tdonline

How does a 20" tire folding bike with winter tires handle? If I install quality winter tires, can a folding bike be my regular winter ride? Or would the winter conditions be too harsh on a folding bike?

A tiny fold isn't necessary since I'm not a daily commuter, but I am car-free so I am reliant on the metro and I would also appreciate an easy packing job for air travel. As mentioned, I do visit family 2-3x annually and they're all cross-country or continent away. I admit the Brompton is very enticing in this respect. It is out of my planned budget though.

The plan is to visit Bikes at Vienna tomorrow and get on folding bikes for the first time ever! Hopefully, I don't do anything embarrassing. It's weird--coming from a regular-sized bike, I'm a little intimidated!

Pinigis 

I am not sure of the thread that you refer to, but if it is an older one you can dismiss it; we have made substantial changes to our products in the past 18 months. If you want to come by and test our products, I can arrange to have them all set for you.

invisiblehand

My experience is that he differences between big and small wheel bikes is small. So your small wheel bike with studded tires will handle like big wheel bikes with studded tires. Since the hubs and brakes are closer to the ground, I imagine that they would get exposed to more glop and ice, but I've never noticed an effect in the DC environment. I hate speaking for other people, but my guess is that whether you ride during a winter day will almost never be due to having 20" or 27" wheels.

It does sound to me that you want a folding bike that can fit wide tires. Studded tires are an investment. Pretty expensive and only useful for a few months. Although they last for a long time.

My guess is that most folding bikes will pack easy enough for you. With a little practice, you'll be surprised how quick you'll get. When I try, I can pack both of our bikes under 30 minutes with some stuff. And I'm way out of practice. As a side note, my experience is that if you fly long distance in the US, you want a hard case and that means you'll want the special case for the Brompton if you go that route.

If you want to go on Metro during peak hours and bring your bike into restaurants, then you want a super compact folder, IME. I use a STRIDA for that. You could use a Brompton too. Both are useful but I never found riding either bike -- I owned a Brompton in the past -- "fun". You could bring in a tikit to some locations -- typically with outdoor seating -- but it's a bit inconvenient to everyone. If you're willing to stand most of the time, then the tikit is also good for Metro.

Tomorrow's visit is exciting. No need to be intimidated. Tim Fricker just nibbles but never bites.** Make sure you ...

(1) ride the bike
(2) fold the bike
(3) roll the bike while folded
(4) pick up the folded bike as if going up/down stairs
(5) think about how you'll carry stuff on the bike (if it's a concern)

Good luck.

** Naturally this is a joke.

fietsbob

Of course comparing a British made bike that holds its value when selling Used,
and a Chinese made bike that depreciates a lot in resale market is hard to explain away.

downtube

Pingis,

This forum is not intended for this type of individual sales, as I mentioned in the other thread.

Thanks,
Yan

downtube

I'm not convinced that Brompton's hold their value. Outside of the UK, NYC, and CA I would bet they do not sell well. ebay is always an option, however that is very risky....customers that complain on ebay can get their money back, and keep items.

I would like more data on Brompton's resale value....anyone want to share?

Thanks,
Yan

Pinigis 

Sometimes new comers to the Forum cannot make contact through the forum messaging, so I am trying to make it easier for someone. This is not an offer for an individual sale, but is an option available to anyone who is geographically able to take advantage of it. This is no different than the ongoing thread related to Brompton's test ride program.

downtube

Pingis,

Your behavior is consistent with something that is not "ok". I hope your behavior improves and your situation will follow suit.

Thanks,
Yan

Pinigis 

Yan,

Take a deep breath and relax. Please read the forum rules. I am not offering anything for sale any more than you are. I am simply informing someone of the opportunity for a test ride, just like the Brompton test ride thread that is active this week. My behavior is appropriate, and hopefully helpful to the forum members.

Paul

tdonline

Thanks to Tim at Bikes at Vienna. A really solid store and Tim was very patient and generous with his time as I tried out a Tern, 2 Dahons and 2 Bromptons. Will try to limit this post to a semi-novel rather than an entire one.

If you saw me walking about, you would think I have average length limbs. As far as I know, no one has mocked me for having T-Rex arms...But when it comes to bike fitting, apparently I have baby-length arms! It brought back memories of the grief I went through with my Trek 1000 purchase. Basically the Tern and Dahons killed my shoulders as I was too stretched out. The Dahon 7 and 8 seemed to be particularly long. The 8 had a far longer handlebar stem which helped somewhat but I couldn't angle the handlebar to help cut the gap. This is where the Brompton excelled with the H bar. It extended high enough and it could be angled towards me.

After seeing and riding folders in real life rather than on my computer screen, I have to say the 20 inch bikes fulfill one need and that is folded, they will fit in my apartment. But with their size and weight, out in the streets, I would basically treat them as regular bikes as I can't imagine hauling them around (or even wheeling them) in comfort. That means I would need to lock them up just as I would with my regular bike. They would also be a better fit on the Metro. I do take my bike onto the Metro on the weekends and it would be nice to not worry about hitting people with my big wheels. Or losing my grip and have my bike hurtle down the aisle. Still, I'm not sure if those two advantages justify buying folders that aren't great fits.

I also can't see myself traveling with them either. I know they can be disassembled and fitted into a suitcase--but I'm not sure I'm up for it and I wouldn't enjoy being worried if I have reassembled the bike correctly once I land. I don't want to spend my time on a trip tending to a bike that isn't working optimally.

Now the Brompton addresses the above issues. It folds down to a smaller footprint, it rolls well, the H Bar mitigate my T-rex arms...mind it's still not exactly a light item to carry around. And I admit, they are lovely and I really didn't mind the 16 inch wheels much. Perhaps because I'm a pretty small rider? I can't stand the Brompton gearing though. I went online after the store visit and the total cost was over $1,900 after I selected my modest customization. Gulp. As a mostly non-commuter I'm not sure I can justify that kind of outlay.

The poster who said fitting, even more so for a folder, is really important was right. I may have to investigate further to see what the other brands/models are carried locally as I can't imagine buying a folder without test rides. I'm just a fussy fit.

Any recommendations for folders that will accommodate my tragically short arm reach? Aside from a Brompton of course.

linberl

As I said, I am the Queen of T-rex Arms, ha ha. So - look for a bike with a shortish tube (anywhere from 48-52 cm). Much more than that, and you may have some issues. Then, you need to try it with no more than a 60mm bike stem and some swept back bars, ideally between 25 and 45 degrees. The cost replacing a stem and handlebars is not that great, and sometimes you can sell off the parts you have removed to offset the cost. There's a fabulous pre-loved Bike Friday that would fit you right now, a NWT with 48cm frame, but it is $1250. https://www.bikefriday.com/folding-b...ed-48cm-33898/
If it is something you can afford, I'd call them. They can tell you what measurements they need to make sure it will fit you well, and you can trust them to be honest about it. You can also ask if they honor the 30 trial on pre-loved bikes (you just pay return shipping).
"Tragically short arm reach"....just dying over that!

tdonline

Linberl, thanks for the rec...I'm not sure I'm willing to go above the 1K mark. Again, I'm not a commuter and I'm not sure I can justify paying that kind of money for a sometime bike. And definitely for a bike I can't test ride. That extended handlebar stem is trouble...

The 48-52 cm suggestion is highly appreciated! I didn't have a number to reference as I'm not sure how regular bike sizes relate to folders. My Trek 1000 is 45cm (possibly 47, I can't remember exactly...it's a very small bike, I only have enough room for one bottle attachment) and even then I had to get rid off the drop handlebars and go all-granny style to have my arms ride comfortably. I checked the Dahon 7 and it's a 57cm! Yikes, no wonder I struggled with it. What I find a bit off is that when I was researching road bikes--all the bikes came with very detailed geometric information. With folders, some brands don't bother to make that information readily available. It's strange as local dealers are scarce and many people have to buy folders online. You'd think all geometric data would be uploaded for easy reference.

Edited, I measured the distance between my seat and the handlebar and it's about 18 inches. The grips are about 3 inches higher than the seat.

linberl

The Dahon Curve is just a tad over 52 cm. With swept back bars at 45 degrees (probably $30 aftermarket) it should work for you. Comes in 16 and 20" models. Dahon Curve D3 folding bike – NYCeWheels.com Cute, too. Maybe you should call NYCEwheels and ask them which models have a short tube? If you go to dahon's website and select a particular bike, most of them have the specs under the "geometry" tab midway down the page. A couple do not. Look at the top tube dimension to compare. This one is only about 50cm...https://dahon.com/bikes/eezz-d3/

badmother

I have several folders, both 20" ones, curve 16" and Brompton.

You can buy studded tyres for 20" folders and the 16" size for Brompton. Not for the Curve. Not sure if the Brompton wheel size could fit on a Curve (with the slimmer studded tyres for Brompton).

I am happy with my Curve but in your situation and traveling that much and wanting to bring a bike plus being car free I am thinking Brompton. Also the easyest bike to bring into buildings to avoid theft.

If you think that bringing the bike with you all the time can be a problem you could also get rid of your present bike and get one beater (cheap looking) folder and one folder to fly with, like a Dahon Curve. Both of them would fit in your apartment. Beater could be a 20" one that can take studded tyres for winter. Curve can not take studded (unless you make them yourself) but is a light great bike for travel. you can ask thor if it is possible to change out the stem on the Curve for less reach.

two folders like suggested may not be cheaper than a Brompton in the long run but safer since a beater may be left alone if locked outside and you would still have one bike to ride if the beater is stolen.

I suggest you PM the three folder sellers here as they can have info on smaller

if you insist on keeping your present roadbike you can look into converting it to 650B or similar wheel size. Search the forums for info.

tdonline

I asked Tim about trying 16" Dahon but he doesn't carry any at his store. He also said they only offer up to 3 gears (I had indicated as a triple rider, gears are my friends.)

That eezz d3 is very intriguing. Love the fold and the 20ish pounds weight. Not sure if the gearing is right for me. Here is a very thorough review of the bike--sounds like it's for the boy/girl racers.

Dahon EEZZ D3 Owner Review ? Skye Ventures ? Singapore

badmother

I also looked at eezzd3 after i posted. Looks like the handlepost goes more straight up and the curves post goes more forwards. This Could be an advantage for you but of course depends on the top tube lenght of the two bikes.

linberl

Maybe one of the more mechanically inclined can answer whether you can upgrade the gearing if you find it wanting. Given your unique circumstances, I'd say find a bike that fits first and tweak as needed.

You should PM downtube/Yan and ask what the top tube dimension is on the Mini. It is 8 speeds internal gearing and looks a lot like the Curve, 24.5 lbs, folds small.

tdonline

If it curves forward (away from me) then that's a big no. The eezzd3 does look great though. The fold and weight are certainly enticing.

downtube

The mini has a top tube length of 53cm (center to center ). I'm not sure the top tube length is what the OP needs, I think virtual top tube is more relevant ( from hands to saddle ) and that changes as the saddle & stem goes up ( or down ). It can also be modified by rotating the bars or for-aft adjustment on the saddle...alot of variables to work with.

Thanks,
Yan

linberl

Well, sounds like the Mini might work, since at 5'3" the seat is going to be pretty far down. Add some swept back bars... I don't suppose there is a way for someone in the OP's location to actually try one? You've got them at a great price right now...

downtube

We don't have dealers, nor are we looking to add any, hence we do not have the facilities for a test ride.

Thanks,
Yan

downtube

I just looked at Dahon's site for the Speed d7. Is this a $500 bike without quick releases on the wheels? When did they downgrade it?

Thanks,
Yan

HGR3inOK

AFAIK, the Dahon Speed D7 has never had quick releases on the wheels. You may have it confused with the Speed P8.


-HANK RYAN-
Norman, Oklahoma USA

downtube

I sold Dahon's up until 2005, and I recall it had QR's. Am I wrong?

Thanks,
Yan

veloceleste

sorry, couldn't resist!
From one of my favorite books:
T Rex Trying