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Old 02-06-12, 09:22 PM   #1
BeerNuts
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Tern Pricing Structure Help!

Hey guys,

I am looking at my first folder and I am just over thinking stuff way to much and figured you guys could help. I have decided on a Tern bike because of price, new features, stiffer ride. Now the problem comes down to picking one and the pricing is making me second guess my choices. My budget is 1k give or take. I need multiple speeds, rack, fenders, and low maintenance and insane durability for riding in foreign countries.

At first I thought a D7i would be a great bike, its got everything that I want but its $800. But the only part that isn't on the D8 is the IGH. The D8 is $650 the D7i is $800, that means the IGH alone is costing me $150 extra. So for $150 all I gain is the internal hub, nada else.

But if I go to the P9 over the D7i everything changes. You gain higher end everything over the D7i. The P9 is $100 more than the D7i and the only thing they have in common is the frame. Your getting a whole new high end bike. But you lose the IGH, fenders, and rack. This makes you add another $100 to replace them. On budget, great bike.

The P24H for only $50 more than the P9 adds lots more value and features. The fenders alone are like $50 so the handle bar and 24 gears are a free bonus. This seems like a amazing deal but I don't really need the 24 gears so I hesitate. Add $50 for the rack and its 1k just like I wanted. Amazing fully loaded bike.

D8 is the easy choice, fits all the needs and costs the least. But I have always had higher end bikes and parts. The 'base' model kinda scares me since I do not know how well it will hold up in time. I don't want to feel like I should have just spent the money later and got the 'power windows' if you know what I mean. Cheap now possibly pay for it later.

P24H over P9 = Awesome Deal, Every high end feature you can get for $1k. Only $50 more!
P9 over D7i = Awesome Deal, Lost IGH gained way more high end parts almost a new bike. Lost gears and handle bar over the P24H, but at budget.
D8 over D7i = ??? Deal, Gained IGH kept all the low end features... Lost tons of upgrades vs P9.
D8 = Cheap, Standard.

Ive spent the last 3 days just looking at these four bikes trying to figure out the best fit and value for the 1k budget. Ive read everything I could find, looked at every photo, watched every video. It's starting to not make sense anymore, and I am out of new information.

Can you guys please help by giving pros and cons and what you would do given the brand and budget. I live in Central Florida there are no used Bromptons, there are no dealers, and there is no used market on craigslist.
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Old 02-06-12, 10:39 PM   #2
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D8 add aone fenders and a carrier and you have a real solid bike with nothing fancy on it which can give you trouble in any foreign country
thor
p.s I have all of them in stock .... just if somebody thinks I am steering you cause of my inventory
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Old 02-06-12, 11:43 PM   #3
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What are you using the bike for?
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Old 02-07-12, 06:36 AM   #4
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There is no law (natural nor juridical) that forces you to use all the gears you have on a bike. If you decide on the P24 you have a wider range to choose from. Even if you end up using only 5, they will suit you better than if you instead had a 5 gear IGH.
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Old 02-07-12, 08:54 AM   #5
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D8 add aone fenders and a carrier and you have a real solid bike with nothing fancy on it which can give you trouble in any foreign country
thor
p.s I have all of them in stock .... just if somebody thinks I am steering you cause of my inventory
Yup, you have the best deal on them anyway. I respect that even though I said my budget was 1k you recommend the $650 model. If only you had that white/orage one

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What are you using the bike for?
No lie 99% of its life will be in town rides for getting around and workouts so 20-30 miles a day, few weekend trips, some trails. The main reason I am going folder this time though is travel. I take 3-4 trips a year to somewhere and I would like the bike to come with me. Once again around town mostly but maybe a day or two into the hills/villages.

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There is no law (natural nor juridical) that forces you to use all the gears you have on a bike. If you decide on the P24 you have a wider range to choose from. Even if you end up using only 5, they will suit you better than if you instead had a 5 gear IGH.
True I had thought of this. My current bike is a 24 speed and I would say I only ever used 5 of them. I never could figured out the crosschaining problem so half of them were un-useable anyway. I don't think the folders have the cross chain problem but with the P24H I would still have a IGH. Unless IGH's are built like tanks and last 5-10 years no problem I am worried about that small chance of breaking down in Thailand and no one knowing how to fix it.

I do love the idea of IGH but I have never seen nor met anyone with one. I would be more fine with it if people just said they last forever with no extra work. But just looking around this isn't what ive seen, almost no one is advocating them on bikeforums.
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Old 02-07-12, 09:00 AM   #6
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I would get the 24 speed then especially if you are touring and in a hilly area. Also you get all of the upgrades.
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Old 02-07-12, 09:32 AM   #7
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I do love the idea of IGH but I have never seen nor met anyone with one. I would be more fine with it if people just said they last forever with no extra work. But just looking around this isn't what ive seen, almost no one is advocating them on bikeforums.
I'm sorry if I'm misunderstanding you but on the first post it sounded as if you preferred IGH but now it sounds as if you would prefer deraillieur? The problem with IGH on tour (mainly) is that if they break then they are hard to fix. But depending on where you are planning to go that might not be a big deal (if there is a city quite close I guess you can get it fixed there). The problem with IGH + derailleur is the fact that you will get the worst of two worlds (I still bought a Brompton 6 speed though).

My best tip is not the P24H or any other bike but rather one on how to choose. Never mind trying to get the most bang for the buck. Choose the one that suits your needs. What you don't have, you won't miss. My guess is that all of the bikes above have good enough components not to worry about that.
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Old 02-07-12, 09:45 AM   #8
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Yup, you have the best deal on them anyway. I respect that even though I said my budget was 1k you recommend the $650 model. If only you had that white/orage one


ikeforums.
White/Pink, Gray/Orange, Black/Blue in D 8 ....
I do have White orange in the VergeX10 :-)

thor

Cans ... I like cans .... have more bikes with cans than with derrailleur ... Depending where the travel goes you will be stranded with an IGH .... if its northern Europe ...No problem .... In America ( north) no problem, as you can get whole wheels and emergency stuff send , not so much repair, but replacement .... rest of the world its 50 50 ....
Thats why I suggest the simplest bike, with the least bells and whistles ....
( put a smaller front chainwheel on, where you can shift by hand to the mountain gears and you will be fine ...)
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Old 02-07-12, 10:02 AM   #9
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I'm sorry if I'm misunderstanding you but on the first post it sounded as if you preferred IGH but now it sounds as if you would prefer deraillieur? The problem with IGH on tour (mainly) is that if they break then they are hard to fix. But depending on where you are planning to go that might not be a big deal (if there is a city quite close I guess you can get it fixed there). The problem with IGH + derailleur is the fact that you will get the worst of two worlds (I still bought a Brompton 6 speed though).

My best tip is not the P24H or any other bike but rather one on how to choose. Never mind trying to get the most bang for the buck. Choose the one that suits your needs. What you don't have, you won't miss. My guess is that all of the bikes above have good enough components not to worry about that.
I really do love the the idea behind them. Silent shifting, instant shifting, travels better, it all sounds great. But i know very little about them and their longevity. The forums have mostly been "costly to repair" "needs a trained shop" "10% loss in power" "dont travel with it" "often dose not have enough lube". I would perfer a IGH but i want to see some posts of "10,000 miles still like new" "5 yrs later time for a tune up" "way better than my derailer". I am just amazed how the bike shops and the manufactures are doing zero work to sell or explain why its better other than weather resistant. I want to see "matience free for 5 years or 5,000 miles". So yeah i would like one but i am not sold. I am no fan of derailers. I hate the 24 speed i have now, but if i am stuck with them i am stuck.

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Old 02-07-12, 11:43 AM   #10
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Here is a thread Rohloff on touring bikes: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...not-to-Rohloff (the biggest problem with Rohloff is that the hub will cost like a whole bike).
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Old 02-07-12, 03:14 PM   #11
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Here is a thread Rohloff on touring bikes: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...not-to-Rohloff (the biggest problem with Rohloff is that the hub will cost like a whole bike).
Nice to know there are some bombproof IGH's, I doubt the Nexus 7 is as good quality though.
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Old 02-07-12, 03:58 PM   #12
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I have had several Nexus 7 and no problems.
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Old 02-07-12, 04:16 PM   #13
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I really do love the the idea behind them. Silent shifting, instant shifting, travels better, it all sounds great. But i know very little about them and their longevity. The forums have mostly been "costly to repair" "needs a trained shop" "10% loss in power" "dont travel with it" "often dose not have enough lube". I would perfer a IGH but i want to see some posts of "10,000 miles still like new" "5 yrs later time for a tune up" "way better than my derailer". I am just amazed how the bike shops and the manufactures are doing zero work to sell or explain why its better other than weather resistant. I want to see "matience free for 5 years or 5,000 miles". So yeah i would like one but i am not sold. I am no fan of derailers. I hate the 24 speed i have now, but if i am stuck with them i am stuck.
You do know that the P24h you're contemplating uses a "Neos Triniti, 3 x 8 spd." which would be similar to a Sachs 3x7 or a SRAM Dual Drive.. all use a 3speed IGH combined with a multi-gear cluster + rear derailleur and a single chainring..
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Old 02-07-12, 07:32 PM   #14
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The Rohloff although a piece of art does have a few problems here and there. Just look long enough and you will find those folks who really didnt have much luck with it. I would also like to think that some of the world travellers have extensive knowledge how to fix things on their travels .... However sometimes I do wonder ..lol

again for me the simpler the better

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Old 02-07-12, 09:22 PM   #15
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Silghtly OT but no one seems to mention the NuVinci 360. Is the extra cable the main problem?
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Old 02-08-12, 08:15 AM   #16
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I have been commuting with my D7i since the beginning of the year. I am 6'1" and 215-220 and I mash on it sometimes and it is great. The nexus 7 is great. I rarely use more than 1 or 2 gears on it though. Florida is flat.

Also sheldon brown has great info on maintaining IGH setups. They aren't that hard. Preventative maintenance is best.
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Old 02-09-12, 03:14 PM   #17
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Thanks for the advice and input from everyone. Today I placed an order for a P24H since it has the most upgrades for the price. Some time later if the 24 gear hybrid setup fails me I can just replace it. Ill start a new thread and post lots of photos when it comes since no one else has this model.
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Old 02-09-12, 07:54 PM   #18
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its been checked and on its way to you ...almost ... lol
Big Thanks Thor
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