Unbiased Review of Parrafin Chain Lubing
#126
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OK, here's the official video:
This concludes my review. I've decided to use paraffin lubing from now on because
(1) It takes less time and bother than oil-based lubing
(2) I don't get chain tatoos
(3) My hands don't get dirty if I need to handle the chain on a ride
(4) I like the looks of a clean chain
(5) I expect that I will get more life out of each chain (less road grit in the rollers.
(6) I don't need to spend time wiping and re-oiling the chain after every few rides (when I'm tired)
(7) It's less expensive
(1) It takes less time and bother than oil-based lubing
(2) I don't get chain tatoos
(3) My hands don't get dirty if I need to handle the chain on a ride
(4) I like the looks of a clean chain
(5) I expect that I will get more life out of each chain (less road grit in the rollers.
(6) I don't need to spend time wiping and re-oiling the chain after every few rides (when I'm tired)
(7) It's less expensive
Last edited by Zinger; 07-09-13 at 08:43 PM.
#127
Senior Member
I put on a new chain on 4/22/13 and rode with regular chain oil for 275 miles.
I switched to paraffin lube on 5/17/13, and rode 801 miles.
I cannot detect any elongation with the tape measure. My chain check tool of course shows everything is OK.
I could tell you when it elongates enough to be replaced, but I don't think that's going to tell you anything. The elongation depends on riding style, environment, road grit type, etc, and there are wide variations even among riders who use the same lube.
My 8-speed chain only costs about $20, so improvements in chain life aren't as important to me as convenience, lack of chain tattoos, and looks.
I switched to paraffin lube on 5/17/13, and rode 801 miles.
I cannot detect any elongation with the tape measure. My chain check tool of course shows everything is OK.
I could tell you when it elongates enough to be replaced, but I don't think that's going to tell you anything. The elongation depends on riding style, environment, road grit type, etc, and there are wide variations even among riders who use the same lube.
My 8-speed chain only costs about $20, so improvements in chain life aren't as important to me as convenience, lack of chain tattoos, and looks.
The wear comparison, as you note, is a pretty individual thing and there is wide variance between riders. The only real basis for comparison would be lifetime of the a chain before and after on the same bike with the same rider in total miles.
I will say this though, there is a wide variance in lubes and the effect on chain wear. I used to get about 1500 miles out of a chain using Dumonde tech lube. With Chain L, I get nearly twice that so it's not a fluke and the lube matters. I'd also go a bit out on a limb here and say that a more persistent lube is going to do better for chain wear than a less persistent one - and that may be the benefit.
As far as the cleaning of the paraffin goes, I think that once you go paraffin on a chain you probably need to stay there. I don't see any way that a substance like paraffin is going to be easily cleaned out from the inside of the links and off the surfaces of the rollers. I would also think that it would make a mess if you tried to clean it, didn't get it all off (hard to see how that would happen) and then lubed with something else.
J.
#128
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I'm not sure I'd agree with that. If you decide to go with something else after trying paraffin, why would you need to remove any paraffin remaining? It wouldn't interfere with any other lubricant you would use. I know that if I switch back to something else I'm sure not going to worry about any paraffin still on the chain when I do. Who knows, the combination just could be the "magic elixir" of chain lubes!
#129
Senior Member
I'm an engineer but not a chemist. I suppose it would cause issues with either a reaction or in preventing the other newer lube from bonding with the chain.
This is a problem with DuMonde's Lube. If you don't get the old oil based lube off, it really turns into a mess (for example).
J.
This is a problem with DuMonde's Lube. If you don't get the old oil based lube off, it really turns into a mess (for example).
J.
#130
Señor Blues
I've been following this thread, and I think I want to do it. I just changed a cassette and I've measured and cut the new chain to length. But...
As you probably know, new chains typically come with a waxy, greasy kind of coating. It's my understanding that the reason for the coating is mainly to prevent stored, new chains from rusting, and is not really meant for lubrication while functioning. Whatever the reason, my question is, should I somehow try to remove the coating before dipping the chain in the hot wax? Or, will the hot parraffin remove or otherwise displace the waxy coating? I hope I can get some kind of response from those who have done this. My plan is to do this tomorrow (Friday) if possible. Thanks for any help.
As you probably know, new chains typically come with a waxy, greasy kind of coating. It's my understanding that the reason for the coating is mainly to prevent stored, new chains from rusting, and is not really meant for lubrication while functioning. Whatever the reason, my question is, should I somehow try to remove the coating before dipping the chain in the hot wax? Or, will the hot parraffin remove or otherwise displace the waxy coating? I hope I can get some kind of response from those who have done this. My plan is to do this tomorrow (Friday) if possible. Thanks for any help.
#132
Senior Member
People know that different conditions will influence chain wear irrespective of the lubricant used.
People like you also say you get 1500miles out of a chain. But we don't have the other metrics that count -- such as number of speeds, manufacturer, design, and most importantly, the point at which you say the chain is worn out.
I can say I have got 11,000km out of a chain, and all I used was motor oil, but would it be any use to you?
PS: I think TromboneAl has covered a lot of these metrics, and now the length. I hope he continues to measure length. Sometimes a chain will suddenly wear a lot more quickly after appearing to be OK for many miles.
Oh, and I might add in relation to chain checkers, a favourite story of mine. A colleague brought in his chain-checker in to work one day, and unsolicited, measured the wear on my bike's chain. He stood up and said: "No, that's too worn. You have to get a new one". I pointed out the chain was new and had been on the bike a week.
#133
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My point was that at the start of this experiment, I had no bias. I was neutral as to which was better. I was not prejudiced towards paraffin or oil. If it had been more trouble and effort, I would have reported that in an unbiased way. If I were a paraffin manufacturer, I'd be biased, and my subjective evaluations could not be trusted.
Note that I am no longer unbiased. I like paraffin much better than oil now.
#134
Senior Member
Something can be subjective, yet unbiased.
My point was that at the start of this experiment, I had no bias. I was neutral as to which was better. I was not prejudiced towards paraffin or oil. If it had been more trouble and effort, I would have reported that in an unbiased way. If I were a paraffin manufacturer, I'd be biased, and my subjective evaluations could not be trusted.
Note that I am no longer unbiased. I like paraffin much better than oil now.
My point was that at the start of this experiment, I had no bias. I was neutral as to which was better. I was not prejudiced towards paraffin or oil. If it had been more trouble and effort, I would have reported that in an unbiased way. If I were a paraffin manufacturer, I'd be biased, and my subjective evaluations could not be trusted.
Note that I am no longer unbiased. I like paraffin much better than oil now.
As I said after you measured the chain, my interest was piqued. Genuinely.
I, too, have been in the camp which says it seems all too hard, and the results all too short and doubtful. Heck, I have used motor oil for years and even WD40, all with what I consider to be acceptable results, but in the face of vehement arguments against both.
But I like to think I have an open mind on many things, and if you can prove to me through this thread that paraffin works in terms of reduced wear, longevity and cleanliness, I will give it a try even though my conditions may well be a little more arduous than yours.
One of the things I really like is that you are servicing the thread, rather than just saying your were going to do, then let it trail off after first week.
#135
Señor Blues
#136
Senior Member
And this is where the thread falls down. While it might seem unbiased, it isn't because it relies almost totally on subjective assessments of visual appearance and noise. The true measure is still the length of the chain. We have a base point now to deal with because one measurement has indicated the length of the chain is the same after a certain number of miles.
People know that different conditions will influence chain wear irrespective of the lubricant used.
People like you also say you get 1500miles out of a chain. But we don't have the other metrics that count -- such as number of speeds, manufacturer, design, and most importantly, the point at which you say the chain is worn out.
I can say I have got 11,000km out of a chain, and all I used was motor oil, but would it be any use to you?
PS: I think TromboneAl has covered a lot of these metrics, and now the length. I hope he continues to measure length. Sometimes a chain will suddenly wear a lot more quickly after appearing to be OK for many miles.
Oh, and I might add in relation to chain checkers, a favourite story of mine. A colleague brought in his chain-checker in to work one day, and unsolicited, measured the wear on my bike's chain. He stood up and said: "No, that's too worn. You have to get a new one". I pointed out the chain was new and had been on the bike a week.
People know that different conditions will influence chain wear irrespective of the lubricant used.
People like you also say you get 1500miles out of a chain. But we don't have the other metrics that count -- such as number of speeds, manufacturer, design, and most importantly, the point at which you say the chain is worn out.
I can say I have got 11,000km out of a chain, and all I used was motor oil, but would it be any use to you?
PS: I think TromboneAl has covered a lot of these metrics, and now the length. I hope he continues to measure length. Sometimes a chain will suddenly wear a lot more quickly after appearing to be OK for many miles.
Oh, and I might add in relation to chain checkers, a favourite story of mine. A colleague brought in his chain-checker in to work one day, and unsolicited, measured the wear on my bike's chain. He stood up and said: "No, that's too worn. You have to get a new one". I pointed out the chain was new and had been on the bike a week.
Originally Posted by JohnJ80
I used to get about 1500 miles out of a chain using Dumonde tech lube. With Chain L, I get nearly twice that so it's not a fluke and the lube matters.
That would mean that it's the same rider, same bike, same terrain, same riding habits, same chain model, but different lube. The lube would be responsible for the difference.
Pay attention.
J.
#137
Senior Member
Yes it would if I told you how much more or less chain life I got with a different lube. Just like I did in the same post from which you snipped the part that you quoted and was, therefore, out of context.
That would mean that it's the same rider, same bike, same terrain, same riding habits, same chain model, but different lube. The lube would be responsible for the difference.
Pay attention.
J.
That would mean that it's the same rider, same bike, same terrain, same riding habits, same chain model, but different lube. The lube would be responsible for the difference.
Pay attention.
J.
#138
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The solvent in it evaporates leaving a film that's attractive to dust and it's not recommended for either micrometers or clocks (from what I've read) for that reason.
And I can verify the mess that it leaves inside a mic because I've taken the spindles out and seen it. You'd do better using motor oil on a micrometer.
Now if you were to coat a chain with it before waxing, however, I'm not sure how that might work. If a film stayed under the wax that might work out. But I suspect it would interfere with the parrafin's bonding to the chain and if you spayed it onto the waxed chain the solvents in the WD40 might break down the wax coat. It would be interesting to hear from anyone who tried it. I'm still considering whether I'm going over to parrafin or not. It's not like I'm not happy with what I've got but the cleaner chain and less maintenance is appealing....The rust not so much.
When I first started cycling I remember using WD40 on chains without anything else (as well as motor oil) and, as I recall, it did pick up more grit than the Starrett M1 that I replaced it with as does generic aerosol silicone to some degree (but not so much as the WD40). It also didn't work so good at lubricating by itself. I've never tried mixing WD40 with other lubes though.
Last edited by Zinger; 07-12-13 at 01:17 AM.
#139
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It would stop rust but here's what I know about using WD40 on micrometers:
The solvent in it evaporates leaving a film that's attractive to dust and it's not recommended for either micrometers or clocks (from what I've read) for that reason.
And I can verify the mess that it leaves inside a mic because I've taken the spindles out and seen it. You'd do better using motor oil on a micrometer.
Now if you were to coat a chain with it before waxing, however, I'm not sure how that might work. If a film stayed under the wax that might work out. But I suspect it would interfere with the parrafin's bonding to the chain and if you spayed it onto the waxed chain the solvents in the WD40 might break down the wax coat. It would be interesting to hear from anyone who tried it. I'm still considering whether I'm going over to parrafin or not. It's not like I'm not happy with what I've got but the cleaner chain and less maintenance is appealing....The rust not so much.
When I first started cycling I remember using WD40 on chains without anything else (as well as motor oil) and, as I recall, it did pick up more grit than the Starrett M1 that I replaced it with as does generic aerosol silicone to some degree (but not so much as the WD40). It also didn't work so good at lubricating by itself. I've never tried mixing WD40 with other lubes though.
The solvent in it evaporates leaving a film that's attractive to dust and it's not recommended for either micrometers or clocks (from what I've read) for that reason.
And I can verify the mess that it leaves inside a mic because I've taken the spindles out and seen it. You'd do better using motor oil on a micrometer.
Now if you were to coat a chain with it before waxing, however, I'm not sure how that might work. If a film stayed under the wax that might work out. But I suspect it would interfere with the parrafin's bonding to the chain and if you spayed it onto the waxed chain the solvents in the WD40 might break down the wax coat. It would be interesting to hear from anyone who tried it. I'm still considering whether I'm going over to parrafin or not. It's not like I'm not happy with what I've got but the cleaner chain and less maintenance is appealing....The rust not so much.
When I first started cycling I remember using WD40 on chains without anything else (as well as motor oil) and, as I recall, it did pick up more grit than the Starrett M1 that I replaced it with as does generic aerosol silicone to some degree (but not so much as the WD40). It also didn't work so good at lubricating by itself. I've never tried mixing WD40 with other lubes though.
I'm no expert but if you wax a chain and it is going rusty WD40 should help.
WD40 is often recommended for cleaning off wax, just done a little experiment
and it certainly does. I'd spray it into a dropper bottle and use that to apply it very
sparingly (no wiping) a while after the waxing to try to extend the waxing intervals.
Gumming up clocks and micrometers (which some claim is eventual breakdown
of small quantities of organic oil additives) is not the same as the limited life
of a bicycle chain and not really relevant.
rgds, sreten.
I'll also note the relubing/waxing process has no mechanism I can
see to remove wear particles from inside the chain and IMO needs
to be repeated a of number of times before making any judgement.
Last edited by sreten; 07-12-13 at 01:04 PM.
#140
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This might be an option:
Rust-resistant chain ($28).
I do know that I want my next chain to be very shiny.
Rust-resistant chain ($28).
I do know that I want my next chain to be very shiny.
#141
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This might be an option:
Rust-resistant chain ($28).
I do know that I want my next chain to be very shiny.
Rust-resistant chain ($28).
I do know that I want my next chain to be very shiny.
You've sold me on trying it Al
Last edited by Zinger; 07-14-13 at 03:15 AM.
#142
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Here's an update:
I now have 2,090 miles on this chain, and it is still fine. I checked for stretching, and it still hasn't reached the .75 point on my Bike Hand gauge. But remember that chain stretch depends on so many variables, that this doesn't tell you anything about wear with wax.
It does get some rust on it, but I've never heard any squeaking.
Last night I thought I'd try soaking it in Ospho to remove the rust. That was probably a mistake. This morning it was a green and black goopy mess, and somewhat fused together! I'll see if I can get it cleaned up, but if not, I've already purchased this chain for the rainy season. That should solve the rust problem.
I now have 2,090 miles on this chain, and it is still fine. I checked for stretching, and it still hasn't reached the .75 point on my Bike Hand gauge. But remember that chain stretch depends on so many variables, that this doesn't tell you anything about wear with wax.
It does get some rust on it, but I've never heard any squeaking.
Last night I thought I'd try soaking it in Ospho to remove the rust. That was probably a mistake. This morning it was a green and black goopy mess, and somewhat fused together! I'll see if I can get it cleaned up, but if not, I've already purchased this chain for the rainy season. That should solve the rust problem.