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  1. #1
    Senior Member GeorgeBMac's Avatar
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    a budding amateur bike mechanic?

    I could probably post this on the mechanic's forum -- but the people on this forum are experiened riders and may have a better perspective on the subject...

    Last night I attended my first class of 6 on 'Beginner Bicycle Mechanics". Each week we will be covering a couple chapters from Park Tools's "Big Blue Book of Bicycle Repair'. The instructor appears to be pretty good -- but the student is pretty weak (I'm NOT mechanically inclined). But, my main goal is to simply build a foundation and learn some of the basics and, at a minimum, to know what I need to ask my LBS to do!

    But, on the other hand, I would love to be able to rebuild an old bike and just be able to tinker around a bit...

    So, the instructor gave us a list of Park Tools that we could buy from her (20%) off. It's a long list. But, the Park Tool "Advanced Mechanic's Tool Set" (AK-37) seems like the easiest way to go. These tools are NOT required for the class -- but we can buy them if we want. And, I am considering it in order to get myself off to a 'good start' and be sure I have the resources I need if I persue this whole thing further...

    As for getting repairs and maintenance done -- my LBS is great! They do nice work at very reasonable prices. I will probably never do any better than these guys. So, getting involved in the mechanic's side would be more to further the hobby than for any pragmatic need.

    So, what do you experienced folk say about amateur mechanics?
    -- Is it a good thing or a dangerous thing?
    -- Is the Park Tool Advanced Mechanic's Tool Set just another dust collector or is it helpful?

    And all thoughts (even belly laughs!) will be appreciated...

    So, thanks for any insights... I really don't know where I'm going with this and where it might end up...
    --------------------------------------
    bikes: 1992 Cannondale R500, 2012 Trek DS 8.5, 2008 LeMond Poprad

  2. #2
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    Speaking strictly for myself, I wouldn't buy the tool kit. That's a fairly expensive kit, even with a 20% discount. My advice would be to buy individual tools on an "as needed" basis. You can an awful lot of repairs with a good set of metric hex wrenches and basic screwdrivers. When you need something like a pedal wrench or cone wrenches get them from your LBS.

  3. #3
    Squeaky Wheel woodway's Avatar
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    Doing your own bike maintenance is not hard and very rewarding. There is no reason you cannot improve your skills to do just as well as the LBS for routine maintenance tasks.

    I looked at the Park Tools kit you mentioned and I own all those tools (and more). Except I bought them one at a time rather than all at once. If I was starting out again, I probably would just buy the kit and would have saved myself time and money. But back when I started I had no idea it would become such an obsession...

  4. #4
    Senior Member jmccain's Avatar
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    I think that's a very nice kit, particularly if you can get it at 20% less than what, say, Amazon sells it for.

    Personally, I'd rather ride than wrench, but that's just me. I worked in bike shops growing up so I have some mechanical competency, but what I really enjoy about cycling is riding.

    But, for many people, working on bikes is their primary joy. Only you can decide what you'd like.

  5. #5
    Time for a change. stapfam's Avatar
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    You need to be able to understand the basics of bike maintenance. Not talking major jobs but changing cables and brake blocks is a good start. If you can change those items- then you can check and adjust them yourself when out on a ride. Common things like puncture repairs and tyre changing spring to mind aswell. Then how to adjust and tighten headsets and how about when the wheel goes out of true on a ride?

    Basic mechanics can get a bit involved but can save a fortune at the LBS.

    Personally I would not go for the Park tool kit unless you have no tools at present and it is a reasonable price----AND it has the tools that fit your bike and not as the last kit I looked at that was for a 10 year old bike. Components change over the years and so do the tools required to work on them.
    How long was I in the army? Five foot seven.


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  6. #6
    Senior Member epiking's Avatar
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    Congradulations on wanting to know more...

    Most cyclists do some level of repair/maintenance themselves. How far one goes down that road is strictly a personal choice neither good or bad. There is good to be gained by knowing more about your bike mechanically. It will make you a better cyclist. You may want to evaluate how far you want to take it when you finish the class.

    There is certainly nothing wrong with the toolset are considering. The only downside is that you may wind up buying tools you may not use. An alternative route would be to buy some basic hand tools, then buy the bike specific tools you need along the way. You will be able to match your expenditure to the level of invovlement you care to go.

    Keep your relationship going with your LBS and that will be an ongoing source of information and parts.

    Above all, Have fun...
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  7. #7
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    It can't hurt knowing the theory of bike repair. There are a number of things that I do myself: repair flats, change tires, repack bearings, true wheels, adjust brakes, replace brake pads, change chains, change rear clusters, change pedals, put on seats, put on computers, adjust deraillers and some other stuff. Some things I don't fool with because I only need to do them once in a blue moon or never. So why have the tools? Also, I don't do handlebar tape. I can do it but I never get it looking as nice as the bike shop does.

  8. #8
    Senior Member Retro Grouch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stapfam View Post
    AND it has the tools that fit your bike and not as the last kit I looked at that was for a 10 year old bike. Components change over the years and so do the tools required to work on them.
    That's what I think too.

    Who uses headset wrenches anymore? Bottom bracket's, and the tools for installing them, have changed twice in the last decade alone. There is no tool kit that will work on every bike so you might as well concentrate on buying tools to fit the bikes that you have.

    Also, nobody makes the best of everything. For example, I don't like Park cable cutters. That's a tool that you'll find yourself using fairly frequently so you might as well get a good one that you like.

  9. #9
    Senior Member NOS88's Avatar
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    I'd probably buy one or two Park tools while taking the class, but not the whole kit. I too am of the mind that you should buy the tool when you need it. I'd probably start with a Y hex wrench and the Park pedal wrench.

    I also tend to agree with Retro Grouch, I don't like Park's cable cutters and there are other places that sell tools just as functional for less. For example, I like Nashbar chain checking tool more than Park's.
    A conclusion is the place where you got tired of thinking. - S. Wright

  10. #10
    Dharma Dog lhbernhardt's Avatar
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    If you get the 20% discount n the range of Park tools, then I would get the following:

    - the entire set of "P" hex wrenches

    - the cable cutter (yeah, nobody likes it, but it works, and it has a thing for crimping on the cable ends)

    - the full set of the professional cone wrenches (13,14,15,16, and 17mm)

    - the dial-in torque wrenches with sockets and allen keys (one thing I don't have but wish I had!) You need a torque wrench to work with the newer components on carbon fiber frames.

    - might as well get the spoke keys now, if you're really serious. You know you are a real bike mechanic when you can build a good set of wheels, complete with valve in the right place.

    - get the home mechanic's bike stand, with tool tray. It's really handy.

    - get the tool that holds the handlebars in place while you're working on the rest of the bike. It's REALLY handy.

    The rest of the tools you can get one at a time as you need them. Different components require different tools, although some are interchangeable. The tool for installing/removing Shimano Hollowtech cups also works on SRAM cups, but you don't need it if you're working on square-taper bottom brackets.

    Also, I'm assuming you have the basic generic tools that are not bike-specific, such as a PRECISE 6" crescent wrench, needle-nose pliers, mechanics' hammer, etc.

    Luis

  11. #11
    Senior Member GeorgeBMac's Avatar
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    Thank you all for sharing your many cumulative years of experience... You have saved me time and money ...

    Although I frequently see disagreements on this forum, one thing is sure: you guys know bikes, you know how to use them, and you know how to care for them...

    In the scheme of things, I am a rookie. I started riding this past spring and have accumulated a little over 1,500 miles. While that sounds like a lot to me, it is nothing to many of you.

    So, I THANK YOU VERY MUCH for sharing your thoughts and insights on this thread and on others...

    Be well, and thanks again,
    George
    --------------------------------------
    bikes: 1992 Cannondale R500, 2012 Trek DS 8.5, 2008 LeMond Poprad

  12. #12
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    I do all my own work plus family and friends bikes as well. I believe I do a better job than the LBS's because I'm meticulous and, being retired, can afford to take my time.

    Like most other posters I've purchased my bike specific tools as needed. Those who buy tools in a "kit" seem to end up with tools they will never use and/or duplicates.

  13. #13
    Time for a change. stapfam's Avatar
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    All you need to work on a bike are a few basic tools. Allen keys and initially a basic set will cover the sizes needed. The main sizes needed are 3-4-5 and 6mm and the one to fit your Crank fixing if you have that type of crank. Spanners and the main one I use is a 10 mm and possibly an adjustable if any other are required. Cycling specific tools and cable cutters are the ones I use most Closely followed by Bottom bracket tools-Crank puller and rear sprocket removal chain whip and socket. Pedal spanner is one I wondered if I would ever use but after struggling with a short 15mm spanner and a hammer- I bought the long cycling spanner to make the job easier. Wheels and cone spanners if you have that type of wheels. I bought a cheap set many years ago and they lasted well but when they got a bit worn I invested in an expensive set and have not used them since. Spoke spanners for re-trueing wheels are a good idea and there are several sizes. I have 3 different sizes as I never know what size my mates will turn up with.

    Extra items do make things easier and the main one is a bike stand. They vary in quality and type so get one you can afford- will fit your bike and be sturdy enough to use. A Floor pump is very handy and they once again come in various quality's so try before you buy. I have several pumps that will get a tyre to 80psi with ease. Above 100 for the road tyres is impossible. I asked advice at the LBS and it did cost a fortune but will pump to 200psi if I ever need it.

    All my tools have been acquired on an as need basis. I have made several mistakes on buying tools that I rarely use and even more mistakes with tools that are not man enough for the job.

    But as said- bikes are basic and the mechanical skill to repair them is not hard. And if you attempt a job and mess it up- there is always the LBS to fall back on.
    Last edited by stapfam; 10-13-12 at 02:59 AM.
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  14. #14
    rebmeM roineS JanMM's Avatar
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    Learning to maintain your bikes is A Good Thing. (Don't have anything to add to what's already been said.)
    RANS V3 (steel), RANS V-Rex, RANS Screamer

  15. #15
    Semper Fi, A way of life. qcpmsame's Avatar
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    I agree with not buying the entire set, the 20% still leaves Park Tools high in the price range. When you complete the course you can determine any specialty tools for your components Park, Pedros or VAR makes. Most of the tools you use a lot like the allen wrenches mentioned and basic hand tools can be bought at Sears or Lowes much cheaper and a better guarantee to boot. I agree with the pedal wrench and maybe a Y-wrench from Park but not many more at this point. the only other specialty wrench I would get is a torque wrench that reads in Ft/Lbs and/or Nm or get three of the preset torque allens for use on the stem, bars, seat and FD.

    Good choice on taking the course too.

    Bill
    "I Can Do All Things Through Christ Who Strengthens Me" Philippians 4:13

  16. #16
    Senior Member Mort Canard's Avatar
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    George,
    Who is putting on the class? The LBS? Local Free University? It sounds like a very interesting offering. I haven't ever seen anything like that more advanced than the very basic skills of changing tires and simple cable lubing.


    I know some local bicycle mechanics who are pretty tight lipped about their craft simply because if they offer a suggestion of the appropriate part the customer will just head for the internet and buy it off Nashbar, Performance, etc...
    "The future's all yours, you lousy bicycles" Butch Cassidy

  17. #17
    Garlic
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    I would not buy the kit either. I've been maintaining my own bikes for 45 years and I have nothing like that. I have a nice set of basic auto mechanic hand tools and just a few bike-specific tools, some of which change every decade or so, some stay the same. Besides the stuff that's always on the bike including a spoke wrench and allen keys, I have a couple of cone wrenches, the appropriate BB, crank and cassette tools for the bike of the decade, chain tool, and that's about it. Unless you plan to set up a home shop, you don't really need a stand. Very nice, but not necessary. Frankly, I don't have room for that stuff. I prefer to live simply and that usually means no garage, the tools are in the front closet, and you work on the bike on the back porch.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mort Canard View Post
    ...I know some local bicycle mechanics who are pretty tight lipped about their craft simply because if they offer a suggestion of the appropriate part the customer will just head for the internet and buy it off Nashbar, Performance, etc...
    Sure, but it could also be a good marketing tool. If you show people something that's pretty complicated like building a wheel, some would just hire you to do it, I think. It could be a good way to get customers into your shop.

  18. #18
    Senior Member GeorgeBMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mort Canard View Post
    George,
    Who is putting on the class? The LBS? Local Free University? It sounds like a very interesting offering. I haven't ever seen anything like that more advanced than the very basic skills of changing tires and simple cable lubing.


    I know some local bicycle mechanics who are pretty tight lipped about their craft simply because if they offer a suggestion of the appropriate part the customer will just head for the internet and buy it off Nashbar, Performance, etc...
    It is being offered by "Trek of Pittsburgh" which is a local dealer of Treks and few other brands (like Kona). They have about a half dozen stores and this beginner's course is actually being offered at 2 of them -- with a limit of 6 people to a class -- once a week for 6 weeks.

    The first class was just lecture (although we had more questions than she had lecture!). This week we'll bring our bikes in and start working on them ("sprockets, cranksets and chains").

    And, yes, I agree, this is really good of them... But, it shows the spirit of why I bought my Trek DS from them... Don't get me wrong, I love the Trek DS and love it more the more I ride it. But, I when I was shopping I decided up front that unless I found a very clear winner at another bike shop that I would buy from them -- because I knew I could trust and depend on them. And, I make a practice of buying all my bike gear from them (although I buy almost everything else -- except food and gas -- online).

    In short, they are good people. They support me and I support them. I think in biology (50 years ago) they called that a "symbiotic relationship".

    But this being the 50+ forum, I think you all could relate to this:
    The class is all guys my age or nearly my age (62). But, it is being taught by a young girl! A girl teaching guys mechanics! Do you believe it! This world just keeps on changing!!!
    When I grew up a girl wouldn't be caught dead in a mechanics class -- much less teach it!
    ... BUT, she's REALLY good! She been doing it full time for at least 10 years and she definitely knows what she's doing and what she's talking about...

    And, again, thank you all for your input and insights. I value your knowledge and opinions a great deal. Thank you!
    --------------------------------------
    bikes: 1992 Cannondale R500, 2012 Trek DS 8.5, 2008 LeMond Poprad

  19. #19
    Senior Member teachme's Avatar
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    http://www.rei.com/product/711889/pa...ti-tool-mtb-3c

    This is what I bought recently.
    Attached Images Attached Images
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  20. #20
    Senior Member GeorgeBMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teachme View Post
    Very cool! It even has a bottle opener?
    ... I have a multi-tool, but NOTHING like that! Not even in the ball park...

    BTW, mine has gotten a lot of use -- but never by me. It's all the other riders stuck on the side of the trail trying to tighten this or that...
    --------------------------------------
    bikes: 1992 Cannondale R500, 2012 Trek DS 8.5, 2008 LeMond Poprad

  21. #21
    Senior Member Flying Merkel's Avatar
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    One of my favorite things to do is get an old neglected bike, strip it down and get it back on the road. Of the last 4 bikes I've acquired, 3 look like they didn't cover 20 miles in their entire life.

    The list:

    1982 Raleigh Gran Sport

    1982 Peugeot PH19 mixte

    1965 (?) American Eagle coaster brake.

    1996 Specialized Ground Control

    Put about 100 miles on the Raleigh, 30 on the Peugeot. Sold on Craigslist for a total of $380.00. The Eagle I might keep. It has charm. No other word will do. The Ground Control is going up for sale. Might keep it if I don't get my price.

    I have a few special tools. I buy as needed. Some aren't really necessary, like cable cutters or a headset press, but they are nice to have.

    Down by the Huntington Beach pier, there's a few old guys who collect on the weekends with their bikes. Most are restored or customized. Talked with them once. They are all car or motorcycle guys who got frustrated with projects that took years and thousands of dollars to finish, if ever. Then when they had their hot rod together, they couldn't really use it. A bicycle project is an achievable goal- and you can ride it!

    I love working on bikes. A properly tuned bike is a joy to ride.
    Pronounced "Murkle"

  22. #22
    Senior Member rdtompki's Avatar
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    There is nothing routine-maintenance wise that the average Joe/Jill can do themselves. Congratulations on taking the initiative. Bottom brackets and headsets may require tools that don't make economic sense and a wheel truing stand is very much personal preference. I only have two bikes, one single and one tandem, and in a combined 16K miles haven't had to touch a wheel so I don't know that wheel truing makes sense in my situation, but a lot of folks get pleasure out of fixing up older bikes and such where the full range of tools makes a lot of sense.
    Rick T
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  23. #23
    Senior Member teachme's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GeorgeBMac View Post
    Very cool! It even has a bottle opener?
    ... I have a multi-tool, but NOTHING like that! Not even in the ball park...

    BTW, mine has gotten a lot of use -- but never by me. It's all the other riders stuck on the side of the trail trying to tighten this or that...
    Yeah, the guy at my LBS said I could virtually disassemble my entire bike with this tool. Disassembling would be the easy part; reassembling would be a whole nuther story!
    Official member of the Brotherhood of Clyde...

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  24. #24
    Senior Member Retro Grouch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teachme View Post
    Yeah, the guy at my LBS said I could virtually disassemble my entire bike with this tool. Disassembling would be the easy part; reassembling would be a whole nuther story!
    Yeah - right! Try removing and reinstalling a water bottle cage and get back to us.

  25. #25
    Senior Member Timtruro's Avatar
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    +1, it's a nice tool kit, but expensive. Buying as you need them will mean the tools are those you wll use more often. Nice set of allen wrenches, pedal and possibly a bottom bracket tool and so forth. One set I use a lot is a small torque wrench set in newton meters, bike Nashbar has a good set at a reasonable price.
    "If there are no cigars in heaven, I shall not go." -Mark Twain

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