Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Fifty Plus (50+) Share the victories, challenges, successes and special concerns of bicyclists 50 and older. Especially useful for those entering or reentering bicycling.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 08-20-09, 08:29 PM   #1
VROD
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: roanoke rapids nc
Bikes: lotus classique ,haro mirra pro,gary fisher mtb 1980's, trek T1
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
new brooks

I put my 30 year old brooks professional on my fixed gear a while back rode good except it is a little to wide in the center and rubbed my legs so I ordered a new brooks swift from wallington.It was delivered yesterday so I put some proofhide on it put it on the bike right before I went to bed.After work today I went on a 15mi easy ride not bad I think I will have it broken in within a week.The biggest problem is I forgot how slick they are when new I kept sliding forward made my neck a little sore but even that was getting better by the time I got home.I may have to tilt it up a little for a while but for now I am going to leave it level for a couple of days and see what happens.
VROD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-20-09, 09:10 PM   #2
The Weak Link
Banned.
 
The Weak Link's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Post-partisan Paradise
Bikes: GF Wahoo '05, Trek T1000 '04, Lemond Buenos Aires '07
Posts: 4,938
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Brooks are a tool of Satan and an offense to our Mother Gaia.

Go for it.
The Weak Link is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-09, 09:37 AM   #3
Hermes 
Elite Rider
 
Hermes's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: La Jolla, CA
Bikes: Too Many
Posts: 9,932
Mentioned: 72 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 90 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by The Weak Link View Post
Brooks are a tool of Satan and an offense to our Mother Gaia.

Go for it.
+1 From other threads, including the current one raging on the B-17, @ss on a bicycle seat is a religious experience.
Hermes is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-09, 06:30 PM   #4
CB HI
Cycle Year Round
 
CB HI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Honolulu, HI
Bikes:
Posts: 12,349
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 443 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by VROD View Post
...The biggest problem is I forgot how slick they are when new I kept sliding forward made my neck a little sore but even that was getting better by the time I got home.I may have to tilt it up a little for a while but for now I am going to leave it level for a couple of days and see what happens.
As I understand it, a Brooks is suppose to be more nose up than other saddles.
CB HI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-09, 08:13 PM   #5
pastorbobnlnh 
Freewheel Medic
 
pastorbobnlnh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Ascending or Descending the NH Mountains NW of Concord!
Bikes: Snazzy* Schwinns, Classy Cannondales, & a Lonely '83 Santana Tandem (* Ed.)
Posts: 10,323
Mentioned: 9 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 44 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by CB HI View Post
As I understand it, a Brooks is suppose to be more nose up than other saddles.
I like mine level or tipped about 1 degree down.
__________________
Bob
Dreaming about riding in NH's summertime!

Visit my websites:
FreeWheelSpa.com orpastorbobnlnh.com
pastorbobnlnh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-21-09, 09:01 PM   #6
VROD
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: roanoke rapids nc
Bikes: lotus classique ,haro mirra pro,gary fisher mtb 1980's, trek T1
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
the other one I had level and it worked great so I set this one about the same. I am going to give it a few more miles before I start moving it,at least until the slickness wears off.I have to ride a brooks I was born in england and my grandmothers maiden name was brooks.I rode another 15 mi tonight after work seems a little less slick.
VROD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-09, 06:20 AM   #7
BluesDawg
just keep riding
 
BluesDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Milledgeville, Georgia
Bikes: 2015 Specialized AWOL Comp frameset (custom build), 2015 Zukas custom road, 2014 Specialized Crave Pro 29, 2003 KHS Milano Tandem, 1986 Nishiki Cadence rigid MTB, 1980ish Fuji S-12S
Posts: 13,275
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
One thing to keep in mind is that a Brooks saddle is not flat from front to rear like some saddles. The middle part is lower than the front or the rear. I mount my saddle so that a level laid across the front and rear of the saddle shows it as level. Viewing my saddle, you would call it slightly nose up.
When the saddles are new and slick, I mount them a little more nose up to avoid sliding forward.
BluesDawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-09, 10:52 AM   #8
Riverside_Guy
Senior Member
 
Riverside_Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NYC-UWS
Bikes: Trek 750
Posts: 373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Sliding forward may have something to do with the width of the tongue. I have an Avenir, which can be VERY comfortable, but it has a kind of fat nose. I have mine set with the nose canted up. Yet, I still find that I have slid forward so my genitals get more "pressed on" than sitting farther back. I think what is happening is the action of peddling and the fat nose is what is making me gradually shift farther forward.
Riverside_Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-09, 05:40 PM   #9
VROD
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: roanoke rapids nc
Bikes: lotus classique ,haro mirra pro,gary fisher mtb 1980's, trek T1
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
the first ride I was not just sliding forward I was sliding every way it was just real slick. Last night was better. I am not going to ride tonight we have had thunderstorms roads are wet and it is still misting rain I need to rest the old legs anyway.Will take a longer ride tommorrow
VROD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-22-09, 07:20 PM   #10
JohnDThompson 
Old fart
 
JohnDThompson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Appleton WI
Bikes: Several, mostly not name brands.
Posts: 16,797
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 224 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by VROD View Post
I put my 30 year old brooks professional on my fixed gear a while back rode good except it is a little to wide in the center and rubbed my legs so I ordered a new brooks swift from wallington.
So, umm, whatcha doin' with the old Brooks?

Just askin', ya know...
JohnDThompson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-09, 02:59 PM   #11
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Bikes:
Posts: 12,421
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 71 Post(s)
I think one slides forward for two reasons.

One is that the saddle is too far back, and your natural pedaling position (the one that is natural for your knees) places you in front of the sit bone support area, i.e. the wide part of the saddle. The saddle needs to move forward in this case.

The other is that you have it tipped nose down too far, and you are falling forward off of the sit bone support area. This can also results in too much hand, arm, and upper back pressure, from constantly pushing yourself back to where the saddle feels good. Tilt the saddle nose up a very small amount at a time. Stop raising it when perineal pressure becomes a problem.

You can also have both problems at teh same time. I would adjust fore/aft first, if there isn't a lot of hand and arm pressure.

Last edited by Road Fan; 08-23-09 at 03:02 PM.
Road Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-09, 04:04 PM   #12
BluesDawg
just keep riding
 
BluesDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Milledgeville, Georgia
Bikes: 2015 Specialized AWOL Comp frameset (custom build), 2015 Zukas custom road, 2014 Specialized Crave Pro 29, 2003 KHS Milano Tandem, 1986 Nishiki Cadence rigid MTB, 1980ish Fuji S-12S
Posts: 13,275
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Fan View Post
I think one slides forward for two reasons.
Third reason is riding a shiny new Brooks saddle. Everything can be set up perfectly and you'll slide on a brand new Brooks. The only reason sliding back isn't more of a problem is that the legs press against the wider rear section and keep you from sliding back. The problem goes away after several rides as the sheen wears off.
BluesDawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-09, 05:41 PM   #13
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Bikes:
Posts: 12,421
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 71 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesDawg View Post
Third reason is riding a shiny new Brooks saddle. Everything can be set up perfectly and you'll slide on a brand new Brooks. The only reason sliding back isn't more of a problem is that the legs press against the wider rear section and keep you from sliding back. The problem goes away after several rides as the sheen wears off.
You're right that movement is easier on a slick platform, but I really don't buy that as a cause. You're also right that the width of the rear section limits rearward slip, but it also (I have had this problem) causes a bruising sensation at the rear top of the thigh, due to a lot of repetitive pressure while pedaling. That wasn't one of the OP's complaints.

I really think if you are in good balance on teh saddle, you won't move. And if you aren't in good balance, comfort will be compromised.
Road Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-09, 06:50 PM   #14
VROD
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: roanoke rapids nc
Bikes: lotus classique ,haro mirra pro,gary fisher mtb 1980's, trek T1
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnDThompson View Post
So, umm, whatcha doin' with the old Brooks?

Just askin', ya know...

it going back on the old road bike
VROD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-09, 07:09 PM   #15
VROD
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: roanoke rapids nc
Bikes: lotus classique ,haro mirra pro,gary fisher mtb 1980's, trek T1
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
great day today 85 degrees very little wind so went for a 54 mi ride after lunch I tried a new route more hills than usual.The ride was good except my spin didn't feel right so after supper went for a 16 mi ride and did some seat adjustments,up 1/8 and forward 1/8 spin is better.I now have 100 mi on the seat and the dimples are starting to show.The seat was much more comfortable today not perfect but alot better my butt is a little sore but not anywere near unbearable.I could have gone farther with no problem.
VROD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-23-09, 07:14 PM   #16
George
Senior Member
 
George's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Katy Texas
Bikes: Specialized Roubaix
Posts: 5,409
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by pastorbobnlnh View Post
i like mine level or tipped about 1 degree down.
+1
__________________
George
George is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-09, 05:28 AM   #17
BluesDawg
just keep riding
 
BluesDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Milledgeville, Georgia
Bikes: 2015 Specialized AWOL Comp frameset (custom build), 2015 Zukas custom road, 2014 Specialized Crave Pro 29, 2003 KHS Milano Tandem, 1986 Nishiki Cadence rigid MTB, 1980ish Fuji S-12S
Posts: 13,275
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 43 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Fan View Post
You're right that movement is easier on a slick platform, but I really don't buy that as a cause. You're also right that the width of the rear section limits rearward slip, but it also (I have had this problem) causes a bruising sensation at the rear top of the thigh, due to a lot of repetitive pressure while pedaling. That wasn't one of the OP's complaints.

I really think if you are in good balance on teh saddle, you won't move. And if you aren't in good balance, comfort will be compromised.
So you don't buy that acceleration and braking (among other normal forces present while cycling) will cause someone to slide on a properly positioned but slick saddle? My experience says that it will.
BluesDawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-09, 08:44 AM   #18
Riverside_Guy
Senior Member
 
Riverside_Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NYC-UWS
Bikes: Trek 750
Posts: 373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Road Fan View Post
I think one slides forward for two reasons.

One is that the saddle is too far back, and your natural pedaling position (the one that is natural for your knees) places you in front of the sit bone support area, i.e. the wide part of the saddle. The saddle needs to move forward in this case.

The other is that you have it tipped nose down too far, and you are falling forward off of the sit bone support area. This can also results in too much hand, arm, and upper back pressure, from constantly pushing yourself back to where the saddle feels good. Tilt the saddle nose up a very small amount at a time. Stop raising it when perineal pressure becomes a problem.

You can also have both problems at teh same time. I would adjust fore/aft first, if there isn't a lot of hand and arm pressure.
While I certainly can agree with your points, I have played with forward/rearward positions as well as the angle to the ground, going from one extreme to the other, with 10-20 miles for each "try." I have left it at canted UP in the nose and mounted almost as forward as it can be.

I think a third force is at play... as I said, with a fairly fat nose, I think the mere act of peddling kind forces me forward. My other saddle has a substantially thinner nose, so I never noticed being too far forward. But it also didn't have a whole lot of padding, so I had sore sit bones after the first 5 miles.
Riverside_Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-09, 08:37 PM   #19
VROD
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: roanoke rapids nc
Bikes: lotus classique ,haro mirra pro,gary fisher mtb 1980's, trek T1
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
ok guys I haven't broken in alot of brooks saddles just the 2 I have now.I take the saddle out of the box put 2 coats of proofhide on the bottom and a light coat on the top.I install the seat in the same location as the seat that is on the bike(center of h-bars to back of seat) and level I let the saddle sit over night then I wipe off excess proofhide.I then ride the bike for a few days until the dimples start to form.When the dimples form I no longer slide around then I can adjust the saddle to suit my legs arms and neck as the saddle continues to brake in I may have to make more small adjustment.Tonight I could only do my 15 mi after supper ride when I rode out of the drive way my butt settled right into the dimples and felt good for the whole ride.I will not be able to do any longer rides until fri will see what happens then.
VROD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-09, 09:02 PM   #20
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Bikes:
Posts: 12,421
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 71 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BluesDawg View Post
So you don't buy that acceleration and braking (among other normal forces present while cycling) will cause someone to slide on a properly positioned but slick saddle? My experience says that it will.
I DO buy that, I'm an engineer who believes physics. But I think one normally compensates for those forces (at least I do), and each little disturbance and correction only takes a brief period of time. What I have seen with a saddle out of place or off-angle is that I tend to move slowly forward, not really noticing what's happening, until OUCH, wher'd all that pressure come from?
Road Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-24-09, 09:15 PM   #21
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Bikes:
Posts: 12,421
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 71 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverside_Guy View Post
While I certainly can agree with your points, I have played with forward/rearward positions as well as the angle to the ground, going from one extreme to the other, with 10-20 miles for each "try." I have left it at canted UP in the nose and mounted almost as forward as it can be.

I think a third force is at play... as I said, with a fairly fat nose, I think the mere act of peddling kind forces me forward. My other saddle has a substantially thinner nose, so I never noticed being too far forward. But it also didn't have a whole lot of padding, so I had sore sit bones after the first 5 miles.

Not sure I understand: with a fat nose you drift forward faster than if you have a saddle with a narrow nose?

I see two factors: simple gravity, and your body being biomechanically more comfortable pedaling with your sit bones in a certain location. I feel it's up to us to put the saddle where the body wants it, not to tell my sitbones where they must be. There is such a thing as a seat tube angle that is too laid back, IMO.

It sounds to me like your body wants to be pedaling with your sit bones farther forward than your saddle can go, that's why you're drifting forward. Maybe you can try a seatpost with no setback, to see if you are able to get the saddle far enough forward?

This is kind of branching off into philosophy, and I have no proof of my viewpoint. My way of thinking has worked to set up my bike and that of Mrs. Road Fan, but that's my sample size.
Road Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-09, 09:32 AM   #22
Riverside_Guy
Senior Member
 
Riverside_Guy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: NYC-UWS
Bikes: Trek 750
Posts: 373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think it's the width of the nose that is "sliding" me forward. Keep in mind the slope of the side of the saddle; so on each stroke of my leg, there's "more seat" to push me forward. As I said, with another saddle with a far, far thinner nose, I do not slid forward at all. THAT saddle had very little padding, so I got hot spots on both sit bones.

The actual issue is there's a nice "valley" in the meatiest part of the saddle for my "stuff" but sitting on the nose brings a tad too much pressure to said body parts.

It all has me thinking about noseless saddles. Or about raising the bars a tad, or some so I can sit more upright (even thought about a kind of bar end where I can position my hands 4" above my flat bars). BUT, my arms now are in great shape for laying out more... so it's all about satisfying multiple things, not all of which work in perfect harmony!
Riverside_Guy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-25-09, 09:58 AM   #23
Road Fan
Senior Member
 
Road Fan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Bikes:
Posts: 12,421
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 71 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riverside_Guy View Post
I think it's the width of the nose that is "sliding" me forward. Keep in mind the slope of the side of the saddle; so on each stroke of my leg, there's "more seat" to push me forward. As I said, with another saddle with a far, far thinner nose, I do not slid forward at all. THAT saddle had very little padding, so I got hot spots on both sit bones.

The actual issue is there's a nice "valley" in the meatiest part of the saddle for my "stuff" but sitting on the nose brings a tad too much pressure to said body parts.

It all has me thinking about noseless saddles. Or about raising the bars a tad, or some so I can sit more upright (even thought about a kind of bar end where I can position my hands 4" above my flat bars). BUT, my arms now are in great shape for laying out more... so it's all about satisfying multiple things, not all of which work in perfect harmony!
My basic point is that we are not designed to sit on the nose of a saddle. If you are sitting on the nose an adjustment is needed, unless you are a time trialist who has trained for that position. I have no experience with noseless saddles. I don't have this problem (i.e. sliding forward) any more. I think that if we listen, our bodies tell us where they like to sit, and how.

Last edited by Road Fan; 08-26-09 at 08:03 PM.
Road Fan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-26-09, 06:46 AM   #24
FloridaBoy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: SW Florida The Everglades
Bikes: Rivendell Chevoit and a Panasonic 1986 7500 MTB
Posts: 196
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluesdawg View Post
one thing to keep in mind is that a brooks saddle is not flat from front to rear like some saddles. The middle part is lower than the front or the rear. I mount my saddle so that a level laid across the front and rear of the saddle shows it as level. Viewing my saddle, you would call it slightly nose up.
when the saddles are new and slick, i mount them a little more nose up to avoid sliding forward.
+1
FloridaBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:33 AM.