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  1. #1
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    Different models of the Big Apple tires?

    Hi,

    I've been looking into Schwalbe's Big Apple tires, and I noticed there are different version, and I wonder how they differ.

    There's the Big Apple Performance Wire and Big Apple Plus HS 430. There might be other ones, I'm not sure. Anyway, any idea how they differ?

    Edit: It seems that the Plus offer more puncture protection.
    I have a different question. I currently have Kenda Kwest 20 x 1.5" tires, and I wonder if replacing them with 20 x 2" Big Apple tires would slow me down.
    Last edited by YonathanZ; 04-10-15 at 06:42 PM.

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    Portable Audio/Bike Lover tds101's Avatar
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    Is better cushioning worth the hypothetical loss of a possible mile or so per hour? I personally would think comfort is more important. YMMV.

    Fitness is only a side effect,...I feel alive when I ride!!!

  3. #3
    jur
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    I think Big Apples will be faster. Kenda Kwest is a good one but BAs are better. Don't be tempted to pump them over 50psi.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tds101 View Post
    Is better cushioning worth the hypothetical loss of a possible mile or so per hour? I personally would think comfort is more important. YMMV.
    Losing 1mph is absolutely fine. If that's the difference, than it's totally worth it. Thank you.

  5. #5
    Senior Member osco53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tds101 View Post
    Is better cushioning worth the hypothetical loss of a possible mile or so per hour? I personally would think comfort is more important. YMMV.
    "Loss of a possible mile or so per hour?"

    I don't buy it unless your at the top of a road bikes performance envelope.

    My 36 pound, now 41 with added riding gear Tour Easy recumbent had a 700 x 28c on it, the tire needed 95-100 psi to protect the rim.
    Max psi was 115,,really ? I don't think so... I'm not racing.
    The ride was terrible, It beat me to death, every tiny road imperfection went right into the bike.

    I replaced It with a 700 x 38C, max Psi was 80 for this tire, I run 75...

    The ride is fantastic, No Noticeable speed loss at all as far as I can tell.

    On my new 20" folder, P8 I wanted fat tires, wanted the Big Apples, the 20 x 2.00",, I got the 20 x 1.75" and am very happy.
    The other one I test rode with 20 x 1.25" was harsh, felt disconnected and every sidewalk crack made it to me...

    IMO due to a 20" tire's much reduced circumference Fatter is far more Important as a comfort factor..
    As for rolling resistance,, Bha ! Humbug !
    How about we get stronger

    Loosing 1 mph,,, learn to spin better,
    the faster you can spin the more comfortable that next gear is and the less It's like mashing so say's my knee's....

    ,I don't race so,,,
    "I personally would think comfort is more important." ,,, You betcha !
    Last edited by osco53; 04-11-15 at 04:00 PM.
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  6. #6
    jur
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    The most important factor in tyre speed is tyre loss, not width or pressure. Tyre losses are from squirming rubber (not a big factor in BAs with its almost smooth tread) and tyre casing suppleness, and I strongly suspect BAs are substantially better than Kendas. So I expect a small improvement in speed.

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    jur
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    Here is an article on tyre research which I believe to be the last word.

    The Tire Pressure Revolution, by Jan Heine | Road Bike Rider

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    Portable Audio/Bike Lover tds101's Avatar
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    Well, my point was IF you lose 1 mph with fatter tires WHO CARES!!! The butt saving comfort is worth the risk. Me, I'm a fast rider when on my bikes. I've never had a slowdown with fatties. I'd say, for a newbie, reading up on this subject might be enlightening. But, unless your a competitive athlete, then a slightly slower roll is no big deal. And, for most, I doubt they roll any slower anyways.

    PS: I'm not the op, so please let him/her know what's up. Me,...I always go fatter tires. Where I live it's pothole hell!!! Lol!!!

    Fitness is only a side effect,...I feel alive when I ride!!!

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    Senior Member smallwheeler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jur View Post
    Here is an article on tyre research which I believe to be the last word.

    The Tire Pressure Revolution, by Jan Heine | Road Bike Rider
    TL;DR:
    "Tire pressure does not significantly affect your bike’s rolling resistance, but the casing construction of your tires does. This means that you can ride lower pressures without going slower, and that wide tires are no slower than narrow ones – as long as they have similar casings. The fastest tires have supple casings that consume less energy when they flex, and transmit fewer vibrations, creating a win-win situation. These tires roll super-fast no matter at what pressure you run them."


    this sounds very logical to me and dovetails nicely with the claims made regarding big apples on Balloonbikes - the principle.

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    Thanks for the comments, everyone. I'll contact the bike shop where I bought the bike just to make sure I can install 2" tires, and then I'll buy them if they can fit.

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    Portable Audio/Bike Lover tds101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YonathanZ View Post
    Thanks for the comments, everyone. I'll contact the bike shop where I bought the bike just to make sure I can install 2" tires, and then I'll buy them if they can fit.
    From the sound of it the bike shop is giving you incorrect information. Just go purchase a set of Big Apple's from a store they can be returned to if your afraid. I really doubt you'll have any issues with fit. Your making the upgrade more complicated than necessary.

    Fitness is only a side effect,...I feel alive when I ride!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tds101 View Post
    From the sound of it the bike shop is giving you incorrect information. Just go purchase a set of Big Apple's from a store they can be returned to if your afraid. I really doubt you'll have any issues with fit. Your making the upgrade more complicated than necessary.
    No one sells them here. I'll be ordering from bike24.com, and shipping alone is 20 euros. I want to be sure before I spend 55 dollars on tires.

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    Portable Audio/Bike Lover tds101's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YonathanZ View Post
    No one sells them here. I'll be ordering from bike24.com, and shipping alone is 20 euros. I want to be sure before I spend 55 dollars on tires.
    Ah, I understand. Your cautiousness is fully justified. Just take the wheels off and measure.

    Fitness is only a side effect,...I feel alive when I ride!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tds101 View Post
    Ah, I understand. Your cautiousness is fully justified. Just take the wheels off and measure.
    Measure what? The internal part of the rim? Can't I just measure externally and thus have a guesstimate about the internal width?

  15. #15
    Portable Audio/Bike Lover tds101's Avatar
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    Measure the width of the FORK, not the rim of the tire. The rim width is irrelevant.

    $_32.JPG

    Fitness is only a side effect,...I feel alive when I ride!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by tds101 View Post
    Measure the width of the FORK, not the rim of the tire. The rim width is irrelevant.

    $_32.JPG
    Very close to 3 inches. Like, 2.9 point something. Similar width where the rear wheel is. Why doesn't the rim width matter? The shop where I had a inner tube replaced a few months ago said that rim won't fit a tire wider than 1.75", but that's not the shop that sold me the bike, so they might be wrong.

  17. #17
    Senior Member osco53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YonathanZ View Post
    Very close to 3 inches. Like, 2.9 point something. Similar width where the rear wheel is. Why doesn't the rim width matter? The shop where I had a inner tube replaced a few months ago said that rim won't fit a tire wider than 1.75", but that's not the shop that sold me the bike, so they might be wrong.
    Again, take your tire off the rim and give us In MM Inside rim width just In case you have some really skinny rims and that I doubt..
    Measure the fork width like tds101 said and measure your brake calipur width,, where it would go around the wider tire..

    I betcha a six pack of beer your rims are fine for 2.15" wide Big apples,, Umm IF I loose this bet,,
    It's gonna be cheap beer and you gotta come get It !
    “Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live.” Mark Twain

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    Quote Originally Posted by osco53 View Post
    Again, take your tire off the rim and give us In MM Inside rim width just In case you have some really skinny rims and that I doubt..
    Measure the fork width like tds101 said and measure your brake calipur width,, where it would go around the wider tire..

    I betcha a six pack of beer your rims are fine for 2.15" wide Big apples,, Umm IF I loose this bet,,
    It's gonna be cheap beer and you gotta come get It !
    Must I take the wheel off? I can remove the tire partially to measure, and I already measured the fork. And you're probably right. The rim is probably a generic, chinese-made one, and the're the same front and rear, and since the rear holds a hub motor, I doubt it's a skinny rim, because then it would have to be super strong, and this bike isn't super expensive.

  19. #19
    Portable Audio/Bike Lover tds101's Avatar
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    The width of the rim won't be an issue because you DON'T have the high end slim profile wheelset on that bike. The guy at the bike shop was wrong. I've been through it before. Big Apple tires will fit your bike PERFECTLY!!! I'll even bet you beer!!!

    Fitness is only a side effect,...I feel alive when I ride!!!

  20. #20
    Senior Member osco53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YonathanZ View Post
    Hi,
    Anyway, any idea how they differ?
    Edit: It seems that the Plus offer more puncture protection.
    Click on the model name of said tire,,like you noticed,, on has better puncture protection,,,
    one is for E- bikes,, rated for big speeds,,,
    one is basic,, I bet softer,,lighter,,

    Also look at Big Apples new brother,,Big Ben
    “Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live.” Mark Twain

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by tds101 View Post
    The width of the rim won't be an issue because you DON'T have the high end slim profile wheelset on that bike. The guy at the bike shop was wrong. I've been through it before. Big Apple tires will fit your bike PERFECTLY!!! I'll even bet you beer!!!
    Your bet means nothing to me, I don't drink beer.
    And yeah, you're right. So can I just order the 2.15" Big Ben and get it over with? My arse will thank me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by osco53 View Post
    Click on the model name of said tire,,like you noticed,, on has better puncture protection,,,
    one is for E- bikes,, rated for big speeds,,,
    one is basic,, I bet softer,,lighter,,

    Also look at Big Apples new brother,,Big Ben
    Yeah, I'll get the Big Ben I think. Rated for 50kmph ebikes, which mine achieves at declines. It also seems to be a bit more grippy off-road, which I like riding at times.

  23. #23
    Senior Member osco53's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YonathanZ View Post
    Must I take the wheel off? .
    Well No IMO it would be easier,,all we need to see is Inside rim width,, with one of these,,

    ux_a13071600ux0397_ux_g03.jpg147828.jpg
    “Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live.” Mark Twain

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    Quote Originally Posted by osco53 View Post
    Well No IMO it would be easier,,all we need to see is Inside rim width,, with one of these,,

    ux_a13071600ux0397_ux_g03.jpg147828.jpg
    I have one of these. I'll try it tomorrow morning. It's 3am here, so I'll let you know tomorrow.

  25. #25
    Senior Member osco53's Avatar
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    BTW FWIW I rode 10 very Intense single track miles today on my mountain bike.. I set several personal records

    I'm gonna have to start wearing long pants,,my legs are so Rad,, or I guess I can carry a can-o-mace to fight off the wimin folk

    Just sayin
    “Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live.” Mark Twain

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