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Old 10-18-11, 08:13 PM   #1
christ0ph
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Reducing arthritis and joint pain- both on the cutting edge and cheap

I just wanted to post links to some research on a short list of substances that originated in plants, many of which have been showing promise in treating a great many health problems. One of them is arthritis and more generally, joint pain/cartilage deterioration.

A growing body of evidence shows that resveratrol protects joints..

Other plant substances, notably curcumin, silymarin, EGCG (green tea), quercetin, etc. also are suddenly the subject of intense inerest in the medical research community.

It is not by any means fringe science. These substances, in the last few years, have become the subject of worldwide, mainstream attention.


Molecular targets of natural health products in arthritis
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...7/?tool=pubmed


The antioxidant resveratrol protects against chondrocyte apoptosis via effects on mitochondrial polarization and ATP production
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/1.../art.23799/pdf


Pomegranate extract inhibits the interleukin-1β-induced activation of MKK-3, p38α-MAPK and transcription factor RUNX-2 in human osteoarthritis chondrocytes
http://arthritis-research.com/content/12/5/R195


Effects of resveratrol in inflammatory arthritis.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17115116


There are lots more on PubMed, just follow the related articles links on the last article to get started finding them
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Old 10-19-11, 06:55 PM   #2
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"Substances" that originate from plants are called drugs. The drugs that you're referencing are unregulated, wrt efficacy and quality. If you want to experiment on yourself, go ahead. Maybe you already have.
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Old 10-19-11, 07:47 PM   #3
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Reads more like a cutting edge rip-off. People been searching for Ponce's fountain for ages and to no avail. And rest assured its not going to be found in some plant growing in your front yard.

Eat balanced meals and see you doctor if you have problems.
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Old 10-19-11, 07:56 PM   #4
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And rest assured its not going to be found in some plant growing in your front yard.
How about the back yard?
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Old 10-19-11, 08:06 PM   #5
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How about the back yard?

Well, if its my back yard all you'll find is poison oak and Japanese Kudzu. I kinda doubt this will do much for arthritis.
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Old 10-19-11, 08:11 PM   #6
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pessimists abound.
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Old 10-19-11, 09:56 PM   #7
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pessimists abound.
Ain't it so... one could grow old waiting for the medical establishment to conclude anything.
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Old 10-19-11, 10:54 PM   #8
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Some of those will reduce inflammation.

And that will help all over the body.

Here are some others to play with, Omega 7, Astaxanthin and Ubiqinol.
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Old 10-20-11, 08:00 AM   #9
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Only speaking for myself, and others might agree or disagree. I have arthritis in my shoulder and arms, and legs. At one time the attacks were very bad. However, I have found out from EXPERIENCE, that daily exercise keeps arthritis at bay, allows me to function better even at my age level. BTW, I don't take NOTHING for the arthritis, maybe a aspirin every once and a while..
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Old 10-20-11, 08:06 AM   #10
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If you just have to take a pill, try MSM for joint health.
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Old 10-20-11, 01:58 PM   #11
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"Substances" that originate from plants are called drugs. The drugs that you're referencing are unregulated, wrt efficacy and quality. If you want to experiment on yourself, go ahead. Maybe you already have.
Many of these substances have been known and used for thousands of years, the issue is that you you don't have .03 cents worth of plant material that has been packaged up by big pharma and sold to you for $1.50 a pill....
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Old 10-20-11, 05:20 PM   #12
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If you just have to take a pill, try MSM for joint health.

MSM? What exactly is that?
Lately I have been using Glucosamine/Chondroitin, works great for knee pain. Instead of pain and snap, crackle,pop it sounds kinda squishy when you bend your knees.
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Old 07-31-13, 02:59 AM   #13
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Hey!!!! christoph this is gracie, actually I'm looking for a supplements to clear the joint pains problem i have the some supplements list but i need best supplement so if you have any idea about the supplements also please share your information here.......
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Old 07-31-13, 06:35 AM   #14
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MSM? What exactly is that?
Lately I have been using Glucosamine/Chondroitin, works great for knee pain. Instead of pain and snap, crackle,pop it sounds kinda squishy when you bend your knees.
All placebo. Not a shred of evidence that it works.

My wife has been on industrial strength Turmeric for some time now. I think she gets better relief from willow bark.

Right. Willow bark is the source of aspirin. But now that you can get the stuff in a bottle, it must not be any good

Maybe some of these treatments will pan out. I hope so because I would take them myself. But in vitro activity doesn't always translate into in vivo ​effectiveness.
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Old 07-31-13, 09:38 AM   #15
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Ain't it so... one could grow old waiting for the medical establishment to conclude anything.
If you laid all the doctors in the world end to end they still wouldn't reach a conclusion.
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Old 07-31-13, 09:55 AM   #16
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I have severe RA and take Enbrel, Methotrexate and Meloxicam (mobic)... Helps, while i was waiting to be diagnosed i was on Prednisone for 2.5 years and develloped Type 2 DIabetes...That is why i started cycling...The cycling helps my knees more than anything i have done over the last 10 years...I can pedal and a very nice cadence and do 20 miles i find without ANY joint pain...My muscles now ,,,, LOL yhat's another story...working on that...I tried MSM, Chondroitin and Glucosamine either by themselves or all together with absolutely no results... My rheumatologist said while not really snake oil it is hit or miss in about 75% of his patients...Catching it on time and treating it is the best to prevent real joint damages...
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Old 07-31-13, 10:05 AM   #17
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If you laid all the doctors in the world end to end they still wouldn't reach a conclusion.
Hey! That's my line. I want an asterisk or something.
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Old 07-31-13, 10:56 AM   #18
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Sorry about that. Hope there isn't a repeat fee.
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Old 07-31-13, 11:24 AM   #19
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I've had arthroscopic surgery on both knees and been diagnosed with arthritis in my left knee. I used glucosamin & condroitin for a while but on my annual physical the doctor noticed some abnormal liver numbers. I stopped taking it and all went back to normal.

Since then I came across Voltaren Gel. My knee has ached for years. With voltaren twice a day my knee pain is completely gone and I exercise on an elliptic for forty minutes and ride my bike the same length each day. The advantage of Voltaren is the aspirin in it goes right to the joint instead of throughout the body. I read somewhere your system gets only 1-2% of the NSAID from a normal aspirin.

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Old 07-31-13, 12:56 PM   #20
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MSM? What exactly is that?
Lately I have been using Glucosamine/Chondroitin, works great for knee pain. Instead of pain and snap, crackle,pop it sounds kinda squishy when you bend your knees.
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All placebo. Not a shred of evidence that it works.
Don't know (or really care) what 'evidence' you feel you need before trying glucosamine/chondroitin, but MY personal experience is: it DOES work, no placebo involved. I've done straight gluco, little effect. Done gluco/chon/MSM, no EXTRA effect from the MSM. Done gluco/chon/hyaluronic acid, terrible side effects.

Being a suspicious and skeptical person, placebo effects are largely lost on me. If I try some sort of preparation for an issue, I DON'T just EXPECT it to work, I wait and see IF it does.

I'm actually GLAD there's "not a shred of evidence" -- that means the f'n FDA will leave it alone, and the cost will stay down.
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Old 07-31-13, 03:13 PM   #21
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Don't know (or really care) what 'evidence' you feel you need before trying glucosamine/chondroitin, but MY personal experience is: it DOES work, no placebo involved. I've done straight gluco, little effect. Done gluco/chon/MSM, no EXTRA effect from the MSM. Done gluco/chon/hyaluronic acid, terrible side effects.

Being a suspicious and skeptical person, placebo effects are largely lost on me. If I try some sort of preparation for an issue, I DON'T just EXPECT it to work, I wait and see IF it does.

I'm actually GLAD there's "not a shred of evidence" -- that means the f'n FDA will leave it alone, and the cost will stay down.
I accept the reprimand, intended or not, and admit my post was needlessly brusque.

A bit of context, and I mean nothing personal in this: an "explosive" article came out recently, here: http://www.mayoclinicproceedings.org...405-9/fulltext

The article is called medical reversals and outlines 146 things that doctors thought were good ideas that, in the opinion of the authors, proved to be flat wrong.

I read the entire thing. As I was working down the list, there was one "blunder" after another: this thing didn't work, that thing was counterproductive, and this thing over here was a flat disaster. I imagined readers saying, "Yeah, you arrogant creeps. Think you know everything, wrong half the time, and you charge too much".

Then when I got to the entry about the ineffectiveness of glucosamine, I imagined people hopping up and yelling, "Now wait a minute!! You've gone too far!!!".

It's like the old Southern joke: watch it, preacher man, you've gone from preaching to meddling with that one".
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Old 07-31-13, 03:42 PM   #22
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I have severe RA and take Enbrel, Methotrexate and Meloxicam (mobic)... Helps, while i was waiting to be diagnosed i was on Prednisone for 2.5 years and develloped Type 2 DIabetes...That is why i started cycling...The cycling helps my knees more than anything i have done over the last 10 years...I can pedal and a very nice cadence and do 20 miles i find without ANY joint pain...My muscles now ,,,, LOL yhat's another story...working on that...I tried MSM, Chondroitin and Glucosamine either by themselves or all together with absolutely no results... My rheumatologist said while not really snake oil it is hit or miss in about 75% of his patients...Catching it on time and treating it is the best to prevent real joint damages...
i agree. i have both osteoarthritis and RA and i am taking methotrexiate, predisone when i have the flares and leflunomide tho i don't want to take these meds i do find that it does help tremendously. the VA has already told me i should be on enbril, with Iv 1 x monthly but so far i am staying away from that as long as i can. Cycling does help quite a lot, but when the flares hit nothing seems to help
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Old 07-31-13, 03:58 PM   #23
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Aw crap, I think I'm going to quit:

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Old 07-31-13, 06:51 PM   #24
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For me the Enbrel made the most difference...I give myself a shot once a week...They offer a Copay card and it only costs me $10.00 a month...
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Old 07-31-13, 07:02 PM   #25
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And I'm sure the OP has read this re resveratrol : http://www.theatlantic.com/health/ar...ercise/277993/

Oh crap, I'm drinking a glass of red wine right now.
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