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Old 08-09-17, 10:19 AM   #1
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Frame Hinge Tightness

I was telling someone with typical weak hand strength, that if you don't see see bruising mark on your hand and if it didn't hurt alittle, then it's not tight enough.

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Old 08-09-17, 07:54 PM   #2
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https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...nge+adjustment
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Old 08-12-17, 12:47 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by tds101 View Post
Dahon service manual says 29 Newton-meter to 49 Newston-meter (21 ft-lb to 36 ft-lb), for the Vybe clamp.

But I have no idea how that translate into real world feel.

My bike from the factory had super tight handlepost clamp...but very loose frame clamp.
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Old 08-12-17, 12:49 PM   #4
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Dahon service manual says 29 Newton-meter to 49 Newston-meter (21 ft-lb to 36 ft-lb), for the Vybe clamp.

But I have no idea how that translate into real world feel.
I don't have a clue myself (I don't own a torque wrench, but I should), so I just use common sense.
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Old 08-12-17, 01:05 PM   #5
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There's no set rule. it depends on the specific design. Some are not great and need to be tightened with near superhuman strength. Others, mainly those with a cam of some kind are fully secure with little effort. Note, that most, if not all, the lever or cam systems are adjustable, so getting that right is key.

BTW - there's a decent degree of forgiveness in the hinge's design. There wont be a disaster if it should loosen. Instead you'll hear telltale clicking and in extreme cases see or feel that they're loose. So, the worst likely scenario is having to stop and tighten mid ride. If you have issues with the hinge loosening, tighten it more. If all is OK then whatever you're doing is fine.
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Old 08-13-17, 07:29 PM   #6
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I make it just tight enough so it can't move when I ride over potholes. If there is any play, you'll soon see wear on the hinge, so when in doubt check there often until you get a feel for it. Better to start off a little less tight than break the latch. To do this by hand without a meter may just take some mechanical talent that's not required with regular bikes. If everything works as it should, some of those hinges can last decades.
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Old 08-14-17, 12:37 PM   #7
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Thanks for those videos. I didn't realize my hinge has a lock screw hidden inside, until I saw the video.

I guess the lock screw keeps the adjustment from moving...that could explain why I have to readjust the hinge so often.
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Old 08-14-17, 03:23 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by mtb_addict View Post
I was telling someone ... that if you don't see see bruising mark on your hand and if it didn't hurt a little, then it's not tight enough.
The generally accepted recommendation is that you should use pressure firm enough that you see the imprint of the lever on the palm of your hand. Neither bruising nor pain is necessary.

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Dahon service manual says (insert torque value here)... But I have no idea how that translate into real world feel.
Basically it's impossible to measure the actual torque without specialized equipment... even a standard torque wrench can't do this.

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BTW - there's a decent degree of forgiveness in the hinge's design. There wont be a disaster if it should loosen.
If the bike is ridden with a loose latch, there can be stress concentrations in areas that move when they shouldn't. If anything, it's better to be a little on the too-tight side than too loose, especially if the frame and latch are made of aluminum.

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If there is any play, you'll soon see wear on the hinge...
There will be wear on the hinge surfaces to a certain extent no matter what. That is why the joint is adjustable. One of the first things to go is the paint on the heavily loaded spots; even this small amount of dimensional change can make the latch markedly looser.

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Thanks for those videos. I didn't realize my hinge has a lock screw hidden inside, until I saw the video.
This is an improvement in the latch which I had not seen. Neither of my two Dahons has this feature, nor does my Tern. I put a drop of blue Loc-Tite on the threads to prevent movement, but once you're used to making the adjustments you can do it in seconds without tools if the barrel adjusters are loose enough. The lock screw is a nice touch!

FWIW, I have a Dahon Helios XL with 3,000 miles on it, a Dahon Mu XL with over 12,000 miles on it, and a Tern Verge S11i with over 5,000 miles on it.
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Old 08-14-17, 03:38 PM   #9
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If the bike is ridden with a loose latch, there can be stress concentrations in areas that move when they shouldn't. If anything, it's better to be a little on the too-tight side than too loose, especially if the frame and latch are made of aluminum....
You read more (or maybe less) into my post about latch forgiveness. I don't suggest that riding with a loose latch for any long interval is OK. But I do say that loose hinges make themselves obvious, giving the rider plenty of opportunity to address the problem.
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Old 08-14-17, 03:58 PM   #10
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You read more (or maybe less) into my post about latch forgiveness. I don't suggest that riding with a loose latch for any long interval is OK. But I do say that loose hinges make themselves obvious, giving the rider plenty of opportunity to address the problem.
I agree with you. The thing that's the mystery to me is why anyone would ride with a loose latch in the first place, as the correct adjustment is so easy to obtain. You adjust the barrel one way and check: if it's too loose, you turn it the other way until you get it right. In the days before the Dahon-Tern split I was active on the Dahon Forum, and have been active on the Tern Forum since... it never ceases to amaze me how many owners don't keep their bikes in adjustment. Kind of like the guy who bought a guitar and some time later took it back to the shop to complain about the bad sound, saying "it was in tune when I bought it".
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Old 08-14-17, 04:35 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sweeks View Post
I agree with you. The thing that's the mystery to me is why anyone would ride with a loose latch in the first place, as the correct adjustment is so easy to obtain. You adjust the barrel one way and check: if it's too loose, you turn it the other way until you get it right. In the days before the Dahon-Tern split I was active on the Dahon Forum, and have been active on the Tern Forum since... it never ceases to amaze me how many owners don't keep their bikes in adjustment. Kind of like the guy who bought a guitar and some time later took it back to the shop to complain about the bad sound, saying "it was in tune when I bought it".
Steve
Different folders use various systems. I prefer those with some kind of cam or toggle system, which tend to be easy to use and very reliable. However, I also have one with a hand (knob) screw. That one takes decent force to get tight, and does loosen when riding.
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Old 08-14-17, 07:03 PM   #12
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Different folders use various systems. I prefer those with some kind of cam or toggle system, which tend to be easy to use and very reliable. However, I also have one with a hand (knob) screw. That one takes decent force to get tight, and does loosen when riding.
On my Dahons and Tern, the latches are all of the "over-center" variety, which will self-close once the closure is almost complete. These are pretty reliable as long as they are properly adjusted, and there is a moderately wide range of "proper" adjustment. And, as you pointed out ^^, they are pretty obvious when they are loose.
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Old 08-15-17, 05:31 AM   #13
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... The thing that's the mystery to me is why anyone would ride with a loose latch in the first place, as the correct adjustment is so easy to obtain...
Because there are people who still don't know how to use a quick release skewer and tighten it like a wingnut.
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Old 08-15-17, 07:27 AM   #14
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Because there are people who still don't know how to use a quick release skewer and tighten it like a wingnut.

How has this come to pass???
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