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  1. #1
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    dahon vector x10 versus tern link (or verge)

    Hello, I am considering buying a folding bike for a 5-10km (each way) daily commute.

    At the shop I have been offered a second hand dahon vector x10 for a price at which here I can get a new tern link.
    I was wondering if the dahon vector x10, being an older model but supposedly a better bike in its own days, is still to be considered a better bike than the Link.

    I was wondering the vector x10 could be compared to a Verge X10 of today, is that about right?

    Thanks for your comments,
    Roberto

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    Quote Originally Posted by foice View Post
    Hello, I am considering buying a folding bike for a 5-10km (each way) daily commute.

    At the shop I have been offered a second hand dahon vector x10 for a price at which here I can get a new tern link.
    I was wondering if the dahon vector x10, being an older model but supposedly a better bike in its own days, is still to be considered a better bike than the Link.

    I was wondering the vector x10 could be compared to a Verge X10 of today, is that about right?

    Thanks for your comments,
    Roberto
    i have a dahon vector x10. i bought it brand new and it has never failed me in all my rides. it is my best all-around bike. light. fast. well-made. excellent components. it also won the eurobike of the year in 2010.

    the dahon vector x10 can be compared to the tern verge x10. the tern verge x10 has improvements on the frame hinge and the handlebar stem, if i am not mistaken.

  3. #3
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    Think the only problem I heard of was chain drop so the later ones had a shark tooth chainwheel or something!

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    you mean the vector x10 has the tendency to loose the chain and this has been fixed in the updated model (which is the Verge?)

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    chain drops will happen in both vector x10 and verge x10 if the rear derailleur is not properly adjusted.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marxmini View Post
    chain drops will happen in both vector x10 and verge x10 if the rear derailleur is not properly adjusted.
    ok thanks for clarifying.

    Would you say that the Vector x10 is still a superior bike than the Link?

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    Quote Originally Posted by foice View Post
    ok thanks for clarifying.

    Would you say that the Vector x10 is still a superior bike than the Link?
    Yes i think that even the older vector x10 will perform better than the Link. please check hinges and locks and have the seller do a service check before you purchase the bike. good luck.

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    2X10s IMG_2380.jpg

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    Hello, thanks for your comments. Sure I will have a check to the hinges and locks, these are of course "the hinge" of the idea of folding the bike

    The shop here has some good reputation, however I agree that need to be inspected well. I am kind of new to the business, so please furnish me with more comments and suggestions if you feel like. I am not really an expert biker, even the most obvious things are welcome!

    Thanks,
    Roberto

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    Quote Originally Posted by marxmini View Post
    2X10s
    nice pic! both vector x10? wow!

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    Quote Originally Posted by foice View Post
    nice pic! both vector x10? wow!
    yes both dahon vector x10. i bought them in 2011.

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    Quote Originally Posted by marxmini View Post
    yes both dahon vector x10. i bought them in 2011.
    Being an owner of vector x10, may I ask you what you think is a fair price for such bike today? Let's say a bike bought in early 2012 or so ... I am not expert at all about pricing second hand bikes, and I do not want to pay too much for it just because I like it and the second-hand market here is small.

    Cheers,
    Roberto

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    if a vector has the same price as a Verge ..I would take the Tern...
    If it has the same price as a link I would def take the Dahon ...

    Frames and forks are expensive , howver the components are really what drives the price up ... i.e you get far better components with the vector than with a Link ....

    yes the tern frame is stiffer than the regular dahons, the vector frame gets awful close though. And it is debatable if you really can feel the difference in day to day riding . Its almost like having a car with 330 hp versus 350 hp .... can you feel the difference ? I sure don't and I have raced cars for years. ( don't ask.... the older I get the better I was )

    thor
    Having fun selling Terns and Dahons for a living. My personal website is also my business website, same as my profile name, therefore no link given to follow forum rules.

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    Quote Originally Posted by foice View Post
    Being an owner of vector x10, may I ask you what you think is a fair price for such bike today? Let's say a bike bought in early 2012 or so ... I am not expert at all about pricing second hand bikes, and I do not want to pay too much for it just because I like it and the second-hand market here is small.

    Cheers,
    Roberto
    i normally depreciate 15% on the first year and 5% every year therafter.

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    thanks for the tip! wow! bikes keep price so much over time?

    I mean a car would loose some 20-30% just in the first year ... let alone electronics!

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    Senior Member ThorUSA's Avatar
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    idont fully agree with MArxmini here.... usually they loose money faster and more of it. It always seem to depend on what bike, what model , if it is still available, what the price was when you bought it, and so many other factors ....

    thor
    Having fun selling Terns and Dahons for a living. My personal website is also my business website, same as my profile name, therefore no link given to follow forum rules.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThorUSA View Post
    if a vector has the same price as a Verge ..I would take the Tern...
    If it has the same price as a link I would def take the Dahon ...

    Frames and forks are expensive , howver the components are really what drives the price up ... i.e you get far better components with the vector than with a Link ....

    yes the tern frame is stiffer than the regular dahons, the vector frame gets awful close though. And it is debatable if you really can feel the difference in day to day riding . Its almost like having a car with 330 hp versus 350 hp .... can you feel the difference ? I sure don't and I have raced cars for years. ( don't ask.... the older I get the better I was )

    thor
    i wanted to get the new tern verge x10 or x20 but i always thought it was basically the same as the vector x10 so i never did.

    are the differences between the vector x10 and verge x10 big enough to warrant the purchase of the latter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThorUSA View Post
    idont fully agree with MArxmini here.... usually they loose money faster and more of it. It always seem to depend on what bike, what model , if it is still available, what the price was when you bought it, and so many other factors ....

    thor
    disagreement well taken :-) i find that higher end, no longer produced folding bikes hold more value over time.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by marxmini View Post
    are the differences between the vector x10 and verge x10 big enough to warrant the purchase of the latter.
    The biggest difference is frame stiffness. I've tried dahons, terns and bromptons so there is quite a noticeable difference once you stand up and start wrenching on the handlebars to make the crest of that hill! The frame is the part that you cannot upgrade afterwards no matter how much money you put into it, so think of it as a good canvas you start with and the parts are the paint. You can change paints as you go along but you will always be working on that same canvas.

    edit: one more thing for daily riders that fold 2+ times a day, the tern hinges have repleacable bushings and swings pretty much with very little friction, over time when the bushings wear out you can just buy new bushings from tern for a few bucks. But for the dahon once the hinge bolt is loose and has play, there's not much you can do but purchase a new bike, it's a steel bolt pressed into aluminum directly. This only affects commuters that fold them ALOT. My wifes Dahon still folds pretty tight and snug, but it's not a daily commuter.
    Last edited by Azreal911; 04-01-15 at 08:02 AM.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azreal911 View Post
    The biggest difference is frame stiffness. I've tried dahons, terns and bromptons so there is quite a noticeable difference once you stand up and start wrenching on the handlebars to make the crest of that hill! The frame is the part that you cannot upgrade afterwards no matter how much money you put into it, so think of it as a good canvas you start with and the parts are the paint. You can change paints as you go along but you will always be working on that same canvas.

    edit: one more thing for daily riders that fold 2+ times a day, the tern hinges have repleacable bushings and swings pretty much with very little friction, over time when the bushings wear out you can just buy new bushings from tern for a few bucks. But for the dahon once the hinge bolt is loose and has play, there's not much you can do but purchase a new bike, it's a steel bolt pressed into aluminum directly. This only affects commuters that fold them ALOT. My wifes Dahon still folds pretty tight and snug, but it's not a daily commuter.
    very interesting comment indeed. As you might have read above, I am thinking to buy a second hand dahon vector x10. From what you say it seems that I should be very very carefuly checking the hinges, as in the Dahon Vector x10 these cannot be replaced in any way. Being a 2-3 maybe 4 year old bike I think this is a possible risk in second hand buying.

    As I am not very experienced (especially in visually inspecting the Hinges), may I ask what should I look for in checking if the hinges are worn out?
    Maybe somebody has pictures of good and worn out hinges we can compare.

    Thanks a lot for the discussion!
    Roberto

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by foice View Post
    very interesting comment indeed. As you might have read above, I am thinking to buy a second hand dahon vector x10. From what you say it seems that I should be very very carefuly checking the hinges, as in the Dahon Vector x10 these cannot be replaced in any way. Being a 2-3 maybe 4 year old bike I think this is a possible risk in second hand buying.

    As I am not very experienced (especially in visually inspecting the Hinges), may I ask what should I look for in checking if the hinges are worn out?
    Maybe somebody has pictures of good and worn out hinges we can compare.

    Thanks a lot for the discussion!
    Roberto
    I wouldn`t worry too much about used dahon`s what i was talking about are extreme cases where they use them day in and day out for a few years. if the fold feels like there`s friction and there is no wobble in the hinge when the dahon is in a half fold (like 90 degree angle or something) then it should be good. When there is some friction to me the hinge is still nice and tight and would last quite awhile. You can try add some oil in there to penetrate it to make it last longer and leave the bike upside down when you put a few drops in that hinge pin. It worked awesome for my wife`s dahon jack because it was overly tight and was soo hard to fold. This would ONLY be for dahons! bromptons and terns don`t act and feel the same when you check their folding mechanisms. I`ve read in the past on the forums one user used their dahon an extreme amount and the fold was pretty much done, not sure what was the resolution or did he have to get a new bike but i couldn`t find that post. for casual use you should have zero concern of the hinge ever wearing out.

    for the terns you can just buy new bushings:
    Igus Bearings | Tern Folding Bike and Folding Bicycle Accessories | Canada
    Thorusa sells them for $5 a pair lol. so yeah that`s all you really need to do with the terns.

    as for bromptons they are steel on steel so and not steel pressed into alumnium so i haven`t heard of anyone coming into the same problems at all with brommies. something with the chemistry which i cannot explain .

    hope this helps.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Azreal911 View Post
    I wouldn`t worry too much about used dahon`s what i was talking about are extreme cases where they use them day in and day out for a few years. if the fold feels like there`s friction and there is no wobble in the hinge when the dahon is in a half fold (like 90 degree angle or something) then it should be good. When there is some friction to me the hinge is still nice and tight and would last quite awhile. You can try add some oil in there to penetrate it to make it last longer and leave the bike upside down when you put a few drops in that hinge pin. It worked awesome for my wife`s dahon jack because it was overly tight and was soo hard to fold. This would ONLY be for dahons! bromptons and terns don`t act and feel the same when you check their folding mechanisms. I`ve read in the past on the forums one user used their dahon an extreme amount and the fold was pretty much done, not sure what was the resolution or did he have to get a new bike but i couldn`t find that post. for casual use you should have zero concern of the hinge ever wearing out.

    for the terns you can just buy new bushings:
    Igus Bearings | Tern Folding Bike and Folding Bicycle Accessories | Canada
    Thorusa sells them for $5 a pair lol. so yeah that`s all you really need to do with the terns.

    as for bromptons they are steel on steel so and not steel pressed into alumnium so i haven`t heard of anyone coming into the same problems at all with brommies. something with the chemistry which i cannot explain .

    hope this helps.
    hello, thanks for the detailed description of how to check. maybe you are right, this is not an issue that should worry most of the people, however here we are talking a bike I've never seen before and have no idea what used of it has been made, so better check it a bit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by foice View Post
    hello, thanks for the detailed description of how to check. maybe you are right, this is not an issue that should worry most of the people, however here we are talking a bike I've never seen before and have no idea what used of it has been made, so better check it a bit.
    the best is still to check both bikes, the vector x10 and the link, out. inspect. compare. road test.

    i am most certain that you will be able to choose which bike is for you. good luck.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azreal911 View Post
    edit: one more thing for daily riders that fold 2+ times a day, the tern hinges have repleacable bushings and swings pretty much with very little friction, over time when the bushings wear out you can just buy new bushings from tern for a few bucks. But for the dahon once the hinge bolt is loose and has play, there's not much you can do but purchase a new bike, it's a steel bolt pressed into aluminum directly. This only affects commuters that fold them ALOT. My wifes Dahon still folds pretty tight and snug, but it's not a daily commuter.
    Hmmm. The Dahon V-Clamp hinge on the Vector uses a stainless steel pin turning on lubricated brass bushings, similar to the crankshaft in an engine. (I don't think Azreal911 meant to imply that the steel pin was turning against aluminum.)

    Tern was unable to use this design, so redesigned around plastic bushings. The Tern's plastic bushing will wear much faster than the lubricated brass bushing in the Dahon, so it's designed to be replaceable.

    Tern's marketing says this is a feature.
    "When man first set woman on two wheels with a pair of pedals, did he know, I wonder, that he had rent the veil of the harem in twain? A woman on a bicycle has all the world before her where to choose; she can go where she will, no man hindering." The Typewriter Girl, 1899.

    "Every so often a bird gets up and flies some place it's drawn to. I don't suppose it could tell you why, but it does it anyway." Ian Hibell, 1934-2008

  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by tcs View Post
    Hmmm. The Dahon V-Clamp hinge on the Vector uses a stainless steel pin turning on lubricated brass bushings, similar to the crankshaft in an engine. (I don't think Azreal911 meant to imply that the steel pin was turning against aluminum.)
    ah, I checked and see what you mean tcs, didn't know they changed and updated their hinges for the better. My wife's dahon jack is on the visegrip clamp and there was pretty much no bushings in there and felt like the steel pin turning against aluminium which was why it was sooooo friggin hard to fold until i added a few drops of oil in there with the bike upside down overnight.

    Now that I understand the vector on the new vclamps the OP has pretty much nothing to worry about because you can replace the brass bushings just like terns! how the hell did I miss that detail!?!? Tern was selling it like some apple "feature" lol. Funny my tern is running on brass bushings also, these plastic bushings are their "new" feature.

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