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Fitting Your Bike Are you confused about how you should fit a bike to your particular body dimensions? Have you been reading, found the terms Merxx or French Fit, and don’t know what you need? Every style of riding is different- in how you fit the bike to you, and the sizing of the bike itself. It’s more than just measuring your height, reach and inseam. With the help of Bike Fitting, you’ll be able to find the right fit for your frame size, style of riding, and your particular dimensions. Here ya’ go…..the location for everything fit related.

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Old 06-14-17, 05:49 PM   #1
CrashandBreak
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Cycling at 70 with a old back and a new bike

Hello,

I am 70 years old but I am an avid road biker (I started riding in 2010). I have severe lower back problems, but, in the recent past, have had no troubles cycling 50-80 miles on my long weekend ride.

I've been riding a 56 cm Specialized Roubaix Elite for the past four years, but I took a leap and bought a new 2017 Roubaix Expert (Future Shock...just trying to mitigate stress on my back). All of a sudden, my back has failed and I cannot ride.

I took a measurement on my new Expert from the saddle tip to midway on the handlebars... 21". The same measurement on my older Elite was 19.5'). Clearly, I am more stretched out, and, although I can't prove it, my back is suffering as a result of not being more upright.

What I don't understand is how two 56 cm bikes made by the same company can be so different. Both have a 90 stem (length). Can someone explain this to me?

I am just so confused by such a large difference. And I am concerned about going to a 75 stem and lowering the handlebars.

Can someone help me or guide me?

I am so upset...I saved in retirement to buy the Expert, and now I feel the fit is damaging my back.

Help! Please help!

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Old 06-15-17, 07:44 AM   #2
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I don't know anything about those particular two bikes, but it's not unusual for the 'same size' bikes to have very different geometries. You would need to compare the geometry chart particulars of the two bikes. Things like stack and reach, which can be different on bikes that are the 'same size'.
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Old 06-15-17, 09:26 AM   #3
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Do you still have the Elite? If so I'd first try riding it and see if that improves your symptoms. In addition to checking the saddle-bar distance also see if the saddle on the two bikes is in the same position relative to the pedals - one might be farther forward also affecting your position.

If you're able to confirm that the old position results in more comfort I'd certainly try to replicate it as closely as possible on the new bike by adjusting the saddle position and stem.
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Old 06-15-17, 09:32 AM   #4
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I don't know anything about those particular two bikes, but it's not unusual for the 'same size' bikes to have very different geometries. You would need to compare the geometry chart particulars of the two bikes. Things like stack and reach, which can be different on bikes that are the 'same size'.
Thanks so much for the education. I didn't know this.
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Old 06-15-17, 09:34 AM   #5
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Do you still have the Elite? If so I'd first try riding it and see if that improves your symptoms. In addition to checking the saddle-bar distance also see if the saddle on the two bikes is in the same position relative to the pedals - one might be farther forward also affecting your position.

If you're able to confirm that the old position results in more comfort I'd certainly try to replicate it as closely as possible on the new bike by adjusting the saddle position and stem.
Thanks so much. I will definitely follow your advice...and, yes, I kept the Elite (it was in great shape, but the highest bid I got was $600, so I kept it as my winter road bike.

Thanks again.
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Old 06-15-17, 10:01 AM   #6
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If I'm reading the geo specs correctly, the 2017 Top Tube length for a 56 is 561.8mm compared with 2016 Roubaix being 565mm. So, your measurement wouldn't seem to make sense based on that alone.

Does your current saddle position have the same exact relationship measurements to the bottom bracket center/pedals (KOP)? If it's not the same it could explain some reach difference. The new Roubaix is nice (I have 2016 model), dial it in and enjoy!
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Old 06-15-17, 11:02 AM   #7
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Changes in frame angles may be a factor. Sounds like the new bike has a longer reach. Even so, you should be able to achieve a more compact, upright riding position by working with saddle and stem positions (which might require a different stem and seat post).
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Old 06-15-17, 11:43 AM   #8
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My bike originally came with a 100mm stem and I felt too stretched out. I went to a 90mm stem and while it was better, I still felt a bit stretched out. I settled on a 75mm stem and used that for several years. Eventually I got better cycling fitness and I'm back to the 90mm stem. If you need a shorter stem to be comfortable, go for it. Nothing bad will happen.
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Old 06-15-17, 01:29 PM   #9
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The way I look at it, you have about 3 contact points on your bike.
  • Bottom Bracket (also look at crank length).
  • Seat Postion
  • Bar Position
Get those three points (plus crank length) the same, and your bikes should fit the same.

Are the saddles identical? They can be different lengths, so the tip of the nose measurement may not be representative. Look at where the seatpost is clamped to the rails. Same Place?

Stems are cheap and easy to replace. Your bike shop might even help you with that. I believe the Future Shock is all within the steer tube, allowing the use of stock stems.

The next size smaller frame will also have a shorter top tube (effective top tube), and might (or might not) be able to be adjusted better with stem and seat adjustments.

You've got a couple of years on me, but I hope to still be riding in 20 years. At this point, I find that I can adapt to just about any riding position, it just takes time and a few miles down the road. The guys at a local C&V show laughed at me as many older riders were choosing higher bar positions, while I had gone LOWER. My personal sleeping position seems to affect my back more than riding the bike (although a backpack can also affect the back). For me, sleeping in a chair is more comfortable than sleeping in a bed. Anyway, pay attention to triggers that go beyond just the bicycle.
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Old 06-15-17, 08:22 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
The way I look at it, you have about 3 contact points on your bike.
  • Bottom Bracket (also look at crank length).
  • Seat Postion
  • Bar Position
Get those three points (plus crank length) the same, and your bikes should fit the same.

.

... try using a yard stick and level to compare the first bike to the second bike--e.g., measuring from the sit-bone area on the seat to the top of the drop. To check your seat location you can attach a nut to a piece of line and drop it down from just under your patella with the pedal at 3 o'clock and see where your knee has been relative to the pedal axle. When that is dialed in you can bring the bars back and raise them by adjusting the stem (hopefully, that will not require getting new brake cables).
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Old 06-15-17, 09:33 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by CrashandBreak View Post
I took a measurement on my new Expert from the saddle tip to midway on the handlebars... 21".
The same measurement on my older Elite was 19.5').
Clearly, I am more stretched out,
If this all proves to be true, is causing your back problems, then you might want to consider being proactive and going to the next level, ie: trialing a bike with an even shorter reach. This may in the long run prove even easier on your back? (posted by one with his own back issues)
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Old 06-15-17, 09:34 PM   #12
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And I am concerned about going to a 75 stem and lowering the handlebars.
You can get stems that angle up and put the bars higher. I think "highrise stem" is the term to search for.
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Old 06-15-17, 10:22 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by CrashandBreak View Post
I am 70 years old but I am an avid road biker (I started riding in 2010). I have severe lower back problems, but, in the recent past, have had no troubles cycling 50-80 miles on my long weekend ride.

I am so upset...I saved in retirement to buy the Expert, and now I feel the fit is damaging my back.

Help! Please help!
Also an old guy here. Also with an X-rays confirmed... bad back.

I also returned to cycling in 2010.

My first bike was just an attempt to get out and get fresh air. It was too upright and hurt my lower back. I had previously always ridden road bikes... so I went that direction.... and found relief. Problem solved.

I bought a new bike in late 2010. It didn't fix properly. My neck and shoulder hurt. A LOT of adjustments and a new stem and it fit... good enough.

I bought and restored several bikes most were my size and some I kept and enjoyed for sometime. When I found a new bike I wanted to own and try.... I'd buy it then sell another bike from my stable and often times made a profit. I learned a lot about bikes doing that.

In 2014 I bought another new bike.... that fits like a glove. Never any discomfort. Or should I say... any discomfort from cycling. But then again.... I have 5 bikes and none of them cause me any pain.

But my old back does hurt from time-to-time. Doing electrical work... or any work where my hands are over my head.... can cause almost disabling pain. Mowing the yard on my riding mower... jars my lower back... till I can hard straighten up. Weight gain, swinging a golf club, picking up branches after a storm..... lots of things can cause back pain.
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Old 06-15-17, 11:45 PM   #14
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I looked at images of the 2012-2013 Elite, It looks like the seat post had near zero setback. The CGR seat post in the 2017 Roubaix has about 25 mm setback. You might try sliding the seat forward and if you can far enough and it feels right, you may want to get a seat post with less setback.

If your seat post in the Elite is the same diameter, you might try it in the4 Expert (but if it is aluminum, make sure you wipe all grease off it with alcohol first).
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Old 06-19-17, 05:45 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by dwing View Post
If I'm reading the geo specs correctly, the 2017 Top Tube length for a 56 is 561.8mm compared with 2016 Roubaix being 565mm. So, your measurement wouldn't seem to make sense based on that alone.

Does your current saddle position have the same exact relationship measurements to the bottom bracket center/pedals (KOP)? If it's not the same it could explain some reach difference. The new Roubaix is nice (I have 2016 model), dial it in and enjoy!
I am going to my local bike shop today to try to get this straightened out. Thanks so much for helping me. I love the 2017 Roubaix Expert. It is the last new bike of my life, so I want to get it right. Thanks again.
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Old 06-19-17, 05:46 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by McBTC View Post
Changes in frame angles may be a factor. Sounds like the new bike has a longer reach. Even so, you should be able to achieve a more compact, upright riding position by working with saddle and stem positions (which might require a different stem and seat post).
Thanks so much for the encouraging words. I'll let you know how things turn out.
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Old 06-19-17, 05:48 AM   #17
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My bike originally came with a 100mm stem and I felt too stretched out. I went to a 90mm stem and while it was better, I still felt a bit stretched out. I settled on a 75mm stem and used that for several years. Eventually I got better cycling fitness and I'm back to the 90mm stem. If you need a shorter stem to be comfortable, go for it. Nothing bad will happen.
Oh, that's great news! I thought I 75 mm stem might make control more difficult. Thanks for helping me!
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Old 06-19-17, 05:51 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by CliffordK View Post
The way I look at it, you have about 3 contact points on your bike.
  • Bottom Bracket (also look at crank length).
  • Seat Postion
  • Bar Position
Get those three points (plus crank length) the same, and your bikes should fit the same.

Are the saddles identical? They can be different lengths, so the tip of the nose measurement may not be representative. Look at where the seatpost is clamped to the rails. Same Place?

Stems are cheap and easy to replace. Your bike shop might even help you with that. I believe the Future Shock is all within the steer tube, allowing the use of stock stems.

The next size smaller frame will also have a shorter top tube (effective top tube), and might (or might not) be able to be adjusted better with stem and seat adjustments.

You've got a couple of years on me, but I hope to still be riding in 20 years. At this point, I find that I can adapt to just about any riding position, it just takes time and a few miles down the road. The guys at a local C&V show laughed at me as many older riders were choosing higher bar positions, while I had gone LOWER. My personal sleeping position seems to affect my back more than riding the bike (although a backpack can also affect the back). For me, sleeping in a chair is more comfortable than sleeping in a bed. Anyway, pay attention to triggers that go beyond just the bicycle.
Lower!!!! Wow!!!You're just a kid! Seriously, thanks for all the information. Thanks to this forum, I'll go to today's second fitting with more confidence. Thanks for helping me.
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Old 06-19-17, 05:55 AM   #19
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... try using a yard stick and level to compare the first bike to the second bike--e.g., measuring from the sit-bone area on the seat to the top of the drop. To check your seat location you can attach a nut to a piece of line and drop it down from just under your patella with the pedal at 3 o'clock and see where your knee has been relative to the pedal axle. When that is dialed in you can bring the bars back and raise them by adjusting the stem (hopefully, that will not require getting new brake cables).
Thanks. I did take those measurements and the distances vary by slightly more than an inch, so I am definitely stretching out farther. With bulging discus at L3, L4, and L5, and some other lower back issues, an inch might seem tiny, but after a week in bed with a heating pad, an inch has really set my training back. I've thought and thought about it, and my new bike is the only thing that has changed ... I hope!!!

Thanks again.
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Old 06-19-17, 05:58 AM   #20
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Originally Posted by coominya View Post
If this all proves to be true, is causing your back problems, then you might want to consider being proactive and going to the next level, ie: trialing a bike with an even shorter reach. This may in the long run prove even easier on your back? (posted by one with his own back issues)
That's a possibility. Technically, I should be on a 58 mm, but I chose a 56 mm Roubaix Elite because of my back issues. Because I'm not "hip" about the new technology, I just assumed, erroneously, that the Expert would fit me like the Elite. Man, I've I got a lot to learn!!!

Thanks again!
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Old 06-19-17, 06:03 AM   #21
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Also an old guy here. Also with an X-rays confirmed... bad back.

I also returned to cycling in 2010.

My first bike was just an attempt to get out and get fresh air. It was too upright and hurt my lower back. I had previously always ridden road bikes... so I went that direction.... and found relief. Problem solved.

I bought a new bike in late 2010. It didn't fix properly. My neck and shoulder hurt. A LOT of adjustments and a new stem and it fit... good enough.

I bought and restored several bikes most were my size and some I kept and enjoyed for sometime. When I found a new bike I wanted to own and try.... I'd buy it then sell another bike from my stable and often times made a profit. I learned a lot about bikes doing that.

In 2014 I bought another new bike.... that fits like a glove. Never any discomfort. Or should I say... any discomfort from cycling. But then again.... I have 5 bikes and none of them cause me any pain.

But my old back does hurt from time-to-time. Doing electrical work... or any work where my hands are over my head.... can cause almost disabling pain. Mowing the yard on my riding mower... jars my lower back... till I can hard straighten up. Weight gain, swinging a golf club, picking up branches after a storm..... lots of things can cause back pain.
We are kindred spirit. Last October, a driver ran a sop sign at 40 mph and I had to go down fast...I was unable to click out. Happened too fast. I stuck my hand out to break my fall, and I broke my wrist. I pedaled 30 miles home with a broken wrist...there was once big climb...my wrist hurt like the dickens, but I tolerated the pain and got home safely.

Back/Nerve pain is the worst. A broken wrist pales in comparison to what I go through with my back.

So I understand completely what you're saying.

Thanks again.
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Old 06-19-17, 06:05 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by GeneO View Post
I looked at images of the 2012-2013 Elite, It looks like the seat post had near zero setback. The CGR seat post in the 2017 Roubaix has about 25 mm setback. You might try sliding the seat forward and if you can far enough and it feels right, you may want to get a seat post with less setback.

If your seat post in the Elite is the same diameter, you might try it in the4 Expert (but if it is aluminum, make sure you wipe all grease off it with alcohol first).
Good to know about the setback. So much to learn... I appreciate you helping me. I'll let you know what happens.

Thanks again.
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Old 06-19-17, 06:17 AM   #23
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That's a possibility. Technically, I should be on a 58 mm, but I chose a 56 mm...
Thanks again!
I have a recurring lower back issue but it's just vertebrae that slip out of alignment. I see a chiro every few months for a checkup but day to day I lay on my back and wriggle around and get lots of *clicks* up the back and even in the neck. I use no force, just twist my body in natural motions doing stretches.

Yesterday I went out for my usual 40k run and within a couple of km I knew there was a problem. My right knee had pain when I stood up out of the saddle to pedal and at one point I had a sharp twinge of pain in my lower back. I stopped and lay on the ground and wriggled around a bit, pulled one knee up onto a straight leg and tried a twist but felt my spine was jammed and wouldn't fully rotate. [ No. 7 in the physio chart below]

I knew it was unwise to go ahead with the ride and put stress on a vertebrae that was out so I toodled on back home. This sort of thing happens very very rarely now, and has never caused me to miss a ride. I put it down to not warming up and stretching properly before I left. Age catching up






No. 7

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Old 06-19-17, 10:41 AM   #24
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No. 7

I also do the same exercises on a daily basis and see a chiro regularly. One other thing I do which helps is to maintain a straight back on the bike. Instead of bending at the waist, I think of folding at the hips while the back remains straight. I can even ride in the drops for a while but I've no real reason to do so.
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Old 06-19-17, 11:49 AM   #25
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I also do the same exercises on a daily basis and see a chiro regularly. One other thing I do which helps is to maintain a straight back on the bike. Instead of bending at the waist, I think of folding at the hips while the back remains straight.
I never thought of that? I employ something like it (when I think of it) sitting here at the computer, but never thought of adopting the same attitude on the bike? I just push my hips forward to put the concept into practice, I'll try it next time I'm in the saddle, thanks berner.
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