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Old 07-16-08, 03:39 AM   #1
volenet
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folding into unfolding

i know this might seem like an odd thread but...
i own a Dahon Tournado that was a gift to me and is unfortunatelly too big. it's a 56cm version and i'm only 168 so i would surely need the 52cm frame. I'm thinking that I'm either gonna sell the bike or just buy a new frame (not a folding frame as i don't really see the point with a road bike) and swap all the parts.
what i want is a touring bike... something i can commute on but also do my weekend - sort of sporty - rides.
i'd like to hear some opinions on what option you think is better. thanks.
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Old 07-16-08, 06:02 AM   #2
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That's a nice bike, shame it's too big for you. Dont even think about converting it into a non-folding bike, it would cost a lot and you'd end up with something maybe not so desirable. I'd imagine getting a smaller Tornado frame and swapping the parts over would be on, if not expensive, but certainly worth asking Dahon if its possible, maybe Thor who posts here could advise on the availability of new frames. If its brand new you could try a few Dahon dealers and see if they would do a deal for you in exchange for something more suitable, you should get a decent price for it. Other than that, put it on ebay or craigslist, but you would probably loose a fair bit of it's value that way.

Good luck, come back and tell us what happens, & what bike you end up with !

Last edited by Diode100; 07-16-08 at 06:07 AM.
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Old 07-16-08, 06:44 AM   #3
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If you are happy with all the components of the bike, a frame swap isn't a bad idea. You'll likely get a good amount for the frame on Ebay.

The thing to do is find out how much the LBS would charge to swap out all the kit. Assuming you aren't wanting to that yourself.

If you are reasonably mechanically adept, swapping bike bits is pretty straightforward. The bottom bracket and headset would be the only bits that need really specialist tools, and you can always have your LBS do those bits and do the rest yourself.
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Old 07-16-08, 08:38 AM   #4
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This is a 1250 pound ($2500) bike !!!

It has to be worth more in its complete and proper state than canabalised for the parts, remembering you still have to source and pay for a second frame. Trade it, dont chop it !
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Old 07-16-08, 09:31 AM   #5
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no individual frames available .... the closest non folding frame would be a Rivendell
http://www.rivbike.com/products/list...product=50-172
frame fork and headset will put you back 1600 dlr .. but this is really the closest you get with the Dahon Tournado.....

it would be much better to sell the complete bike than to cannibalize it...... with the only exception that you buy a real cheap ( unworthy) frame and fork and than sell the Dahon frame for a premium

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Old 07-16-08, 09:41 AM   #6
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I was going to suggest sell the bike and get a Smooth Hound or Hammer Head, It is not a folder but for the money it is a great deal and easy to transport. With the money you have left over go on a trip with it.
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Old 07-16-08, 03:07 PM   #7
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thanks for all your advice. i think it makes sense not to cannibalize it. it's kind of hard to part with the bike though because it is a real beauty. but the size is crucial and i don't feel comfortable riding it.
i live in prague, czech republic and not only here but in all europe i won't be able to find another (smaller) one. in england, yeah, but they don't usually ship to the mainland. so i guess i'll have to pick up a different model. ****. believe me, bike shopping sucks over here big time. it's all just MTBs
any ideas what i could get? this is my kind of bike
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Old 07-16-08, 03:18 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brakemeister View Post
it would be much better to sell the complete bike than to cannibalize it...... with the only exception that you buy a real cheap ( unworthy) frame and fork and than sell the Dahon frame for a premium

thor
premium frame? what could that be?
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Old 07-16-08, 03:37 PM   #9
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Smooth Hound http://www.thorusa.com/dahon/2007/smoothhound.htm
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Old 07-16-08, 03:44 PM   #10
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premium = as in a lot of money
premiun in this case means that you can get a lot of moeny for the frame ( or a Premiun )

ok ... :-)
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Old 07-17-08, 02:01 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diode100 View Post
This is a 1250 pound ($2500) bike !!!

It has to be worth more in its complete and proper state than canabalised for the parts, remembering you still have to source and pay for a second frame. Trade it, dont chop it !
Quote:
Originally Posted by brakemeister View Post
no individual frames available .... the closest non folding frame would be a Rivendell
http://www.rivbike.com/products/list...product=50-172
frame fork and headset will put you back 1600 dlr .. but this is really the closest you get with the Dahon Tournado.....

it would be much better to sell the complete bike than to cannibalize it...... with the only exception that you buy a real cheap ( unworthy) frame and fork and than sell the Dahon frame for a premium

thor
I'm not super familiar with the tournado, but it seems to make financial sense to just swap the frame out. The Ritchey break-away system adds a huge amount of value to the frame. If you don't need it, I'd guess you can get a lovely custom frame, say a Roberts, Yates, or Mercian, for at least even money. This would also have the benefit of having a frame custom made to fit you. (You could get fit locally, and send the dimensions to the frame builder.) I'm saying this assuming you are looking for a conventional, non-break away bike.

If you sell your old bike as a complete unit, you are paying depreciation on all the parts that make up the bike. If you sell just the frame, you are only paying depreciation on the frame. Beyond that, generally speaking, a you'll get more money for a used bike if you sell the parts individually than as a whole unit. Part of the reason for this is bike manufacturers get components at a reduced price compared to MSRP. The market price on individual components is based on MSRP, not the price manufacturers are paying. This goes for frames too.

It's easy enough to determine if you can figure out what the market value of your bike (and the frame by itself) is in it's current condition. Estimate what the frame is worth by itself, and what the used bike is worth as a complete unit. Then price a new frame of equivalent quality (minus the break-away system), as well as a new complete bike similarly spec'd. I'd bet good money that you'll save a bundle swapping the frame.

Of course, none of this considers the hassle of doing the swap, or the labor costs if you aren't going to do it yourself. Not to mention that you would be without a bike while the transition happens. However, to have bike custom made to fit you exactly...

...bliss.
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Old 07-17-08, 04:49 AM   #12
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custom built frame... wow, you're opening new horizons. i just quickly checked the names you mentioned and i love it. i have to give it more search to find out if it's better to buy whole bike or just a frame and swap. you're right... i love the rest of the bike but again... i don't even know if i'll be able to sell just the tournado frame.
in the meantime i'll probably just get something to commute...
i can't take my eyes of this Speed P8 that sells for 580

but its 20" wheels scare me for the city
so maybe just a coaster like electra that's already got 26" wheels and it's cheap

thanks again for all your input. it's helping me to decide

Last edited by volenet; 07-17-08 at 04:55 AM. Reason: stupidity
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Old 07-17-08, 04:55 AM   #13
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good to know

Quote:
Originally Posted by bendembroski View Post
I'm not super familiar with the tournado, but it seems to make financial sense to just swap the frame out. The Ritchey break-away system adds a huge amount of value to the frame. If you don't need it, I'd guess you can get a lovely custom frame, say a Roberts, Yates, or Mercian, for at least even money. This would also have the benefit of having a frame custom made to fit you. (You could get fit locally, and send the dimensions to the frame builder.) I'm saying this assuming you are looking for a conventional, non-break away bike.

If you sell your old bike as a complete unit, you are paying depreciation on all the parts that make up the bike. If you sell just the frame, you are only paying depreciation on the frame. Beyond that, generally speaking, a you'll get more money for a used bike if you sell the parts individually than as a whole unit. Part of the reason for this is bike manufacturers get components at a reduced price compared to MSRP. The market price on individual components is based on MSRP, not the price manufacturers are paying. This goes for frames too.

It's easy enough to determine if you can figure out what the market value of your bike (and the frame by itself) is in it's current condition. Estimate what the frame is worth by itself, and what the used bike is worth as a complete unit. Then price a new frame of equivalent quality (minus the break-away system), as well as a new complete bike similarly spec'd. I'd bet good money that you'll save a bundle swapping the frame.

Of course, none of this considers the hassle of doing the swap, or the labor costs if you aren't going to do it yourself. Not to mention that you would be without a bike while the transition happens. However, to have bike custom made to fit you exactly...

...bliss.
Good advice bendembroski
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Old 07-17-08, 07:41 AM   #14
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So far I like the Mercian frames the most. I'm thinking Vincitore

I've checked the dimensions and everything and it seems like a nice fit. I also asked them for a catalog so I can choose a nice finish.
the only thing is I would have to wait some 12-16 weeks to get the frame. and of course the price... i'm looking at some 700. well, i hope i can at least sell the tournado frame.
what do you guys think it's worth? 500?
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Old 07-17-08, 11:42 PM   #15
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Probably the best thing to do is see if you can buy a new frame separately retail first. That should give you a good reference point. If they're not available, the next best thing is to see how much high quality, seperable frames go for in general, and use that as a starting point. Take a look at frames by Thorn for instance, or any high quality steel tourer with S&S couplers.

500 sounds about right, but that is just off the top of my head...

Keep in mind that with a new frame, just the breakaway couplers will set you back something around 350.
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Old 07-18-08, 12:08 AM   #16
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...............
but its 20" wheels scare me for the city
...........
Can you tell us why?
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Old 07-18-08, 12:25 AM   #17
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I would steer well clear of the Electra. Bikes like those are not much good for serious riding. They're good for casual cruising on a boardwalk.
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Old 07-18-08, 02:07 AM   #18
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I was also wondering why the apprehension towards 20" inch wheels. I've got 'em on my swift, and love nippy handling in the city. IMHO, better for city riding than a 700 or 26" bike.
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Old 07-18-08, 03:53 AM   #19
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well, prague is not exactly cyclist friendly place... cobblestones, holes, aggressive drivers. i've rode cruisers similar to electra in places like berlin or amsterdam and i liked it but that's a whole different story. you could ride anything there. prague streets are fight for survival. my girlfriend has a Dahon Glide with 24" wheels, she loves it and i think it's a great ride for a city but going for wheels smaller than that?
I guess i have to see if i can test ride it in a LBS. I'm not sure about that though. it's hard to determine what bike would be right for you without test riding it but with not that many specialized shops around...
if you guys ride a 20" wheel bike,... in what terrain?, what is your experience with bad holy roads?

about the road frame... i've contacted the Mercian shop already and they've send me what measurements i need to do. so i guess it might happen. i'm gonna keep you posted.

i appreciate all your input
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Old 07-18-08, 05:36 AM   #20
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The roads around here are in pretty bad nick. Lots of potholes, sunken manhole covers, ruts, the lot. I've been to Prague and would say the roads in Glasgow are comprable. I regularly ride my 700c, 26 inch, and 20 inch bikes and have had the least trouble with the 20 incher going out of true. My guess is the the smaller diameter wheels are stronger. That said, I tend not to jump curbs and I avoid potholes as best I can. I suppose a 20 inch wheel might be a problem when hitting a really BIG hole in the road, but in those cases a bigger wheel is going to hurt too.

The short answer to your questions is I don't think a 20" bike will be a problem for those road conditions. Tire choice is probably more important (Big Apples seem popular here). Like you said, best to ride something first if you get the chance.
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Old 06-05-09, 03:02 AM   #21
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done

It's been a long time but I'm finally done with the frame swap. Here you can see my bike with the custom made King of Mercia frame from Mercian. I've been riding it since yesterday and I just don't wanna get off the bike. It's exactly as bendembroski said... a bliss. It feels like I'm finally riding a bike - super comfortable, I have a whole new control of the bike, even all the parts just seem to be working somehow better. Thanks everybody so much for your input!
Anybody wants the old Tournado frame (great condition)? I'll be selling it on eBay anyway.
Cheers!
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