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  1. #1
    Building a better Strida
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    IF MODE is NOW AVAILABLE!

    Hey guys/gals,

    been a while since i posted but my inbox had something interesting today and its the IF mode by Mark Sanders/Ming Cycle. Looks like the beta tests have finally come to blossom.

    --------------------



    IF-Mode: An Engineering and Design Masterpiece

    The IF-Mode, by acclaimed industrial designer Mark Sanders, is now available for purchase in the USA. Winner of the 2008 Eurobike Award, and the 2009 iF Gold Award (along with the Apple iPhone, the Macbook Air and the VW Golf Mk6), the IF-Mode is a rolling, folding work of art and a bike collector’s dream machine.



    Production is limited. Orders received by Monday, May 4th will be delivered in June 2009. Orders placed after May 4th will not be available until summer’s end. Be the first to own the world’s most exciting and technically advanced folding bike.



    Go to www.areaware.com/mode for more information or to place an order, or call 800-783-5683, ext. 214.



    Mark Sander's Design Brief:

    Most people prefer large wheeled bikes, in part due to ease of pedaling. So when I designed the IF-Mode, I thought about combining the benefits of small folders with full size bicycles, keeping in mind the innovation and value people expect from their personal tools. The IF Mode combines large wheels, ease of near instant folding, compactness, and clean design. Like luggage, it rolls anywhere. Its monoblade wheel mountings, enclosed transmission and uncluttered aesthetic offer a radical new image of what a bicycle can be.



    Read + See

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=BD2lFgMfh2k

    bicycledesign.blogspot.com/2009/03/design-award-for-if-mode.html

    http://www.ppolnews.com/?id=84686&ke...E-folding-bike

    http://www.foldingcyclist.com/Pacifi...ding-bike.html

    www.gizmag.com/ifmode-folding-bicycle/11349/

    http://www.ifdesign.de/awards_exhibi...=goldselection

    http://www.ifdesign.de/beitragsdetai...itrag_id=45000



    Areaware [exclusive USA distributor of the IF-Mode]
    95 Spring St., 2nd floor • New York, NY 10012
    www.areaware.comdiana@areaware.com





  2. #2
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    why is this design limited to a full size bike? it would be nice if it comes in 20inch wheel. maybe we can petition mark to make one. that's what i will say a real commute folder...

  3. #3
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    0. 32 pounds.

    1. Almost everything is custom.

    2. It's humongous!

    3. Not clear that it can roll backwards without the pedals striking the body. The movies are careful never to show that.

    4. An axle with a single attachment point is known as a "lever". I think it's nearly guaranteed to wear out at a rate far exceeding normal axles. Like the Strida, this bike has *two* such axles. But unlike the Strida, this bike has 26" wheels, making a much more forceful lever.

    5. Two speeds. On a 26" wheel bike. In this day and age.

    6. No suspension when adding it would have been trivial.

    7. $2500. For $2500 you can buy TWO tikits or Bromptons, both of which are better bikes.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Chop!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmaniqui View Post
    why is this design limited to a full size bike? it would be nice if it comes in 20inch wheel. maybe we can petition mark to make one. that's what i will say a real commute folder...
    There are several transmogrifications of the IF:- The IF Mode, The IF Reach 20" (Video) & The IF Cross (so far)
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  5. #5
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by feijai View Post
    0. 32 pounds.

    1. Almost everything is custom.

    2. It's humongous!

    3. Not clear that it can roll backwards without the pedals striking the body. The movies are careful never to show that.

    4. An axle with a single attachment point is known as a "lever". I think it's nearly guaranteed to wear out at a rate far exceeding normal axles. Like the Strida, this bike has *two* such axles. But unlike the Strida, this bike has 26" wheels, making a much more forceful lever.

    5. Two speeds. On a 26" wheel bike. In this day and age.

    6. No suspension when adding it would have been trivial.

    7. $2500. For $2500 you can buy TWO tikits or Bromptons, both of which are better bikes.
    I agree if it weighs 32 lbs for $2500 that is poor.

    But wether it rides better than a brompton or co can only be decided by a test ride. I think it will ride better than a brompton, but i am also simply guessing.

    I do not agree than bike should have suspension. It adds weight and slows the bike. It is right on the right bike for the right reasons.
    The 2 speed design may fit a lot of purposes well. ie most bromptons sell as 3 speed. I would consider a superlight single speed bike like little pixels or evil V over a heavier more complex design.


    Interesting design ,will it live up to the promise? or simply look beautifull, for collectors and never be competively priced.
    Last edited by bhkyte; 04-29-09 at 02:58 PM.

  6. #6
    lube addict
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    This IF Mode news was posted earlier here.

  7. #7
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    feijai,

    "2. It's humongous!"

    It is designed that way. Not intended to compete for smallest fold and wasn't designed with small wheels in mind. You don't have a clear understanding of its target market.


    "4. An axle with a single attachment point is known as a "lever". I think it's nearly guaranteed to wear out at a rate far exceeding normal axles. Like the Strida, this bike has *two* such axles. But unlike the Strida, this bike has 26" wheels, making a much more forceful lever."

    Your assumption not borne out by real world observation and testing. You probably know the same designer created the Strida and IF Mode right? Don't you think he would be aware of the issue?


    "5. Two speeds. On a 26" wheel bike. In this day and age."

    Why don't you fault the Strida for being only a 1-speed? Don't pick and choose what you want to fault with the IF Mode. It is designed to be simple without over cluttering the bike with feature-creep. It is not bloated like Microsoft products.



    "6. No suspension when adding it would have been trivial."

    First you fault it for being 32 lbs. Then you fault it for lacking suspension? See any flaw in your logic there? See answer to point 5.



    "7. $2500. For $2500 you can buy TWO tikits or Bromptons, both of which are better bikes."

    Again designed for a different type of user. Tikits and Bromptons are small-wheeled bikes with their inherent handling traits and ride quality. The IF Mode, is intended for a whole group of people who normally discounted folding bike products due to prejudice or preferences against small wheels. So when you say the Tikit or Brompton is better, you need to ask yourself, "Better for who?".

    The IF Mode is most assuredly not intended to compete head to head with a Brompton or Dahon. In fact, Bromptons are in a class by themselves in the folding world just like the Carryme is in a class by itself among the micro-bikes.


    Horses for courses.

    The Strida isn't cheap for what it does either. The price reflects the cost of early adoption and the quality inherent in a Pacific Cycle product.

  8. #8
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    Here is what Pacific say about the IF Bikes:

    "Compared to other consumer products, folding bikes are an interesting challenge... right on the cusp of engineering/structural design and user-focused design - they have to work well, be easy to use while cool and appealing! ‘Folders’ are a keystone of future personal transport - making public travel effectively ‘door-to-door’. They are compact, portable ‘human-amplifiers’, while being pure fun to use.

    In any survey, small wheel folders are only a tiny minority - most people choose large wheeled bikes. There are variety of reasons for this: tradition, perception of ease of pedaling, and emulating bikes used in sports. But the most important is probably image. So when we designed the iF series, we thought “what if we could combine the benefits of the latest small folders into a compact, full sized bike, with the design quality, innovation and
    value people expect in other personal tools, such as iPods and mobile phones?”

    The IF Mode is the first result of this thinking, combining large wheels with the benefits of near instant folding into a small, narrow, convenient package. Then, like modern luggage, it rolls everywhere on its main wheels. With monoblade wheel mountings, enclosed transmission and uncluttered design, it aims to attract new people towards using a bicycle as a useful form of transport. It adds all the benefits of cycling, and folding bicycles as an elegant product that even motorists will be proud to own and use.

    The iF Urban and iF Reach offer the same benefits as the iF mode, but based on the latest trends in conventional bicycles: using the lightest and most highly developed wheels, gears and suspension systems. These bikes appeal to existing cycling enthusiasts as well as new riders. They make high performance cycling portable.

    The original iF Mode prototype was a concept; it demonstrated the basic fold, structure and shape, but the engineering was not ready or optimised for production. It posed a difficult challenge, using engineering or automotive—rather than traditional bicycle making—techniques. Pacific put engineering and bicycle making skills to work, keeping in mind the vision to make something appealing to both enthusiasts and non-cycists.

    Michael Lin and Ryan Carroll used leadingedge Solidworks 3D modeling software to create the iF Mode from scratch, with more than 240,000 steps in six months. Every single part, including chain and drivetrain were fully functional in this huge project. As a result of this effort the radical iF Mode went into production months, not years, later."

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by puppypilgrim View Post
    You don't have a clear understanding of its target market.
    I don't think Pacific does either.

    Pray tell: what do *you* think is the target market of a $2500 bike which folds into a big package and has only two speeds?

    Your assumption not borne out by real world observation and testing. You probably know the same designer created the Strida and IF Mode right? Don't you think he would be aware of the issue?
    Appeal to authority doesn't work well with me. I am unimpressed by the Strida: I think it's a classic example of aesthetics over functionality.

    Why don't you fault the Strida for being only a 1-speed?
    I do.

    First you fault it for being 32 lbs. Then you fault it for lacking suspension?
    Quite a number of folding bikes are under 32 pounds with at least rear suspension, and they manage to do it under $1500. Some under $500.


    Again designed for a different type of user. Tikits and Bromptons are small-wheeled bikes with their inherent handling traits and ride quality. The IF Mode, is intended for a whole group of people who normally discounted folding bike products due to prejudice or preferences against small wheels. So when you say the Tikit or Brompton is better, you need to ask yourself, "Better for who?".
    Actually, I'd say "better for whom". But here's what I think: people who spend $2.5K on *any* kind of bike are the kind of people who are serious bike afficionados. These people are the least likely to not do research into whether small-wheeled bikes are acceptable. Your "whole group" is microscopic. Scratching my head a lot, the only group I can think of that would buy the IF Mode would be wealthy people who want to show it off as bling, but for some reason aren't wealthy enough to buy a Moulton. That's not a huge market.

    The Strida isn't cheap for what it does either. The price reflects the cost of early adoption and the quality inherent in a Pacific Cycle product.
    The Strida is one third the price. And I think the *Strida* is a low-value product. I can't figure out any significant market for IF Mode at all.

    I think IF Mode exists mostly as a flagship model for Pacific to use in advertisements or whatnot. That is, it's a loss leader.
    Last edited by feijai; 04-29-09 at 06:01 PM.

  11. #11
    hipster traffic dodger ChiapasFixed's Avatar
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    "...tradition, perception of ease of pedaling, and emulating bikes used in sports. But the most important is probably image."
    So they are openly admitting they designed a product to cater to peoples ignorance?
    Hmmm... on second thought, I guess that what most industries are thriving on these days, what with manufactured consent, created needs and all that.
    So, the IF mode is a fashion bike for fashion minded urbanites. Fine by me if it gets more people riding instead of driving, but I sure aint buying it.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by feijai View Post
    An axle with a single attachment point is known as a "lever". I think it's nearly guaranteed to wear out at a rate far exceeding normal axles. Like the Strida, this bike has *two* such axles. But unlike the Strida, this bike has 26" wheels, making a much more forceful lever.
    Actually these bikes have four, as opposed to normal bikes with just two (one for each pedal) and Mark Sanders has commented the the forces are similar, but I find it hard to imagine that pedals wouldn't be worse off because you don't purposely stomp on the wheels.

    Quote Originally Posted by ChiapasFixed View Post
    "...tradition, perception of ease of pedaling, and emulating bikes used in sports. But the most important is probably image."
    So they are openly admitting they designed a product to cater to peoples ignorance?
    Hmmm... on second thought, I guess that what most industries are thriving on these days, what with manufactured consent, created needs and all that.
    So, the IF mode is a fashion bike for fashion minded urbanites. Fine by me if it gets more people riding instead of driving, but I sure aint buying it.
    Mark Sanders has admitted it from back when it was still the Swivelhead. The entire starting premise of the design is that the mass market refuses to buy small wheeled bikes no matter how great they are, thus the need to design a large wheeler competitive with small wheelers in terms of fold. Then the world economy tanked as they were ramping up production and they said "holy crap! there goes our mass target market; better switch to plan B: sell a small production run to people with more money than sense"

    It's all a marketing game. Pacific makes a lot of bikes at a lot of different price points and it's hard to imagine there being much difference in effort/design between them. But apparently wheel size plays a big part in what they think people will pay because the Carryme is the cheapest and the IF Mode is the most expensive
    Last edited by itsajustme; 04-29-09 at 06:53 PM.

  13. #13
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    Actually these bikes have four, as opposed to normal bikes with just two (one for each pedal) and Mark Sanders has commented the the forces are similar, but I find it hard to imagine that pedals wouldn't be worse off because you don't purposely stomp on the wheels.
    True. But it seems to me that wheel axles must meet a significantly higher set of requirements than pedal axles. They must be completely true, they must spin much more rapidly and with less energy loss. Furthermore, the stress isn't just on the wheel axle in this new bike -- it's on the monofork and mono-"triangle". These now have to resist warping and bending even though each of them is between 1 and 2 feet long. They have to stay true as well. With two fork tines or four elements on the triangle it's far easier to do this.

    Now such beasts have long existed on certain motorcycles for example; but those are much heavier and allow much chunkier building material. I think there's a reason road bikes haven't been often designed like this, even for $2500.

  14. #14
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    Another useless 'designer' bike.
    32 lbs, 2-speed and $2500? I have spent much less to build a 18lbs montague folder with full gearing.

    However, I think pacific's 'Three-dimensional' folding system itself is very innovative and will result in a broad range of practical folders.
    Last edited by Raxel; 04-29-09 at 11:39 PM.

  15. #15
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    Guys - 1 more bike 1 less car !! Pacific know a bit about bikes and folding bikes

    and this bike may attract the sort of person who doesn't want a folded bike to look like a wheelchair accident

  16. #16
    Building a better Strida
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    well... i moved on to normal 700c wheel bikes.. my strida is solely used just to return and retrive beer

    i have a vintage bianchi
    fuji fixed
    and building up a vintage miele..


    if only IF cycles would catch on to the fact that in this economy, the ppl that are gonna be buying bikes are the ones that can't afford cars, and for $2500, to some ppl, thats a car.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by vmaniqui View Post
    why is this design limited to a full size bike? it would be nice if it comes in 20inch wheel. maybe we can petition mark to make one. that's what i will say a real commute folder...
    Having read through this thread and in spite of Mark's/Pacific's position on wheel size as it influences a purchase, I have to second this notion. Imho, the Mode is just too big and heavy for a folder, but the mechanism for the fold is elegant and efficient. I'm a big fan of Strida, though i think the IF Mode fold is even more effortless (as if that was possible), and the more traditional geometry is a plus. That said, I can put my Strida into a gym locker. I'd love to see a lean 16 inch wheel version that weighs less than 25 lbs for under $1000, but I'm not holding my breath .

  18. #18
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    I guess the popular use of 16" and 20" wheels for commutting folding bikes ,the main market?,use this compact wheel size for a reason.Try again IF MODE?

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    The more I look at Mark's design the more I realize there's nothing new there. It looks like there are two hinges but there aren't. It's just a single hinge in the top tube, plus we're spinning the front wheel 180. The only reason to rotate the front wheel at all is that Pacific decided that the monofork and the monochainstay had to be on different sides, for what reason I can't possibly fathom. To look cool maybe? Anyway, the bike is little more than a traditional horizontal splitter with the seatmast pushed down. The monofork and monochainstay enable the wheels to be right next to one another. It's just styled to look more like a puzzle bike.

  20. #20
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    feijai,

    "The more I look at Mark's design the more I realize there's nothing new there."

    It's hard to take you seriously when you write stuff like this. LOL.

  21. #21
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    It appears many here are quite fine with current bike models and are not offering much encouragement to those looking to advance the state of the art. I suppose products like the IF MODE might be targeted for other people because most here don't seem to like it for their own personal reasons. Given all the harsh criticism I've read it makes me wonder why anyone would go to the trouble of designing, engineering and manufacturing a new folding bike line.

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    If people cannot be civil (and factual), they need to butt out of here !

    An interesting presentation by Mark Sanders http://issuu.com/carltonreid/docs/notes he says:

    Making IF Mode is quite difficult, only Pacific could make it happen so easily.
    IF Mode has been very well received …. In both Red and Blue Ocean markets.
    Gold award’s are normally given to products like Apple’s iPhoneand Sony Cameras
    Our aim is …..
    IF Mode is acting as an ‘ambassador’ to get non-cyclist’s into folding bikes,
    and into cycling .. Pacific are working on lots of future developments.

    There is also some information about the Pacific reach, and other folding bikes.

  23. #23
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    The swivelhead or IF fold has been design for sometime. The elegance of its design can be summarized as follows:

    a. Rapidity of the fold - Dahons and Dahon Licensed Technology (DLT) bikes don't fold as quickly. The Brompton, Strida or Carryme doesn't fold as quickly. Then again the approach to folding design is highly dependent on the designer's objective. For example, the Brompton is designed to achieved the most compact square fold possible. The Carryme is designed to be an optimized stroller fold.

    b. Wheelability of the fold - The main folding bikes that can be wheeled when folded are Tikit (not completely folded but it works), Carryme, Strida and iF bikes. Pacific Cycles makes the Carryme and iF bikes. The wheelability of the Carryme was undoubtedly influenced by the addition of Mark Sanders while he was on the Pacific Cycles payroll.

    Now I don't know Mark personally neither am I the president of the Mark Sanders Legal Defence team. I just think the criticisms of the iF Mode's design and pricing are unwarranted particularly when the criticisms demonstrate ignorance in understanding blue ocean vs. red ocean diversities in the marketplace.

  24. #24
    Non-Spandex Commuter jdmitch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by puppypilgrim View Post
    Now I don't know Mark personally neither am I the president of the Mark Sanders Legal Defence team. I just think the criticisms of the iF Mode's design and pricing are unwarranted particularly when the criticisms demonstrate ignorance in understanding blue ocean vs. red ocean diversities in the marketplace.
    Yup, I don't think MS was targeting folder aficionados with the iF Mode..

  25. #25
    Senior Member Chop!'s Avatar
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    The idea with the original Swivelhead was to create a fast folding mechanism that, once unfolded, pulled the whole hinge area into tension, the way a Pedersen pulls it's skinny tubes into tension when you sit on the hammock-style saddle.
    I first saw this years ago when I went to an engineering presentation given by Mark, I was really impressed and would still like to get my hands on one.
    So, it's got 2 speeds? (it's the only IF model that has!) my Strida copes very well around the Cities of Europe, in London these days it's all single speed fixies!
    The IF Reach has normal gearing options, as does the IF Cross (based on the old Swivelhead by the looks of it)
    It just gives a few more options to the 1000s of commuters who are turning away from traffic-jammed cars & taking to bikes, more bikes, means more resources for cyclists, means more bikes, means more resources for cyclists, means more bikes, means more resources for cyclists, means more bikes, means more resources for cyclists, means more bikes, means more resources for cyclists!
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