gif4445

I'm 55 and just got serious about cycling a couple years ago. Bought a Trek 1.2 and did the Nebraska ride (BRAN) a couple times and an unsupported 500 mile ride to the mountains. Finally last March, I determined that I was a touring type of rider, so I bought a Surly LHT. I have put about 3400 miles on it since and love the comfortable ride. Have only been on my Trek a couple times since I purchased the LHT. I am toying with the idea of replacing the Trek with a different road bike, for the times that I do want to ride a little faster. I know some of the improved comfort of the LHT over the Trek can be attributed to its steel composition, but what part does the geometry play? I know I prefer the longer wheelbase of the LHT over the 1.2. Would carbon be a noticeable improvement over aluminum? Or am I doomed to choose either comfort or speed? Any suggestions would be appreciated.

MinnMan

It's material and it's geometry - both.

You seem to be headed in the direction of one of the "plush" road bikes such as a Specialized Roubaix or the (new) Trek Domane. THese are carbon bikes. If you want to compare directly the influence of geometry vs. frame material, you can test-ride a Specialized Secteur, which is Al-framed, but has the relaxed Roubaix geometry.

I'm pretty sure there are steel-framed touring bikes that are lighter than the Surly, but I don't know too much about them.

lee kenney

I now have a LHT, had a few bikes, 66 vintage 45 cyclng years . My one observation about the LHT is loaded with bags and racks {Front and rear** it still feels good , not twitchy !I have the 26 in wheel model and a nice supple tire only improves that comfort. {Panaracer T serve 1.75**

gif4445

Yes Lee, I love the LHT for touring, loaded or semi-loaded. I'm just looking for a bike that I can take on a fast unloaded run. I'm in rural Nebraska, but live close to a 30,000 population town that has a group that does a weekly 25 mile ride. Fast group does 20-22, slow group does 18 or so. I can keep up with the second group on my Trek, but not especially fun for me. Maybe could do it on the LHT if I'm trained up. Just looking for a light, at least sorta comfortable alternative.

chasm54

I'm not that familiar with the US market, but if what you are looking for is touring bike geometry, yes there are lots of tourers that are lighter than the LHT. Some of that is accounted for by frame material but ere are steel tourers too that are lighter, at the expense of the very large load-carrying capacity that something like an LHT affords. Have a look at the Raleigh Clubman, for example, which is an elegant steel bike which if you put a rack on it will deal with moderate loads for touring but is light enough to feel a bit livelier. If you want to spend bigger, there are Ti tourers, I think Van Nicholas make one.

Alternatively, as MinnMan suggests, you might try some of the road bikes with slightly more relaxed geometry. The Giant Defy as opposed to their TCR, for example, as well as the Roubaix or Domane. These won't be ideal for touring unless you're going ultralight, though they will cope with saddlebag/barbag combinations. And they are as fast as an out-and-out race bike.

As for the materials vs geometry debate, frame design and tyres make more difference to your comfort than does choice of material. Having said that, different materials do have different characteristics. What is more comfortable depends on personal preference, but I do feel (it may be prejudice based on the particular bikes I've ridden) that both carbon and steel will tend to damp out road buzz better than aluminium.

berner

I ride a Specialized Secteur which has an aluminum frame and triple chain rings. This bike weighed 22 pounds originally and a bit less now. It seems fairly quick but it's not a 15 pound carbon racer. Of interest to me is a long wheel base and mount points for a rear rack. With 25 pounds in panniers the bike handles fine. I'm very satisfied with this bike but that does not stop me from looking at other beauties. My roving eye has spied the Gunnar Sport which has a long wheelbase also and may be worth a look. https://gunnarbikes.com/site/bikes/sport/

prathmann

Primarily geometry and shock-absorbing components such as the saddle, tires, and, to a lesser extent, handlebars and wheels.

fietsbob

the (new) Trek Domane is also offered in an Aluminum Frame version.
for less $ than the CF line.

But Road bike is a shorter rear than a touring bike, But lots of people Tour on a Road bike.
just alter the gearing to suit.

Comfort can come from getting the bike fit right, regardless of type.

NOS88

Comfort and speed are not mutually exclusive. However, there is a point at which you are playing one against the other. In terms of frame materials, steel, carbon, aluminum and titanium can all be fabricated to create great bikes. It’s the way the material is used that makes for different ride characteristics. I think your best bet would be to go to a good LBS and tell them what you are looking for in ride characteristics and see what they recommend. I suspect they will steer you toward a comfort bike like the Specialized Roubaix or the Giant Defy. I’d be very leery of taking the recommendations of anyone who used phrases like, “Carbon is much more comfortable than aluminum.” Either they don’t know what they are talking about, think you’re a dolt, or have inventory they are trying to sell. In any event, it’s probably in your best interest to test ride as many bikes as you can in the comfort range. The one thing that concerns me is that even with the carbon comfort bikes, they are not going to have the long wheelbase/chain stays that a typical touring bike has. If this is a large part of why you like your current ride, you may be looking for a lighter and stiffer touring frame that will allow more of the pedaling energy to be effectively transferred into driving the bike forward. But lots of test rides will help you know.

10 Wheels

Take a Good Look at the other riders and the bikes in the fast group.

Chances are they All have Younger Motors

B. Carfree

I believe most of comfort comes from a proper fit. However, once that is dealt with, there is no doubt that things like a longer wheelbase, relaxed geometry and a proper amount of rake and trail can make a great deal of difference. If you want the bike to be lighter, look to your wheels and other components; there's a lot of weight-loss that can be bought. Of course, the engine usually has the most excess weight and it can be dropped for free.

Steel bikes can be just as light, stiff and comfortable as carbon. Maybe Luis will chime in here with how much his Rodriguez weighs (I'm sure it's UCI illegally light). If you want to blow a bit of dough, maybe you should look into a custom rig. If you do, be sure to work with someone you trust to get the fit right.

qcpmsame 

It sounds like you are looking for a bike similar in geometry to a Specialized Roubaix/Secteur, as said above, and the Zertz system will add to the comfort. They are both light and well thought of by most riders. If you will ride CF I'd say a look at the Roubaix would be worth the time, I believe I read that Specialized had taken a triple option off the board for the Roubaix as far as gearing (I could vry well be wrong and you could certainly work out a deal for a swap with your LBS.) I went form a triple to a double on my R500 and have a compact double on my CAAD 10 4 and I have not missed the extra low gear, as of yet. There are so many manufacturers now that I wouldn't pretend I know what all is available in this configuration and geometry, research, test rides and patience are probably your best shot, best of luck in your search.

Bill

big john

I have a Gunnar Sport which I've put about 30,000 miles on. It does well on rough roads but I wouldn't call it "plush". I use 23mm tires and 36 spoke wheels.
The frame has long chainstays and eyelets for a rack and weighs about 4 pounds. Many carbon frames weigh 2 pounds or less, so it will build a couple pounds heavier than one of them.

FrenchFit 

I have a Roubaix Comp, one of last triples, and a dozen other bikes. It's an improvement in weight, stiffness and aero you're looking for..and the Roubaix delivers. My mph jumps up significantly when I ride that bike. The bike is comfortable for long rides, even after I slammed the stem and went with a more agressive wheelset. However, I am not in love with the ride qualities of carbon. There is a certain deadness to carbon; for me it just takes the fun out of riding. So, you can have comfort and speed but the quality/characterisitics of that ride is going to be a matter of individual preference. My Roubaix is semi-permanently parked.

gerv 

What about a Surly Cross Check.? Chain stays are around 42cm... so little shorter than a LHT. It's a pretty nice ride and there are many other steel frame bikes in this class. Soma has the Double Cross. Salsa has a similar model... just to name a few.

gif4445

Following some suggestions here, I did take a brief trip to the LBS and looked at a Roubaix. Sport I believe? Not enough time or good enough weather to test ride. Hopefully that will come later this week. I did check the specs and looks like wheelbase is closer to my LHT than the Trek 1.2. That should be an improvement, I would think. While we are talking fit and geometry, here is a further question. Since one poster brought it up, what about a custom built bike? If $$$ is no object, would a custom build be that much better than selecting the best (comfort, performance) bike available? (or should I start a new thread?)

chasm54

Some custom builders are superb, of course. But unless one has unusual proportions or other requirements (for example, I have a clubmate with fused vertebrae who has a custom road bike with an exceptionally tall headtube) there is no need to go custom in order to get a bike that fits perfectly and rides well. Mass produced frames can be made to fit almost all of us with judicious selection of stem length, seatposts etc.etc.

And going custom isn't risk-free. A good frame builder can build you a bike with the characteristics you say you want, but you have to be very clear about your requirements. There are people out there with buyer remorse because they specified something that they thought they would like...

If I were you I'd shop around among the stock frames before deciding that custom is the way to go.

wobblyoldgeezer

[QUOTE=gif4445;14940507]Following some suggestions here, I did take a brief trip to the LBS and looked at a Roubaix. Sport I believe? QUOTE]

Roubaix - very popular, very succesful commercially - must say something.

Lots of nippy tourists speak highly of this - but maybe not different enought to the LHT? I suspect lighter, though

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5op0wgJjsKo

wobblyoldgeezer

Here's this years, next model up

(Sorry if I come across as a sales rep - honestly I'm not - but I bought a Rocky Mountain road bike 4 years ago since when I've been as happy with it as a dog with 2 tails!)

https://www.bikes.com/main+en+01_102+...ATID=26&Y=2012

dannwilliams

I have a LHT and I love the comfort of the ride, but it is a hard bike to love as it is a lot of work to ride fast. I had a Kona Sutra before the LHT, another touring bike, and I could ride it about 2 mph slower than my road bike with the same amount of effort based on heart rate monitor data. The LHT is about 4 or 5 mph slower for the same effort. I believed the hype I read about the LHT and how everyone loved them, causing me to sell the Kona and buy the Surly. It will never be an all-rounder for me, I think a CC frame would fit that better than a touring bike.

BikeWNC

The carbon deadness you feel is due to the material count and layup of the frame not the carbon itself. Ride a SWorks frame and you will notice the lively road feel. Any material can be made to ride to a certain extent, within the boundaries of frame construction, to ride however you want. Though there will always be tradeoffs depending on the material you choose. In my opinion, carbon maximizes the best of the characteristics I like in a frame.

BikeWNC

Comparing the ride of a LHT to a Roubaix is difficult. The LHT is designed for maximum stability while the Roubaix, though somewhat relaxed from an all around race bike like the Tarmac, is still designed to be a race bike, just pushed more towards comfort. My dealer says most riders should be on the Roubaix even though most steer towards the Tarmac at first. I've had both and like the Tarmac for how I ride most of the time. I'd certinly get another Roubaix though in the future.

irwin7638

I had an LHT until I upgraded the frame to a Rivendell Hunqapillar, it's not a lighter frame, but I liked it enough to buy a Sam Hillborne which is almost identical geometry but lighter tubing. I find the Riv's are as, if not more, comfortable for all day riding than the LHT, but they also handle better. I always felt like I was steering the LHT around rather than just leaning and riding through the corners. The Riv's both handle much more quickly that the LHT.

Marc

martianone

IMHO - you want a comfortable, fast, responsive bike to primarily ride on the road - not really the LHT geometry or build. A road bike, but not the racing geometry ? Consider a Soma ES or Surly Pacer ? Someone mentioned a CrossCheck. Like you, i was looking for the same ride, tried most of the models listed and plenty more - the fit was't just right for me. Echoing another's comment - no matter what you get - get the fit. You ask about custom - that was my route - I went with a Gunnar Roadie with their made to measure geometry. My bike can be best described as a steel frame road racing bike, with touring geometry, set up like a cyclocross bike with a mix of mountain and road bike components. LBS was very patient during the fitting(s), I picked most of parts, wheelset, etc - in the end I got a perfect (for me) ride and fit. The completed bike weights about a pound more than my older AL road bike. My components were primarily mid level - total cost - right in the area of ultegra level carbon relaxed geometry racing bikes. Cannot figure out why I didn't do this sooner.

bwfox

I have a mid level 2013 Roubaix Compact, with wide range SRAM Apex.My other steel bike is a Salsa Fargo which would be very similar to your LHT. I really like the Roubaix for long day rides, just a tube, a multi tool and a co2 and a couple of water bottles. Light and fast, (by my standards), 59 and 1 leg....