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Old 08-09-17, 08:27 PM   #76
downtube
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtroup View Post
As a new Tern owner, I find it valuable to have a Tern rep visiting these forums. He stepped up to resolve a problem to the customer's satisfaction, and is harassed and baited for his attention. If for some unfathomable reason, you need to hate on a company (a company of which you are clearly not even a customer), maybe you could at least pretend to be civil, or better yet, ignore the thread, so that us actual customers can benefit from the rep's presence on the forum. Thanks.
I understand your position, and I agree with the question....why all the hate??? There is alot you may not be aware of. I will make a list in the next few days and post here.

Please understand I think all the senior active folding bike forum members ( except Thor ) agree with my position on this matter.....they are considered experts in this field, and that means alot.

Thanks,
Yan
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Old 08-10-17, 01:53 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by smallwheeler View Post
what would it take? multiple deaths? i'm sure you realize it's only by amazing luck that that hasn't already occurred.
Maybe I'm wrong in assuming this but it always feels to me that people take little notice of the weight restrictions on bikes. You get a Specialized bike that has a weight capacity of 136kg/300lbs and lifetime frame warranty and you get a Decathlon BTwin bike that has a load capacity of 100kg which they state includes the bike weight itself which could be 15kg.

http://www.btwin.com/notices/wp-cont...5V_EN_PE12.pdf

So one is about 85/86 kg capacity in real terms and the other is 50kg stronger a huge difference. Of course the btwin bike gets the good reviews thanks to its super light design and low price and the Specialized looks expensive and handles poor in comparison but is actually a much stronger and safer bike. There has been a huge recall of Btwin bikes recently due to frame failures for larger frame sizes of their mountain bikes and I wonder how many of those people were actually within their low weight requirements especially as people tall enough to need the larger frames would be likely to be over the bike's low weight limits.

If a Tern bike has a 95kg or 105kg maximum weight capacity allowing for clothes and things I might want to carry I'm going to need a body weight of maybe 80 or 90kg to be safely in their maximum weight capacity. I realise these Tern frames may actually have failed due to quality issues and inconsistency of manufacturing but assuming they have born the cost of this recall and have improved their bike frames now plus working within their weight limits I would think they would still be a viable option. Sadly the very best weight I've achieved in recent years is about 95kg and I'm aiming to get to 100kg at the moment as I'm north of that figure. I'll probably always be too heavy to be safe on a Tern bike anyway. One thing I won't be buying is a secondhand Tern bike, not knowing its history and who has been riding it yet I actually see the secondhand price of Tern bikes is actually really high.
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Old 08-10-17, 04:07 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by downtube View Post
This sounds kind of like IBM, Google or Apple. However, the truth is the IP they used against me was worthless since no one ever used anything like it in the bicycle industry. It was developed by Dahon ( patent was submitted and approved for Dahon ). They hold a couple design patents ( design IP is nearly impossible to enforce ), especially when no one uses such poor designs. It didn't stop them from filing a case for patent infringement. Every lawyer I talked to laughed at the claim.....it was that ridiculous. I understand these cases have been filed against more companies than mine. I know of one overseas that conceded to the Plaintiff's demands...without a fight. I have been told there are many more.

Thanks,
Yan
Yan,

I doubt either Dahon or Tern would have wasted money on expensive lawyers persuing frivolous claims.

Mark
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Old 08-10-17, 07:28 AM   #79
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Mark,

I think your presence is best served in a heavily moderated forum like Tern's. People are free to speak here.

Well the complaint can be found at https://www.dropbox.com/sh/x5ddjbzrk...pofuUT-Sa?dl=0 . I also included the warning letter that was sent to my "fake" address in Agora Hills, Ca . More on that later.

There are many problems with the complaint:

1. Jurisdiction - I have not lived or operated the Downtube in PA for nearly a decade, yet it was filed in PA. www.downtube.com even states we are in Greensboro, NC and I deliver bikes in the Triad.
2. There are claims of shell businesses - This is beyond absurd. Who would even think of such nonsense??? Is there any justification? If so please share.
3. They claim we don't have the capital to run our operation- I've been doing this for almost fifteen years, and we have had triple digit growth in the past few years. I would say our operation has never been better.....but what do I know???
3. The complaint claims that I was served with a warning letter. A letter was sent to me at a fake address in Agora Hills, Ca. I have never set foot in the city of Agora Hills, Ca. The address was a UPS Store Box. I called the store and they confirmed that I never owned a box at the store. The filing attorney stated he got the address from the Plaintiff ( Mobility/Tern ). The filing attorney may have issues with the BAR since I was never served the letter & the complaint claims I received it. They are not allowed to lie in a complaint, my being served with a warning letter was a lie!
4. Then we get to the design patents- Every attorney laughed at the claim. They all said the same thing, " we don't see any connection". It was that ridiculous.

They pulled the case case after I threatened Rule 11 sanctions, which applies to filing a frivolous lawsuit.

To summarize Downtube beat Mobility ( Tern ) and it will happen again next time they file more nonsense.

Thanks,
Yan
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Old 08-10-17, 08:34 AM   #80
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I mean that Mr. Bickerton's appearance here deserves thankfulness, appreciation and respect - but not being attacked for things which may not be mainly his mission at Tern.
Please let us get back on topic, regarding the hinge bolt.
(I do not own a Tern bike.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by audioforma
Any suggestions please? I bought this bike second hand...
As this is your first post:
Welcome at bikeforums

I believe to remember that Tern's warranty is valid for the first buyer exclusively,
in that case you might think about consulting skilled bike mechanics.
Explain them the facts, show them pic and tools description below - they will know how to use the extractor if they are really skilled!

1. We, two experienced Viennese mechanics, claim that it is shameful and awkward to hear bike store owners say:
"OMG - a snapped bolt thread - this is a total frame loss!"
Repairing of threads and retracting of broken bolts is actually basic knowledge for a bike mechanic - we recommend to hire qualified personnel.
Replacing the frame for this reason is a tremendous waste of ressources we believe.

2. The broken Tern bolt - granted - may be called tricky, but it is possible to repair and my friend figured out how, as already posted at a German forum. For an experienced mechanic it should be no problem to fix the issue within 1-2 hours - providing that correct tools are used; these are very important.
Below the "special" tools; costs ~ 20 Euros, and a short description:
Most right a cylindrical (screw) extractor pin, size1, 3,2 x 60 mm (it is rippled lengthwise),
Ausdrehstift Gr.1 3,2X60mm bei SPIRAL Reihs & Co. KG
next to it the nut for driving of the pin (the hole inside is also rippled to match the outer shape of the pin exactly),
Ausdrehmutter Gr1 10X3,2mm bei SPIRAL Reihs & Co. KG
above the guiding tube for the 3,2 mm drill bit (size 8,0 x 3,2 x 30 mm, edge beveled),
a few high quality 3,2 mm drill bits,
most left the new Tern bolts.
Hint: Don't waste time with the common, conical, left-hand threaded screw extractors, these will most likely not work.
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Old 08-10-17, 09:50 AM   #81
Abu Mahendra
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Originally Posted by smallwheeler View Post
you forgot the dahon "lapdogs"?
Those exist too. Blind fanboyism, dogmatic allegiance exists in all brands. I, myself, love my two Dahons, but admittedly they are not the common, entry-level ones. The moment Dahon started pulling T**n antics, I would call it out for what it is. Dahon lapdogs are far less common and numerous than, say, Brompton or BF...
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Old 08-10-17, 03:02 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mtroup View Post
As a new Tern owner, I find it valuable to have a Tern rep visiting these forums. He stepped up to resolve a problem to the customer's satisfaction, and is harassed and baited for his attention. If for some unfathomable reason, you need to hate on a company (a company of which you are clearly not even a customer), maybe you could at least pretend to be civil, or better yet, ignore the thread, so that us actual customers can benefit from the rep's presence on the forum. Thanks.
Please note that I am Senior Member of this forum who reviews forum postings daily, and a former authorized dealer for Tern (and Dahon, Raleigh, Diamondback, Hoffman, Linus and Detroit Bikes).

As an authorized dealer for Tern bicycles in the USA from 2011 through 2015, my experience was that the company owners and employees were conscientious, accessible and focused on providing the best folding bikes possible. Frame recalls were handled promptly with a focus on minimizing the inconvenience to the customer. My recollection is that we only had one Tern warranty claim (a broken brake lever?), and that claim was handled promptly and satisfactorily.

I agree with Mr. Lyansky's statement, "There is a lot you may not be aware of." I do not agree with his position regarding Tern to the extent that he portrays the company and its employees as evil beings who do not care about their customers.

-HANK RYAN-
Norman, Oklahoma USA
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Old 08-10-17, 04:03 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HGR3inOK View Post
Please note that I am Senior Member of this forum who reviews forum postings daily, and a former authorized dealer for Tern (and Dahon, Raleigh, Diamondback, Hoffman, Linus and Detroit Bikes).

As an authorized dealer for Tern bicycles in the USA from 2011 through 2015, my experience was that the company owners and employees were conscientious, accessible and focused on providing the best folding bikes possible. Frame recalls were handled promptly with a focus on minimizing the inconvenience to the customer. My recollection is that we only had one Tern warranty claim (a broken brake lever?), and that claim was handled promptly and satisfactorily.

I agree with Mr. Lyansky's statement, "There is a lot you may not be aware of." I do not agree with his position regarding Tern to the extent that he portrays the company and its employees as evil beings who do not care about their customers.

-HANK RYAN-
Norman, Oklahoma USA
How many Tern folders are sold in OK?
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Old 08-10-17, 05:11 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by Abu Mahendra View Post
How many Tern folders are sold in OK?
I don't know. We were selling ~1/month when we had our shop in Norman. Our best seller was the Link C7 (~1/3 of the Terns we sold). We drew folding bike customers from Kansas, Arkansas and Texas because we had one of the largest selections of folding bikes between the Mississippi and the Rockies.

-HANK RYAN-
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Old 08-14-17, 12:47 AM   #85
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Originally Posted by Mark Bickerton View Post
Hi Alex,
I am sorry to hear that you are disappointed in your Tern bike and the service you have had.
If you think I can be of any help please email me directly and I will do what I can.
My email is "mark . bickerton @ ternbicycles . com" (no spaces)
Thanks
Mark Bickerton
UK Representation for Tern Bicycles
Mark
I wasn't disappointed with my bike, I thought it was an extremely good and fast bike! But you know, when you are riding at 18mph + and the next thing you know you are on the floor only to find your bike has just snapped in half you kind of lose confidence in the brand you bought into!!
Evans customer service had been very good to date!
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Old 08-14-17, 08:04 AM   #86
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The Tern Verge has similar geometry to the Dahon IOS no? Are there any cases of this particular Dahon breaking? Wonder what is the difference between the two ...
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Old 08-14-17, 08:11 AM   #87
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Originally Posted by Blackstrida_A_ View Post
I mean that Mr. Bickerton's appearance here deserves thankfulness, appreciation and respect - but not being attacked for things which may not be mainly his mission at Tern.
Please let us get back on topic, regarding the hinge bolt.
(I do not own a Tern bike.)



As this is your first post:
Welcome at bikeforums

I believe to remember that Tern's warranty is valid for the first buyer exclusively,
in that case you might think about consulting skilled bike mechanics.
Explain them the facts, show them pic and tools description below - they will know how to use the extractor if they are really skilled!

1. We, two experienced Viennese mechanics, claim that it is shameful and awkward to hear bike store owners say:
"OMG - a snapped bolt thread - this is a total frame loss!"
Repairing of threads and retracting of broken bolts is actually basic knowledge for a bike mechanic - we recommend to hire qualified personnel.
Replacing the frame for this reason is a tremendous waste of ressources we believe.

2. The broken Tern bolt - granted - may be called tricky, but it is possible to repair and my friend figured out how, as already posted at a German forum. For an experienced mechanic it should be no problem to fix the issue within 1-2 hours - providing that correct tools are used; these are very important.
Below the "special" tools; costs ~ 20 Euros, and a short description:
Most right a cylindrical (screw) extractor pin, size1, 3,2 x 60 mm (it is rippled lengthwise),
Ausdrehstift Gr.1 3,2X60mm bei SPIRAL Reihs & Co. KG
next to it the nut for driving of the pin (the hole inside is also rippled to match the outer shape of the pin exactly),
Ausdrehmutter Gr1 10X3,2mm bei SPIRAL Reihs & Co. KG
above the guiding tube for the 3,2 mm drill bit (size 8,0 x 3,2 x 30 mm, edge beveled),
a few high quality 3,2 mm drill bits,
most left the new Tern bolts.
Hint: Don't waste time with the common, conical, left-hand threaded screw extractors, these will most likely not work.
I assume the bolt breaks at interface of threaded part and non-threaded part?

Then you drill using the guide? Next you hammer the extractor pin and screw out the broken threaded portion of the bolt?

Sorry, based on the picture, I am trying to guess the method.

With regard to the "reverse thread" conical extractor, yes I had bad experience with it, but it was with a car engine. In the end, had to weld a metal piece to broken bolt to remove it.
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Old 08-14-17, 09:51 AM   #88
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Hi dahoneezz,

no reason to be sorry and three times "Yes exactly"

Two more hints for drilling/using guide:
- The guide can be used at the same time for the depth adjustment of the drill bit.
- The borings (or drill shavings, swarfs) should be removed several times during drilling.
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