have moved to the Adirondack region of New York. The cycling is just great.
    Cycling in the Daks is truely great. How far up the lake are you - across from Burlington?
    There is a great supported Adirondack ride coming up in Aug called the Ididaride - out of North Creek on the Hudson, I did it last year and plan on doing it again this year. It keeps getting bigger as the word gets out. A great ride, well done and a nice party at the end. Come join us.
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  19. #19
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    i'm about 10 miles south of Burlington right at the ferry landing in Essex, NY. You seem to be traveling a section of the Adirondacks I don't know much about. My range is in the east and I typically stay this side of Lake Placid. A good ride for me is over to the High Peaks region. It gets pretty remote in the places you write of, I haven't really explored over there yet. I've enjoyed keeping up with your exploits, I'm on here a fair bit, just don't say much

  20. #20
    gone ride'n cyclinfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Addison View Post
    i'm about 10 miles south of Burlington right at the ferry landing in Essex, NY. You seem to be traveling a section of the Adirondacks I don't know much about. My range is in the east and I typically stay this side of Lake Placid. A good ride for me is over to the High Peaks region. It gets pretty remote in the places you write of, I haven't really explored over there yet. I've enjoyed keeping up with your exploits, I'm on here a fair bit, just don't say much
    Actually that area around North Creek is not all that remote.
    Our club will sponsor a ride out of North Creek on the 8th of Aug that will follow 28 to Blue Mtn Lake and up to Long Lake and then back on 28N through Newcomb back to North Creek - 80 miles. There are some sections in that loop where you don't pass much but in reality by staying on the main road you are really are never far from help if needed. I would recommend the Ididaride if you want a good ride with a nice group in that area, last year there were several hunderd riders and the ride is gaining popularity.

    If you are riding over to Lake Placid you must be quite capable on steep terrain, I know there are very long and difficult grades particularly along 73.

    Good to hear from you
    "Of all the things I ever lost I miss my mind the most." Mark Twain
    If all you have is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail.

  21. #21
    Senior Member marvelous's Avatar
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    Vermont living

    I grew up in Vermont, I have lived in Colorado and California. Vermont is entirely within a mountain range. It's the only state that can make this claim. It is also the most rural state in the union. This means no matter where you go you'll have farms and hills. The cost of living is very low. You should consider addison county the riding there is especially good.

  22. #22
    Freewheel Medic pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
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    Marvelous,

    Have you ever been to West Virgina? There is barely a place level enough for a baseball diamond. It's just as mountainous, just as rural, and nearly 3 times larger (despite the fact that it looks larger below ).

    http://www.enchantedlearning.com/usa/states/area.shtml



    Bob
    Dreaming of Summertime in NH!

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