Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Fifty Plus (50+) Share the victories, challenges, successes and special concerns of bicyclists 50 and older. Especially useful for those entering or reentering bicycling.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-17-10, 02:28 PM   #1
miss kenton
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
miss kenton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Blueberry Capital of the WORLD, NJ
Bikes: Trek '09 1.5 wsd, Trek '13 Cocoa
Posts: 2,095
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
TdF question - NOT a spoiler

I have noticed that while coasting in descent some riders push one of their knees outward. It seems to me this would slow them down. Is that why they do it? If not, what purpose does this move serve?
miss kenton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 02:37 PM   #2
BikeWNC
Climbing Above It All
 
BikeWNC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Basking in the Sun.
Bikes:
Posts: 4,146
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It helps with keeping their center of gravity lower and towards the center of the arc. These guys are going very fast on those descents and they often feel the need to move their mass into the turn to maintain the line and traction (to some extent).
BikeWNC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 02:39 PM   #3
miss kenton
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
miss kenton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Blueberry Capital of the WORLD, NJ
Bikes: Trek '09 1.5 wsd, Trek '13 Cocoa
Posts: 2,095
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Thanks so much for the prompt reply.
miss kenton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 03:07 PM   #4
BengeBoy 
Senior Member
 
BengeBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA
Bikes: 2014 Pivot Mach 5.7 MTB, 2009 Chris Boedeker custom, 1988 Tommasini Prestige, 2007 Bill Davidson custom; 1988 Specialized Stumpjumper
Posts: 6,941
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
More extreme example, same phenomenon:

BengeBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 03:39 PM   #5
stapfam
Time for a change.
 
stapfam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: 6 miles inland from the coast of Sussex, in the South East of England
Bikes: Dale MT2000. Bianchi FS920 Kona Explosif. Giant TCR C. Boreas Ignis. Pinarello Fp Uno.
Posts: 19,915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
And you often see them discarding things on the final 5 km's of the ride like water bottles and cycling caps.
__________________
How long was I in the army? Five foot seven.


Spike Milligan
stapfam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 04:06 PM   #6
miss kenton
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
miss kenton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Blueberry Capital of the WORLD, NJ
Bikes: Trek '09 1.5 wsd, Trek '13 Cocoa
Posts: 2,095
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BengeBoy View Post
More extreme example, same phenomenon:

Yes! Exactly what I was writing about (except less extreme).
miss kenton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 05:13 PM   #7
Lightingguy
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Long Island, NY
Bikes:
Posts: 625
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
It's how I was taught to descend on a bike. Knee on the turning side pointed out. Helps with keeping the center of gravity low and allows you to slide the body a bit over the frame to center the weight. Helps to keep the tires from sliding out from under you.

SB
Lightingguy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 05:47 PM   #8
BengeBoy 
Senior Member
 
BengeBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA
Bikes: 2014 Pivot Mach 5.7 MTB, 2009 Chris Boedeker custom, 1988 Tommasini Prestige, 2007 Bill Davidson custom; 1988 Specialized Stumpjumper
Posts: 6,941
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightingguy View Post
It's how I was taught to descend on a bike. Knee on the turning side pointed out. Helps with keeping the center of gravity low and allows you to slide the body a bit over the frame to center the weight. Helps to keep the tires from sliding out from under you.

SB
BTW, I was taught to corner with knee pointed out, but *in* toward the direction I'm turning. I grew up riding motorcycles, and took lots of corners like the pic I pasted above.

Not sure you would call that pointed "in" or "out"?

However, a couple of years ago I read on the Internets (where everything is true) that this is no longer considered to be the right way to take a corner.

To wit: "Some riders believe that sticking the knee out or leaning the body away from the bike, improves cornering. Sticking out a knee is the same thing that riders without cleats do when they stick out a foot in dirt track motorcycle fashion. It is a useless but reassuring gesture that, on uneven roads, even degrades control. Any body weight that is not centered over the bicycle (leaning the bike or sticking out a knee) puts a side load on the bicycle, and side loads cause steering motions if the road is not smooth. Getting weight off the saddle is also made more difficult by such maneuvers. "

http://www.bicyclesource.com/descending_and_cornering

Whatever. I still stick a knee out; however, my attorney no longer permits me to recommend it.


(edited: I hope I am not confusing sticking a knee *out* with sticking a knee *in* toward the center of the curve in my explanation.

Last edited by BengeBoy; 07-17-10 at 06:19 PM.
BengeBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 05:52 PM   #9
miss kenton
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
miss kenton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Blueberry Capital of the WORLD, NJ
Bikes: Trek '09 1.5 wsd, Trek '13 Cocoa
Posts: 2,095
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightingguy View Post
It's how I was taught to descend on a bike. Knee on the turning side pointed out. Helps with keeping the center of gravity low and allows you to slide the body a bit over the frame to center the weight. Helps to keep the tires from sliding out from under you.

SB
Though I trust your experience, to me (one with no experience with fast descents nor a physics scholar) it looks like it would have the opposite affect; as if one would topple over!
miss kenton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 06:53 PM   #10
t4mv
ES&D
 
t4mv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Roadieville, USA
Bikes: 3Rensho, Merlin XL, Melton custom, Michael Johnson tandem, Look 481SL, Pedal Force RS
Posts: 1,373
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BengeBoy View Post

However, a couple of years ago I read on the Internets (where everything is true) that this is no longer considered to be the right way to take a corner.
Yeah, there's this certain know it all on the Internet (his claim to fame is a wheel building book...) that says there's no need to stick your knee out (or into a turn, if you want). I say do whatever you want, whatever makes you comfortable.

One thing that *is* intriguing though is counter-steering in a turn; if you feel like a turn is getting away from you, just push a little on the inside hook of the h-bar, on the side you're turning into. It's kinda weird at first, but the premise is that pressure exerted on the inside hook (i.e. pointing the wheel away from the turn) leads to the bike leaning over more in the opposite direction, and carving a deeper, sharper turn. A handy skill to have in case you ever find yourself overcooking a turn.
t4mv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-10, 08:27 PM   #11
BluesDawg
just keep riding
 
BluesDawg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Milledgeville, Georgia
Bikes: 2015 Specialized AWOL Comp frameset (custom build), 2015 Zukas custom road, 2014 Specialized Crave Pro 29, 2003 KHS Milano Tandem, 1986 Nishiki Cadence rigid MTB, 1980ish Fuji S-12S
Posts: 13,251
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 33 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by t4mv View Post
One thing that *is* intriguing though is counter-steering in a turn; if you feel like a turn is getting away from you, just push a little on the inside hook of the h-bar, on the side you're turning into. It's kinda weird at first, but the premise is that pressure exerted on the inside hook (i.e. pointing the wheel away from the turn) leads to the bike leaning over more in the opposite direction, and carving a deeper, sharper turn. A handy skill to have in case you ever find yourself overcooking a turn.
Yep. I learned this long ago on motorcycles where it was a more important technique because of the higher speed and greater mass being turned.
BluesDawg is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:43 AM.