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  1. #1
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    xootr swift vs dahon speed pro tt- any thoughts for a noob?

    Howdy. Long time listner, first time caller.

    Kinda thinking about building/buying a folding bike, mainly out of curiosity. Plus, I hate trying to take a full sized bike with me when I travel.

    Thinking pretty hard about a xootr swift- I like that it uses pretty standard components (standard hubs, etc). I'd probably be buying a frame and building this up from leftover parts.

    Also looking at the Dahon Speed Pro TT- similar price, slightly less standard parts, but possibly lighter and definitely yellower...

    Looking at the above due to price- both can be had for under a grand. As nice as the bike friday looks, I can't justify that kind of expense.

    So, tell me your thoughts, good and bad. I'm looking for something that will be most similar to a road bike- I won't bother with fenders or racks. Just something for getting out some nice quick miles. Needs to be reasonably easy to put in a suitcase without costing extra. And, of course, it has to work for a 6' 2", 200+ pound guy.

    If y'all have any ideas, lemme know.

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    Quote Originally Posted by buck-50 View Post
    And, of course, it has to work for a 6' 2", 200+ pound guy.

    If y'all have any ideas, lemme know.
    I'd go with the Xootr .. the Xootr will build up lighter .. sounds like you don't need the TT's dual drive.. at your height, you probably don't want the TT's seatpost extended as high as it will need to be to accommodate you .. that will be a lot of leverage at the seat clamp area. You can build a bullet Xootr at right around 20lbs.. these bikes have a strong following with the modders amongst us.

  3. #3
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    I appreciate the feedback- thanks!

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    Part-time epistemologist invisiblehand's Avatar
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    There may not be much to debate here since it isn't clear to me that the Speed Pro TT is ergonomically good for you. Although I would test ride it, nonetheless.

    You might want to look at a used Bike Friday. They are around and since they are typically second bikes for travel, their used prices have been quite good lately. The frame warranty follows the bike. And Bike Friday replacement stem posts are quite reasonably priced.

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    Could you elaborate about the fit on the TT? Just curious. And thanks for the tip on used Bike Fridays.

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    Professional Fuss-Budget Bacciagalupe's Avatar
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    A few thoughts....

    • Transporting a folding bike won't offer quite as big an advantage over full-sized as you might expect; I always found packing a folding bike to be a PITA. You will likely avoid fees though as long as the bike is under the weight limits.
    • The Xootr has a very solid feel and design, and you have a bit more adjustment options.
    • The Dahon has a much better fold and (afaik) a wider gearing range.
    • Performance will probably be about the same.

    Not sure how big a deal the proprietary parts thing is, since the higher-end Dahons tend to use more standard parts than the cheaper models.

    I think you'll be fine with either one, as long as you don't expect miracles when flying with the folder.

  7. #7
    Senior Member kamtsa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buck-50 View Post
    ... I'd probably be buying a frame and building this up from leftover parts...... both can be had for under a grand. As nice as the bike friday looks, I can't justify that kind of expense.
    Can you get Speed Pro TT for less than 1K? All the prices I have seen locally and online were north of 1K http://www.thorusa.com/dahon/current/speedprott.htm

    Also, since you plan to buy only a frame, have you tried to ask BF to sell you a bare frame?


    Kam

  8. #8
    Part-time epistemologist invisiblehand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buck-50 View Post
    Could you elaborate about the fit on the TT? Just curious. And thanks for the tip on used Bike Fridays.
    It has been a few years since a test ride, but the handlebar is not very adjustable -- either fore/aft or height -- relative to the saddle. Fit for me -- ~6' -- was OK. But I decided that it was worth getting a better fitting bike.

    But your fit might be very different. IMO, it would be worth it to sit on the bike to verify one way or the other.

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    Good to know. There's a dahon dealer in town- I should definitely check it out before I get my heart too set... The xootr, well, that'll probably be a leap of faith.

    As for prices, I'm seeing the Speed Pro TT selling on Ebay for between 850-950- older model perhaps?

  10. #10
    jur
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    I haven't ridden a Dahon Speed TT so have no experience there... however, my Swift has the stiffest frame of just about any folding bike, so if you have doubts about a bit of flex, try the Dahon before you buy. The Swift is almost a guaranteed satisfactory buy.

    As for traveling with a bike - you didn't mention what sort of travel. Assuming air travel: Folding bikes still take a fair amount of labout to get into a suitcase. By Birdy is the easiest, and a brompton would be easier still. Haven't tried the Swift but I know it involves separating the frame - PITA. My guess is the Dahon would be easier than the Swift. If you mean road travel, well the Swift is no problem there.

    For packing into a suitcase, buy the largest one you can find (Samsonite Flite), this way you will save time. The Flite is unlikely to attract over-size attention. But plan not to have anything in the suitcase along with the bike - try to have only the bike, that is simplest.

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    Senior Member kamtsa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by invisiblehand View Post
    It has been a few years since a test ride, but the handlebar is not very adjustable -- either fore/aft or height -- relative to the saddle. Fit for me -- ~6' -- was OK. But I decided that it was worth getting a better fitting bike.

    But your fit might be very different. IMO, it would be worth it to sit on the bike to verify one way or the other.
    +1

    About 18 months ago I tested the TT Pro in a local store and eventually got a BF NWT because I did not like the fit.

    The TT Pro is very cool bike. Good fold (compared to the NWT), light, simple design, wide gear range (DD), interesting stock handle bar, and brifters (the only DD bike I know that comes stock with brifters), not to mention its look and color (including the tires). If I recall correctly it had some adjustably in the handlebar stem but I am not 100% sure.

    If you are interested in the TT Pro, take a test ride and see how it fits you. Maybe you have the perfect body geometry for which the Pro TT was designed.

    BTW, have you considered the Pacific Reach? http://www.pacific-cycles.com/produc...?cat1=1&cat2=6 It is a full suspension folder and I think it is in the same price range as the Pro TT.

    Kam

  12. #12
    Eschew Obfuscation SesameCrunch's Avatar
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    Good suggestion about the Reach. Its ride is very close to a roadie bike. Larger wheels, larger fold, though.

    I'd like to reiterate the weight difference between the Swift and SpeedPro. I had a 2004 era SpeedPro. It was on the heavy side (prob 27, 28 lbs), especially with Dual Drive. I think the lighter Swift will come closer to the full size road bike feel.

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    Wow- that pacific reach is pretty cool. Pacific bikes U.S. Headquarters are here in town but I've never seen one of their folding bikes. 'course I'm assuming they're the same pacific as the one that owns schwinn. Where does one find pacific folders in the US?

    I really appreciate everyone's advice so far.

  14. #14
    Eschew Obfuscation SesameCrunch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buck-50 View Post
    Wow- that pacific reach is pretty cool. Pacific bikes U.S. Headquarters are here in town but I've never seen one of their folding bikes. 'course I'm assuming they're the same pacific as the one that owns schwinn. Where does one find pacific folders in the US?

    I really appreciate everyone's advice so far.
    BruceMetras on this Forum has them... He's in the SF Bay Area.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by buck-50 View Post
    Wow- that pacific reach is pretty cool. Pacific bikes U.S. Headquarters are here in town but I've never seen one of their folding bikes. 'course I'm assuming they're the same pacific as the one that owns schwinn. Where does one find pacific folders in the US?

    I really appreciate everyone's advice so far.
    The Pacific Reach is indeed a cool bike... Pacific Bikes and Pacific Cycles are two different companies.. Pacific Cycles manufactures the Pacific Reach/Birdy/Airnimal/ to name a few.

    http://www.pacific-cycles.com/produc...&cat2=6&pid=33

    The drop bar Reach Racer series is not $1k.. they are roughly $1800 to $2000 depending on the dealer.. they were $1600 back in 2006 .. PM me if you'd like more info on them ..

  16. #16
    Eschew Obfuscation SesameCrunch's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buck-50 View Post
    Wow- that pacific reach is pretty cool. Pacific bikes U.S. Headquarters are here in town but I've never seen one of their folding bikes. 'course I'm assuming they're the same pacific as the one that owns schwinn. Where does one find pacific folders in the US?

    I really appreciate everyone's advice so far.
    One other thing - Another Forum-ite who calls himself Triathlete, just recently went through the same decision making process you're going through. He's a (guess what?) triathlete and looking for a sporty, race-worthy bike. He ended up with a Reach.

    You might pm him and get his thoughts on the Reach, as well as his decision process.

  17. #17
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    So far, some great advice and suggestions.

    As much as I like the looks of the reach that price tag may put it out of my reach for a while. One question for the fans of the Pacific Reach- will it fold into a standard suitcase?

    So far, what I'm hearing about my two original choices is:
    the swift can be built up pretty light, it's stiff and feels a lot like a full size road bike, but may be a PITA to fold into a suitcase. Would most likely be buying without ever riding. It's not been a problem for me with traditional bikes, but this is not a traditional bike.
    the Speed pro TT could be slightly heavier, possibly harder to fit to a big guy, less stiff but easier to fold and considerably yellower. Additional plus for the Dahon is that there is a dealer in town and I could try one out.

    And of the new suggestions what I'm hearing is:
    The Pacific Reach racing is awesome but probably out of my price range for now, also AFAIK, nowhere to test ride.
    Bike Friday are well built and quite nice but also out of my price range, though might be cheaper used.

  18. #18
    Eschew Obfuscation SesameCrunch's Avatar
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    Nothing you're considering will fit into a standard suitcase without some work. You'll probably have to remove wheels, handlebars, maybe the fork, and prudently, the rear derailleur. 20-30 minutes.

    The only bike that's fold and go is the Brompton, but, even then, it takes a slightly larger than airline standard case.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by SesameCrunch View Post
    Nothing you're considering will fit into a standard suitcase without some work. You'll probably have to remove wheels, handlebars, maybe the fork, and prudently, the rear derailleur. 20-30 minutes.
    I'm OK with fairly major disassembly/reassembly. The big thing for me is being able to take a bike with me without incurring major charges, but still being fun to ride once I get there.

    I'll check out the bromptons!

  20. #20
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buck-50 View Post
    So far, some great advice and suggestions.

    As much as I like the looks of the reach that price tag may put it out of my reach for a while. One question for the fans of the Pacific Reach- will it fold into a standard suitcase?

    So far, what I'm hearing about my two original choices is:
    the swift can be built up pretty light, it's stiff and feels a lot like a full size road bike, but may be a PITA to fold into a suitcase. Would most likely be buying without ever riding. It's not been a problem for me with traditional bikes, but this is not a traditional bike.
    the Speed pro TT could be slightly heavier, possibly harder to fit to a big guy, less stiff but easier to fold and considerably yellower. Additional plus for the Dahon is that there is a dealer in town and I could try one out.

    And of the new suggestions what I'm hearing is:
    The Pacific Reach racing is awesome but probably out of my price range for now, also AFAIK, nowhere to test ride.
    Bike Friday are well built and quite nice but also out of my price range, though might be cheaper used.
    This summary seems about right. However I have seen Pacific Reachs on sale in shops and on ebay in the UK for between 380-450.

    Personally I prefer to have the TT Dual drive ,much is expensive to buy separately and represents a better value for money IMO as a bulit up bike. Otherwise a good dual drive wheel build can cost 300-400. I think the dahon will go in the suitcase easier. However the swift will be cheaper if you have components lying around. However, the Swift gearing will be limited for fast riding unless you get a big chain ring (58 approx),or cespro hub,both of which could add al ot of cost to get your build satisfactory. So I vote TT.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
    The Dahon has a much better fold and (afaik) a wider gearing range.
    Xootr now sell an adapter to mount a front derailleur. So if the stock gearing isn't wide enough, it can easily be changed.
    ICE B1, Brompton H6, Schwinn Mirada drop-bar vintage mtb

  22. #22
    Senior Member kamtsa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by yangmusa View Post
    Xootr now sell an adapter to mount a front derailleur. So if the stock gearing isn't wide enough, it can easily be changed.
    Will it get to the DD 550% range?

  23. #23
    Part-time epistemologist invisiblehand's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamtsa View Post
    Will it get to the DD 550% range?
    I recall that it can support a triple. So roughly speaking, yes.

  24. #24
    jur
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    The Pacific Reach will not fit into a Samsonite Flite. I have a suitcase into which it fits which has slightly different aspect ratio to the Flite, about same overall size. So if you did get a Reach, you would quite a search on your hands to find a suitcase.


  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by kamtsa View Post
    Can you get Speed Pro TT for less than 1K? All the prices I have seen locally and online were north of 1K http://www.thorusa.com/dahon/current/speedprott.htm

    Also, since you plan to buy only a frame, have you tried to ask BF to sell you a bare frame?

    Kam
    Bike Friday says they won't sell a bare frame- fair enough, and the used prices are pretty good right now. May just see if I can find a used pocket rocket.

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