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Old 02-15-14, 02:05 PM   #26
Dudelsack 
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There's so much good advice here, I need to provide some bogus insight to even things out.

Carbon bikes melt when it rains.

When it gets cold, the frame shatters.

Over 90F the frame asplodes.

They take the scraps of asploded bikes and make airplanes out of them. That's why no one in their right mind would even board an Airbus.

Glad I could help.
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Old 02-15-14, 02:19 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Tpcorr View Post
Hey tsl, thanks for the response, it made me smile.
That was the intent.

The one bike to pay particular attention to is the Bianchi, because it's using drivetrain components from Campagnolo instead of Shimano. Some would argue there's a difference in quality, and others would argue there isn't. The primary difference, once your ass is in the saddle is the ergonomics and operation of the levers. They feel different, and they operate differently. Some people prefer one over the other, and some people don't care.

At first glance, it runs counter to my usual advice--to ignore the components and focus on the frame, because you can always change components, but you'll always be stuck with the frame.

However, in this case, we're talking about different manufacturers with different design philosophies, so here, the components deserve some attention.

But only to the extent that they improve your enjoyment of the ride.
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Old 02-15-14, 02:25 PM   #28
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Had a 14 Roubaix like the one pictured in gray, exc. bike, you'll be very happy, it's quite comfortable and the zertz fittings give a certain degree of comfort on rough roads.


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So I've decided to get a new bike this spring and need some expert advice. I'm soon to be 57 and am in pretty good shape. I did a lot of riding in the 80's and 90's, mostly fast club rides and century rides. I just started riding again last spring, after a 10 year or so hiatus, and am having a blast. I currently ride my 1987 Cannondale SR500 105. I love this bike and probably have put close to 50,000 miles on it. I bought my older son a Trek 1.5 for his birthday last year and I couldn't believe how smooth and comfortable it rides.

Most of my rides will be with one or both of my boys (19 and 22), so I have my work cut out for me. I don't want them waiting on the old man too much. I'll also do club rides and would like to complete a couple of centuries, my goal is sub 6 hours. I have a lot of lower back pain and because of this I spend most of my time in the drops.

As a concession to age I've been looking at carbon frame bikes with a relaxed geometry. These bikes are fairly expensive (for me) and want to make sure my money is well spent. I don't want to start a flame war, or have this thread be a primer on carbon vs. aluminum, but I just want some assurance that carbon frames are as durable and trouble free as my aluminum frame Cannondale has been.

So I've been looking at these bikes, mostly carbon bikes with the newer Ultegra groups, the outlier is a Bianchi with the Veloce group. I don't want to spend too much over $3k. When the weather gets nicer here in the northeast I'll be in heaven test riding these bikes. For now help me with my list and tell me what you think of my choices so far.

Cannondale Synapse Carbon 3 Ultegra http://www.cannondale.com/can/catalo.../category/916/

Bianchi Intenso Veloce http://www.bianchiusa.com/bikes/road...eloce-compact/

Trek Domane 4.7 http://www.trekbikes.com/us/en/bikes...ne_4_7_compact


Specialized Roubaix SL4 Comp http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bik...-compact#specs

I don't know much about the Veloce group on the Bianchi, but that bike just looks pretty. I'd also consider these same carbon bikes with the 105 group as it seems you get a lot of bang for your buck with it. I just don't want my new bike to have older tech on it. This will probably be the last bike I'll purchase. I'm not thin skinned so tell me what you really think!

Tom
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Old 02-15-14, 02:30 PM   #29
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It has been said Quote: all things being equal, they will be..

I'm not a fan of the way the front STI shifter works , but I just put them together for others to buy.

test ride them all ..

You may like the Veloce better ,

looks like they used a FSA crank to keep the cost down .

rather than the Veloce crank .. but point of sale you can throw more money at that
and have it changed..

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Old 02-15-14, 02:31 PM   #30
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One thought you might consider... all of your brands being relatively equal, you might ask around and see which shops provide the best service and let that influence your decision. Good after-sale service is something you don't think about much when you're buying, but it can come in handy at important times, such as when you need a quick tuneup before a major event, etc.
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Old 02-15-14, 02:49 PM   #31
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When my wife and I had our bike shop we told mature, , individuals to RIDE our samples and other store samples and pick the bike that indeed spoke to them. While price can be a factor, the bike has to respond to your every demand and work with you. A LBS here allows hours of test riding for their better machines.

true story-My bike since 1983 was a Waterford Paramount I built up until a friend gave me an American made CAAD 8 with Dura Ace. Difference was night and day. At 62 and one week I competed in my first Sprint Triathlon with the Cannondale allowing me to fly. Four months later my wife registered me for Ironman Florida and said I could buy a new bike. Test rode a bunch and then got on a Giant Propel Advanced SL3 that did not have the ISP, Integrated Seatpost, cut down. Even though the seat was WAY TOO HIGH, the bike spoke to me. Other bikes I test rode were more expensive but did not speak to me as the Giant did so with my wife's permission I bought the bike.

87 windy and hard miles today but they were SWEET.

While price can be a factor, ride all the bikes you can until you find the one and go from there. YOU DESERVE IT.

Good Luck.
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Old 02-15-14, 03:43 PM   #32
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Test rode a bunch and then got on a Giant Propel Advanced SL3 that did not have the ISP, Integrated Seatpost, cut down.
There is a frame that I was really interested in that has an ISP. Everything I've read suggests avoiding it because once it's cut there is no raising the seat post ever. And, re-sale (not what I'm considering but who knows) is difficult. Just wondering how you reconcile that and if there's more I should know.
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Old 02-15-14, 04:14 PM   #33
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There is a frame that I was really interested in that has an ISP. Everything I've read suggests avoiding it because once it's cut there is no raising the seat post ever. And, re-sale (not what I'm considering but who knows) is difficult. Just wondering how you reconcile that and if there's more I should know.
Good question.

As I mentioned, the bike spoke to me and it will be the last road bike I purchase, barring catastrophic failure. If my lottery entry into the Kona Ironman World Championships is picked on April 15th, I might consider a full out TT bike.

As far as the cut post, the bike came with varying sized seat post shims totaling 20mm to raise the seat if ever needed. Doubt that will be needed for myself since I continue to become more vertically challenged as years pass.
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Old 02-15-14, 04:21 PM   #34
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I went thru the same process in December. I rode the Roubaix, the Felt Z, the new 2014 Cannondale Synapse and the Trek Domane. I rode all of them over rough roads and found the Domane to be the smoothest ride but with the best lateral stiffness so it climbs or sprints well with no discernible flex. I got the 9000 DA but all the bike shops seem to be of the opinion that the Ultegra is just as good.
As you can deal on Treks in SoCal I went with the 6 series but doubt the 4 series would feel any different. I do think any of the bikes you are looking at would be great. Be sure the shop has people who know how to fit you.
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Old 02-15-14, 04:57 PM   #35
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the only real difference between the latest DA and ultegra is DA is slightly lighter? That was my understanding


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I went thru the same process in December. I rode the Roubaix, the Felt Z, the new 2014 Cannondale Synapse and the Trek Domane. I rode all of them over rough roads and found the Domane to be the smoothest ride but with the best lateral stiffness so it climbs or sprints well with no discernible flex. I got the 9000 DA but all the bike shops seem to be of the opinion that the Ultegra is just as good.
As you can deal on Treks in SoCal I went with the 6 series but doubt the 4 series would feel any different. I do think any of the bikes you are looking at would be great. Be sure the shop has people who know how to fit you.
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Old 02-15-14, 05:27 PM   #36
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Whenever I read reviews about those bikes I always read that the Specialized is the most comfortable riding bike due to the zertz inserts on the stays and forks that take out a huge percentage of the road vibration which is why I went with titanium bike because of comfort and being old comfort becomes an issue.

However if you crash the carbon bike the chances are greater of having it destroyed. Look you can get a Lynskey (the original owner of LiteSpeed) titanium bike for that same amount of money and probably less! Adrenalin Bikes; see: http://www.adrenalinebikes.com/store...ategoryID=3074 has a selection of Lynskey's on sale, the very first one is a fantastic bike the R230, people here own those and love them, and it's only 2,775...OR...go to page 2 and scan down to the last bike called the Rouleur, this bike has a less aggressive geometry and is built for a mix of comfort and aggressiveness but not as aggressive as the R230. If you get the bike through Adrenalin you can make any component, wheel, fork, change you want and they will credit you the cost of the swap item for the new item. You can go directly through Lynskey too but they won't do swaps. Also Lynskey has the Peloton which is the one I got, it has a bit more comfort to it then the Rouleur, or if you want even more comfort they also have the Viale which is a light touring/commuter bike. Adrenalin can order either of those Silver series Peloton or Viale, if you go that route talk to Matthew, he is very knowledgeable and doesn't believe in overselling stuff that won't have any noticeable difference.

I upgraded my Peloton 105 components through Adrenalin by swapping the 105 rear to Ultegra, FSA Orbit to Cane Creek 110 headset, Dura Ace brake cables, Shimano black rs500 wheels for silver rs501 (6700) which have a slightly deeper profile, Lynskey fork for a Enve 2.0 (which from two other brands of TI bike friends have that fork makes a big difference in handling) and I paid less than you would for the Specialized even after adding in pedals and accessories I got!

Just something to consider.
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Old 02-15-14, 06:06 PM   #37
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Another thing to consider .....IMO in 10 yrs. electronic shifting will be THE thing. Everything else will be like friction shifters are today. Just sayin'.
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Old 02-15-14, 06:49 PM   #38
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what he said!!!

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Another thing to consider .....IMO in 10 yrs. electronic shifting will be THE thing. Everything else will be like friction shifters are today. Just sayin'.
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Old 02-15-14, 07:22 PM   #39
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Another thing to consider .....IMO in 10 yrs. electronic shifting will be THE thing. Everything else will be like friction shifters are today. Just sayin'.
Not sure about that. Bikes have for the most part gotten to where the add-ons are wants without compelling advantages for most people. I have a carbon frame and love it, but I'd never say in 10 years aluminum will be dead because I didn't need a carbon frame, I wanted it. Likewise with gearing; electronic is nice to a lot of people, but it's not likely to be a need for everyone. There's simply no discernible flaws in high-end manual components to warrant electronic for everyone.
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Old 02-15-14, 07:25 PM   #40
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However if you crash the carbon bike the chances are greater of having it destroyed.
Sadly, this is popular wisdom, but it's simply not true. The beauty of a composite is that it is essentially a weave, whereas traditional metals are not. Thus, when a metal frame breaks, it's done, but a carbon frame can easily be repaired by simply replacing the damaged/missing carbon with a new weave using an appropriate bonding agent. Carbon is the only material that can be repaired stronger than it was before damaged, although there may be slight appearance imperfections in a carbon repair.
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Old 02-15-14, 07:42 PM   #41
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You say you have lower back pain and will therefore spend a lot of time in the drops? Most people think a more upright position is better for their lower back issues.
I only go down in the drops when it's windy.... I mostly ride with my hands on the hoods. But... I also have a bad back and the sit-up and beg position bicycles kill my lower back. Heck even my riding lawn mower hurts my back. Bending over in the road cycling position seems to isolate my back from the bumps and jars. I guess... the bumps are absorbed in my seat/rear and my bent arms.

Road cycling works for me and my bad back too.
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Old 02-15-14, 07:44 PM   #42
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Bruce, that's the kind of thing that has me a little worried about carbon.

Tom
Well I'm not about to get involved in another steel vs carbon debate. I'm not even qualified.



I sure do like the new/old fusion look of this $1850 Surly Pacer with a carbon fork though. That's 18lbs for the 56cm model.

Lots of stuff out there to consider. No need to hurry in a decision after picking everybodies brains.
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Old 02-15-14, 07:44 PM   #43
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Two level PLIF with appliances in my lower back, no problems with the drop bars at all. It stretches things out to ride, hoods or drops, and always seems to feel much better than it did at the start of a ride, after a day at work.

Bill
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Old 02-15-14, 08:31 PM   #44
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Well I'm not about to get involved in another steel vs carbon debate. I'm not even qualified.



I sure do like the new/old fusion look of this $1850 Surly Pacer with a carbon fork though. That's 18lbs for the 56cm model.

Lots of stuff out there to consider. No need to hurry in a decision after picking everybodies brains.
Very nice bike!
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Old 02-15-14, 10:59 PM   #45
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Another thing to consider .....IMO in 10 yrs. electronic shifting will be THE thing. Everything else will be like friction shifters are today. Just sayin'.
Perhaps, but you won't find me using them...'Just sayin". It's just another way for the component corporations to find more ways to dig deeper into our pockets, and the bad part about that...we let them!

It's a lot like when we went from SIS to STI or Ergo, SIS was faster than the new stuff! the new stuff is closer to the speed of a high quality friction system. So why did we go to integrated? it cost more to buy and replace, so now it's on to electric which will cost even more. We really don't need electric shifting, hell if their going to go that far they might as well make a CVT hub and then we lazy arse rich Americans won't even have to shift anymore at all! By the way, they are working on a CVT hub, it will probably be out in about 15 years to the masses, just in time to get people to want to upgrade AGAIN.
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Old 02-15-14, 11:28 PM   #46
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I find all this fear of innovation rather amusing. I've ridden a bike with electronic shifting and it is definitely much faster and more precise than mechanical cable systems. It also eliminates all the front derailleur trimming that is necessary with most mechanical systems. The reason I didn't buy one is that they are currently a lot more expensive and I'm living off a social security check and small annuity pension. When they migrate to the lower product lines and get the prices down they will become more mainstream. As to carbon fiber frames, prices have already come down significantly to where they are available to most common folk, and much of the fear of their fragile nature is unfounded.

BTW, I rode my new CF bike today and loved every minute of it.
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Old 02-16-14, 01:49 AM   #47
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Take a look at BD ... no tax and free shipping
http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/...ura_ace_10.htm
Shimano Dura Ace, Kestrel RT1000 SL Carbon $2,595

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Old 02-16-14, 02:22 AM   #48
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. Likewise with gearing; electronic is nice to a lot of people, but it's not likely to be a need for everyone. There's simply no discernible flaws in high-end manual components to warrant electronic for everyone.
As I recall when asked about the new index shifting one of the mechanics on a pro team said most pros would never need it because they "already knew how to shift." Back then that was pretty much my take on it too.
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Old 02-16-14, 08:24 AM   #49
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As I recall when asked about the new index shifting one of the mechanics on a pro team said most pros would never need it because they "already knew how to shift." Back then that was pretty much my take on it too.
I hear you, but there's a huge difference between what's mass adopted by the pro peloton and even a typical bike consumer, even a high-end one. Pros get all their equipped furnished and manufacturers use pro racing as a way to test the viability and adaptability of various technologies. Electronic shifting isn't exactly the equivalent of going from a manual to a 5-speed automatic in a car. You're still shifting, the work is just shifted from cables. To me, that brings us to the question of what doesn't work with cable-actuated shifting? To me, nothing.

As I've said before, I wouldn't say people need a carbon frame either, but even if you're not a racer or the fastest on the planet, you'll immediately notice the smoother ride. Not everyone will want/need to pay for that, but obviously many will. But I'm not sure how many will rush out to replace bikes for it. Industry pubs always pump this stuff because they sell ads based on it, but to the average cyclist, there's a placebo effect at best here, I think.
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Old 02-16-14, 08:43 AM   #50
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I'm thinking there may be a generational schism here. I say this as a guy who last week finally discarded his flip phone for a smart phone. DI may not motivate some of us but I think it will catch on with younger riders. I totally agree that the bike mags will hype electronic shifting and that only makes me feel that it will be big. Anyone who lives in a consumer culture knows what advertising can do to you. As you point out they hype it because it sells product. And, IMO they will sell this too.
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