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Old 04-15-17, 10:14 AM   #1
alexvazquez
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Allen Sport XWay versus New World Tourist

Hi,

I'm. Trying to decide what folding bike to buy. My two final options are Allen Sport XWay 20 speed at $1,260 usd or Bike Friday New World Tourist 24 speed at $1,300 usd. I like more the XWay design but really want to get feedback from someone with experience with folding bikes.

Appreciate any help.
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Old 04-15-17, 10:28 AM   #2
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Hey there.
Well, apart from having 20 speed, the bolth bike are completely diferent.
New world tourist is a chromoly bike, 406 wheels, focused on long distance touring and hard to fold(2min).
Allen x xtrem is a aluminum 6061, 451 wheels, veru focused on premium urban bike niche(comparable to dahon vector, etxc)..
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Old 04-15-17, 10:42 AM   #3
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Hey there.
Well, apart from having 20 speed, the bolth bike are completely diferent.
New world tourist is a chromoly bike, 406 wheels, focused on long distance touring and hard to fold(2min).
Allen x xtrem is a aluminum 6061, 451 wheels, veru focused on premium urban bike niche(comparable to dahon vector, etxc)..
Hi, appreciate your feedback. I want it to use it for pavement roads basically, small hills, etc I like XWay design more, what is chromoly bike? Does aluminum 6061 is good or bad? 451 wheels are better?

Appreciate it
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Old 04-15-17, 10:59 AM   #4
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Hi, appreciate your feedback. I want it to use it for pavement roads basically, small hills, etc I like XWay design more, what is chromoly bike? Does aluminum 6061 is good or bad? 451 wheels are better?

Appreciate it
You are welcome.
i would dare to suggest you to stay away from new world tourist as its not what you looking for(its a steel frame, needs taken care, clean, focus on road ride, heavy duty touring.
it also take WEEKS to your bike arive from their facotory.
From alen i never see one from mylself but they seem very nice for mild priced foldinder.
alu 6061 is industry standard, found in cheap to mid range bikes(oposed to 7005 alu).
406 AND 451 is wheel diameters os 20" folders
If i was going to buy myself, i woould open posaibilities and try to include DAHON VECTOR; BIKE FRIDAY PACKIT
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Old 04-15-17, 11:11 AM   #5
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You are welcome.
i would dare to suggest you to stay away from new world tourist as its not what you looking for(its a steel frame, needs taken care, clean, focus on road ride, heavy duty touring.
it also take WEEKS to your bike arive from their facotory.
From alen i never see one from mylself but they seem very nice for mild priced foldinder.
alu 6061 is industry standard, found in cheap to mid range bikes(oposed to 7005 alu).
406 AND 451 is wheel diameters os 20" folders
If i was going to buy myself, i woould open posaibilities and try to include DAHON VECTOR; BIKE FRIDAY PACKIT
Great feedback, do you really know if I will feel a difference between 20 speed and 24 speed ?
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Old 04-15-17, 11:31 AM   #6
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Great feedback, do you really know if I will feel a difference between 20 speed and 24 speed ?
Hey, gears and they quantity is a very tricky subject.
20 gears in my opinion is already a lot, pehaps usefull if you are a road biker that needs to go very fast on flats and need to reduce a lot in insane hill.
To awnser objetively, 20(2x10) gears is better than 24(3x8).
In short, because you wont have a lot chain cross and forbiden gear combinations.
Best
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Old 04-15-17, 11:55 AM   #7
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I would not focus on 20 or 24 gears. Most likely both bikes will have more than enough gears.

More relevant is steel vs aluminum & 406mm vs 451mm wheels. Steel is much more comfortable to ride, and 451mm tires are difficult to source, making 406mm better ( since you will have options ).

I like the NWT, honestly I don't understand how Allen advertises 451mm wheels as superior....they are actually inferior for most applications.

Thanks,
Yan
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Old 04-15-17, 12:28 PM   #8
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I also think that both 20 and 24 gears are plenty. With 8sp you get a more durable chain though indeed 3x front shifting can be more trouble prone than 2x. Personally I also favor chromoly frames over alu. Steel is forgiving - you do not worry about minor dents or crimping. In the case of alu a dent may mean the frame being on its way out. As mentioned, riding alu can be harsh compared to steel. Finally, NWT is a reasonable bike but its folding is so-so. I have no experience with Allen.
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Old 04-15-17, 12:32 PM   #9
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Take a few minutes to calculate all of the gear ratios available with either 20 or 24 speeds. You will likely find a lot of duplicate (or near duplicate) gear ratios, so the number of unique gear ratios will be less than tht 20 or 24 advertised. Having a huge number of gear combinations to choose from is not necessarily an advantage, I typically find myself using only three or four gears typically anyway.
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Old 04-15-17, 07:25 PM   #10
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My BF is 14 years old and there is no rust or any other issue with the chromoly frame; steel doesn't crack easily and can be repaired. Also BF gives a lifetime guarantee on their frames, and is well known for their incredible customer service. It is not quite as light as an aluminum frame but it absorbs shocks which matters with 20" wheels. I can quick fold my BF NWT in 60 seconds; others can do it faster
. The folding stem version is similar to folding a Dahon; you can compare speed to the regular bike friday. It can be packed into a suitcase for flight as well (~20 mins with practice). I encourage you to RIDE the bikes you are considering. Call BF and they can put you in touch with either a local dealer or a local customer to have a test ride. Don't know about the other bike in terms of testing it. If you are going to travel a lot with your folder then 406 wheels will be much easier to deal with for replacement tires/tubes/rims.
Finally, the BF will be custom built to your exact size and specifications. I'm not familiar with Allen enough to know whether they are another one-size-fits-all (or doesn't) folding bike.

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Old 04-15-17, 07:36 PM   #11
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Why did you decide on these two very different bikes?

Personally, I think before buying a bike, you should carefully consider what you want from the bike. Then find a dealer to try some folding bikes. Or if you're interested in the Bike Friday, you can normally contact a local through Bike Friday with a bike to examine and perhaps test ride.

Broadly speaking, 406 wheels, rims, tires, and tubes are much more common. I would stick with them.
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Old 04-16-17, 07:25 AM   #12
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My BF is 14 years old and there is no rust or any other issue with the chromoly frame; steel doesn't crack easily and can be repaired. Also BF gives a lifetime guarantee on their frames, and is well known for their incredible customer service. It is not quite as light as an aluminum frame but it absorbs shocks which matters with 20" wheels. I can quick fold my BF NWT in 60 seconds; others can do it faster https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWvzk-CP9po&t=31s. The folding stem version is similar to folding a Dahon; you can compare speed to the regular bike friday. It can be packed into a suitcase for flight as well (~20 mins with practice). I encourage you to RIDE the bikes you are considering. Call BF and they can put you in touch with either a local dealer or a local customer to have a test ride. Don't know about the other bike in terms of testing it. If you are going to travel a lot with your folder then 406 wheels will be much easier to deal with for replacement tires/tubes/rims.
Finally, the BF will be custom built to your exact size and specifications. I'm not familiar with Allen enough to know whether they are another one-size-fits-all (or doesn't) folding bike.
Well, i must say im impressed.
The nwt used to need allen key to unscrew stem.
But even improved, its still a clumsy method compared to brompton dahon or even bf tikrit.

Also, when you say you have a cromoly bike for 13 years and no sigh of rust i must say you are dar lucky.
IF A CROMOLY bike get and dent of scuff, it will rust heavily.
IF A CROMOLY bike stay in saline enviroment(a costal city, a city that uses salt to melt snow) it will rust badly.
There is so many examples...
pehaps living in a very dry places like arizona or atacama in chile these guys lasts forever but thats not the reality of the majority of places in world.
these bike need to be taken care as babies, clean, treat scuffs and dents with anti corrosive primer, keeps painting...its not for everyone.
Lastly I must dissagree with cromoly been forgiving with hashness. Chromoly Brompton have serius harsh ride. Very similar to my alu 6061 dahon mu also similar to my alu 7005 dahon dove. For harsh the thing that matters is tyre pressure and wideness.
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Old 04-16-17, 09:34 AM   #13
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Well, i must say im impressed.
The nwt used to need allen key to unscrew stem.
But even improved, its still a clumsy method compared to brompton dahon or even bf tikrit.

Also, when you say you have a cromoly bike for 13 years and no sigh of rust i must say you are dar lucky.
IF A CROMOLY bike get and dent of scuff, it will rust heavily.
IF A CROMOLY bike stay in saline enviroment(a costal city, a city that uses salt to melt snow) it will rust badly.
There is so many examples...
pehaps living in a very dry places like arizona or atacama in chile these guys lasts forever but thats not the reality of the majority of places in world.
these bike need to be taken care as babies, clean, treat scuffs and dents with anti corrosive primer, keeps painting...its not for everyone.
Lastly I must dissagree with cromoly been forgiving with hashness. Chromoly Brompton have serius harsh ride. Very similar to my alu 6061 dahon mu also similar to my alu 7005 dahon dove. For harsh the thing that matters is tyre pressure and wideness.
I live in San Francisco, a coastal environment. Bike chromoly is just fine and I haven't even treated it with framesaver. I'm curious if you ever had a chromoly bike or where your experience with chromoly comes from? Bromptons are not chromoly! They are hi-ten steel unless you upgrade to titanium. Very different from chromoly. Specs for brompton: Frame
Main: Butt brazed, low carbon steel (titanium rear triangle optional).
Fork: Butt brazed, low carbon steel (titanium fork optional).
Seat Post: Polished alloy.

The Tikit is no longer produced btw. And BF is less about folding and celebrated for their great ride quality.
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Old 04-16-17, 10:03 AM   #14
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Also, when you say you have a cromoly bike for 13 years and no sigh of rust i must say you are dar lucky.
IF A CROMOLY bike get and dent of scuff, it will rust heavily.
IF A CROMOLY bike stay in saline enviroment(a costal city, a city that uses salt to melt snow) it will rust badly.
There is so many examples...
pehaps living in a very dry places like arizona or atacama in chile these guys lasts forever but thats not the reality of the majority of places in world.
these bike need to be taken care as babies, clean, treat scuffs and dents with anti corrosive primer, keeps painting...its not for everyone.
Lastly I must dissagree with cromoly been forgiving with hashness. Chromoly Brompton have serius harsh ride. Very similar to my alu 6061 dahon mu also similar to my alu 7005 dahon dove. For harsh the thing that matters is tyre pressure and wideness.
Many wrong statements. I favor steel bikes and often buy used ones. A number of these in my household is about 20y old. They all do fine and I live in an area with harsh winters and heavy salting during the winters. In fact now in spring you often ride over surfaces sprinkled with salt crystals. I hardly even bother to cover any area where paint could come off. Chromoly does not want to rust. I am of light weight and, unless there is good suspension, I feel that I could lose teeth riding an alu frame - tires don't help. Bromptons ride very smoothly...
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Old 04-16-17, 11:27 AM   #15
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So you mean that buying Allen Sport XWay 451mm wheel will be harder to find replacements than buying 406mm from BF bike? And you also say that steel frame offers a softer ride and is more confortable? why?
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Old 04-16-17, 11:50 AM   #16
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You are welcome.
i would dare to suggest you to stay away from new world tourist as its not what you looking for(its a steel frame, needs taken care, clean, focus on road ride, heavy duty touring.
it also take WEEKS to your bike arive from their facotory.
From alen i never see one from mylself but they seem very nice for mild priced foldinder.
alu 6061 is industry standard, found in cheap to mid range bikes(oposed to 7005 alu).
406 AND 451 is wheel diameters os 20" folders
If i was going to buy myself, i woould open posaibilities and try to include DAHON VECTOR; BIKE FRIDAY PACKIT
I just feel lost, so from reading all post that means that Allen Sport XWay 451mm is not a good idea, is there a big difference if I get a 7 or 8 speed buy versus 20 speed? I wont ride it on 45 degree hills I guess and I can save some money. I want a very light bike, small in foldable size and confortable to ride. As told you my main purpose of having the bike is for working out 1 or 2 hours per day. Appreciate again for your help.+
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Old 04-16-17, 11:57 AM   #17
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I would stay away from Allen, unless they closeout their carbon bikes for $800 again. A Dahon Speed 8 is my favorite Dahon. Steel frame, cassette drivetrain. All around good bike.

Thanks
Yan
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Old 04-16-17, 10:43 PM   #18
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I just feel lost, so from reading all post that means that Allen Sport XWay 451mm is not a good idea, is there a big difference if I get a 7 or 8 speed buy versus 20 speed? I wont ride it on 45 degree hills I guess and I can save some money. I want a very light bike, small in foldable size and confortable to ride. As told you my main purpose of having the bike is for working out 1 or 2 hours per day. Appreciate again for your help.+
my friend, this thread exists to help you.
first there is not a bike witch is light and afordable at same time.
Lets get things simple again.

you want to buy a folding bike and have us$1.200,00 to spend.

Lets skip wheels sizes and frame materials infinite discussions.

Lets also skip gear discussion.

I will make some choices for you:
Wheel: 406 20"(available everywhere, upgradeable, easy serviceable)
Frame: 7005 alu hidroformed(top class aluminun alows to make tinner and lighter state of the art framesvery stiff great)
Gears: all around 20 top of the class sran red

For this money and specs you may find very almost top of the class in dahon nice bikes:

Dahon vector x20:
https://www.amazon.com/Dahon-Vector-P20-92-7-06-Folding/dp/B00K9Y1NEO

FOR a litle extra of 600,00, expending your bucket to 1.800,00 you can go even for a carbon fancy folder dahon 30 anni from our loved thorusa seller:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00EA1FYSI/ref=mp_s_a_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1492403829&sr=8-4&pi=AC_SX236_SY340_QL65&keywords=dahon+folding+bike&dpPl=1&dpID=51D7UJbJwZL&ref=plSrch

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Old 04-17-17, 03:36 AM   #19
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I would stay away from Allen, unless they closeout their carbon bikes for $800 again. A Dahon Speed 8 is my favorite Dahon. Steel frame, cassette drivetrain. All around good bike.

Thanks
Yan
+1

The Best Folding Bikes - Reviews and Ultimate Buying Guide

Best folding bike for 2017 - BikeRadar

Why henceforth I will no longer use 2x drivetrains on my 406 bikes...
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Old 04-17-17, 07:53 AM   #20
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I wouldn't pick any of the 2 bikes. For just $999, I would buy the Dahon Qix D8, it's unbeatable for the price.

Dahon Qix D8 Review - The Best Commuter Bike Ever
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Old 04-17-17, 08:28 AM   #21
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Bikefolded reviews the lowest end bikes on the market. Their reviews do not have the depth of other reviewers. I would not take their recommendation seriously.

Thanks
Yan
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Old 04-17-17, 08:43 AM   #22
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Thanks for the links, why the Allen Sports XWay is on that list when its 451mm and people say that the problem is lack of tires and replacements.? That was my first choice actually. Thanks
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Old 04-17-17, 08:56 AM   #23
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I would stay away from Allen, unless they closeout their carbon bikes for $800 again. A Dahon Speed 8 is my favorite Dahon. Steel frame, cassette drivetrain. All around good bike.

Thanks
Yan
Hi, someone share a URL The Best Folding Bikes - Reviews and Ultimate Buying Guide and sorprise that Allen Sport XWay is the 2nd option to pick. Im now lost again
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Old 04-17-17, 09:00 AM   #24
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From the list provided BikeRadar is the only reputable source.

Thanks
Yan
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Old 04-17-17, 09:07 AM   #25
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From the list provided BikeRadar is the only reputable source.

Thanks
Yan
Really? Good to know.
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