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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ratdog View Post
    Would be if it was made of aluminum otherwise the corrosion would be a problem for a steel bike.
    Steel yachts and aluminium bikes, I will never understand these people

    As an aside: Has any one ever seen a steel frame of any age that rusted through? Even bikes that stand outside for forty years seem to stay structurally sound.


    The armchair entrepreneur in me says 'no' too.

    Although I did get the impression that this doesn't necessarily have to be a big moneyspinner. There are other reasons why a company may wish to distribute a product.

  2. #27
    cpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhkyte View Post
    I was just about to pull the trigger on ebay to buy one of these when they sold out. But on sale again now. Not sure if I made a lucky escape!
    Bhkyte, I'd like to see you fit bullbars to one of these.

  3. #28
    PatronSaintOfDiscBrakes dynaryder's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elvis Shumaker View Post
    As an aside: Has any one ever seen a steel frame of any age that rusted through? Even bikes that stand outside for forty years seem to stay structurally sound.
    Never saw a frame rust through,but have seen plenty of other issues. Stuck seatposts are fairly common,as are probs in the headset and BB.

    C'dale BBU('05 and '09)/Super Six/Hooligan8and 3,Kona Dew Deluxe,Novara Buzz/Safari,Surly Big Dummy,Marin Pt Reyes,Giant Defy 1,Schwinn DBX SuperSport/Qualifier,Brompton S6L,Dahon Speed Pro TT

  4. #29
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpg View Post
    Bhkyte, I'd like to see you fit bullbars to one of these.
    Lol
    Believe it or not it had not occurred to me !
    I was woundering about a adding a stem extender through if I get one. Might improve ride. Would imagine carry me miles better with dropped bars.
    I have Put spare dahon andros stem on birdie for moment.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8. Birdie red.

  5. #30
    Senior Member DVC45's Avatar
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    If its like the Mobiky Genius, then I wouldn't bother. I don't think they sell well.

  6. #31
    cpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhkyte View Post
    Lol
    Believe it or not it had not occurred to me !
    I was woundering about a adding a stem extender through if I get one.
    Looking again at the photos, I think drop bars would work. The bars that come with it seem to be telescopic and are clamped to the steerer tube so should be straight forward to to swap them. Its a fairly wide fold so drop bars might not stick out that much.

  7. #32
    Senior Member Pinigis's Avatar
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    I think I will let this bike, and this thread, die now. The bike really does not meet many needs, it does not fit my business model, and there is probably not a sufficent market for it. It is akin to a car accident...you just have to stop and look at it.

  8. #33
    Weakling
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    Looks similar to this one.
    http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...ike-from-China
    Seems very few trust something that different? I still wait for a decent report on how it is to use and ride.

  9. #34
    Senior Member Still Pedaling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpg View Post
    I want one, just because I admire it as a piece of design and engineering. I have been thinking about getting one of these from the ebay seller and even emailed some of the people who had bought one and left feedback to get their opinions. Generally very positive although most said they would not do long distances on one, I guess most of us would agree with that.

    Here are some photos from the ebay listing http://s1104.beta.photobucket.com/us...4-130.jpg.html

    And a video. http://s1095.photobucket.com/albums/...rent=001-1.mp4
    Love the video. One of the things that fascinate me with folding bikes is the numerous and cleaver designs. How I wish there was a magazine (periodical) dedicated to folding bikes. All what is out there today I think might warrant such a publication.
    "It's best to remain silent and be thought the fool, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt" -- Mark Twain

  10. #35
    Senior Member Still Pedaling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weakling View Post
    Looks similar to this one.
    http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...ike-from-China
    Seems very few trust something that different? I still wait for a decent report on how it is to use and ride.
    You have to hand it to the Chinese for coming up with some neat designs. So many knock Chinese productivity and quality. Maybe in some areas perhaps because so much is produced with quantity in mind. I own an Epiphone Les Paul that is made in one of the Epiphone factories in China. The guitar is well made, plays nicely and sells for hundreds of dollars less than a Gibson Les Paul made here. I also don't mind bikes that are made in China. Perhaps they don't ship out high end models, but that doesn't mean that they can't. After all, they have been making bikes by the millions for many, many years. At least they ship out inexpensive bikes so that those of us who don't belong to the "Heavy Wallet Brigade" can afford one.

    Sorry for being off topic here.
    "It's best to remain silent and be thought the fool, then to open your mouth and remove all doubt" -- Mark Twain

  11. #36
    cpg
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    My bench top lathe and milling machine are both made in China and they are fantastic and very competitive priced. I have done good work with them, mostly making bits for bikes.
    Mezzo I4 (converted to dual drive), Whyte PRST-1, Trek 1200, Dahon Jack, Bickerton (work in progress)

  12. #37
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cpg View Post
    My bench top lathe and milling machine are both made in China and they are fantastic and very competitive priced. I have done good work with them, mostly making bits for bikes.
    So the mezzo rolling rack kit, and stem qr you kindly made for me are partly made by china!!!
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8. Birdie red.

  13. #38
    cpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhkyte View Post
    So the mezzo rolling rack kit, and stem qr you kindly made for me are partly made by china!!!
    Thats one way of looking at it. I dont know where drills, taps, milling bits, lathe tools and alumium came from. Could be a truly multinational product.
    Mezzo I4 (converted to dual drive), Whyte PRST-1, Trek 1200, Dahon Jack, Bickerton (work in progress)

  14. #39
    lowlife bottom feeder BassNotBass's Avatar
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    In this day and age there's very little that the average person buys that isn't made in China. The last bike shop I worked at sold higher end bikes (>$1,200) and they were made in China. A lot of my electric and acoustic basses... made in China. My lathe... also made in China. Just like with any country, there are manufacturers who build high quality stuff and others that sling crap out of their doors.
    I plan on living forever... so far so good.

  15. #40
    Senior Member overbyte's Avatar
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    This bike came up in the "Rare and Unusual Folding Bikes" thread at http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...1#post16544002. You may want to read from that posting downward.

  16. #41
    Nobody mconlonx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elvis Shumaker View Post
    As an aside: Has any one ever seen a steel frame of any age that rusted through?
    Yes. One Bianchi Volpe that lived outside and was used as a messenger bike in salty Boston. I got the frame, it had electrical tape common to lockup bikes along the TT, DT and ST. While cleaning it up, unwrapping the tape from the ST, I found that the seat tube had rusted through in the middle, completely. I believe the issue was protective tape holding water against the frame, it looked rusted out from the outside.

    I've also had a couple older steel bikes come through a shop where it technically didn't rust through, but there was rust enough around the BB that in once case, the seattube had cracked near the BB, in another case the DT had cracked near the BB. These bikes were 30+ years old, beaters, and looked like they had lived life outside.
    I know next to nothing. I am frequently wrong.

  17. #42
    Nobody mconlonx's Avatar
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    Oh, and I'd not buy the bike in the OP. Just not what I'm looking for in a folding bike.
    I know next to nothing. I am frequently wrong.

  18. #43
    Senior Member overbyte's Avatar
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    More videos of this ultra-compact folding bike:
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMjY1MzQ1NDMy.html
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTgzOTkxMTA0.html
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMjY1NT....3.4-1.1-1-1-3
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDA4MjYyNDQw.html
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMzc2OTQxNDQ0.html
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDA2NDE1Mjgw.html

    At first glance, the Mobiky looks similar when unfolded, but notice that the folding goes only to the first step of the "Freeride" bike. That is, the Mobiky just shortens the wheelbase; doesn't flip up the wheels into a very compact package. Here's a video of an electric-assisted Mobiky (or perhaps a clone of it) in use in China:
    http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XNDY2Mj...12-1.12-1-2-11. Compare especially the use on a commuter train. (I notice that the Mobiky is no longer being marketed in the US, and that the only Mobiky models on the French website have 16" wheels, not 12" as I think they used to have.)
    Last edited by overbyte; 03-15-14 at 09:39 PM. Reason: more

  19. #44
    Senior Member overbyte's Avatar
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    This ad for it
    http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=2013.1.w4023-2611583279.2.y7YcsF&id=15869152247#

    shows this comparison of 2 of them with a 16" Dahon folded
    T2aYLmXotXXXXXXXXX_!!696292724.jpg
    Here are the specs of that Dahon model http://dahontec.en.made-in-china.com...es-KT510-.html.
    Last edited by overbyte; 03-09-14 at 09:25 AM.

  20. #45
    Senior Member overbyte's Avatar
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    Does this bike conform with US CPSC requirements for import and sale in the US?

    The answer is: No, it doesn't in the present design.

    I've been studying the Consumer Products Safety Commission (CPSCO) regulations on bicycles. One requirement is that any bike with a single chain sprocket in front and a single sprocket in the rear must have a chain guard that meets certain specifications. Basically, the guard has to look like the ones commonly seen on cruiser bikes, covering at least 90 degrees of the chainring sprocket and extending to within 3.5" of the rear chain sprocket. These regulations are enforced in 3 ways. At the port of entry, to get through US Customs, any shipment of bicycles must have a Certificate of Conformance with the shipment or available online to the customs officers. The certificate is a legal document which the importer or manufacturer must produce, certifying that the product meets CPSC regulations in all regards. Second, the CPSC can order sellers to stop selling non-conforming bikes and to recall them (either to rectify the non-conformance or to refund the buyer). Third, if a consumer sues, the courts will look unkindly upon an injury due to a non-compliance, by the seller and/or manufacturer, with product safety regulations.

    Filing a false certificate is subject to civil and criminal penalties. Border officers won't (are not supposed to anyway) release the shipment for pickup or delivery inside the US unless the product is certified as compliant. They would notify the importer, who has a certain number of days to provide the certification document, or to ship it back outside of the US, or otherwise the customs department will seize and destroy the shipment. I saw an article about a Land Rover 4x4 vehicle worth $100,000, which was seized and crushed because it didn't conform with the requirement for all vehicles manufactured in the last 25 years to have airbags. They routinely seize and destroy all sorts of products: counterfeit brand-name products, children's products that have lead paint or unsafe small parts, etc. Single items that come in as manufacturer's samples are exempt. So are custom-made bikes rather than factory made in quantities. But other than the few exceptions, all bikes sold in the US must meet the CPSC requirement. If somehow a seller doesn't comply and sells a non-conforming bike that is subject to the requirements, and someone is injured due to a manufacturing defect, it would be difficult to defend. Liability insurance does not cover willful acts that are illegal. Compliance requires testing to the specific standards for bicycles set forth in the CPSC regulations in the Code of Federal Regulations.

    So unless the manufacturer can figure out how to add the chain guard to this unusual folding design, importing this bike for sale would be prohibited in the US. The regulations also require front and rear reflectors, which would be easy to add, and various strength testings (braking power, fork strength, axle retention in the fork, etc.).

    What puzzles me is that I see many single-speed or fixie bikes on the road and advertised by online sellers, which have no chain guard or only a simple ring around the crank chainring, which does not meet the legal requirement unless the front or rear has multiple sprockets (multi-speed gearing) and obviously a single-speed bike does not. How do those non-conforming bikes get imported? Are the importers submitting false certifications? Is the US Customs and Border Protection agency just turning a blind eye to the details of the certification? Does anyone have any experience with this?

  21. #46
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Often these legal items are removed immediately.

    Refle tors in pedals can slide out and jam on the crank and cause an accident. So much for safety improvements. Rollerblades come with brakes that cause an advanced skater to trip over it when crossing over into corners.
    A chain could have a cover over it on this bike.
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8. Birdie red.

  22. #47
    Senior Member overbyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bhkyte View Post
    Often these legal items are removed immediately.

    Refle tors in pedals can slide out and jam on the crank and cause an accident. So much for safety improvements. Rollerblades come with brakes that cause an advanced skater to trip over it when crossing over into corners.
    A chain could have a cover over it on this bike.
    A chain guard over the chain would not be difficult. A guard over the belt drive might be tricky because the belt folds when the bike is compacted. Maybe a 2-piece guard over the belt would work.

  23. #48
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    And yet chain guards are rare on just about ANY Trek bike we've ever sold at the LBS. So much for CPSC enforcement?

  24. #49
    Senior Member overbyte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by alaskanb3arcub View Post
    And yet chain guards are rare on just about ANY Trek bike we've ever sold at the LBS. So much for CPSC enforcement?
    The CPSC regulation 1512 says:
    This part sets forth the requirements for a bicycle as defined in §1512.2(a) (except a bicycle that is a “track bicycle” or a “one-of-a-kind bicycle” as defined in §1512.2 (d) and (e)) which is not a banned article under §1500.18(a)(12) of this chapter.
    and
    (d) Track bicycle means a bicycle designed and intended for sale as a competitive velodrome machine having no brake levers or calipers, single crank-to-wheel ratio, and no free-wheeling feature between the rear wheel and the crank.
    and
    §1512.9 Requirements for protective guards.

    (a) Chain guard. Bicycles having a single front sprocket and a single rear sprocket shall have a chain guard that shall cover the top strand of the chain and at least 90° of the perimeter where the drive chain contacts the drive sprocket as shown in figure 7. The chain guard shall extend rearward to a point at least 8 cm (3.2 in.) forward of the centerline of the rear axle. The minimum width of the top area of the chain guard shall be twice the width of the chain in that portion forward of the rear wheel rim. The rear part of the top area may be tapered. The minimum width at the rear of the guard shall be one-half the chain width. Such chain guard shall prevent a rod of 9.4 mm (3⁄8 in.) diameter and 76 mm (3.0 in.) length from entrapment between the upper junction of the chain and the sprocket when introduced from the chain side of the bicycle in any direction within 45° from a line normal to the sprocket.
    (b) Derailleur guard. Derailleurs shall be guarded to prevent the drive chain from interfering with or stopping the rotation of the wheel through improper adjustments or damage.
    So a fixie and all bikes with multiple-gear derailleurs in front or rear are exempt from the chain guard requirement. If the Trek bikes you saw met those exemptions, they'd be legal. But I've seen single-speed freewheeling bikes with 1 or 2 brakes and yet no full-length chain guard if it even has a guard at all. Also, you've probably seen bikes with plastic disks between the cassette and spokes. That disk is to comply with the (b) regulation for guards against malfunctions of a maladjusted derailleur. Often bikes don't have those guards. The manufacturer or importer bears the responsibility for filing a truthful certificate of compliance with the regulations. If a false one is filed with the shipment of bikes, the only way the deficiency would be discovered would be if someone brings it to the attention of CPSC (and even then, who knows if they are so backlogged that they wouldn't respond until someone actually is injured). However, a personal injury lawyer isn't going to ignore the regulations when seeking to blame everyone involved in the bike manufacturing, importing, and sale.

  25. #50
    Senior Member bhkyte's Avatar
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    Most fixes are not intended for track use so the exclusion does not count. A racing bmx bike ,(ie track bike),is not a road bike and may get around the road requirements even though they have a rear brake in UK. I think a bmx bike with a chain guard might fail race scrutineering anyway, as it's an unnesseary component that could fail. That's my heresy not official. I suppose a lot of this implementation is toothless??
    Dual drive Mezzo (GOLD), Dual Drive Mezzo with bullbars (black), White Brompton thingy with Dahon Androes stem and bull bars. Birdie (old sytle) 7 speed. Downtube NS8. Birdie red.

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