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  1. #51
    Senior Member boston blackie's Avatar
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    Finally - I just completed the project! I removed that noisy Nexus 4 IGH, and replaced it with an Alfine 8 speed IGH. It didn't compromise the fold a bit. It runs silent. I think I'm gonna like it!
    Last edited by boston blackie; 01-30-10 at 07:08 PM.
    2008 Dahon MuP24 - thudbuster LT, SKS fenders, Marathon winters
    2009 Mezzo I-4, converted to Shimano Alfine 8
    BD Motobecane Le Champion SL Campy Record groupo

  2. #52
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Review, photos please?
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  3. #53
    Senior Member boston blackie's Avatar
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    I took a couple of snap shots today on my Iphone, doesn't look like much, but it is a good conversion for the bike. Mezzo should offer the the 8 speed - it is so much better than the 4 speed IGH.
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    2008 Dahon MuP24 - thudbuster LT, SKS fenders, Marathon winters
    2009 Mezzo I-4, converted to Shimano Alfine 8
    BD Motobecane Le Champion SL Campy Record groupo

  4. #54
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    See you are running your 56tooth with out a chain guard,Birdie version should fit if you need one. Has the gearing range with this set up?
    Last edited by bhkyte; 05-21-10 at 02:46 AM.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  5. #55
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    Hi Boston Blackie, I am very interested in your skate wheel mod from earlier in the thread; I know you said you used 1/4" x 2 1/2" bolts, (with nylock nuts), but what kind of skate wheels did you use? I can't get my head around the differences between Micro Scooter wheels or Inline Skate/Rollerblade wheels! Add to that they come in so many different sizes!!! Any advice would be welcome!
    Last edited by Wheelrider; 08-17-11 at 06:07 AM.
    Giant TCX (Campag Veloce), Bianchi Infinito Athena, Trek Fuel EX8 & Mezzo D10. All modified in some way or another!

  6. #56
    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    Bike Friday buys 24 hole rims, for their Tikit.
    you can lace a 36 hole hub up, just leave out 1/3 of the spokes.

    want a wider ratio range? , Use same hub, + Schlumpf 2 speed planetary cranksets.
    2 overdrive and 1 reduction gear type.

    I dont care for the -drag the chain down to almost in the dirt-
    way derailleurs work on wee wheels. but thats just me..

  7. #57
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Rollerbalde wheels around 76mm are fine. Preferably get clear ones with red cores as a rear LED light works really well .ie The rollerblade wheels glow!
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  8. #58
    Junior Member
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    Thanks bhkyte, I'll be giving it a try over the weekend then!

    Just fitted my MKS EZY-Cube pedals, nice to be "clipped in" again!
    Giant TCX (Campag Veloce), Bianchi Infinito Athena, Trek Fuel EX8 & Mezzo D10. All modified in some way or another!

  9. #59
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wheelrider View Post
    Thanks bhkyte, I'll be giving it a try over the weekend then!

    Just fitted my MKS EZY-Cube pedals, nice to be "clipped in" again!
    I have discovered that MKS cleat are compactable with shimano. But not the other way around so its worth fitting MSK cleat rather than Shimano ones if you run two peddle systems, as I do.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  10. #60
    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    What gear inch span will I get (low gear, high gear)
    depends.. chainring size and cassette selection choice determines that.
    little wheel big chainring.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhkyte View Post
    I have discovered that MKS cleat are compactable with shimano. But not the other way around so its worth fitting MSK cleat rather than Shimano ones if you run two peddle systems, as I do.
    Thats worth knowing! I'm not as happy with the "clipping out" on the MKS pedals as my SPD's, but I was chatting to a retired engineer who thinks it may be feasible to fit Shimano pedals to the MKS axle. Personally I doubt it, but I'm happy for him to have a look! If it comes off, I'll let you know!
    Last edited by Wheelrider; 09-01-11 at 04:43 AM.
    Giant TCX (Campag Veloce), Bianchi Infinito Athena, Trek Fuel EX8 & Mezzo D10. All modified in some way or another!

  12. #62
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Just seen a I4 Mezzo in good condition go for 225 on ebay, wish I had some money at moment. What would I do with it.....
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  13. #63
    Junior Member
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    Not a happy bunny today! I noticed "play" in the stem hinge last week, and it has been getting progressively worse, so on my way home from work I thought I'd ride round by the LBS that I bought it from and let them have a look.

    Half an hour of fiddling and they were not able to make any improvement, so they are sending it back to Mezzo! I've read on various forums that that other owners have had similar problems, so guess i'm not alone! However it means i've now got to use my winter bike as my commuter until I get it back and that adds a whole load of complication to the commute to work!
    Giant TCX (Campag Veloce), Bianchi Infinito Athena, Trek Fuel EX8 & Mezzo D10. All modified in some way or another!

  14. #64
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wheelrider View Post
    Not a happy bunny today! I noticed "play" in the stem hinge last week, and it has been getting progressively worse, so on my way home from work I thought I'd ride round by the LBS that I bought it from and let them have a look.

    Half an hour of fiddling and they were not able to make any improvement, so they are sending it back to Mezzo! I've read on various forums that that other owners have had similar problems, so guess i'm not alone! However it means i've now got to use my winter bike as my commuter until I get it back and that adds a whole load of complication to the commute to work!
    This problem has always gone with a little adjustment on my bike. ie tightening the pivot, or adding a washer. If the stem folds too easily its too loose at the hinge and needs tightening.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  15. #65
    Senior Member
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    Wheelrider, I had that problem. Is your bike old or new? My bike is older and the stem was in the same colour as the bike. Newer bikes the stem is black. I now realise that my stem was always not quite right, even when it was new, the stem had to be tightened until the hinge was stiff.

    Now I have a black stem. It seems much better, it folds freely and doesn't wobble at all. I think the old stems were made from a different alloy.

    "Once you try black, you'll never go back"

    :-)


    Part was 45ish. Bike was only out of my hands for about an hour. Too many miles for a warranty repair, even though I think the looseness of the joint caused the wear that made it worse and worse.

    http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...9-Wobbly-mezzo
    2008 Mezzo D9
    2012 Giant Avail 2

  16. #66
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    Mine's only about 3 months old, and is black anyway.

    Anyhow, got it back today, the LBS told me ATB (the distributers) had replaced the stem, however I knew there was a little "scratch" on it from loading on the train a few weeks back, and guess what? It was still there!!! So no they didn't replace the stem etc, but they seem to have adjusted the wobble out.

    I'm not about to dismantle it to find out just how it works, but it looks like they have slightly tightened up the little grub screws that hold one of the rollers in place (sorry if i'm not using the correct terminology!), as one used to be about 1mm proud and isn't anymore. In fact i'm going to stick my neck out here and say i doubt it ever went back, rather they used the time they had to fiddle about until they got it right!

    Still i'm not going to complain, back and working is good! Loved riding the TCX, but getting it on & off the train wasn't much fun! So come monday the Mezzo will be getting hammered again, fingers crossed it last this time! If it doesn't, I'll be forced to mention the "B" word LOL!

    Bhkyte, I'll take your point and keep an eye on how easy it become to fold as that may have been the issue.

    On another issue, is it me or could the front brake be a little better? I've a spare 105 off SWMBO's bike so might swap it over and see if that helps.
    Giant TCX (Campag Veloce), Bianchi Infinito Athena, Trek Fuel EX8 & Mezzo D10. All modified in some way or another!

  17. #67
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wheelrider View Post
    M
    On another issue, is it me or could the front brake be a little better? I've a spare 105 off SWMBO's bike so might swap it over and see if that helps.
    "Koolstop" sammon brake blocks will sort that out. Possibly add a teflon linned brake cable, but this makes more difference on the back.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  18. #68
    Junior Member
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    Ahh... that makes sense! I'd noticed that sometimes when I unfold it the brakes are "stuck on". So i've got into the habit of squeezing the levers a couple of times before I set off and that seems to release it. Sounds like a good proactive modification!
    Giant TCX (Campag Veloce), Bianchi Infinito Athena, Trek Fuel EX8 & Mezzo D10. All modified in some way or another!

  19. #69
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wheelrider View Post
    Ahh... that makes sense! I'd noticed that sometimes when I unfold it the brakes are "stuck on". So i've got into the habit of squeezing the levers a couple of times before I set off and that seems to release it. Sounds like a good proactive modification!
    You will still need to do this due to the fold strechers on the cable ,but the brakes will function betterdue to a reduced in friction.Back more than front due to longer run.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  20. #70
    cpg
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    Senior Member cpg's Avatar
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    On boxing day I was visiting family in the Malverns and took the Mezzo out for ride. Big mistake, the I4 is not the correct tool for the job, ran out of gears up hill and ran out of gears down hill. The experience convinced me that while the 4 speed hub is fine around town I need something more versatile.
    I have just bought a mildly used 24 speed Sram dual drive hub. I am new to these hubs and have few questions for you Bhkyte.
    1. Did you consider lasing the 36 hole hub to the existing 28 hole rim? Was it just easier to build onto a new 36 hole rim?
    2. You talked in an earlier thread about using either the click box or a toggle changer. What's the advantage/disadvantage of the two? Is the toggle changer something you adapted from Sturm Archer or is it a proper Sram part?
    3.My 4 speed hub is a grip shifter but I want to replace this with trigger shifters for both the new derailier and the hub. Do Shimano shifters work with the Sram hub? I had assumed that STI levers pull the same amount of cable as trigger shifters.
    Thanks in advance.

  21. #71
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpg View Post
    On boxing day I was visiting family in the Malverns and took the Mezzo out for ride. Big mistake, the I4 is not the correct tool for the job, ran out of gears up hill and ran out of gears down hill. The experience convinced me that while the 4 speed hub is fine around town I need something more versatile.
    I have just bought a mildly used 24 speed Sram dual drive hub. I am new to these hubs and have few questions for you Bhkyte.
    1. Did you consider lasing the 36 hole hub to the existing 28 hole rim? Was it just easier to build onto a new 36 hole rim?
    2. You talked in an earlier thread about using either the click box or a toggle changer. What's the advantage/disadvantage of the two? Is the toggle changer something you adapted from Sturm Archer or is it a proper Sram part?
    3.My 4 speed hub is a grip shifter but I want to replace this with trigger shifters for both the new derailier and the hub. Do Shimano shifters work with the Sram hub? I had assumed that STI levers pull the same amount of cable as trigger shifters.
    Thanks in advance.
    Hello,
    I have two dual set ups.

    black bike is sram 3 X 9 with brifters and a sram click box (standard),
    The gold bike 3X7 sachs with toggle chain (standard) and twist grip/quickfire chargers.

    Its about 4 years now since sram conversion and 3 for sachs so from best of my memory!!!

    1) My sram 36 spoke wheel is laced to 36 spokes, ! considered other options like 24 and 18,but wheel builder happist to go for 36. Built up by freewheel nottingham, no complaints. I bought a Sun rim, better if you can find a doulde wall rim instead. but this did mean i could sell old rear wheel.

    2) As far as I remember simular shimano indexes with sram in all ways. ie a tripple 8 speed wll index with dual drive 8 speed. So you can match it up to shimano or sram shifters, or alternatively google the dedicated single sram dualdrive shifter3 X8.
    I have trigger shifters on my sash bike. Sti compactable yes just keep to the same number of gears.

    3) You do need to remove a small cover on the click box on the sram, ( just undo a screw), and rely on a different way of securing the rear wheel in the folded package. If you read the thread I have a cheap solution that works fine. ( I rest the rear wheel nut on the rear chain stays and secure the bars to the seatpost using a hair bobble. Its as quick to fold, as easy and as secure!!)

    4) you need to get a cable stopper clip to attach to the rear stay of the bike to get the internal to work. A few pence of ebay. agian in the thread.

    5) The main problem is getting the cable routing correct for the extra cable, espically when you fold and unfold the bike. reread the thread for more information. Problem is if the cable is in the wrong place or too tight it fouls on the seatpost insertion when its folded or forces the chain to com fo and wedge between the chain guilder and the chain ring when unfolding. Pm me if you have a problem, and I will send you some pics of my cable routing when you are at that stage.

    4)Difference between sash and sram is that the sram changers better on the internal in my set up.
    It changers slicker than grease on the sram, even under load, its wounderfull. I love it with the brifters.

    Easier to go for a good IGH like a alfine like boston blakie, but if you got the dual drive already go for it I say. Bit of hassle but it will be great when completed. Plus I can warn you of the pitfalls!!!
    go for teflon lined cables and inners for smother down changers als while at it.

    approximately new click box 18 + wheel build 50 rim + used 8 speed cassete and sti used 20, used rear drailer 20+ new chain 5 + new cables 10

    128 approximately - sell old wheel = less than 100
    - sell me your nexus 4i wheel set? as i want one!!
    Last edited by bhkyte; 01-05-13 at 06:06 AM.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  22. #72
    cpg
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    Hi Bhkyte. Thank you for your comments and the offer of further advice, it has cleared up one or two things. I had considered an Alfine or Nexus 8 hub but the dual drive came up at the right price. I have read the thread a couple of times now and will read through it a few more times yet as each time my understanding improves.
    Freewheel are good bike shop and its reassuring to know that a local bike shop to me can to the wheel build, although I hope to do it myself. I have a couple of packs of new stainless spokes that I got for a project that I will not be doing now so I just need to get a spoke thread rolling tool.
    I will let you know what I decide to do with the 4 speed hub, I might dismantle it and use the rim but it might be some time before I get the project fully under way so if you are in a hurry for the hub it might be better to look elsewhere.
    A friend recently bought a D9 and we went out for ride to today. I hadn’t realised the front chain ring on an I4 is different to a D9, the I4 being 42 teeth and the D9 being 54 teeth so there is good chance I may have to change the chain ring. I feel a gear ration spread sheet coming on.
    My dual drive hub is disc compatible so it got me thinking. I tried a 160 diameter disc that I had spare, unfortunately it was just a bit too big to fit the frame. I tried a 140 disc, for now its a piece of 140 diameter cardboard as I don’t yet have a 140 disc but it proved the point. Now I just need to fire up the milling machine and make a suitable calliper bracket. Its all good fun.

    IMG00460-20130105-1146.jpgIMG00463-20130105-1147.jpgIMG00464-20130105-1147.jpg

  23. #73
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Dualdrive with reari disks, nice!!
    Othermods planned?
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  24. #74
    cpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhkyte View Post
    Dualdrive with reari disks, nice!!
    Othermods planned?
    Not yet, one thing at a time. I think dual drive with disks is enough for now.

  25. #75
    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    Because the 3x7 Sachs DD uses a pull chain it takes up less space than the Click box. of the current hubs.

    though the hub may be made with 36 holes you can skip a few,
    to work with a lesser multiple , say a 24 spoke rim.

    I got a big range out of My AW3 hub with A Schlumpf Mountain drive.
    2 speed planetary crankset so [even numbers] 50t reduces to a 20t, in low range..
    no overlap, range is 18" to 80" in 6 gears.. 15:54 (21.6)
    (a Brompton specific torque arm ) with a knob rather than the strap on all the others.

    their Speed drive is an overdrive 1.6x, so 34t acts like a 54t , when engaged
    overdrive torques less so a chamfer machined in the BB shell
    offers enough grip for the torque transfer..
    When engaged, the Crank arms turn at a different speed than the chainring.

    Swiss Manufactured so wont be cheap .. I paid over the stated $500 budget to get mine.

    Benefit of double planetary gears is they can shift at slow speeds and stopped.
    a benefit for the double shift when I Bog down in Low/1st in the high range on a hill,
    because next lower gear is 3rd/high in the Low range.
    Last edited by fietsbob; 01-09-13 at 01:53 PM.

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