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Old 12-27-12, 11:58 AM   #1
WC89
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Cyclists Hate?

Just venting here. Some time between last Friday morning and the next Saturday morning, on a 3.5 mile stretch of nicely paved, lightly traveled (by cars), 2-lane road (no shoulder), through tree-lined watershed property and very low-density residential properties, some lowly individual scattered broken glass every few hundred feet or so The road is not even a popular cyclist road - I don't know why it's not popular, b/c to be such a nice stretch of road it's a little rare that I see another cyclist. I've had no hostile encounters with any motorists, except for one a couple of months ago who layed on his horn while passing me at high speed. It's the kind of road that when cars pass, there's always plenty of room and rare for a passing car to have traffic in the opposite lane to contend with. I reported to local PD just so they would be aware. I also reported to local DPW w/ a request for a street-sweeper.
What a big AH that did such a thing!

Last edited by WC89; 12-27-12 at 03:14 PM.
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Old 12-27-12, 12:12 PM   #2
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For many people, bicycles are supposed to be purchased and then hung up in the garage. I don't think they believe that bicycles should ever be ridden. They get apoplectic if someone rides on their road. Yup, the road belongs to them personally because they paid their whopping $79.99 in license tag fees that year. Doing so means that every road in the USA belongs to them. So if a cyclist is out on their road, the cyclist is going to become the target of their righteous wrath. If you think I am kidding, I have lost count of the number of motorists who have yelled precisely those sentiments at me through their windows, usually when I am waiting for a traffic light to turn. Oddly enough, I seem to meet with more motorist hostility on Sunday mornings.
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Old 12-27-12, 01:28 PM   #3
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I have never understood why motorists should "hate" cyclists. I find that when I am driving, I am delayed FAR more by other motorists than by any cyclist.

It's funny that motorists will often get stuck behind big trucks, but they never yell, scream, or throw beer cans at the truck driver.

Is it because they are stupid that motorists tend to consider cyclists to be their biggest enemy, when in truth their biggest enemy is other drivers? Or are they too heavily influenced by the media? If motorists could just get other drivers off the road (and onto bikes or into buses by extolling the virtues of cycling or mass transit), they'd have much fewer volume delays and traffic jams. But no, they insist on bullying cyclists because... cyclists are easier to bully? The type of personality that bullies cyclists is basically too cowardly to go after the real causes of blocked traffic (namely themselves)?

I think we're basically just dealing with typical bullies. It would be nice if the media realized this and stopped fomenting conflict between cyclists and motorists in order to sell ads.

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Old 12-27-12, 02:38 PM   #4
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I think we're basically just dealing with typical bullies. It would be nice if the media realized this and stopped fomenting conflict between cyclists and motorists in order to sell ads.

Luis
Journalists do any number of stupid things. This is just one of them.

If you get paranoid, you can mount a camcorder on your bike. People have been fired/arrested for irresponsible behavior towards bikes that was caught "on tape". I have one for such an occasion, but I rarely ride with it and since I've bought it I've had 0 run-ins.
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Old 12-27-12, 03:57 PM   #5
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I have never understood why motorists should "hate" cyclists. I find that when I am driving, I am delayed FAR more by other motorists than by any cyclist.
I'll add that I suffer more delays by motorists than motorists suffer from me when I am riding. I think there is some sort of primitive tribal thing going on with some of the bike haters.
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Old 12-27-12, 06:29 PM   #6
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Get used to it . . .
Have ridden 300,000+ miles in 30+ states, Canada, Mexico. Yes, have ridden in Maryland too; drivers/roads are no worse than elsewhere.
At age 80 I pedaled 5,200+ miles in 2012.
Save your anger!
Pedal on!
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Old 12-27-12, 08:15 PM   #7
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I was traveling with a few director level guys at my company last and we got on the subject of hobbies. They were both in to guns, I brought up bikes. One of the guys said "mountain bikes?" I said, "No, mostly road bikes." He went on to tell me about the packs of riders in his town that aggressively take over the roads, cause all kinds of traffic congestion, mayhem, and heart burn in general. He asked if it was absolutely necessary for cyclists to ride on the roads. After some explanation of why the roads are the safest, and really the only place for road cyclists to ride; I told him I really just boils down to common respect. Bicycles need to respect drivers, and that respect needs to be reciprocated. If everyone keep their heads on straight it works.

Don't know if I shifted his thinking at all. Probably not.
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Old 12-28-12, 01:04 AM   #8
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Get used to it . . .
I guess that's why I'll never be a road bike guy...I just don't have that passion. I enjoy riding on the road. I would enjoy it much more if I lived in a more rural area then LA. For me it takes the fun out of it and just adds stress.

Heck, biking is just cross training from running for me...I don't need the tension every time I go out. Especially when I can hop on a trail less then a mile from house. I'll probably get on the Litespeed (reluctantly) tomorrow and pedal over to the Rose Bowl and back. Then again, my frame of mind in the morning might be...who needs it...and just climb the fire roads on my Ellsworth.

Your dedication is admirable Rudy.
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Old 12-28-12, 01:45 AM   #9
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What makes you think that the glass was "scattered" (which kind of implies the person had a stock of broken glass and was purposefully distributing it at various intervals) or that it had anything to do with bicyclists?

My guess is that it was just a couple of nimrods more or less randomly tossing bottles on the road just for fun and because they're idiots. But no particular malice towards cyclists.
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Old 12-28-12, 02:44 AM   #10
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Don't many problems but there are always a few nutters about that are out to cause problems. Or are they just out to cause problems? We have a local MUP that runs through the town and is a favourite haunt for the "Youth" of the area. They have a few choice spots where they congregate and it is under the bridgs that go over the MUP. Whether they realise it or not-The fires they light in the path and the beer bottles they leave around are going to cause problems. In the words of the local Authorities---They have to go somewhere and it is better they do it out of the public view rather than in the town.

The mere fact that they ruin the MUP with the broken glass- the rubbish they leave and the damage to the path seems to be secondary. And I have to agree- I don't want them acting the way they do in the town but I would prefer it if they act in the correct manner wherever they are.
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Old 12-28-12, 03:33 AM   #11
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I guess that's why I'll never be a road bike guy...I just don't have that passion. I enjoy riding on the road. I would enjoy it much more if I lived in a more rural area then LA. For me it takes the fun out of it and just adds stress.

Heck, biking is just cross training from running for me...I don't need the tension every time I go out. Especially when I can hop on a trail less then a mile from house. I'll probably get on the Litespeed (reluctantly) tomorrow and pedal over to the Rose Bowl and back. Then again, my frame of mind in the morning might be...who needs it...and just climb the fire roads on my Ellsworth.

Your dedication is admirable Rudy.
I am pretty much of the same mind: I can hop on a number of trails quite easily. It avoids the danger as well as the hassle of the roads.

At least there I can settle down into a nice, pleasant, steady rhythm and enjoy the ride and beauty of the nature around me. Around here I would either be on a busy highway holding up traffic or stopping every few hundred yards for an intersection or something -- and to get to a back road would take longer than it does to get to a trail.

A 100 miles or so of rails to trails are within 10 miles of my house and they are just safer, easier and more pleasant than on the road.
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Old 12-28-12, 06:34 AM   #12
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What makes you think that the glass was "scattered" (which kind of implies the person had a stock of broken glass and was purposefully distributing it at various intervals) or that it had anything to do with bicyclists?

My guess is that it was just a couple of nimrods more or less randomly tossing bottles on the road just for fun and because they're idiots. But no particular malice towards cyclists.
Yup - like graffiti and other personal property damage - its usually not personally directed. Just a few people with no regard for ANYBODY.
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Old 12-28-12, 06:39 AM   #13
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I was traveling with a few director level guys at my company last and we got on the subject of hobbies. They were both in to guns, I brought up bikes.
I'm into guns and biking, two sport hobbies that are unlikely to mix. Unless a biathlon is invented where you sprint for a few miles followed by a 500 ft 15% climb, then dismount the bike while unslinging the rifle and, with a 105% heart rate, try to hit a target.

Naw, I think I'll keep the sports separate.
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Old 12-28-12, 06:47 AM   #14
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Get used to it . . .
Have ridden 300,000+ miles in 30+ states, Canada, Mexico. Yes, have ridden in Maryland too; drivers/roads are no worse than elsewhere.
At age 80 I pedaled 5,200+ miles in 2012.
Save your anger!
Pedal on!
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A-freaking-MEN. No sheeeiiittt... about time one reads some sanity around these 'parts'.

Roll your eyes... do the yawn routine.. act bored. Petal on.......... world is full of nuts... not all of them in cars or riding bikes.
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Old 12-28-12, 07:19 AM   #15
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I just find it amusing that many motorists who feel that cyclists are holding up traffic have to slow down to our speed in order to tell us that.
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Old 12-28-12, 07:32 AM   #16
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What makes you think that the glass was "scattered" (which kind of implies the person had a stock of broken glass and was purposefully distributing it at various intervals) or that it had anything to do with bicyclists?

My guess is that it was just a couple of nimrods more or less randomly tossing bottles on the road just for fun and because they're idiots. But no particular malice towards cyclists.
I wonder if they were beer bottles?
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Old 12-28-12, 09:18 AM   #17
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Get used to it . . . Rudy/zonatandem
I ride on the road about 90% of the time, with the last 10% split between MUPs and mountain bike trails and I have to say I totally agree with Rudy. I very rarely, i.e. almost never, have incidents with motorists. Occasionally, sure, it happens.

But . . . like Rudy says, "Save your anger! Pedal on!"

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Old 12-28-12, 09:38 AM   #18
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Tacks on the road are an occasional occurrence on rides such as "Ride the Rockies."

Why?

Jealousy?
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Old 12-28-12, 09:58 AM   #19
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I'm into guns and biking, two sport hobbies that are unlikely to mix. ....
FWIW, I've hunted by mtb, as have a number of my friends.
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Old 12-28-12, 10:51 AM   #20
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After recent news, it should be clear that there are many, and it seems increasing numbers, of crazy and violent people committing senseless acts. When on my bike, I'm all about making friends and riding defensively and I drive my car the same way. I don't think that riding with tails between our legs serves any purpose but being friendly and very careful and alert does.
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Old 12-28-12, 11:20 AM   #21
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FWIW, I've hunted by mtb, as have a number of my friends.
Did you shoot any mtn bikes? Roasted mtn bike - yum!!
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Old 12-28-12, 11:37 AM   #22
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Compared to most here, my total miles cycled on the road in my life pales in comparison. Like I've mentioned a few times, I'm a runner who has logged over 60,000 miles running over 30 years, many of them on the road.

I can say I've never had any aggressive actions towards me in my limited experiences on the road. My apprehension to riding on the road in LA comes from the cars coming within a few feet of you with no regard to slowing down. Also sucking the exhaust from their cars. Add in running stop lights and signs, not "seeing you" despite you're wearing screaming bright orange/yellow/lime.

I get it with regard to "get over it" or "just do it". I've run in both NYC and Rome, two of the most harrowing experiences with cars I've ever had. But my feelings were...sc**w it, I'm getting in my run regardless of the cars. There's definitely a point, if we all end up doing all this stuff long enough, where as runners or cyclists you have to develop that sense of "no fear". If we didn't, we'd be running on a treadmill or riding a stationary bike at the gym...how much fun is that of course..

My wife is a lifetime auto insurance claims manager. She's currently with Automobile Club (AAA) of Southern Ca. She works at home and is constantly showing me the latest bike or motorcycle accident (in fact as I'm typing this, her adjustor on speaker phone is telling her about the latest accident involving a cyclist) that as come in on her computer...pictures and all. Yesterday it was some guy who wiped out on his $14,000 Pinerallo coming down Angeles Crest on Christmas day. A car had forced him into the side of the mountain on one of the sections with a very narrow shoulder. The guy's banged up pretty good but will live. Of course in typical RB fashion, all he cares about is if the Auto Club will cover his bike... She told me that bikes and motorcycles make up for at least 35% of the claims. Many of them (she estimates 60%) fatal or end up with the cyclist being in a wheelchair.

Every time I go out on my RB she gives me a Saying ..."why can't you just ride on the mountain bike and do the trails?" I come back with..."I gotta try and keep what little road chops I have up". Her..."ok but make sure you have your phone with you and where are you going ?! ". Me..."got it and over to the Rose Bowl, the usual "..

One of her fellow claims manager's husband is a former LAPD/CHP motorcycle cop. He's rolled those things more times then I can remember she said. He's retired and still likes to ride with other ex-cop buds. She threatened to divorce him if he didn't sell the motorcycle. He did got a bike and now just tools around the bike path down by the beach....she's ok with that.

As I'm typing this I'm putting on my shorts. Temps have risen a bit and morning rush hour has cleared out. I'm heading out for my 20 miler over to the Rose Bowl and back.

Last edited by Dave Ferris; 12-28-12 at 11:45 AM.
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Old 12-28-12, 11:51 AM   #23
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We're told here to say to drivers who ask why we pay no taxes to ride on the road that drivers pay an emissions tax not road tax because of the toxic fumes their cars pour out.

Cyclists dont pour out such emissions therefore pay no tax.
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Old 12-28-12, 12:03 PM   #24
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Much like Stapfam and others have said a lot of the debris left on the road have nothing to do personally with cyclists it is either thoughtless litter or thoughtless youth. Glass and other things tossed on city basketball courts, tennis, even open handball courts aren't directed and people playing basketball, tennis or handball they are directed at society in general. They are parts of an act of defiance saying, "we don't care and that is just who we are." I have seen broken glass in places where no one cycles, tacks on running paths, Trash cans knocked over on hiking trails and I imagine the same type of people are responsible for all of it. We just have to do as other cyclists, hikers, runners, walkers and even drivers have to do when the same kind of people toss roofing nails on roadways, realize these problems are a minority of the things we deal with and keep doing we enjoy.
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Old 12-28-12, 12:11 PM   #25
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We're told here to say to drivers who ask why we pay no taxes to ride on the road that drivers pay an emissions tax not road tax because of the toxic fumes their cars pour out.

Cyclists dont pour out such emissions therefore pay no tax.
It's not just the emissions. Cycling advocates will tell you that motorists do not pay the full cost of the infrastructure they use. They are subsidized by non-motorists, such as cyclists who do not own cars. It's not the cyclist getting a free ride, it's the motorist!

And the costs don't even include the monumental health care expenses required to address victims of collisions of autos.

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