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Old 05-22-12, 06:33 PM   #1
bluefoxicy
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HRM graph!



The small break after 8:08 is me getting home. The large break in the middle is the HRM screwing up. The trip home is mainly uphill; I went out to the harbor, obviously you go downhill to find water and uphill to get away from it. You don't find the ocean on top of a mountain.

Had an 8 inch pizza and a peanut butter cookie an hour before this while studying at the Starbucks. Nearly puked by the time I got home, either from exertion or from all the food on my stomach. Puking from exertion is a medical emergency but not criticality 1; and besides I hadn't been at it long enough for my kidneys to shut down (this will happen when you run out of glycogen--trust me, after pizza and chocolate I'm not out of glycogen).

My dad thinks this kind of exertion is going to kill me.
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Old 05-22-12, 07:19 PM   #2
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Puking from exertion a medical emergency?? I have been there a few times... not recently though.

Your HR tells me you are not 50 yet.
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Old 05-22-12, 07:30 PM   #3
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Puking from exertion a medical emergency?? I have been there a few times... not recently though.

Your HR tells me you are not 50 yet.
I'm not so sure about that. My max is about the same as his and I'm on the downhill side of 50.
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Old 05-22-12, 07:59 PM   #4
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Was this, by any chance, to Inner Harbor from Charles Village? I used to live in Charles Village when I first started cycling and that HRM looks about what I remember it feeling like.

Also, glycogen's overrated. I've been experimenting with ketogenic diets (ie high fat and low/no-carb) and so far haven't experienced any problems with my regular cycling routine of 30-40 miles per day. In fact, the more I research it the more it seems that it's unhealthy and unnatural for the brain to be burning glucose instead of ketones...but you can't just "hit the wall" by depleting your glycogen stores (while on a glucogenic diet) and then expect to suddenly operate in ketosis in an efficient way. You have to acclimate yourself and train in ketosis 24/7:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketosis
Insulin: Body Weight and Energy Production - Video Lecture Part 1
Insulin: Body Weight and Energy Production - Video Lecture Part 2
Insulin: Body Weight and Energy Production - Video Lecture Part 3
http://journal.crossfit.com/2010/04/...production.tpl

Last edited by chucky; 05-22-12 at 08:02 PM.
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Old 05-22-12, 08:26 PM   #5
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Puking from exertion a medical emergency?? I have been there a few times... not recently though.
Marathon runners tend to burn off their glycogen stores and keep going on other energy, but their kidneys shut down as a result--an attempt to reduce water loss. The visible symptom is they start gaining weight (while running) until rest and food are supplied--if you weigh yourself every couple miles and gain a few pounds along the way, something is wrong. Eventually vomiting may occur, as well as fatigue, confusion, and brain swelling and death. Vomiting under heavy exertion is considered an indicator.

Yeah this was CV to IH.
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Old 05-22-12, 08:51 PM   #6
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Marathon runners tend to burn off their glycogen stores and keep going on other energy, but their kidneys shut down as a result--an attempt to reduce water loss. The visible symptom is they start gaining weight (while running) until rest and food are supplied--if you weigh yourself every couple miles and gain a few pounds along the way, something is wrong. Eventually vomiting may occur, as well as fatigue, confusion, and brain swelling and death. Vomiting under heavy exertion is considered an indicator.
Is it the loss of glycogen that causes the kidneys to shut down or is it the sheer trauma of pounding the pavement? I ran a marathon 3 weeks ago without any training and, though I felt like I had plenty of energy, it was one of the most punishing experiences of my life. Also, it was my understanding that weight gain and brain swelling was the result of overhydration (ie drinking fluids even after your kidneys have taken a siesta)...after all how can you gain weight if you stop consuming?

What say you bluefoxicy?

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Old 05-22-12, 10:48 PM   #7
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Is it the loss of glycogen that causes the kidneys to shut down or is it the sheer trauma of pounding the pavement? I ran a marathon 3 weeks ago without any training and, though I felt like I had plenty of energy, it was one of the most punishing experiences of my life. Also, it was my understanding that weight gain and brain swelling was the result of overhydration (ie drinking fluids even after your kidneys have taken a siesta)...after all how can you gain weight if you stop consuming?

What say you bluefoxicy?
http://www.amaasportsmed.org/news_ro...ia_reuters.htm

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He found that they died, not just from drinking too much water, but because their kidneys stopped excreting water as a response to skeletal muscle injury.

When runners "hit the wall" they force their muscles to continue to exercise even after they've run out of glycogen, or fuel, he told Reuters Health in an interview. This triggers a stress hormone in the brain to tell the kidneys to halt water excretion, in an effort to maximize blood volume.

When this happens, even a relatively small amount of fluid can cause the brain to swell. If a person continues to consume fluids, the body reacts to the inflammation by continuing to protect blood volume, making the brain swell even more.
You lose sodium, you drink water, you die from water intoxication. Drinking too much water.

You lose sodium, your kidneys push water to your bladder and lymph system to keep things in homeostasis.

You lose sodium, you overexert yourself, your kidneys stop pushing water to your bladder and lymph system, suddenly even small amounts of water intake will kill you.
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Old 05-22-12, 11:11 PM   #8
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Boy, you guys are really into over-exertion!

Moderation has gotten me to age 69 in relatively good shape (except for the throwing arm), don't think I will be changing now.

Worse thing I remember is having my vision black-out for a few seconds after running my first 200M, when they sent our H.S. baseball team out to run in a track meet to show us how bad a shape we were in.

Lou
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Old 05-23-12, 09:03 AM   #9
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I'm not sure how this got into Folding Bikes and not Training & Nutrition. I'm really bad at this "getting to the right forum" thing.
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Old 05-23-12, 10:14 AM   #10
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http://www.amaasportsmed.org/news_ro...ia_reuters.htm



You lose sodium, you drink water, you die from water intoxication. Drinking too much water.

You lose sodium, your kidneys push water to your bladder and lymph system to keep things in homeostasis.

You lose sodium, you overexert yourself, your kidneys stop pushing water to your bladder and lymph system, suddenly even small amounts of water intake will kill you.
Which is why I didn't drink any water after the halfway point when I ran my marathon...and also why I don't carry any water bottles on my bike: No water, no weight gain, no hyponatremia. I just drink as much as possible when rested.

But "hitting the wall" due to mineral (sodium, calcium, etc) vs glycogen depletion are separate issues (which is a point made in one of the videos I posted above) and provided there are sufficient stores of fat and protein (and the body is accustomed to processing them) I don't see any reason why glycogen depletion should necessarily lead to muscle breakdown...especially since it's ridiculous to think that man could have ever kept his miniscule glycogen stores undepleted under the frequent heavy exertions experienced in the wild (because aside from the fact that it's unrealistic to think one would even be able to feast that frequently in the wild, the glycogenesis promoting carbohydrate heavy diets 99% of the human race currently eats are also a luxury that's only been afforded to us since the invention of agriculture and cooking...without cooking our bodies don't even store that much glycogen because we aren't able to digest most raw carbohydrates; believe me I've tried).

Also, for a given effort, I seriously doubt cyclists experience the same degree of muscle injury as runners. IMO that's a problem caused mainly by the anachronism of coupling pavement technology to natural legs when it's really designed to be coupled to wheels. In other words, running on pavement is like sticking your leg in a meat grinder...a simply inappropriate and harmful use of technology.

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I'm not sure how this got into Folding Bikes and not Training & Nutrition. I'm really bad at this "getting to the right forum" thing.
I'm sure the moderators could move it over there if you asked them.

Maybe I should mosey on over there myself as it seems I've developed an interest in nutrition (when did that happen? ) though I remain vehemently opposed to training.

Last edited by chucky; 05-23-12 at 10:27 AM.
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